DUST Search - [request] Mass Driver Minimum Arming Distance

Cross Atu wrote:

McFurious wrote:

Idea from RydogV in another mass driver *****-a-thon thread:

RydogV wrote:

Incorporate a minimum number of "twists" or minimum distance the projectile has to travel before it is armed and will explode. This is a simple feature of most real world grenade launchers as a safety measure and will help ensure the weapon cannot be used as some kind of super-shotgun. It keeps the weapon locked into mid-range combat. You can still give the projectile some damage capability if you get a direct hit at close range...just not explosive damage..

Basically the MD round won't "explode" within the minimum distance and will only deal direct damage to someone if the round hits them. Seems like an idea that should have been in the game already.

I'd say the minimum distance should be 5 meters since that's the highest blast radius of the weapon but perhaps it could be even further. What do you all think?

I think a better solution would be to get the "flat" splash damage fixed. If explosions were occurring in a sphere rather than a circle the CQC value of explosives would be reduced for any player who does not wish to commit suicide.

I'm also dubious about taking more choices out of the players hands, making it "you can't shoot within X range" is a lot more heavy handed than "if you shoot within X range you'll blow yourself up". If we're talking "real world" there's very little reason for an immortal clone solider to have the kind of safety feature described because their loss factor is all in ISK and sometimes it's more effective to take a loss of your own gear while destroying that of the hostile force, so for clones in disposable bodies it just doesn't make sense.

The other, and much bigger issue, is that the MD is a suppression weapon which has been under Uprising geared more and more towards direct/'slayer' combat. This is very much the wrong direction to be taking the MD. Making it more focused on direct/high damage and less on moderate/dispersion (aka splash) damage puts the weapon more and more into direct competition with other offerings in regards to its battlefield role. Dust needs more diversity not less, changes which make the MD function more like the AR in role are going to be bad changes, if they fill the same role or nearly the same role the direct competition will nearly always render one of them fundamentally inferior, replacing greater game diversity (as is the case with the more area denial MD of Chrome) with greater game imbalance (as will be the case if the MD is biased into be a direct/'slayer' primary weapon).

0.02 ISK
Cross


Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 1 post(s)
Jathniel G I A N T EoN. 766	Posted - 2013.08.11 20:40:00 - [1] - Quote I'm not a MD user but... If this is implemented then the damage done by the mass driver must be overall increased. Like 15%. A point blank hit should blow the ever-living fk out of you. Shields or not. BUT N1ck Comeau wrote: How about all mass driver rounds have a timer, but if they hit someone else they explode on impact. Makes sense it is the future after all. This guy has a good idea, but I would modify it. If the mass driver is fired within the "safety range" the explosives go to timer. That said, splash damage should be INCREASED, as a caveat.
Jathniel G I A N T EoN. 766	Posted - 2013.08.11 20:55:00 - [2] - Quote Cross Atu wrote: McFurious wrote: Idea from RydogV in another mass driver ***-a-thon thread: RydogV wrote:** Incorporate a minimum number of "twists" or minimum distance the projectile has to travel before it is armed and will explode. This is a simple feature of most real world grenade launchers as a safety measure and will help ensure the weapon cannot be used as some kind of super-shotgun. It keeps the weapon locked into mid-range combat. You can still give the projectile some damage capability if you get a direct hit at close range...just not explosive damage.. Basically the MD round won't "explode" within the minimum distance and will only deal direct damage to someone if the round hits them. Seems like an idea that should have been in the game already. I'd say the minimum distance should be 5 meters since that's the highest blast radius of the weapon but perhaps it could be even further. What do you all think? I think a better solution would be to get the "flat" splash damage fixed. If explosions were occurring in a sphere rather than a circle the CQC value of explosives would be reduced for any player who does not wish to commit suicide. I'm also dubious about taking more choices out of the players hands, making it "you can't shoot within X range" is a lot more heavy handed than "if you shoot within X range you'll blow yourself up". If we're talking "real world" there's very little reason for an immortal clone solider to have the kind of safety feature described because their loss factor is all in ISK and sometimes it's more effective to take a loss of your own gear while destroying that of the hostile force, so for clones in disposable bodies it just doesn't make sense. The other, and much bigger issue, is that the MD is a suppression weapon which has been under Uprising geared more and more towards direct/'slayer' combat. This is very much the wrong direction to be taking the MD. Making it more focused on direct/high damage and less on moderate/dispersion (aka splash) damage puts the weapon more and more into direct competition with other offerings in regards to its battlefield role. Dust needs more diversity not less, changes which make the MD function more like the AR in role are going to be bad changes, if they fill the same role or nearly the same role the direct competition will nearly always render one of them fundamentally inferior, replacing greater game diversity (as is the case with the more area denial MD of Chrome) with greater game imbalance (as will be the case if the MD is biased into be a direct/'slayer' primary weapon). 0.02 ISK Cross I don't understand what you're saying Cross. Having the flat explosive system work more as a sphere would simply make the explosives work that much more effectively. The diameter of the explosion is still the same whether it's an actual radial sphere or not. That would in no way diminish it's cqc value. The reason the MD is being used as a slayer weapon is because its stats allow for that. This goes all the way back to Replication. When the mass driver was first introduced it didn't have enough rounds in the chamber to kill anyone. 2 rounds. 3 rounds max. It was totally useless. A bunch of us argued to simply give the damned thing the same damage as any basic locus grenade, but no, a bunch of people said it should have more rounds. That transformed the mass driver into the pain in the ass it is today. Make it shoot grenades, cut the number of rounds back down to what CCP initially intended and BUMP UP it's damage to that of an actual grenade so that it can fulfill it's purpose; delivering 2 or 3 well-timed, well-placed grenades back to back. A support weapon. 400 HP damage grenades. But only shooting 2 or 3 at a time. It was never supposed to receive a clip size increase. We all argued this waay back in closed beta.