You're the scrub, quit trying to troll. You fail

You've finally seen the light praise the lord!

On a serious side note scout shotgun only works in pubs not in pc matches, pretty sure if you want to use it in a pc match you have to be a cal assault.

scout + Mass Driver .. this should end well

I advise using the Assault Mass Driver variant!!!

Spelling like that you are already pretty scrubby.

/failmore

Its easy mode no matter where you are unless they above you which would be your own fault..the only people that don't think its easy are people who can't use it

LOL oooookk flaylock steve xD. Or should I say gaylock? gtfo

The skill in using the MD is not in "gun game" but in getting yourself in the right place at the right time. Of course it's easy when you can approach an opponent at his most vulnerable moments/locations. That's how the game should be.

The reason so many people don't like the mass driver, is because if someone using it has got the drop on you, you've probably already lost, and you don't get to rely on your l33t Kb/m skillz to land 10 headshots on them. Too bad for you.

Now HTFU.

Logi+ MD is a hard counter for scout + shotty. I think that is working as intended. The gun naturally lends itself to the idea... Medium splash/medium damage weapon vs a fast moving weakly shielded target... If you are going to make an argument for nerfing MD it shouldn't include any reference to the scout suit...

For the +10 Troll Points: Nerf Rock! Scissors is fine.

It isn't countering everything. If anything, grenades are countering everything... And there are a lot of shots that are in fact difficult. Sure, there are some easy ones too, but I disagree about not seeing any "Bad mass driver users"... There sure are some. And there are good ones too. Favorite examples are Alldin last patch and Kaughst this. Guys are clearly more capable with the weapon than most. If people can be clearly better then there must be a skill element to it. People are clearly worse too.

It is very easy to kill yourself and your teammates at the ranges you speak of. Most of the shots in that range have to be very precise, so as to only damage the intended target.

i get killed by murder taxi's and kamehameha guns (forge's) than m/d's. And they **** me more.

Your the SOB that sent me mail calling me a ***! Plus you made fun of my Corp.

What the hell was that about? You never even told me why you were such a jerk.

Sure you have control over it, but there are tons of shots that you just can't take because of the limitations of the weapon. There have been countless times that I have had to hold up on a shot that I could take with any other gun because I would kill either myself or my teammate with the shots. Sometimes I go for a shot with a very narrow window in which I can only hurt my intended target , and the target shifts into a direct impact, killing me and the target and potentially damaging allies. Friendly drop uplinks are sometimes casualties of positioning and a careless MD shot can detonate friendly REs. A 1% angle shift can mean the difference between life and death.

So it is sweeping the battlefield as the best players use it and are good with it and it is easy mode. But there is some risk involved. But it is easy mode. I haven't seen "all the best" players run to the mass driver in any case. Most still use AR or HMG or Shotty. The players that I have seen using the MD since chromosome are still the ones that seem to be doing the best. In my corp, we usually only bring one MD, on rare occasion two MDs. A few of your guys have picked It up (No issue!), but they only use it part time. Most MDs I have seen was by Pro Hic and it was mostly used as a defensive weapon to suppress pushes. Regular Trooper is really good with his fluxes and did the best on his team most of the time. Another player that has been using the gun for many months now...

Agree 100% about flux grenades. All grenades except contact should have 2 max ammo and grenades should use up more nanite clusters.

I am well aware of my team makeup in most matches. Tonight we had a gentleman from synergy helping us out that did part time MD and part time shotgun. This is uncommon and is usually not the case. Sometimes we have Mcfurious using MD as well. Like I said, at most two... but usually just me. I certainly don't see that as "the best players in the game"... not by a long shot.

MD clip is 6 BTW. The situations you are talking about are AWFUL for an assault mass driver. The Freedom MD is the one that you should be using in any argument regarding short range balance of the MD and it's Direct-Impact-Everytime DPS is still much lower than that of the AR or HMG. Reloads are long and frequent.

Grenades are an issue. The MD is not. Any perceived problems with the MD would be quickly addressed by a grenade-equip nerf.

I am sorry that tone doesn't translate well through the internet. I was being a bit sarcastic when I was saying it was easy mode. Was trying to reorganize your text to point out how that statement was dubious. I failed in that regard.

