DUST Search - Forge Guns need a nerf. Not their damage. Prepared for QQ

Mobius Kaethis wrote:

Talos Alomar wrote:

ladwar wrote:

2.caused by motion. source

a slug made by motion or air if you would have it.
these weapons actually have very short ranges but are powerful at those short ranges. its not meant to be the "heavy sniper platform" is meant to be the heavy anti-vehicle platform so there should be damage drop(start) at around ~100m-150m

of or relating to the motion of material bodies and the forces and energy associated therewith

Caldari hybrid tech is based around railguns shooting material bodies.

The effect you are referring to is Gallente blaster tech, and if you look athe the weapon profiles you'll see that that the FG is indeed a railgun that shoots slugs. The FG is basically just a giant sniper rifle.

Ladwar, I am sorry to report that your understanding of English must not be that good since Talos is actually right. The original description which you quote says the FG fires a kinetic slug. Yes, kinetic means motion but slug has and always will mean a chunk of metal. A bullet in a modern firearm is a kinetic slug.

FG are in fact rail guns. They fire a metalic slug at high velocities in order to produce damage. Modern (read RL) fire arms like the 45 APC have a muzzle velocity of around 850 ft/s producing on the order of 550j of muzzle energy. Modern rail guns, which are only really mounted to naval vessels because of their massive size and power consumption, fire slugs that have around 32 mega-joules of muzzle energy and travel at around mach 7.5, or 8,373 ft/s. Now because of the size of these rail guns it is easier to compare them to naval artillary. The 16" cannons on Iowa class battle ships fired slugs at 2,900ft/s with a muzzle energy of 20 mega-joules. This means that a rail guns slug which is a hell of a lot lighter than a one ton 16" gun slug, actually has a lot more muzzle energy. That gives rail guns huge amounts of range, on the order of 250 miles. source #1 source #2 source #3 source #4

Now in the case of Dust this means that a merc with a FG toting about a miniturized rail cannon, and given that it is in the future (an unknown distance in the future) we will give the FG a lot of "future tech." Even assuming that the FG slug is the size of .5 cal slug the relative speed of a rail slug is about three times higher than a modern fire arm equivalent. A .5 cal round has a muzzle velocity of 850 ft/sec and a max range around 1800 m. Considering how the modern rail fired with about 3 times the muzzle velocity of a modern powder based weapon we can assume that a FG size weapon should have an effective range far in excess of a modern .5 cal sniper rifle. Therefore it is rediculous to say that the range should be reduced or that it should have a damage falloff which starts at around 100m.

Realizing that this is a game CCP has smartly limited the range of the forge to less than 1800m . Lets just keep the FG as it is for now.


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FLAYLOCK Steve Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 194	Posted - 2013.08.09 02:30:00 - [1] - Quote Honestly reducing the range sounds fine and dandy but what you're forgetting is that it's on the slowest thing in the game. I do agree tower forging is annoying. I'm one of the few that use it on the ground but at a distance. Nerfing the range would just give tanks and lavs a advantage. Lavs are already hard to hit unless moving straight ahead. Tanks can move fast vs the speed of a heavy so all the forge can do is sit and wait until a red takes him out before he takes out the tank. And you're a little wrong about the forge gun. It's not an anti vehicle. The weapon description says it's a anti matter weapon meaning its for anything from infantry to installations and vehicle's. Nerfing the range would really make it hard to use due to the fact that a tank can take you faster and easier. You try using a assault forge gun near a tank. It's dangerous because it doesn't hold a charge so you have to hide behind cover and time your charge before it fires. You face two problems there, tank takes you out while you shoot or you misjudged the timing due to being blasted away by a tank and you could kill yourself by your gun splash damage.
FLAYLOCK Steve Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 266	Posted - 2013.08.12 13:13:00 - [2] - Quote Scheneighnay McBob wrote: I think the range makes sense for the weapon. First and foremost, it's a railgun. It's also meant for AV, which you need range for. Finally, heavies are very slow, so they need long range weapons to make up for it. It isn't AV, its for anything. Read the gun, says ANTI MATERIAL. The gun is balanced leave it be
FLAYLOCK Steve Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 266	Posted - 2013.08.12 14:17:00 - [3] - Quote Mobius Kaethis wrote: Talos Alomar wrote: ladwar wrote: 2.caused by motion. source a slug made by motion or air if you would have it. these weapons actually have very short ranges but are powerful at those short ranges. its not meant to be the "heavy sniper platform" is meant to be the heavy anti-vehicle platform so there should be damage drop(start) at around ~100m-150m of or relating to the motion of material bodies and the forces and energy associated therewith Caldari hybrid tech is based around railguns shooting material bodies. The effect you are referring to is Gallente blaster tech, and if you look athe the weapon profiles you'll see that that the FG is indeed a railgun that shoots slugs. The FG is basically just a giant sniper rifle. Ladwar, I am sorry to report that your understanding of English must not be that good since Talos is actually right. The original description which you quote says the FG fires a kinetic slug. Yes, kinetic means motion but slug has and always will mean a chunk of metal. A bullet in a modern firearm is a kinetic slug. FG are in fact rail guns. They fire a metalic slug at high velocities in order to produce damage. Modern (read RL) fire arms like the 45 APC have a muzzle velocity of around 850 ft/s producing on the order of 550j of muzzle energy. Modern rail guns, which are only really mounted to naval vessels because of their massive size and power consumption, fire slugs that have around 32 mega-joules of muzzle energy and travel at around mach 7.5, or 8,373 ft/s. Now because of the size of these rail guns it is easier to compare them to naval artillary. The 16" cannons on Iowa class battle ships fired slugs at 2,900ft/s with a muzzle energy of 20 mega-joules. This means that a rail guns slug which is a hell of a lot lighter than a one ton 16" gun slug, actually has a lot more muzzle energy. That gives rail guns huge amounts of range, on the order of 250 miles. source #1 source #2 source #3 source #4 Now in the case of Dust this means that a merc with a FG toting about a miniturized rail cannon, and given that it is in the future (an unknown distance in the future) we will give the FG a lot of "future tech." Even assuming that the FG slug is the size of .5 cal slug the relative speed of a rail slug is about three times higher than a modern fire arm equivalent. A .5 cal round has a muzzle velocity of 850 ft/sec and a max range around 1800 m. Considering how the modern rail fired with about 3 times the muzzle velocity of a modern powder based weapon we can assume that a FG size weapon should have an effective range far in excess of a modern .5 cal sniper rifle. Therefore it is rediculous to say that the range should be reduced or that it should have a damage falloff which starts at around 100m. Realizing that this is a game CCP has smartly limited the range of the forge to less than 1800m . Lets just keep the FG as it is for now. /agreed