DUST Search - Warning to all mass driver users

P14GU3 wrote:

Bethhy wrote:

P14GU3 wrote:

@Bethhy

I run gallente logi with about 600 ehp. Over 400 of that is armor. ANYTHING explosive rocks me. I kill myself with my massdriver at least 1 or 2 times a day (hence why I say splash is way too big.) Your not getting the point that armor is broken period. All plates need about 50% more hp to make it competitive. Until armor is fixed you can't blame the MD.

It sounds like you are running scout so any opinion you have on the forge is mute. Scout is broken as well. If your not running a scout, you are being direct hit by a forge or wearing basic or lower gear. Both weapons are fairly balanced. Moreso than probably any other weapons in the game. They have also had the most tweaking since dusts inceptiin.

Armor is interesting, flaylock does more armor damage, rail technology does more armor damage, heavy machine gun gets armor damage bonus, mass driver gets armor damage bonus.

As far as killing yourself with MD... You already are receiving less damage at that range then an enemy would... making the gun broken there too... flaylock aswell, yes killing yourself is a side affect of using an AOE weapon but its less so in DUST.

No scout ;) no lower gear ;)

How exactly do I receive less damage than my enemy in CQC? If we are both armor fit we receive the same damage unless I get a direct hit, if they are shield fit, I receive more, or about the same..

And you seem to be skirting around the forge issue. The forge is the most powerful weapon in the game but has heavy drawbacks (pun intended.) It should 1 shot all but the toughest of infantry with splash (2m radius I believe?) And instakill infantry with direct hit.

Will you complain if someone oneshots you with a mlt sniper rifle or standard plasma cannon?


