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I was thinking about racial heavies....

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Logi Bro Greatness Achieved Through Training EoN. 1979	Posted - 2013.08.06 09:01:00 - [1] - Quote NOTE: The statistics I used were taken from standard variants of suits, some statistics increase at the prototype level, but I did not use these statistics. TL;DR compiled at the bottom. The only suits that have all four racial variants are logistics and assault, and I was thinking we could use the information from these suits to get the statistics of the three missing racial heavy suits. The first and most important to me are the health stats, and I think I will use the assault suits to find this. The Amarr assault, which I will use as a base since it is the same race as the only heavy in the game, has base armor/shields of 180/180, and the Gallente and Caldari assault suits are inverses of each other, with bases of 120/210 and 210/120 shields/armor. This means that the dominant stat of each of these suits is 16.66666% greater than that of the Amarr, and the recessive stats are 33.3333% less. With this information, we can reason that it is the same case for the heavy suits, and since the base stats of the Amarr heavy is 405/405, the Gallente heavy will have 16.66666% more armor and 33.333% less shields, and the Caldari is vise versa. The Minmatar heavy is slightly different, since the Minnie assault has base armor/shields of 150/135, so that would be 16.666% less shields and 25% less armor. So the stats come out looking like.... Amarr Heavy- 405 shields, 405 armor Gallente Heavy- 270 shields, 675 armor Caldari Heavy- 675 shields, 270 armor Minmatar Heavy- 340 shields, 270 armor These stats are only assuming that the heavy suits follow a pattern similar to the assault suits, which is just an educated guess, but gives a rough estimate of what we can expect. With the 25% boost to base stats in the core skills section, the Gallente heavy looks as if it could have 843 base armor, not even considering armor plates. The Caldari heavy is vise versa, as always, and could possibly have 843 shields before shield extenders, but at the possibility of only having 25hp/s shield regeneration. (Just a note, the Amarr heavy and Amarr assaults have equal shield regeneration, so it is same to assume the other heavies will follow suit, meaning 20hp/s for Gallente, 25hp/s for Caldari, and 18hp/s for Minmatar. So now I would like to take a look at module slots, which look incredibly tricky when I refer to the Amarr Sentinel for reference. The basic trend for the Amarr suits is a small but equal amount high/low slots, but the trend is defied by the Amarr heavy, with 4low/1high at the proto tier, so the information is too deviated to come to a reasonable conclusion, unfortunately I can't come to an estimate on what to expect from the other heavies. The other stats are pretty straightforward, the Amarr suits typically have less speed, but more stamina, referring to the game, I can see the Amarr assault has 4.8/6.7 speed and 200 stamina, and the Gal/Cal assault suits both have 5/7 speed and 150 stamina, and finally the Minmatar assault has 5.3/7.4 speed and 175 stamina. Skipping the part where I tell you the percentages, it comes out looking like: Amarr Heavy- 3.6/5.1 speed and 125 stamina Gallente- 3.75/5.3 speed and 100 stamina Caldari- 3.75/5.3 speed and 100 stamina MInmatar- 4/5.6 speed and 110 stamina I am basing these stats off of percentages, so the bonuses are much smaller since we are using numbers that are already small to begin with. Basically I am saying a 1% change to 1,000,000,000 is much more notable than a 1% change to 10. If you consider the core skill that gives a 5% boost to speed at lvl 5, the Minmatar heavy could be running at roughly 5.9 m/s before modules. I think it would be safe to assume all of the Sentinel racial variants will come equipped with a grenade, heavy weapon slot, and a sidearm slot, so let's move on to PG/CPU. The Amarr standard assault uses 35/175 PG/CPU, the standard Calssault uses 30/150, the standard Galssault uses 30/150, and the standard Minssault uses 32/160. Skipping the telling you about percentages part again my math tells me it ends up being: Amarr Heavy- 36/180 PG/CPU Caldari Heavy- 31/154 PG/CPU Gallente Heavy- 31/154 PG/CPU Minmatar Heavy- 33/164 PG/CPU So, compiling this information you can see for yourself: Amarr Sentinel A-I 35 PG 180 CPU 405 Shields 405 Armor 3.6 Movement Speed 5.1 Run Speed Caldari Sentinel C-I 31 PG 154 CPU 675 Shields 270 Armor 3.75 Movement Speed 5.3 Run Speed Gallente Sentinel G-I 31 PG 154 CPU 270 Shields 675 Armor 3.75 Movement Speed 5.3 Run Speed Minmatar Sentinel M-I 33 PG 164 CPU 340 Shields 270 Armor 4.0 Movement Speed 5.6 Run Speed I can take a look at the CPU/PG at the proto tier if anyone cares, but I really just wrote this because I was bored.
