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TheAmazing FlyingPig
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
2583
|
Posted - 2013.08.11 19:37:00 -
[31] - Quote
Seymor Krelborn wrote:TheAmazing FlyingPig wrote:Seymor Krelborn wrote:TheAmazing FlyingPig wrote:I think what people fail to realize is that these are digital goods and are treated differently than physical goods.
See, with physical, you own it. It's yours. Do with it whatever you want to do. I can go out and buy a music CD and it's mine to do with as I choose. I can make it into a coaster, I can listen to the music on there, I can upload it onto a website for others to download (legality questionable), but the point is that I own the physical good in my home, and it's mine.
With digital goods, they're not yours. The good is still owned by the company, and it's at their discretion what they will do with it. If you buy the same album off of iTunes, you don't own it. You follow the rules of iTunes to use it. If they decide to change the album art, you have no say in the matter, because when you bought it, you agreed that it wasn't yours, but that you simply bought a license to access this service and accept any changes that might come with it.
You buy Aurum items. They're not yours. I challenge you to find any EULA for any F2P game (or any game with a digital item shop, for that matter) that states that items purchased with cash are yours and not owned by the company, hosted on the server, and provided via license.
It may not seem fair, but you agreed to follow these terms. If you don't like it, the EULA provides you an out. I won't link or quote it, since it seems there are many that could stand to read it in its entirety. just because they can do it, doesn't mean they should.... how many albums would you buy on iTunes if 2 months later they removed 1/2 the songs? sure they could do this, but if they want your long term business they wont. if the consumer stands up and says "this is where I draw the line" the company will listen if they want to remain in business... thats the power of the consumer... exercise that power or be walked all over. Of course it doesn't mean they should, and most companies try to avoid it as much as possible for the reasons you listed. It doesn't mean that it's not necessary on some occasions though, such as a song on the album not belonging there or licensing issues, or more related to this topic, data showing that the contact grenades as they were was causing an atmosphere not enjoyable to the rest of the player base. so then why not compensate the consumer in the name of good business relations? You can be compensated. Read the EULA. |
Seymor Krelborn
DUST University Ivy League
499
|
Posted - 2013.08.11 19:50:00 -
[32] - Quote
TheAmazing FlyingPig wrote:Seymor Krelborn wrote:TheAmazing FlyingPig wrote:Seymor Krelborn wrote:TheAmazing FlyingPig wrote:I think what people fail to realize is that these are digital goods and are treated differently than physical goods.
See, with physical, you own it. It's yours. Do with it whatever you want to do. I can go out and buy a music CD and it's mine to do with as I choose. I can make it into a coaster, I can listen to the music on there, I can upload it onto a website for others to download (legality questionable), but the point is that I own the physical good in my home, and it's mine.
With digital goods, they're not yours. The good is still owned by the company, and it's at their discretion what they will do with it. If you buy the same album off of iTunes, you don't own it. You follow the rules of iTunes to use it. If they decide to change the album art, you have no say in the matter, because when you bought it, you agreed that it wasn't yours, but that you simply bought a license to access this service and accept any changes that might come with it.
You buy Aurum items. They're not yours. I challenge you to find any EULA for any F2P game (or any game with a digital item shop, for that matter) that states that items purchased with cash are yours and not owned by the company, hosted on the server, and provided via license.
It may not seem fair, but you agreed to follow these terms. If you don't like it, the EULA provides you an out. I won't link or quote it, since it seems there are many that could stand to read it in its entirety. just because they can do it, doesn't mean they should.... how many albums would you buy on iTunes if 2 months later they removed 1/2 the songs? sure they could do this, but if they want your long term business they wont. if the consumer stands up and says "this is where I draw the line" the company will listen if they want to remain in business... thats the power of the consumer... exercise that power or be walked all over. Of course it doesn't mean they should, and most companies try to avoid it as much as possible for the reasons you listed. It doesn't mean that it's not necessary on some occasions though, such as a song on the album not belonging there or licensing issues, or more related to this topic, data showing that the contact grenades as they were was causing an atmosphere not enjoyable to the rest of the player base. so then why not compensate the consumer in the name of good business relations? You can be compensated. Read the EULA.
