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Poonmunch
DUST University
Ivy League
176
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Posted - 2013.08.12 05:01:00 -
[1] - Quote
I fukin' love you, man.
Munch |
Poonmunch
DUST University
Ivy League
176
|
Posted - 2013.08.12 05:51:00 -
[2] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:TheAmazing FlyingPig wrote:If this thread doesn't get a blue tag soon, I'll lose all faith in humanity. Oh... the CPM got something better
Dude, don't leave us hanging.
Was it "better" as in a couple of hookers, a pound of coke and a weekend in Vegas to shut you up?
Or was it "better" as in "Holy crap - these people love this game and want to help make it better. We will use their input and communicate with them regularly"?
Munch
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Poonmunch
DUST University
Ivy League
177
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Posted - 2013.08.12 15:50:00 -
[3] - Quote
Buster Friently wrote: I fail to see why a properly elected CPM couldn't be working with CCP to improve things just as effectively as the unelected CPM0. All we need is elections. That's all CPM0 should be doing - providing the framework to deliver CPM1. By this measure, they're as delinquent as CCP in delivering milestones.
Still a good effort, I just think it's on the wrong goals.
I'm honestly leery of an elected CPM. An elected body will naturally feel that they hold more authority than the current body. This could lead to increased conflict between the CPM and CCP (and possibly between the CPM and the rest of the community). The current iteration of the CPM has ties with CCP members and switching horses might require rebuilding relationships that have taken years to hone.
Whether the CPM is elected or not, they will still be held to an NDA. Don't fool yourselves, an NDA is an NDA and a new CPM will not likely have any more access to information covered by an NDA nor more access to information that they can release to us.
The dwindling of the community is almost certainly the cause for this new "openness" by CCP, not anything we have asked for or nagged about. They are listening to us because they have finally figured out that they have to and for no other reason. There has been no massive uptake of this game by the EVE community, likely because the FPS community is not the same as the EVE/MMO community. So the EVE people aren't voluntarily supporting this game with their fees.
That leaves the rest of us.
CCP is a company and their eventual goal will be (and has to be) making money. The cash shop is one way to do this but a subscription fee is, in my opinion, where they want to go in the long run. They will almost certainly bring subscription to this game in line with EVE once it is polished enough to be considered a product in line with other FPS.
My 2 cents,
Munch |
Poonmunch
DUST University
Ivy League
183
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Posted - 2013.08.13 19:05:00 -
[4] - Quote
Heinrich Jagerblitzen wrote:Buster Friently wrote: See, I agree that all this needs to be done, but I don't agree that the CPM0's ideas of how Dust should look different have any merit because the entire point of the CPM is to represent players - which you don't.
Now I'm sorry to derail this as I have. The point from the OP is valid. Hopefully it helps. I still feel the CPM0 should be moving aside as quickly as possible, rather than trying to fix Dust. Whether we represent the players' ideas or not has little to do without our method of selection, and everything to do with our willingness to listen to the community and forward their feedback. Elected officials and alliance leaders can still give the finger to the community, and give CCP their own terrible ideas. And even appointed officials can listen and share community feedback to CCP without letting personal opinion get in the way. In other words, its not the elections that matter - its the conduct of the council members once they are on the council you should be paying attention to at all times. If you feel we are letting our personal opinions or perspectives override community sentiment you should create a thread here in the Council's Chambers outlining why you believe we are failing as representatives, and provide concrete examples.Otherwise, its silly to say that just because we weren't elected we are somehow incapable of bringing community feedback to CCP. That assumption is also dangerous - if you believe that elections somehow guarantee a council member's objectivity, you're setting yourself up to be blind to an elected CPM official doing a terrible job down the road as well, because you gave the election system too much trust to begin with.
I completely agree with this.
Elections are and will be popularity contests. If CCP is seen to certify an elected body, the elected people will certainly see themselves as more "legitimate" than the current CPM and will act in such a fashion.
If CCP doesn't stick to any of the elected body's most minor requests, there will almost certainly be instant cries of "CCP isn't responding to my elected status as the legitimate and sole director of the future of this game!". Of course, many forum flames will follow this type of thinking and the community could begin to fracture.
I can smell the forum smoke now.
And what about corps that are small or even middle sized? And big corps? Will each get an equal voice? Will there be one representative from each corp or a handful from the mega corps? Many, if not all, would vote for guys they play with regularly, giving the really big corps a huge voice at the CPM table. There will inevitably be complaints that this elected CPM is using their position to work for changes that benefit their corps, race or agenda. What if the CPM gets stacked with people who want to run DUST as their own personal extension of EVE and will try to mold DUST into something that benefits EVE (and not necessarily the DUST community)? Would you ban DUST corps that are associated with EVE corps from voting?
How would you run the election? Does each alt get a vote? What about people who make a bunch of alts (like the people who pad their K/D ratios)? What about people who make several Sony accounts? What would the length of term be? Years? Decades? Even a term of one year will cover 12 monthly updates and probably a few versions. That might be a bit too much power for a handful of people. And what if the next elected council wants to undo things that the prior elected council fought for?
I can smell the forum smoke now.
And what about the CPM members themselves? They will get bombarded with requests and demands for action because the community will see them as the conduit for their variously thought out ideas and angry demands. The candidates for CPM should heed that warning because they will become lightning rods for every fool and dreamer with an idea or axe to grind. I can see the piles of e-mails and in-game mails in the CPMs boxes right now. The forums are actually a good place to weed out the good requests from the stupid, irrational or unworkable ones. CCP and the current CPM can read these as well as anyone.
Elections seem like a good idea but the most effective, responsive human organizations are definitely not democratic (businesses, the military, the police, the fire department, EMS, the arts, NASA, the CIA, sports, etc, etc). None are run as democracies. Democracies work best at keeping things stable and middle of the road, not for bold, revolutionary, decisive action.
I think an elected body is a na+»ve aspiration at best and an invitation to chaos at worst.
Munch |
Poonmunch
DUST University
Ivy League
188
|
Posted - 2013.08.14 16:42:00 -
[5] - Quote
Joseph Average wrote:Nova Knife wrote:..the public (or at the very least; The CPM) needs .. The semi-colon does not require a capitalized letter after it.
While we are being pedantic you should realize something; in that phrase, the semi-colon is too strong. There is no need for a semi-colon (or any punctuation).
Munch |
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