Nocturnal Soul Immortal Retribution 331	Posted - 2013.08.06 09:07:00 - [2] - Quote wow CCP SOME ONE HIVE THIS MERC A MEDAL im dead serious you deserve one
Khal V'Rani Nephilim Initiative 242	Posted - 2013.08.06 09:10:00 - [3] - Quote ...because you were bored... I hate you. :-P +1 Good post man. ;-) Would like to see more stuff when you get bored again.
Jastad D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 86	Posted - 2013.08.06 09:16:00 - [4] - Quote And thats is the "MAIN WHY" Other heavy (my only matter would be the CAL.Heavy) are not in the game: Game Balance. I was thinkinh before that the heavy suit are ready to deploy, otherwise a placeholder could be better.But CCP claim that placeholder aren't viable. So i think the matter could be game balance. Let's watch how many people complain about Cal.Logi and imagine a 843 base shield-Beast i can hear Nerf-tears on the horizon Cant wait for the Galli-CRAZY armor platform for my HMG
Logi Bro Greatness Achieved Through Training EoN. 1979	Posted - 2013.08.06 09:22:00 - [5] - Quote Jastad wrote: And thats is the "MAIN WHY" Other heavy (my only matter would be the CAL.Heavy) are not in the game: Game Balance. I was thinkinh before that the heavy suit are ready to deploy, otherwise a placeholder could be better.But CCP claim that placeholder aren't viable. So i think the matter could be game balance. Let's watch how many people complain about Cal.Logi and imagine a 843 base shield-Beast i can hear Nerf-tears on the horizon Cant wait for the Galli-CRAZY armor platform for my HMG I think the release of Gallente and Caldari Sentinel suits will truly define what infantry armor tanking and infantry shield tanking is all about. People say armor tanking is UP now, but what if a a suit that moves faster than our current heavy gets 843 armor? Furthermore, shield tanking might become more about shield regeneration if the base shield regen really is at 25hp/s with 843 health, that would take more than 30 seconds to go from no shields to full shields, not including the shield regeneration delay.
dustwaffle Gravity Prone EoN. 288	Posted - 2013.08.06 09:37:00 - [6] - Quote Good post +1 Have you taken into account the racial flavours though? i.e. Amarr - Armour tanky slow Gallente - Armour tanky fast (relatively) Minmatar - Both tanks (with one being slightly more optimal, basic suit vs specialised suits shifting from armor to shields), fastest in class Caldari - Shield tanky fast (relatively)
Logi Bro Greatness Achieved Through Training EoN. 1980	Posted - 2013.08.06 09:40:00 - [7] - Quote dustwaffle wrote: Good post +1 Have you taken into account the racial flavours though? i.e. Amarr - Armour tank [Buffer] slow Gallente - Armour tank [Active] fast (relatively) Minmatar - Both tanks [Active] (with one being slightly more optimal, basic suit vs specialised suits shifting from armor to shields), fastest in class Caldari - Shield tank [Buffer] fast (relatively) I only took into account the raw numbers, so as long as the assault suits follow their racial flavor, the resulting heavy stats should be the correct flavor to match.
Jack Boost Zarena Family 268	Posted - 2013.08.06 10:58:00 - [8] - Quote CPU/PG come with slot layout. If we dont know what we got no point 'gues'. If amarr have more armor and shield then others (compared) and less slots, then rest racial will have more CPU/PG and slots. Anyway if not.. going for another racial is.. pointles. Less tank (that with little difference in speed dont cover actual gap in combat actions heavy->rest world.) and less CPU/PG. This is difficult task if you want make fit that count with almost no slots and CPU/PG actualy. If racial heavy dont change it... sad face.
broonfondle majikthies P.O.N.A.G.S. D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 110	Posted - 2013.08.06 11:10:00 - [9] - Quote Regarding suit health specs: From what I remember off hand shouldn't the Minmatar suit be essentially a light aHP Gallente like the other suits (poss not the scout, can't remember)? Other than that very nice
LT SHANKS Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 373	Posted - 2013.08.06 11:17:00 - [10] - Quote OP, I love you.