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Bethhy Resheph Interstellar Strategy Gallente Federation 48	Posted - 2013.08.06 18:56:00 - [1] - Quote The problem is with the fundamentals of the mass driver to begin with. It does crap damage to 200 shield but will two shot 600 armor. Now that statement in itself has nothing wrong with it to be honest. The problem is the way the mass driver was designed around the classes. Currently there is still massive stale mates happening on non CQC maps, Basically your enemy and you close to the effective AR range and no side advances. The immediate ground between the two sides is a death zone for anyone trying to bridge the gap. This is what The Heavy class was created for, for massive infantry tanks with medic support that can push and bridge the gaps. This became a problem when people who didn't understand heavy started to chime in on its balances, Heavy shouldn't be an offensive based class it should be defense and survivability and it just isn't right now. Mass drivers are a problem because they conflict with how the game's framework was set out. They have a massive armor damage bonus and stupid range which in case is the problem for the Heavy class. Heavies main threat should be a flanking shotgunner because the AR aren't covering them, a sniper... same cover issue. The Heavy class should not have the gank ability to kill an assault/medic without them having the option to get away, And the assault and medic should not have the ability to kill the heavy without severe ammo/time consumption, basically the heavy needs half the damage, double the range and triple the survivability on the field. Fixing the flux blast radius and buffing the mass driver is the double buff on things that have to stop in patches. Was like LAV Buff where you made them crazy strong and made AV tracking and registry horrific. One Forge gun's are tricky because the heavy class only has two weapon choices really. But tank and dropship inbalances are completely due to Forge guns. Having Militia gun that can one shot kamehameha any Infantry was always a stupid idea... if its a completely stationary target? Sure. But a moving target at over 8meters /s? and your hitting full damage? CCP basically needs to hire a Gun Nut who lives sleeps and breaths guns, so tactical and realistic world representations for futuristic guns can be created.
Bethhy Resheph Interstellar Strategy Gallente Federation 48	Posted - 2013.08.06 19:23:00 - [2] - Quote P14GU3 wrote: All I got out of that was The heavy suit is broken Armor is broken (Both true) And you dont like the idea of a heavy sniper? If a FG hit you running at over 8 m/s he was a good shot. If you lower dmg on the forge tanks and dropships will be OP again. Splash has already been nerfed a couple times iirc and is in a pretty good place now. AV grenades are what really break the vehicle balance and should be nerfed/removed imo. If a blast radius based gun is hitting you for full damage while moving at that speed there is a problem in physics. AV grenades and infantry AV have claimed how many vehicle kills in reality? it totals more then vehicle to vehicle.. MD work fine and perfect if Heavies didn't exist in the game, if the MD was an EMP based shield round they would work perfect.
Bethhy Resheph Interstellar Strategy Gallente Federation 48	Posted - 2013.08.06 19:35:00 - [3] - Quote P14GU3 wrote: Your not getting 1 shotted by splash unless your a scout. And its called "leading your target." Quit running in a straight line. Heavys are broken, quite blaming the MD. And AV grenades rock anything that isn't a dropship, or rail-sniping. You should actually have to spec into AV, not spec into core locusts and get proto AV as a bonus. Lol assuming a players game skill is funny :D and yes getting one shot with considerable HP buffer ;) MD's armor damage bonus is the MD's problem, not the blast radius or the damage.... Heavies one racial armor based suit just highlights it.
Bethhy Resheph Interstellar Strategy Gallente Federation 50	Posted - 2013.08.06 20:09:00 - [4] - Quote P14GU3 wrote: @Bethhy I run gallente logi with about 600 ehp. Over 400 of that is armor. ANYTHING explosive rocks me. I kill myself with my massdriver at least 1 or 2 times a day (hence why I say splash is way too big.) Your not getting the point that armor is broken period. All plates need about 50% more hp to make it competitive. Until armor is fixed you can't blame the MD. It sounds like you are running scout so any opinion you have on the forge is mute. Scout is broken as well. If your not running a scout, you are being direct hit by a forge or wearing basic or lower gear. Both weapons are fairly balanced. Moreso than probably any other weapons in the game. They have also had the most tweaking since dusts inceptiin. Armor is interesting, flaylock does more armor damage, rail technology does more armor damage, heavy machine gun gets armor damage bonus, mass driver gets armor damage bonus. As far as killing yourself with MD... You already are receiving less damage at that range then an enemy would... making the gun broken there too... flaylock aswell, yes killing yourself is a side affect of using an AOE weapon but its less so in DUST. No scout ;) no lower gear ;)
Bethhy Resheph Interstellar Strategy Gallente Federation 50	Posted - 2013.08.06 20:18:00 - [5] - Quote semperfi1999 wrote: Triple the HP....you want heavies to run around with 3000+ HP? Yea that would completely break this game. If they want to max out a tank like the current 1k+ armor heavies they can be a slow walking target why not? We aren't shooting an LAV with little damage recognition and no hitboxes for damage multiplyer's. How much health would you think an infantry "tank" would need to bridge AR range stalemates?
