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Jack McReady
DUST University Ivy League
343
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 07:31:00 -
[1] - Quote
ok, I just started to play a bit of dust after a break and after a few matches I saw that
1. all the pros run in caldari suits spamming core grenades... 2. nice, those grenades one shot my armor tanked proto suit with proto tank mods 3. awesome, shields recharge during a firefight even when they are hit. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=88305&find=unread
how I am supposed to win against that? a caldari suit not only has huge shield pool and faster movement speed (lolstrafe) than my armor tanked suit, the shields also recharge at massive amounts per second during the firefight due to a bug... and this is known for 2 months and not fixed yet? oh and the grenades
trolololo |
Jack McReady
DUST University Ivy League
343
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 07:50:00 -
[2] - Quote
I see some people cannot read and hung up on the grenade part.... let me repeat this slowly for you: shields recharge while you get hit because the recharge delay is not working properly
what about "is not working properly" that you dont understand. I find it amusing how people give me "advice" to counter a bug to save their crutches. |
Jack McReady
DUST University Ivy League
343
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 07:57:00 -
[3] - Quote
Vicious Minotaur wrote:There is an imbalance, you are correct. However, with the right tactics, and/or the right weapon, you can counter them (somewhat).
imbalance? more like game breaking issue when shields recharge while they are hit. |
Jack McReady
DUST University Ivy League
344
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 09:42:00 -
[4] - Quote
Catina Mercia wrote:Jade Hasegawa wrote:Jack McReady wrote:I see some people cannot read and hung up on the grenade part.... let me repeat this slowly for you: shields recharge while you get hit because the recharge delay is not working properly
what about "is not working properly" that you dont understand. I find it amusing how people give me "advice" to counter a bug to save their crutches. Mine works normaly, it dont regen when im getting hit and I run caldari assualt armour Video or it didn't happen. This was tested a thousand times, and your regeneration starts even after your just got hit.
Cat Merc this, you dont even have to test it, just watching your own or enemies shield bars during gunfights is enough as long as it wasnt fully depleted. no one has 100% accuracy and misses in between thus you will sooner or later see how your own or enemies shield raises between hits and I doubt that the shield recharge delay of suits is 0.5seconds or less.
currently you are better off in a std caldari suit than in any proto armor tanked suit. |
Jack McReady
DUST University Ivy League
344
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 10:10:00 -
[5] - Quote
Leovarian L Lavitz wrote:Flux grenades are a hard counter to shields at the moment. There is also a lesser known hard counter: The Plasma Cannon. The Plasma cannon will insta-gib any regulated caldari suit with its splash. It'll drop duel-tanked caldari suits into about half armor, though. another one defending a bug because he cant fight without a crutch. the obvious lie is also amazing, 300 splash damage and he claims he instagib caldari suits with it |
Jack McReady
DUST University Ivy League
344
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 10:45:00 -
[6] - Quote
THEAMAZING POTHEAD wrote:The bug is simply this, when shields are hit the delay starts the timer, however the timer does not reset when damaged, however as soon as the recharging starts, if the suit is damaged, the recharge will stop and the timer will reset once again.
The OP is trying to make it sound like you will be recharging shields even under fire, this is simply untrue. I am a caldari myself, and i dont have a problem killing other shield users because i understand this, since the bug cause them the quick initial recharge i simply do some tiny bit of damage once they start the recharge, to stop it & delay the shields once again. Its very easy to exploit shields weaknesses. another crutch defender. in a gunfight, the armor tanked suits shields get depleted first, caldari suit runs behind cover for a short time and regains huge hp almost instantly. the armor tanked suit gets nothing because of depleted delay and will not be able to catch up with the caldari suits mobility to continue shooting him. this is not outplaying but simply abusing the recharge delay bug cause the armor tanked suit has no time to catch up and he cant run away because the caldari suit is faster.
the only way to stop this from happening is hitting the suit with the flux in which case the caldari suit can simply run away from any armor tanked suit. also hitting those lolspeed caldari suits with a flux is not easy to begin with.
so please get real... |
Jack McReady
DUST University Ivy League
345
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 10:59:00 -
[7] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Doesn't the OP see complaints about the mass driver on GD? they cry because you can get hit around corners when you try to instantly recharge shields in safety
ReGnYuM wrote: Maybe you should ask for permission from your leaders before you start making stupid posts.
