DUST Search - I swear some people are ******* stupid......

Aizen Intiki wrote:

I recently found out that some people still don't get tiercide....... That's just sad.

tiercide- The act of murdering tiers.

You get rid of any tiers in the game, or at least anything that overpowers something else over a wide scale, then make a verity of variants for those things.

ex. the T I Gallente BC's in EVE are called the Brutix, Myrmidon, and Talos. If my memory serves me right, when EVE was under the tier system, the Talos was the "PROTO" Gallente BC, Myrmidon was the "ADV.", and and the Brutix was the "STD" . And, although slightly different, just like now with dust, the Talos was the best to use. When tiercide happened, they were rebalanced, and (although imo the Myrmidon is now the best, cuz' drones), they all have their roles, one being the CQ DPS monster, one being the medium range support, and one being the Long range sniper.

Now that (hopefully) the fools that don't get it do, I will say how I think it should go down: All PROTO weapons, turrets, equipment, and frames should be deleted. After, some things should happen:

For weapons and turrets: Only have one kind of gun, and call it something neat, for example, the GEK-38 Plasma Rifle. From there, we will do a mass change to all of the weapons and turrets, making them T III equipment. What that means in simple terms is add weapon customization. Do the same for vehicle turrets. Now, add AUR variants that have prefits of the weapon modules on them, and make them to where they're similar/same as the variants as we have today. Make them cost no SP.

For suit Frames and vehicle hulls: Get rid of the ADV. and PROTO ones, and add variants that have slight changes to them, like speed, scanning, etc. then give them bonuses for their specific role, like a slight reduction to equipment, or a ROF bonus/level.

For T II frames and hulls: Same as the T I ones, but give them more of a reason to exist other than being just flat out better; a defined role. Like taking away sidearms from most Logis isn't a good idea, but making their weapons weaker, but making the equipment more efficient. ex. There should be a Logi-like T I frame. It wouldn't out-preform it in Logi roles, but if it got in a fight with a Logi frame, it would win, unless the Logi is a good fighter, or gets lucky.

For modules and equipment: Modules should stay as is (tier wise), as I see nothing wrong with them being like that. Equipment should get rid of the STD and PROTO versions, and keep the ADV versions.

Now balance for CPU/PG.