Bethhy Resheph Interstellar Strategy Gallente Federation 50	Posted - 2013.08.06 20:20:00 - [6] - Quote P14GU3 wrote: Bethhy wrote: P14GU3 wrote: @Bethhy I run gallente logi with about 600 ehp. Over 400 of that is armor. ANYTHING explosive rocks me. I kill myself with my massdriver at least 1 or 2 times a day (hence why I say splash is way too big.) Your not getting the point that armor is broken period. All plates need about 50% more hp to make it competitive. Until armor is fixed you can't blame the MD. It sounds like you are running scout so any opinion you have on the forge is mute. Scout is broken as well. If your not running a scout, you are being direct hit by a forge or wearing basic or lower gear. Both weapons are fairly balanced. Moreso than probably any other weapons in the game. They have also had the most tweaking since dusts inceptiin. Armor is interesting, flaylock does more armor damage, rail technology does more armor damage, heavy machine gun gets armor damage bonus, mass driver gets armor damage bonus. As far as killing yourself with MD... You already are receiving less damage at that range then an enemy would... making the gun broken there too... flaylock aswell, yes killing yourself is a side affect of using an AOE weapon but its less so in DUST. No scout ;) no lower gear ;) How exactly do I receive less damage than my enemy in CQC? If we are both armor fit we receive the same damage unless I get a direct hit, if they are shield fit, I receive more, or about the same.. And you seem to be skirting around the forge issue. The forge is the most powerful weapon in the game but has heavy drawbacks (pun intended.) It should 1 shot all but the toughest of infantry with splash (2m radius I believe?) And instakill infantry with direct hit. Will you complain if someone oneshots you with a mlt sniper rifle or standard plasma cannon? If you beleive a game we have shields and armor and build "tanks" on suits, should have guns that one shot u regardless... i don't know what to say? There are plenty of other games that fit that bill with quick scoping and all that fun. Shoot your feet and see how many shots it takes to eat your health with the MD, then repeat with a red dot same health. Repeat with flaylock. *EDIT Officer weapons are always an exception
Bethhy Resheph Interstellar Strategy Gallente Federation 50	Posted - 2013.08.06 20:31:00 - [7] - Quote semperfi1999 wrote: Bethhy wrote: semperfi1999 wrote: Triple the HP....you want heavies to run around with 3000+ HP? Yea that would completely break this game. If they want to max out a tank like the current 1k+ armor heavies they can be a slow walking target why not? We aren't shooting an LAV with little damage recognition and no hitboxes for damage multiplyer's. How much health would you think an infantry "tank" would need to bridge AR range stalemates? Um well first off....everyone would spec into heavies as there would be no reason to be anything else if you are a slayer. If your mainly a support guy then you would probably just run a repairer and sit behind your superman.....you realize the repair guns can repair 100+ hp per second right.....and I think maybe even to 2 different targets at the same time. Also CCP stated that the heavies were designed to be a mobile defensive platform.......not an offensive one. So yea a 3000+ HP heavy would be basically invincible......until everyone was one. Then all we would have is a slow lumbering players using the HMGs trying to kill eachother and constantly failing. TTK would probably be changed to minutes instead of seconds. Sadly i wish the actual repair gun repaired that much i think its more around 30hp/s and the one that can lock on two targets is similar, the monster health repair comes from the proto nanohives pumping out 70hp/s The heavy I was saying needed considerble less damage, its a defensive character not an offensive one.. its ment to take a hit. will heavies moving foward with medics aat their back be bad ass? hell yeah. will they be able to turn around and stop a shotgunner? or two AR's hitting the big slow moving head? *EDIT slow lumbering players that are hard to kill was kinda the purpose of a tank class.
Bethhy Resheph Interstellar Strategy Gallente Federation 50	Posted - 2013.08.06 23:15:00 - [8] - Quote P14GU3 wrote: Now who is assuming about another player? And there are plenty of weapons that 1 shot in this game. Shotgun, sniper rifle, forge gun, nova knives, grenades... And as I have stated before I kill myself in CQC quite often. Sometimes the person I'm shooting at lives. Don't make assumptions because someone beat you in CQC with an MD. It damages the user as much as the target. And no, snipers don't one shot proto's(excluding thales, balac's), nore do shotguns.... nore nova knives. A core locus or militia grenade will end everyone though, as a grenade thrown at a camping target should. its not assumptions silly, its fact. just go do it for yourself shoot your feet and then the enemy the damage values are different, the server bullet registry aside.
Bethhy Resheph Interstellar Strategy Gallente Federation 50	Posted - 2013.08.06 23:29:00 - [9] - Quote P14GU3 wrote: Bethhy wrote: P14GU3 wrote: Now who is assuming about another player? And there are plenty of weapons that 1 shot in this game. Shotgun, sniper rifle, forge gun, nova knives, grenades... And as I have stated before I kill myself in CQC quite often. Sometimes the person I'm shooting at lives. Don't make assumptions because someone beat you in CQC with an MD. It damages the user as much as the target. And no, snipers don't one shot proto's(excluding thales, balac's), nore do shotguns.... nore nova knives. A core locus or militia grenade will end everyone though, as a grenade thrown at a camping target should. its not assumptions silly, its fact. just go do it for yourself shoot your feet and then the enemy the damage values are different, the server bullet registry aside. Not sure what game your playing. Go into a PC match and tell me proto snipers,shotgunners and knifers don't OHK proto. With complex dmg mods 600-700 ehp is nothing for those weapons. Maybe armor just sucks that bad and only gallente have that issue.. No, obviously I was talking about battle academy.