1. Caldari is no longer the master race suit.
2. I know a number of players who make armour tanking viable
3. You have absolutely no idea about what you're talking about.
so, you claim that the bug does not exist and grenades cannot one shot proto armor suits with proto tank mods, when it is clearly the case?
so, when my post is stupid then yours reaches a new level of stupidity, in which case we would have to invent a new word for it. |
Jack McReady
DUST University Ivy League
345
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 11:06:00 -
[8] - Quote
Leovarian L Lavitz wrote: I believe you are mistaken about what I am saying and have I believe you have never actually used a plasma cannon in combat with a positive kd.
I do not need to use a plasma cannon, I can read numbers and do the math and everyone else that can instantly sees that this is an obvious lie. unfitted STD caldari suits against a proto cannon with proto dmg mods obviously does not count as argument |
Jack McReady
DUST University Ivy League
345
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 11:12:00 -
[9] - Quote
Leovarian L Lavitz wrote:Jack McReady wrote:Leovarian L Lavitz wrote: I believe you are mistaken about what I am saying and have I believe you have never actually used a plasma cannon in combat with a positive kd.
I do not need to use a plasma cannon, I can read numbers and do the math and everyone else that can instantly sees that this is an obvious lie. unfitted STD caldari suits against a proto cannon with proto dmg mods obviously does not count as argument https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1153518#post1153518 you claim you can one shot shield tanke caldari suits with the splash damage (which obviously isnt true) and then you post an absolutely unrelated link with no proof? |
Jack McReady
DUST University Ivy League
345
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 11:21:00 -
[10] - Quote
Leovarian L Lavitz wrote: Why are you so upset? I didn't come to your thread to disagree with you about the shield recharge bug, I came to offer a solution until the dev team get it fixed. I get the feeling that you think I've come here to defend the mechanic when I haven't. You claim that I'm here telling fibs when all I offer is my recent experience with various weapon systems verses the bug by offering advice on the more successful at defeating those who would rely on the crutch for their success.
I am not upset but amazed about the defensive posts regarding an obvious bug. also how do you expect me to listen to advice from someone that claims that you can instagib shield tanked caldari suits with the plasma cannon with the splash damage?
Leovarian L Lavitz wrote:.... There is also a lesser known hard counter: The Plasma Cannon. The Plasma cannon will insta-gib any regulated caldari suit with its splash. .... |
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Jack McReady
DUST University Ivy League
346
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 13:07:00 -
[11] - Quote
Brolaire of Asstoria wrote:Question for the OP seeing as he seem to have done extensive research on this... Is the glitch just with Caldari suits or do any of the other suits suffer...sorry benefit from the same glitch? Oh and as for every "pro" and their dog using and abusing the Cal suits, I see plenty of the other racial variants running around at the mo. I'd like to see some actual numbers but Gallente Assault/Logi seems to be more prevalent atm. Amarr Logi here btw. the bug exists on all suits but shield tanked ones benefit the most from it because: -armor tanked suits have less shield hp, thus in a gunfight they get hit with the depleted delay alot earlier than a shield tanked suit. -caldari suits are faster than armor tanked suits which means they can cover to quickly recover alot of shields as long as they are not getting the depleted delay.
to sum it: armor tanked suits dont have the shield hp pool and speed to actually abuse in the way that shield tanked suits can.
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Jack McReady
DUST University Ivy League
351
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 13:44:00 -
[12] - Quote
xxwhitedevilxx M wrote:Actually what you're experiencing here, imo, is "just" lag and bad hit detection. happens the same thing if you shield tank with amarr or minmatar. I know it's annoying but i gotta say it once again : "don't hate the player hate the game". This game's got too many HP, none would ever notice this "lag" or bad hit detection if the game actually permit a max of 200-300 HP. sure, lag and hit detection causes shields to recharge during gunfight... riiiiight that would be a massive lag of several seconds... my internet is not hamster powered and, if you dont know yet, you can set that you get matched with your own region for public matches (which I have). no one is going to buy that argument.