EULA be damned!...if they change something we spent money for we should not have to jump through hoops... they should be proactive...period... sorry if I sound irate, but I think hiding behind the EULA is cowardice, and I think a consumer defending a company over there own money is foolish... |
Maken Tosch
DUST University Ivy League
3539
|
Posted - 2013.08.11 19:54:00 -
[33] - Quote
TheAmazing FlyingPig wrote: You can be compensated. Read the EULA.
It will still be at their discretion though.
Originally, during open beta, we were expected to get a refund of all the AURUM Blueprint Originals (BPOs) as CCP wanted to clear our assets and stuff in preparation for the official release. But then word broke out that doing so will enable certain players to unexpectedly gain ludicrous amounts of AURUM in their wallets when they didn't spend that much to begin with.
What happened was that during closed beta, the AUR price of the BPOs were dirt cheap to the point that a 40,000 AUR merc pack would let you buy an entire stockpile of BPOs (one of each at the very least). Some players even went as far as buying over a hundred units of each unique BPO knowing that all they have to do is wait for the market to open up so as to sell it for ISK to other players. BPOs for modules and weapons at the time were like 100 AUR a piece.
Then came open beta when the price of the AUR BPOs were jacked up to about 1,200 AUR (give or take 100).
Then came the news from CCP that they were going to remove the BPOs as part of an official launch of Dust (except for the BPOs that came in a merc pack) while the players get a refund of the current value of the BPOs (the jacked up prices). Someone from within the community then posted a thread calculating that he would gain between 500,000 and 1,000,000 AURUM as extra because the large stockpile of BPOs that he has were bought back when BPOs were only 100 AUR a piece.
As a result, CCP decided to just let everyone keep their BPOs (all of them) and therefore not reimburse anyone. It turned out that having such an influx of AUR magically appearing without more money involved was too problematic. |
Maken Tosch
DUST University Ivy League
3539
|
Posted - 2013.08.11 19:55:00 -
[34] - Quote
Seymor Krelborn wrote:EULA be damned!...if they change something we spent money for we should not have to jump through hoops... they should be proactive...period... sorry if I sound irate, but I think hiding behind the EULA is cowardice, and I think a consumer defending a company over there own money is foolish...
Stomp all you want. It won't change anything. The entire gaming industry has been doing this for a very long time and it's all perfectly legal. |
Maken Tosch
DUST University Ivy League
3539
|
Posted - 2013.08.11 20:03:00 -
[35] - Quote
PS: Morality takes back seat in most industries. It's been like this since the industrial revolution. It don't matter it's right or wrong. If it's legal, people will do it. |
Seymor Krelborn
DUST University Ivy League
499
|
Posted - 2013.08.11 20:12:00 -
[36] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:Seymor Krelborn wrote:EULA be damned!...if they change something we spent money for we should not have to jump through hoops... they should be proactive...period... sorry if I sound irate, but I think hiding behind the EULA is cowardice, and I think a consumer defending a company over there own money is foolish... Stomp all you want. It won't change anything. The entire gaming industry has been doing this for a very long time and it's all perfectly legal.
Im not stomping, and I resent the notion.... change comes from standing up and saying "no more!"
people throughout history have changed common practices by saying something, and doing something about it...it use to be legal to beat your wife, or own slaves, or do cocain!... it isn't anymore because people said "no more!" and I don't know if your in the loop, but there are huge legal battles going on now about consumer rights with digital products... do you want your rights? or are you ok with being a chump to big business? |
Maken Tosch
DUST University Ivy League
3539
|
Posted - 2013.08.11 20:17:00 -
[37] - Quote
Seymor Krelborn wrote:Maken Tosch wrote:Seymor Krelborn wrote:EULA be damned!...if they change something we spent money for we should not have to jump through hoops... they should be proactive...period... sorry if I sound irate, but I think hiding behind the EULA is cowardice, and I think a consumer defending a company over there own money is foolish... Stomp all you want. It won't change anything. The entire gaming industry has been doing this for a very long time and it's all perfectly legal. Im not stomping, and I resent the notion.... change comes from standing up and saying "no more!" people throughout history have changed common practices by saying something, and doing something about it...it use to be legal to beat your wife, or own slaves, or do cocain!... it isn't anymore because people said "no more!" and I don't know if your in the loop, but there are huge legal battles going on now about consumer rights with digital products... do you want your rights? or are you ok with being a chump to big business?