Peace, Aizen Twisted


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Thor McStrut Reckoners 99	Posted - 2013.08.13 02:24:00 - [1] - Quote Aizen Intiki wrote: I recently found out that some people still don't get tiercide....... That's just sad. tiercide- The act of murdering tiers. You get rid of any tiers in the game, or at least anything that overpowers something else over a wide scale, then make a verity of variants for those things. ex. the T I Gallente BC's in EVE are called the Brutix, Myrmidon, and Talos. If my memory serves me right, when EVE was under the tier system, the Talos was the "PROTO" Gallente BC, Myrmidon was the "ADV.", and and the Brutix was the "STD" . And, although slightly different, just like now with dust, the Talos was the best to use. When tiercide happened, they were rebalanced, and (although imo the Myrmidon is now the best, cuz' drones), they all have their roles, one being the CQ DPS monster, one being the medium range support, and one being the Long range sniper. Now that (hopefully) the fools that don't get it do, I will say how I think it should go down: All PROTO weapons, turrets, equipment, and frames should be deleted. After, some things should happen: For weapons and turrets: Only have one kind of gun, and call it something neat, for example, the GEK-38 Plasma Rifle. From there, we will do a mass change to all of the weapons and turrets, making them T III equipment. What that means in simple terms is add weapon customization. Do the same for vehicle turrets. Now, add AUR variants that have prefits of the weapon modules on them, and make them to where they're similar/same as the variants as we have today. Make them cost no SP. For suit Frames and vehicle hulls: Get rid of the ADV. and PROTO ones, and add variants that have slight changes to them, like speed, scanning, etc. then give them bonuses for their specific role, like a slight reduction to equipment, or a ROF bonus/level. For T II frames and hulls: Same as the T I ones, but give them more of a reason to exist other than being just flat out better; a defined role. Like taking away sidearms from most Logis isn't a good idea, but making their weapons weaker, but making the equipment more efficient. ex. There should be a Logi-like T I frame. It wouldn't out-preform it in Logi roles, but if it got in a fight with a Logi frame, it would win, unless the Logi is a good fighter, or gets lucky. For modules and equipment: Modules should stay as is (tier wise), as I see nothing wrong with them being like that. Equipment should get rid of the STD and PROTO versions, and keep the ADV versions. Now balance for CPU/PG. Peace, Aizen I'll admit that I didn't read most of your post, so there is a chance that what you're saying makes sense, but the fact that you used the Gal battlecruisers as an example of tiericide makes me think that you don't even know what it is, and what it did for Eve. The Talos, while being a Tier 3 BC, was neither superior or better than any Tier 1 or 2 BC from any race. All Tier 3 BCs were niche hulls introduced to fit battleship class weapons at the sacrifice of fitting tank, to make a better glass cannon used for camping; be it gate, station, or POS. Given the right situation, they were/are great hulls. To the example, the Myrm and the Brutix were both beasts in the right hands. The Myrm often overshadowed the Brutix due to it's better combat and fitting flexibility, but that still stands today, after the tiericide. Most ship classes, even though they were divided into Tiers, were well purposed through roles. The tiers had little to do with how well the individual ships performed. The most significant class that was suffering from tiers were the battleships, as the tier 3 BS generally, but not exclusively, dominated all engagements that battleships excelled at. Frigates suffered because most frigates were useless in combat, except the high tier "combat" frigates, which still are among the best combat frigates. Now, post tiericide, there are some more frigates that are combat viable, but certainly not all. As some people pointed out, this isn't Eve, but by using Eve as an example of why tiericide should be implemented, you need to know that all it really did for the majority of the content, is get rid of the word Tier. Hulls still have roles. You still have to train skills to use hulls more effectively, and you still have to pick the appropriate hull and fitting for the task at hand. All that said, Dust isn't ready for tiericide in any form. Since tiers are already fleshed out and skill trees already implemented, but not all content introduced, CCP needs to stay the path until the game is fully fleshed out.
Thor McStrut Reckoners 102	Posted - 2013.08.13 04:12:00 - [2] - Quote Like me, I don't think you read anything I wrote. LOL! Aizen Intiki wrote: Bullshit about the Talos being superior before tiercide and you know it I never said the Talos was superior. You did. Quote: Just because it was/is T III, doesn't mean anything. It was superior, and is now balanced. Superior to what? A Myrm? Maybe at camping, but certainly not at roaming/soloing. Quote: Also, I don't remember getting my ass handed by a Brutix ever. I would always out tank the things, then roast them with sentries (or if they were too close, heavy drones), and snipe then with Rails. Then you obviously were never caught out in the open in a tech 1 cruiser by a shield tanked gank Brutix. Good for you. Quote: Lastly, I didn't say Dust was ready, I said it should happen, but hope it would come soon. I told you I didn't read your entire post. At least we agree on something. What I did say was that hulls in Eve filled roles and niches. Most, if not all, ships still fill those roles, even without tiers in place. So in effect, removing tiers had an almost none effect on the whole of the game. If anything, it was the changes to the skill tree, in prerequisites, that played the biggest role in tiericide in Eve. Quote: PROTO stomps would be non existent, Here is where I disagree. I feel that proto stomps are primarily due to a lack of meaningful veteran content, due in large part to pointless PC, and a lack of corporation involvement in FW due to no meaningful reward and the difficulty in loading up full 16 man teams. Add in the isk faucet that is PC, and the lack of isk sinks, especially at the Proto level, and you get highly coordinated squads used to the PC level competition with nothing better to do then stomp pubs in between PC timers. Removing tiers and what-not just attempts to cover up flaws in core game design and the lack of content/rewards.