xxwhitedevilxx M wrote:He probably never actually tried a Callogi compared to other drop suits. An Amarr Assault could get the same HP with much less money spent, for instance. Gallente Assault/Logi is an incredible DPS machine with a great armor tank. Amarr logi is at the moment and in my opinion the best choice. incredible dps isnt worth that much when you cant apply it cause grenades instagib you while you try to dodge them due to slow speed. or simply because you have low speed and cant chase someone down that is running for cover.
additionally, have YOU actually tried the amarr logi? I have it at lvl5 and the proto logi is as slow as a heavy after you tank it up.
xxwhitedevilxx M wrote: 1 10 out of 16 are Caldari logi PRO, just because it used to be the best suit. I mean, to get the PRO level for another armor, you need more or less 2 mln SP.
if someone would bother they could actually aquire the required the SP to get into another suit in those months but since it is not worth it no on actually bothers to do so. |
Jack McReady
DUST University Ivy League
354
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 14:05:00 -
[13] - Quote
Zendeal wrote:I believe the OP misunderstands how the bug works. Other posters are correct. Damage occurs and the timer starts, if more damage is added after the time starts it has no effect. Once the timer expires shields then begin recharging (Cal having the highest recharge base of all suits excluding scout) As the recharge ticks away if ANY damage occurs during the recharge the whole process starts up again.
What I believe is happening is that the initial damage occurs and the player hides for 3-5 seconds then pops back out and the massive recharge begins during the gunfight. Then due to aim, dodging, luck, whatever you cant manage to hit them again for a few seconds. In this time the Cal player has probably regenerated 100 or so shields.This seems unfair but it works the same for EVERYONE.
No infantry ever recharges shields while they are taking damage. Your complaint is regarding specific builds that utilize shields with Energizers and Regulators and the proper use of cover tactics. I do not disagree that this provides shield tanking a huge advantage over armour tanking and that the bug on the timer needs to be tweaked, but this is NOT a gamebreaking issue nor is it specific to on type of suit.
how I am wrong about the bug? you just repeated it by yourself. recharge delay does not kick in unless the next recharge starts.
your are missing the point. also it is not about specific builds but regular armor vs. regular shield tanks. and yes it is specific to shield tanked suits because suits with lower shield pool have much less benefit because of it. they side effect of having a lower shield hp pool is getting hit with depleted delay alot faster. |
Jack McReady
DUST University Ivy League
355
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 15:29:00 -
[14] - Quote
xxwhitedevilxx M wrote:I do bother, I just don't have enough SP yet. And I have both passive and active boosters- Anyway it's lag/hit detection, that's it. Moreover, have you tried flux, scrambler or lasers on that? flux grenades are terrific against shields and have an enormous blast radius. Imperial Scrambler melts shields. Lasers are pretty good if you know how to use them. edit: save your tears, when everyone will get The Caldari Assault PRO.... I fully expected such a response from a member of a corp that runs proto caldari suits in pub matches standing on hives spamming core grenades and disconnecting should the shiny 300k isk suit die
obvious crutch saving attempt is obvious.
counters are fine and all, bugs are not thus your point is null and void.
Happy Violentime wrote:So.....
Does this 'bug' not also work for the Minmitar assault? Almost same shield hp as the cal, but moves faster - why no QQ for that? Or are you just a Caldari racist? Really? You're just crying cos you made the wrong suit choice. caldari suit was just an example. also in the whole thread i was referring to "shield tanked suits" not caldari specifc. from such an answer of no value I conclude that you are just another player wanting to safe his crutch otherwise you would have read the thread if you were actually interested to provide some real arguments. |
Jack McReady
DUST University Ivy League
359
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 15:43:00 -
[15] - Quote
xxwhitedevilxx M wrote:Nobody in my corp uses core grenades, and, personally, I'm fine with M1. Anyway, I'm speccing into Caldari Assault right now, and then, i'll probably spec into amarr assault. That's just because i think Amarr Assault if way better that Caldari, but you're free to think whatever you want. After all, i don't have to explain anything to you. I don't know whoever gave you this vision of maphia clan...one guy said that we only rail snipe. The other one said that we only uses mass drivers. Now you say we only throw grenades....just try to find some kind of agreement between yourselves.... sure no one does that in your corp, except the full proto squad that I saw yesterday spamming core grenades against std suits in a pub match. and then, a few died and the whole sqaud disconnected ....