People thought Bill Gates and Steve Jobs helped improve the computer and music industry as a whole. They did. But now we see them as our enemy. Microsoft dominates two thirds of the PC market and are working with Apple to curb stomp any competitor from undermining their bottom line by being patent trolls. The road to hell is often paved with good intentions. |
Seymor Krelborn
DUST University Ivy League
501
|
Posted - 2013.08.11 20:20:00 -
[38] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:Seymor Krelborn wrote:Maken Tosch wrote:Seymor Krelborn wrote:EULA be damned!...if they change something we spent money for we should not have to jump through hoops... they should be proactive...period... sorry if I sound irate, but I think hiding behind the EULA is cowardice, and I think a consumer defending a company over there own money is foolish... Stomp all you want. It won't change anything. The entire gaming industry has been doing this for a very long time and it's all perfectly legal. Im not stomping, and I resent the notion.... change comes from standing up and saying "no more!" people throughout history have changed common practices by saying something, and doing something about it...it use to be legal to beat your wife, or own slaves, or do cocain!... it isn't anymore because people said "no more!" and I don't know if your in the loop, but there are huge legal battles going on now about consumer rights with digital products... do you want your rights? or are you ok with being a chump to big business? People thought Bill Gates and Steve Jobs helped improve the computer and music industry as a whole. They did. But now we see them as our enemy (their companies at least). Microsoft dominates two thirds of the PC market and are working with Apple to curb stomp any competitor from undermining their bottom line by being patent trolls. The road to hell is often paved with good intentions.
and absolute power corrupts absolutely... |
Drud Green
Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire
159
|
Posted - 2013.08.11 20:22:00 -
[39] - Quote
Closed beta merc pack..... once bitten a leopard can't change it's stripes because it's twice as shy |
Seymor Krelborn
DUST University Ivy League
501
|
Posted - 2013.08.11 20:24:00 -
[40] - Quote
Drud Green wrote:Closed beta merc pack..... once bitten a leopard can't change it's stripes because it's twice as shy
leopards have spots..... |
|
Maken Tosch
DUST University Ivy League
3540
|
Posted - 2013.08.11 20:26:00 -
[41] - Quote
Seymor Krelborn wrote: and absolute power corrupts absolutely...
But it rocks absolutely too. |
Drud Green
Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire
159
|
Posted - 2013.08.11 20:35:00 -
[42] - Quote
Seymor Krelborn wrote:Drud Green wrote:Closed beta merc pack..... once bitten a leopard can't change it's stripes because it's twice as shy leopards have spots.....
spots are roundish stripes tyvm /thread
|
ZDub 303
TeamPlayers EoN.
1600
|
Posted - 2013.08.11 20:41:00 -
[43] - Quote
What I don't understand is... why can't they just buy back the items they changed? If you want to repurchase them after the change, its only a click away.
Yeah I do buy an aurum item here and there if I need for PC matches but for sure I would never buy more than 10-15 at a time. You can't trust CCP with anything in this game.
Just look at the armored assault pack. People payed a lot of money for those tanks and then CCP nerfs them so they are WORSE than the ISK variants... so fuked up.
I have to admit, the F2P model is not serving this game well, not at all. |
Mobius Wyvern
Guardian Solutions DARKSTAR ARMY
3047
|
Posted - 2013.08.11 20:50:00 -
[44] - Quote
Seymor Krelborn wrote:Justine Oma-Lyndel wrote:Seymor Krelborn wrote:is this what CCP stands for?