If you get direct impacted by a MD while in armor you are probably going to die... and should. If you get hit by 6 rounds from a prototype MD you should also die... That is SIX WHOLE SECONDS that you could have killed the guy in. AR could do it in 3..

Didn't say that Point Blank was awful for MDs... I said they were awful for assault MDs (A subclass) and that you shouldn't be basing any arguments concerning CQC MD balance on them.

I got 2 exos on a commando. too fun

[quote=Exmaple Core]
but you're not mad when you are out on open ground for 2 seconds and get 1-2 shotted by a forge and one shotted by a thales/proto sniper or hit by a taxi? See all those would be more difficult to hit on a shotty scout, so you have an advantage their. I stick out like a ******* christmas tree and can't avoid them cause I'm slow as **** if I want more than 450 EHP.

[quote=Exmaple Core]

If you eat a nade, you are probably going to lose the engagement regardless of the weapon the guy is using. MD just is the naturally compliment to flux grenades. Once again; the problem is with grenades, not the mass driver.

Assualt MD do less overall DPS, offer little advantage in % of hits, and have a higher suicide-dead zone than the standard variants. They also have higher ISK and equip costs. They are inferior in PC CQC and you should be cleaning them up with your scout shotgun.

crying works. tried and tru. get enough pussies on here crying and youll have your nerf

Admittedly, the hit detection for splash weapons is better than it is for line-fire ones. I contest that it is a counter for everything -- Well tanked assaults and Logis will win most fights when they get the jump. If I have enough time to flux or position myself, I will kill them most of the time... Pretty balanced.

It used to be a counter to heavies, but they all seem to be stacking CRAZY HP now-a-day. usually takes right around a full clip... 6 shots and you might kill them, 7 and you are screwed. All the while you are trying to stay out of their LoS. Not easy.

Don't really think scouts are a good example anyway... Seem to be weak in a lot of situations, not just against the MD.

I don't see everyone switching to the MD. Surely it's usage has gone up, but that is to be expected with a balance buff and the high profie threads complaining about it on the forums. Rule #15 of the forums is stated thus: " If you say that something is overpowered on the forums, more people will use it".

[quote=Exmaple Core]

If you don't have time to flux, caldaris, heavies and anyone with 3-4 shield extenders is VERY difficult to kill. A Basic mass driver is going to have a ton of trouble even breaking their shields. I think the flaylock and MD is a fair comparison in some way... We the forum warrior used the flaylock/MD comparison to justify our calls for the flaylock nerf... Facts were that it was MUCH stronger than the MD for much lower equip costs. Can't say that the MD is anywhere near as powerful as the flaylock was... Just not true. Also no where near "Chromosome laser overpowered". Fused gernades did as much damage as a MD clip in 2 seconds, at ridiculously low requirements... in a higher splash area.

I think the popularity is fueled by the flux/md combo.
Decreasing max grenade count to 2(from 3) on flux and locust and increasing their resupply nanite cluster cost should be enough to combat this. It would also help limit "Splash stack" which the MD benefits greatly from.

The more splash damage in the game, the more effective they are. Limiting grenades will likewise limit the MD. A core locust + 1 MD round is much more effective than either one alone. A ton of splash damage is oppressive and stifles gameplay. This is something that the player base figured out through flaylock/fused/flux spam last month. Pretty clear how you can get a similar effect with Flux/locust/MD... Limit the nades first before the MD. It will preserve the diversity of the game better, as grenades are a very popular drop suit slot anyway and they are really strong since you stopped throwing them all limp armed in the build before chromosome.

Oh wow, this thread turned into an actually thoughtful discussion about the current situation of the Mass Driver. Makes me feel bad for my stupid response on the first page, sorry about that.

I think the splash radius should go back to what it was in Uprising 1.0. They buffed it at the same time as the hit detection fix without taking the time to see what effect the fix would have. For reference's sake, I think back then the range for the standard variant was 3 to 3.4, whereas now it's 4 to 4.4.

As far as splash damage, I think that a fix people have proposed that changes the spread based on the distance from the center of the blast makes the most sense. I think lowering the splash before something like that is implemented would be premature, as I think this would fix a lot of people's concerns with the Mass Driver. It just doesn't feel good or cool to be caught at the very edge of the splash radius, but then magically take full splash damage (This goes for other explosives as well).