you can call me a liar, wont change the fact that you havent brought up any valid argument regarding this topic. it is a fact that the bug gives shield tanked suits few extra hp in gunfights additionally to their other advantages they already have. there is no argument you can bring up against it, any attempt is futile. this threads purpose is to get as many troll responses from people relying on the crutch to get the DEVS attention. |
Jack McReady
DUST University Ivy League
359
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 15:47:00 -
[16] - Quote
Happy Violentime wrote:Jack McReady wrote:xxwhitedevilxx M wrote:I do bother, I just don't have enough SP yet. And I have both passive and active boosters- Anyway it's lag/hit detection, that's it. Moreover, have you tried flux, scrambler or lasers on that? flux grenades are terrific against shields and have an enormous blast radius. Imperial Scrambler melts shields. Lasers are pretty good if you know how to use them. edit: save your tears, when everyone will get The Caldari Assault PRO.... I fully expected such a response from a member of a corp that runs proto caldari suits in pub matches standing on hives spamming core grenades and disconnecting should the shiny 300k isk suit die obvious crutch saving attempt is obvious. counters are fine and all, bugs are not thus your point is null and void. Happy Violentime wrote:So.....
Does this 'bug' not also work for the Minmitar assault? Almost same shield hp as the cal, but moves faster - why no QQ for that? Or are you just a Caldari racist? Really? You're just crying cos you made the wrong suit choice. caldari suit was just an example. also in the whole thread i was referring to "shield tanked suits" not caldari specifc. from such an answer of no value I conclude that you are just another player wanting to safe his crutch otherwise you would have read the thread if you were actually interested to provide some real arguments. Why don't you do something useful like write a ticket then instead of crying on the forums like a baby? I'm an llav driver, nothing I hit recharges ever lol + I have no suit skills yet (waiting for content) you muppet! I ahve already filled out several tickets, the thread is just a bonus to get attention :) |
Jack McReady
DUST University Ivy League
362
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 15:59:00 -
[17] - Quote
Wakko03 wrote:How do I know this is now a troll with a touch of flame & bait thread.... you claim that someone has to actively disconnect from a match when the psn and ccp servers are doing it far more effectively lately.
Yeah I use proto grenades and nano-hives, either get on my level or stop complaining about them, ccp's nerfs to my suits mean that is one of my few options left to me, and I only stop the 4-6 proto coming at me in a massive blob it is not like I do more than stall the attack. Hey it means that the LAV guy or tank can take full advantage or the situation. Oh and most of the players I am squading up with have less than 8 million in skill points, I don't see you taking it easy on them, why should I take it easy on you. is that your response regarding a bug that gives shield tanked suits extra hp in a gunfight? |
Jack McReady
DUST University Ivy League
363
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 16:10:00 -
[18] - Quote
Happy Violentime wrote: Good, now STFU! Cos you actually have zero proof that this bug exists (another thread with anecdotal evidence is not proof)
zero proof? lets see....
Catina Mercia wrote: This was tested a thousand times, and your regeneration starts even after your just got hit.
Cat Merc
Vickers S Grunt wrote:yeh its a bug and it is slightly annoying but as a proto G logi and assault i can say it is no where near the problem u are making it out to be ......just chuck down a allotek and u have more regen than he ever will
J Lav wrote:I'm not sure about the shield thing, I hit a guy in a caldari proto suit (not sure if logi or assault) with a flux last night and it took off half his shields. I assume it just nicked him, however I was throwing a second just in case. By the time the second one went off, his shields had recharged to full in the midst of the fight. That seems a little messed up.
Zendeal wrote:Damage occurs and the timer starts, if more damage is added after the time starts it has no effect. Once the timer expires shields then begin recharging (Cal having the highest recharge base of all suits excluding scout)
and finally, alreayd looked into by devs (for over a month now with no fix): https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=987925#post987925
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Jack McReady
DUST University Ivy League
363
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 16:11:00 -
[19] - Quote
Wakko03 wrote:NOPe don't need to respond to this as ccp already stated it is working as intended across all the suits back during the beta, as people keep telling me, it is the suit you choose, your choice has a +/- all of its own.