I understand and support your attempts to balance items in the game.
but AUR items should not be touched!
discontinued... yes, with new versions being rebalanced, fine.
but you cant take our money and then change the properties of those bought items.
its like buying an HD tv and then the manufactures coming to your home and removing the HD.
I have not bought any new items and will not because I cant trust you wont fundamentally alter what ive bought with real money.
how do you justify doing this?
personally I have not ever bought an item you have changed except for the bp raven assault suit which was a minor change in having to skill into caldari suits to use it initially and you did that with the respec so it was not to big a deal.
what guaranty can you give us to trust you with our real money? Your logic on it is misguided. Children don't visit your TV manufacturer and say. "His TV is better than mine, make it even! Or else I'm going with Toshiba!" In a game where money is often thrown around you HAVE to keep things fair to a certain extent. Too much complaining and you lose customers, how many TV companies had this happen and had to upgrade and debug their TV? Fortunately in game items are cheap so you can KEEP buying them or going for a different AUR based weapon, good luck with a TV. Not sure how you can pass judgement on this when you haven't used it... AUR weapons are cheap, really cheap in price, you can go along with FOTM with AUR and never have to face a nerfed character. the point is when you buy something the deal is done... you cant have people pay real money for something and then arbitrarily make something else... couldn't they have achieved the same goal by simply discontinuing items? wouldn't that be more honest? So you're saying that you'd rather they eliminate the item entirely and give you a refund? |
Catina Mercia
Commando Perkone Caldari State
45
|
Posted - 2013.08.11 20:51:00 -
[45] - Quote
gbghg wrote:I always thought that the name was Cat's Control People and that cat merc is actually the CEO and is subtly trolling us and the community devs. ssshhhh |
Seymor Krelborn
DUST University Ivy League
504
|
Posted - 2013.08.11 20:55:00 -
[46] - Quote
Mobius Wyvern wrote:Seymor Krelborn wrote:Justine Oma-Lyndel wrote:Seymor Krelborn wrote:is this what CCP stands for?
I understand and support your attempts to balance items in the game.
but AUR items should not be touched!
discontinued... yes, with new versions being rebalanced, fine.
but you cant take our money and then change the properties of those bought items.
its like buying an HD tv and then the manufactures coming to your home and removing the HD.
I have not bought any new items and will not because I cant trust you wont fundamentally alter what ive bought with real money.
how do you justify doing this?
personally I have not ever bought an item you have changed except for the bp raven assault suit which was a minor change in having to skill into caldari suits to use it initially and you did that with the respec so it was not to big a deal.
what guaranty can you give us to trust you with our real money? Your logic on it is misguided. Children don't visit your TV manufacturer and say. "His TV is better than mine, make it even! Or else I'm going with Toshiba!" In a game where money is often thrown around you HAVE to keep things fair to a certain extent. Too much complaining and you lose customers, how many TV companies had this happen and had to upgrade and debug their TV? Fortunately in game items are cheap so you can KEEP buying them or going for a different AUR based weapon, good luck with a TV. Not sure how you can pass judgement on this when you haven't used it... AUR weapons are cheap, really cheap in price, you can go along with FOTM with AUR and never have to face a nerfed character. the point is when you buy something the deal is done... you cant have people pay real money for something and then arbitrarily make something else... couldn't they have achieved the same goal by simply discontinuing items? wouldn't that be more honest? So you're saying that you'd rather they eliminate the item entirely and give you a refund?
im saying that's a better option than just changing it and leaving you with something you wouldn't have bought... so yes... best option?... no... but better than what they have done.
|
ZDub 303
TeamPlayers EoN.
1601
|
Posted - 2013.08.11 21:04:00 -
[47] - Quote
Mobius Wyvern wrote:So you're saying that you'd rather they eliminate the item entirely and give you a refund?
That is exactly what they should do.