Logi Bro Greatness Achieved Through Training EoN. 1982	Posted - 2013.08.06 18:44:00 - [11] - Quote broonfondle majikthies wrote: Regarding suit health specs: From what I remember off hand shouldn't the Minmatar suit be essentially a light aHP Gallente like the other suits (poss not the scout, can't remember)? Other than that very nice Kind of. The Minmatar suits are all "light" versions, but not neccesarily lighter versions of the Gallente specifically.
Logi Bro Greatness Achieved Through Training EoN. 1982	Posted - 2013.08.06 18:46:00 - [12] - Quote Jack Boost wrote: CPU/PG come with slot layout. If we dont know what we got no point 'gues'. If amarr have more armor and shield then others (compared) and less slots, then rest racial will have more CPU/PG and slots. Anyway if not.. going for another racial is.. pointles. Less tank (that with little difference in speed dont cover actual gap in combat actions heavy->rest world.) and less CPU/PG. This is difficult task if you want make fit that count with almost no slots and CPU/PG actualy. If racial heavy dont change it... sad face. From what I am seeing, I wouldn't be surprised if the Amarr Heavy were completely changed upon release of the other suits. It is completely different from the other Amarr suits, and its slot layout looks more like what I would expect the Gallente Heavy to be.
ZDub 303 TeamPlayers EoN. 1492	Posted - 2013.08.06 18:56:00 - [13] - Quote Man I can only imagine chilling behind a Gallente heavy with a focused rep tool. Whew. Caldari heavies will need to stack Rechargers probably to be of any use, but two rechargers on a heavy with ~600 shields could be quite interesting! Slap a CPU upgrade and a kin cat on the low slots maybe? Cool stuff! However Caldari heavies will probaby get roflstomped by flux nades... I can already see the forum QQ.
Soldner VonKuechle SAM-MIK 56	Posted - 2013.08.06 19:07:00 - [14] - Quote ZDub 303 wrote: Man I can only imagine chilling behind a Gallente heavy with a focused rep tool. Whew. Caldari heavies will need to stack Rechargers probably to be of any use, but two rechargers on a heavy with ~600 shields could be quite interesting! Slap a CPU upgrade and a kin cat on the low slots maybe? Cool stuff! However Caldari heavies will probaby get roflstomped by flux nades... I can already see the forum QQ. Caldari heavies will prolly do what alit if people use heavies for now, forge sniping. With the absence of an infantry shield transporter, caldari heavies will be considerably weak as compared to the armor version because of no remote repairs. A gallenteheavy though. .. that will be a force to be reckoned with. Armor plates + logi = win as you have pointed out. But of course we re all just speculating right now. Hurray theorycrafting!
Johnny Guilt Algintal Core Gallente Federation 213	Posted - 2013.08.06 19:07:00 - [15] - Quote scout racially variants next?
Logi Bro Greatness Achieved Through Training EoN. 1984	Posted - 2013.08.06 19:15:00 - [16] - Quote Johnny Guilt wrote: scout racially variants next? I can take a guess at what their stats would be, if you like, but it would be pure conjecture just like the rest of this.
Beren Hurin The Vanguardians 986	Posted - 2013.08.06 19:24:00 - [17] - Quote Also if you get a sprint and endurance mod on that minmatar heavy, and put some kind of bonus for the HMG you will see what that thing was really made for.