All this means is that should I run across you in game, I will be sure to suicide cook if not outright kill you with a core locus.
HAVE you mentioned what suit you are using/ weapons/ tools, so everyone can rip your little set-up apart? there was never such a response. the response you are talking about is about scouts suits having high recharge rate and too low recharge delay and this was already changed long time ago. |
Jack McReady
DUST University Ivy League
363
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 16:30:00 -
[20] - Quote
Catina Mercia wrote:ReGnYuM wrote:Good work Jack!
Next time you should think before your post. What happens next is entirely up to you. Everytime you say something stupid, offensive, and just straight up QQ. I am going to attack one of your districts and sieze it. If Dust Uni owns zero land then just makes you irelivent in my eyes and feedback void I actually agree to a point. He made it seem like the bug is a dramatic advantage to shields. While it's just an annoyance. it actually gives a few extra HP during a gunfight. you dont actually have to go for cover to benefit from it, it also happens mid fight. I would say that some extra hp is beyond an annoyance. |
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Jack McReady
DUST University Ivy League
368
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Posted - 2013.08.09 16:36:00 -
[21] - Quote
HARDFACTS DUSTTRUTH wrote:An armor suit in the right hands can take out a Caldari suit with ease. Armor can have loads more hit points and stack damage mods, slap a flux on the suit and there you have it. DEAD caldari. Learn how to counter the things before you come screaming nerf noob. If a caldari suit kills you first toe to toe its because you suck and need to learn how to aim. hey look, we havent heard that "argument" yet and it was never trashed before. but thanks anyway for bumping my thread with a trollpost, your attempt to derail this thread just failed and you served me well as it will just bring more attention. |
Jack McReady
DUST University Ivy League
375
|
Posted - 2013.08.09 20:39:00 -
[22] - Quote
Glad to see that not everyone runs the tunnelvision mode. |
Jack McReady
DUST University Ivy League
378
|
Posted - 2013.08.10 21:33:00 -
[23] - Quote
xxwhitedevilxx M wrote:Jack McReady wrote:xxwhitedevilxx M wrote:Nobody in my corp uses core grenades, and, personally, I'm fine with M1. Anyway, I'm speccing into Caldari Assault right now, and then, i'll probably spec into amarr assault. That's just because i think Amarr Assault if way better that Caldari, but you're free to think whatever you want. After all, i don't have to explain anything to you. I don't know whoever gave you this vision of maphia clan...one guy said that we only rail snipe. The other one said that we only uses mass drivers. Now you say we only throw grenades....just try to find some kind of agreement between yourselves.... sure no one does that in your corp, except the full proto squad that I saw yesterday spamming core grenades against std suits in a pub match. and then, a few died and the whole sqaud disconnected .... Not trolling, just stating the truth... you "saw" a whole maphia squad "disconnecting" and "spamming core locus nades", but, my friend you are a liar. Both because we only play on EU battle server (i rarely see any guy from "Dust University") and because up to now we just can't fill a full squad. "Yesterday". Almost the entire corp left two months ago. "Yesterday". We only have one guy with full logi caldari proto, Core locus grenades and mass driver. Maybe you're trying to tell me that you know Maphia Clan more than its own CEO? Please than, I would gladly give up my role in your favor. I brought to your attention more than just one valid reasoning. You just don't want to understand, you just lie trying to put some sense to your delusion. Damn, i shouldn't even be here answering...it's like talking to a wall Cool story bro, anyway thanks for the bump with your answer unrelated to the topic :) |
Jack McReady
DUST University Ivy League
379
|
Posted - 2013.08.11 19:59:00 -
[24] - Quote
I predict new FOTM... caldari assaults with mass driver. oh wait its already happening ingame :)
big shields, plenty slots for stamina mods cause you shield tank anyway.. bunny hop around, rarely get hit due to hit detection issues and spam nades at the enemies feet and regenerate shields incombat due to the recharge delay bug...
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