Delete the item, refund the aurum, and introduce a new rebalanced item. |
Seymor Krelborn
DUST University Ivy League
509
|
Posted - 2013.08.11 23:42:00 -
[48] - Quote
ZDub 303 wrote:Mobius Wyvern wrote:So you're saying that you'd rather they eliminate the item entirely and give you a refund? That is exactly what they should do. Delete the item, refund the aurum, and introduce a new rebalanced item.
I hope at most least they do this... |
Seymor Krelborn
DUST University Ivy League
510
|
Posted - 2013.08.12 07:21:00 -
[49] - Quote
this post will not fall into the obscurity of the many pages on the forums...
CCP owes many people compensation....no... im not one of them, but I would like to feel comfortable purchasing items again, I wont even buy a booster at this point.
CCP us why we should trust you, better yet prove we can! |
Torneido Achura
The Suicide Kingz
7
|
Posted - 2013.08.12 07:32:00 -
[50] - Quote
Seymor Krelborn wrote:RevoItZ wrote:SHUT UP I LOVE THIS GAME! I love it too... when you love something you are honest with it
No.. people usually lie, most certainly
|
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dustwaffle
Gravity Prone EoN.
310
|
Posted - 2013.08.12 07:56:00 -
[51] - Quote
Whining for the sake of whining?
CCP has an EULA in place which does state that they have the discretionary right to change ANY items in the game, and the game and everything in it belongs to CCP.
If you pay, you're paying to have access to such items.
You may claim CCP is hiding behind the EULA, but agreeing to the EULA means you agree with their terms and conditions.
Is this bad customer relations? Well, looking at the abusive language and behaviorr of people on this forum, I would say CCP are doing a pretty decent job so far. Most other gaming companies or forums would be banning people left and right for their behaviour here. In fact, if you were abusive to staff of most places IRL, you could very easily be banned from using their services or products (i.e. in a more "we don't want your money" kind of thing).
tl;dr, you agreed to the terms of the EULA and have to live with it. If you don't want to, then don't agree with the terms. |
Asirius Medaius
Planetary Response Organization Test Friends Please Ignore
199
|
Posted - 2013.08.12 09:32:00 -
[52] - Quote
Seymor Krelborn wrote:is this what CCP stands for?
I understand and support your attempts to balance items in the game.
but AUR items should not be touched!
discontinued... yes, with new versions being rebalanced, fine.
but you cant take our money and then change the properties of those bought items.
its like buying an HD tv and then the manufactures coming to your home and removing the HD.
I have not bought any new items and will not because I cant trust you wont fundamentally alter what ive bought with real money.
how do you justify doing this?
personally I have not ever bought an item you have changed except for the bp raven assault suit which was a minor change in having to skill into caldari suits to use it initially and you did that with the respec so it was not to big a deal.
what guaranty can you give us to trust you with our real money?
Edit: look at all the idiots who replied without understanding what they read... they think I bought this stuff... I didn't... I just think its bad for business and has stopped me from spending money on the game...lol
I may be one of the few people who agrees with you here, but even though I like CCP, some of their decisions haven't been the most bright; I can understand if they completely nerf an AURUM item, and they reimburse you AURUM to spend on the market...
..But leaving you with a product that you wouldn't have initially bought cause the stats are so bad (due to nerfing) only leads to distrust, skepticism, and most of all, buyers remorse, which any reasonable company with decent customer service would try to avoid. If you are already making people question whether or not the equipment you bought with AURUM is going to get nerfed to hell soon or not, it means that your business model (and gameplay, at times) is very unstable. |
KingBabar
Ancient Exiles Negative-Feedback
1045
|
Posted - 2013.08.12 09:55:00 -
[53] - Quote
Keeping within the legality or even "standard busisness practice" for this kind of product is one thing, losing me as a paying customer is still the result for my part.
I really don't care about the legality, they're not getting any more of my money when they chose to put themselves on such a low standard of business ethics.
I guess I'm not the only customer they'll lose because of this.