Billi Gene The Southern Legion 213	Posted - 2013.08.06 19:50:00 - [18] - Quote ZDub 303 wrote: Man I can only imagine chilling behind a Gallente heavy with a focused rep tool. Whew. Caldari heavies will need to stack Rechargers probably to be of any use, but two rechargers on a heavy with ~600 shields could be quite interesting! Slap a CPU upgrade and a kin cat on the low slots maybe? Cool stuff! However Caldari heavies will probaby get roflstomped by flux nades... I can already see the forum QQ. if caldari is a shield tank.. the low slots will be regulators imho
Aero Yassavi PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 1052	Posted - 2013.08.06 20:51:00 - [19] - Quote Quote: Gallente Heavy- 270 shields, 475 armor Caldari Heavy- 475 shields, 270 armor That is good guess using proportions with the assault suits, but I'd bet that these guys would rather have less weakness and more strength. So something like Gallente - 120 shield, 625 armor Caldari - 625 shield, 120 armor
Chunky Munkey Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 1066	Posted - 2013.08.06 21:22:00 - [20] - Quote The Amarr heavy has 2highs and 3lows. The sentinel loses a high for a low. You can work out the slot layouts with a similar method to the number stats. Amarr: 2h 3l Sentinel: 1h 3l Gallente: 2h 4l Sentinel: 1h 5l drools Caldari: 3h 3l Sentinel: 2h 4l Minmatar: 4h 2l drools again Sentinel: 3h 3l I worked these out based on how slots are added and removed between races. The reason I didn't base it on particular trends, such as Gallente & Caldari being inverted, is because it leads to some bizarre results, eg: Caldari light frame having 4highs (wouldn't be overpowered at all ) Edit: Oh and great post OP. I love geeking out on this stuff.

Killar-12 Molon Labe. League of Infamy 427	Posted - 2013.08.06 21:32:00 - [21] - Quote Chunky Munkey wrote: The Amarr heavy has 2highs and 3lows. The sentinel loses a high for a low. You can work out the slot layouts with a similar method to the number stats. Amarr: 2h 3l Sentinel: 1h 3l Gallente: 2h 4l Sentinel: 1h 5l drools Caldari: 3h 3l Sentinel: 2h 4l Minmatar: 4h 2l drools again Sentinel: 3h 3l I worked these out based on how slots are added and removed between races. The reason I didn't base it on particular trends, such as Gallente & Caldari being inverted, is because it leads to some bizarre results, eg: Caldari light frame having 4highs (wouldn't be overpowered at all ) Edit: Oh and great post OP. I love geeking out on this stuff. Caldari might have 4h 2l on the basic and 5h 1l on the sentinel.
TheWee BabySeamus Dem Durrty Boyz 36	Posted - 2013.08.06 21:58:00 - [22] - Quote I think the Caldari Heavy should have 4-5 Highs but other than that its a great starting place. +1
Nocturnal Soul Immortal Retribution 339	Posted - 2013.08.06 22:03:00 - [23] - Quote Logi Bro wrote: Johnny Guilt wrote: scout racially variants next? I can take a guess at what their stats would be, if you like, but it would be pure conjecture just like the rest of this. do id love to read it
EternalRMG ZionTCD 540	Posted - 2013.08.06 22:42:00 - [24] - Quote Nocturnal Soul wrote: wow CCP SOME ONE GIVE THIS MERC A MEDAL im dead serious you deserve one but on a side note the gal and cal should have less base hp then the amarr around the 700 area He is CCP LogiBro right?
Logi Bro Greatness Achieved Through Training EoN. 1993	Posted - 2013.08.06 22:46:00 - [25] - Quote EternalRMG wrote: Nocturnal Soul wrote: wow CCP SOME ONE GIVE THIS MERC A MEDAL im dead serious you deserve one but on a side note the gal and cal should have less base hp then the amarr around the 700 area He is CCP LogiBro right? Negative. CCP Logibro just took my name, is all.
dustwaffle Gravity Prone EoN. 294	Posted - 2013.08.07 06:24:00 - [26] - Quote On a side note, what can you extrapolate from the current vehicles? If and when Minmatar get vehicles, I might actually skill into vehicles for some speeding all over the map type of fun
Logi Bro Greatness Achieved Through Training EoN. 2025	Posted - 2013.08.12 05:08:00 - [27] - Quote Bumping, will also make a scout version soon.
DS 10 Pure Innocence. EoN. 694	Posted - 2013.08.12 11:48:00 - [28] - Quote Awesome work, man. I've been saying for a while how I just want a racial variant with 2 high slots or more so I can save some ISK. I use 2 damage mods on my FG fit, so even just having two would be nice. I see myself either running Caldari or Minmitar if this is close to accurate with Minnie being a little in the lead because of movement speed.
Tank Missile Intara Direct Action Caldari State 9	Posted - 2013.09.20 20:46:00 - [29] - Quote Minmatar heavy will definitely beast it up.
Logi Bro Greatness Achieved Through Training EoN. 2287	Posted - 2013.10.30 05:12:00 - [30] - Quote Reviving. Been Logistics since before it was cool.



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