In the case of the direct hit nades, CCP is directly to blame IMO. The community have largely been against them for a year and in despite of this they re-introduce them. They even put them on sale and market them internally in the game. Then they decide not to "adjust them", but make them almost totally useless. Its not a mere tweak when we go from being able to carry 2 or 3 down to 1, and when the CPU/PG needs are upped from 9/2 and 18/3 to 48/6, which makes them cost as much to fit as the proto core locus nades which in terms make the contact nades totally useless for all sort of competitive play. I seriously doubt that the same fanboys that defends CCP in this matter would do the same if they made all the 1 month boosters only last for 10 days, the whole community would be in uproar. - Its so easy to laugh and point fingers at someone else's missfortune, beware.
Is this done deliberately to "earn a quick" dollar? Or are the Devs simply just not very good at this?
- In either case it seems to be the players that have to pay for it, which is a shame.
|
Seymor Krelborn
DUST University Ivy League
512
|
Posted - 2013.08.12 10:59:00 -
[54] - Quote
dustwaffle wrote:Whining for the sake of whining?
CCP has an EULA in place which does state that they have the discretionary right to change ANY items in the game, and the game and everything in it belongs to CCP.
If you pay, you're paying to have access to such items.
You may claim CCP is hiding behind the EULA, but agreeing to the EULA means you agree with their terms and conditions.
Is this bad customer relations? Well, looking at the abusive language and behaviorr of people on this forum, I would say CCP are doing a pretty decent job so far. Most other gaming companies or forums would be banning people left and right for their behaviour here. In fact, if you were abusive to staff of most places IRL, you could very easily be banned from using their services or products (i.e. in a more "we don't want your money" kind of thing).
tl;dr, you agreed to the terms of the EULA and have to live with it. If you don't want to, then don't agree with the terms.
I did agree to the terms. I was lucky not to buy an item that was changed much... I wont be buying anything now, nor will many others unless they show us we can trust them...tell me, if they erased your char, all your hard work,all the items you bought, would you still play?
if you bought an item today, and they erased it tomorrow, would you buy anything else?
sure they can do these things, and they would get a bad rep and lose business...I feel what they have done, though not as extreme falls under this kind of practice.
you should get on their payroll since defending them is worth more to you than being treated fairly... at least then you wouldn't be a chump. |
Aran Abbas
Goonfeet Top Men.
225
|
Posted - 2013.08.12 11:04:00 -
[55] - Quote
You'd be better served telling it to Metcritic. |
jingle wingle
Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2013.08.12 11:05:00 -
[56] - Quote
Seymor Krelborn wrote:I did agree to the terms. I was lucky not to buy an item that was changed much... I wont be buying anything now, nor will many others unless they show us we can trust them...tell me, if they erased your char, all your hard work,all the items you bought, would you still play? if you bought an item today, and they erased it tomorrow, would you buy anything else? sure they can do these things, and they would get a bad rep and lose business...I feel what they have done, though not as extreme falls under this kind of practice. you should get on their payroll since defending them is worth more to you than being treated fairly... at least then you wouldn't be a chump. You can easily tell when a player has run out of things to say that make sense. First and most common response, throw out an insult. |
Seymor Krelborn
DUST University Ivy League
512
|
Posted - 2013.08.12 11:07:00 -
[57] - Quote
jingle wingle wrote:Seymor Krelborn wrote:I did agree to the terms. I was lucky not to buy an item that was changed much... I wont be buying anything now, nor will many others unless they show us we can trust them...tell me, if they erased your char, all your hard work,all the items you bought, would you still play? if you bought an item today, and they erased it tomorrow, would you buy anything else? sure they can do these things, and they would get a bad rep and lose business...I feel what they have done, though not as extreme falls under this kind of practice. you should get on their payroll since defending them is worth more to you than being treated fairly... at least then you wouldn't be a chump. You can easily tell when a player has run out of things to say that make sense. First and most common response, throw out an insult. EDIT: Second, start using strawmen arguments.
not an insult... by chump I mean letting a company take advantage of you. |
jingle wingle
Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation
0
|
Posted - 2013.08.12 11:10:00 -
[58] - Quote
Seymor Krelborn wrote:jingle wingle wrote:Seymor Krelborn wrote:I did agree to the terms. I was lucky not to buy an item that was changed much... I wont be buying anything now, nor will many others unless they show us we can trust them...tell me, if they erased your char, all your hard work,all the items you bought, would you still play? if you bought an item today, and they erased it tomorrow, would you buy anything else? sure they can do these things, and they would get a bad rep and lose business...I feel what they have done, though not as extreme falls under this kind of practice. you should get on their payroll since defending them is worth more to you than being treated fairly... at least then you wouldn't be a chump. You can easily tell when a player has run out of things to say that make sense. First and most common response, throw out an insult. EDIT: Second, start using strawmen arguments. not an insult... by chump I mean letting a company take advantage of you. Yep, point proven. |
Seymor Krelborn
DUST University Ivy League
515
|
Posted - 2013.08.12 11:20:00 -
[59] - Quote
jingle wingle wrote:Seymor Krelborn wrote:jingle wingle wrote:Seymor Krelborn wrote:I did agree to the terms. I was lucky not to buy an item that was changed much... I wont be buying anything now, nor will many others unless they show us we can trust them...tell me, if they erased your char, all your hard work,all the items you bought, would you still play? if you bought an item today, and they erased it tomorrow, would you buy anything else? sure they can do these things, and they would get a bad rep and lose business...I feel what they have done, though not as extreme falls under this kind of practice. you should get on their payroll since defending them is worth more to you than being treated fairly... at least then you wouldn't be a chump. You can easily tell when a player has run out of things to say that make sense. First and most common response, throw out an insult. EDIT: Second, start using strawmen arguments. not an insult... by chump I mean letting a company take advantage of you. Yep, point proven.
prove your point by adding something viable and thoughtful to the conversation...
let me be clear. I love this game and its community im also an eve player and enjoy that game. I think what CCP is trying to do is ground breaking and they have my full support. that doesn't mean I will defend them blindly I have defended them many times in threads, im not a dooms day sayer and I have the patience to stick with them through this rough patch.
but, what they did here is WRONG regardless of its legality. its bad business its dishonest and CCP is better than this imho. they should fix their mistake and compensate people who are supporting their endeavor not jip them... anyone who cant see this and flings the EULA around like some get out of jail free card is a chump... they are letting a company take advantage of them and then acting like one of their public relations people instead of letting them speak for themselves... its for you, the chumps, as well as the more objective people I am trying to fight for here. what extremes would CCP have to go to before you would stop throwing yourself under the bus for them? lets draw the line here, because, mark my words, if we let them get away with this, the next time they will try to get away with more.... |
jingle wingle
Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation
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Posted - 2013.08.12 11:23:00 -
[60] - Quote
Seymor Krelborn wrote:prove your point by adding something viable and thoughtful to the conversation...
let me be clear. I love this game and its community im also an eve player and enjoy that game. I think what CCP is trying to do is ground breaking and they have my full support. that doesn't mean I will defend them blindly I have defended them many times in threads, im not a dooms day sayer and I have the patience to stick with them through this rough patch.
but, what they did here is WRONG regardless of its legality. its bad business its dishonest and CCP is better than this imho. they should fix their mistake and compensate people who are supporting their endeavor not jip them... anyone who cant see this and flings the EULA around like some get out of jail free card is a chump... they are letting a company take advantage of them and then acting like one of their public relations people instead of letting them speak for themselves... its for you, the chumps, as well as the more objective people I am trying to fight for here. what extremes would CCP have to go to before you would stop throwing yourself under the bus for them? lets draw the line here, because, mark my words, if we let them get away with this, the next time they will try to get away with more....
As an EVE player, do you ask for respecs when they rebalance stuff around?
You pay for game time. Say you train Capital ships 5 or something long like that which takes a month or more. CCP nerfs capital ships. You paid 15 bucks for a month's subscription.
Do you ask for 15 bucks refund?
EDIT: Just so I know where you're coming from. |
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