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Mobius Wyvern
Sky-FIRE
5579
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Posted - 2015.01.06 16:49:00 -
[1] - Quote
DeadlyAztec11 wrote:They do not, at least not in the long run. Why? Because it would ultimately be an SP and ISK sink.
Vehicles would eventually be balanced around pilot suits. This would mean that pilot suits wouldn't be so much an enhancement, but a necessity for vehicle users. You wouldn't wear it to get an edge: you would wear it to just perform at the standard tier.
That's why vehicle users don't really want pilot suits. They will give them nothing. Wrong.
Amidst the blue skies
A link from past to future
The sheltering wings of the protector
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Mobius Wyvern
Sky-FIRE
5581
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Posted - 2015.01.07 01:11:00 -
[2] - Quote
DeadlyAztec11 wrote:Soldner VonKuechle wrote: GFDI SPEAKER SHUT UP!
Ive never wanted to grab someone by the shoulders, shake them incomprehensibly and scream " Are you daft man? " as much as i do when i see you post your pedantic mewlings claiming full superiority over someone.
You don't want conversation about vehicles, you want reformation that your narrow view of vehicles is best.
That kind of siht gives us the balance issues the game has.
Froking grow up and behave like a civilized human being, or go find a train track and nap on it. Please.
I never claimed superiority over anyone. Granted I lost my temper and insulted Spkr4theDead, though he did insult me first. I specifically said that I want conversation and have explicitly stated that no one person's view should be imposed rather we should talk about the issues of the game civilly and without passion. Passion clouds the logical mind because it makes us choose impulse and instinct over logic and reason. Uh, that post you're quoting was aimed at Speaker, not you.
Spkr4theDead wrote: Of course, because I won't play along to get along.
As someone who jumped out of his tank right before I managed to destroy it in a BPO Sentinel, gunned me down, and then sent me a mail that just said "lol", I'm not sure why you're advocating the pilot suit.
Wouldn't that prevent you from doing what I just described?
Amidst the blue skies
A link from past to future
The sheltering wings of the protector
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Mobius Wyvern
Sky-FIRE
5581
|
Posted - 2015.01.07 01:26:00 -
[3] - Quote
Spkr4theDead wrote:MINA Longstrike wrote:Spkr4theDead wrote: Of course, because I won't play along to get along.
No, because you're a judgemental ******* who spouts off without knowing anything about people in question (aka 'you're not a tanker'... to people who either have vehicle alts, or to people who have 2/3rds of their sp into vehicles) and does everything they can to stifle positive discussion. If you stopped having such kneejerk responses and being so belligerent you might find it easier to discuss things with people. lol "vehicle alts" Those that have "vehicle alts" still spout out the nonsense about how easy it is to use a vehicle and how difficult they are to destroy. Their opinion is moot because of that, especially if "they have 2/3 of their SP into vehicles." That makes them a majority pilot, and if they still complain about how hard AV is to use and how difficult it is to destroy vehicles, they might as well cut off their feet if they don't like the way they look. Positive discussion? There is no "positive discussion" when someone that's not a pilot speaks for all those that ARE pilots and says "pilots don't want the pilot suit." There cannot be any rational discussion with someone that insane. That's like Hannibal Lector saying he eats people because he's hungry. There cannot be rational discussion with people like that. Belligerent? Hostile? Difficult? What do you expect me to do when infantry dictates the direction of vehicles, be quiet and say "thank you sir may I have another?" I'm supposed to shut my mouth when these people tell me how I'm supposed to play my desired role? Okay, you've got me really confused here.
Which side of this argument are you on? Are you just going after the OP for "infantry dictating vehicle design" or are you actually advocating pilot suits?
Amidst the blue skies
A link from past to future
The sheltering wings of the protector
|
Mobius Wyvern
Sky-FIRE
5581
|
Posted - 2015.01.07 03:35:00 -
[4] - Quote
Spkr4theDead wrote:Mobius Wyvern wrote:Spkr4theDead wrote:MINA Longstrike wrote:Spkr4theDead wrote: Of course, because I won't play along to get along.
No, because you're a judgemental ******* who spouts off without knowing anything about people in question (aka 'you're not a tanker'... to people who either have vehicle alts, or to people who have 2/3rds of their sp into vehicles) and does everything they can to stifle positive discussion. If you stopped having such kneejerk responses and being so belligerent you might find it easier to discuss things with people. lol "vehicle alts" Those that have "vehicle alts" still spout out the nonsense about how easy it is to use a vehicle and how difficult they are to destroy. Their opinion is moot because of that, especially if "they have 2/3 of their SP into vehicles." That makes them a majority pilot, and if they still complain about how hard AV is to use and how difficult it is to destroy vehicles, they might as well cut off their feet if they don't like the way they look. Positive discussion? There is no "positive discussion" when someone that's not a pilot speaks for all those that ARE pilots and says "pilots don't want the pilot suit." There cannot be any rational discussion with someone that insane. That's like Hannibal Lector saying he eats people because he's hungry. There cannot be rational discussion with people like that. Belligerent? Hostile? Difficult? What do you expect me to do when infantry dictates the direction of vehicles, be quiet and say "thank you sir may I have another?" I'm supposed to shut my mouth when these people tell me how I'm supposed to play my desired role? Okay, you've got me really confused here. Which side of this argument are you on? Are you just going after the OP for "infantry dictating vehicle design" or are you actually advocating pilot suits? I hate infantry dictating the direction vehicles go in, and yeah, I want the pilot suits because I'm a pilot. You saw my previous post, didn't you? I thought you would be an advocate for still being able to run BPO Sentinels in your tank to kill anyone who tries to AV you.
Amidst the blue skies
A link from past to future
The sheltering wings of the protector
|
Mobius Wyvern
Sky-FIRE
5581
|
Posted - 2015.01.07 13:30:00 -
[5] - Quote
Monkey MAC wrote:Aah I missed this, spkr's incoherent whining about because nobody is him or his friend Taki they shouldn't get a say as to how vehicles work, yet they are allowed to say how Infantry works, loving that logic.
Now I'm not saying that Spkr is entirely wrong their are somethings, that he says here I agree with, even if he lacks the tact to put them across elegantly.
1) Pilot Suits giving penalties based on race. Shouldn't happen, if I put a Rail Rifle on a Minmatar suit, do I recieve a physical penalty to my stats? No. Do Caldari weapons synergise with Minmatar well? No. The conflicting styles are enough off a penalty in themselves, this should be the same with vehicles.
2) Pilot Suits giving fittings bonuses/reductions based on race Can't happen, unless the devs find a way of incorporating Pilot Suits directly into the vehicle fitting screen, you will never be able to call in your fits, because they will all be invalid where you have built them with your suit in mind. While this makes for the simplest bonus to pilot suits, it's also the hardest to implement.
Now I'm not going to bother going over the bad points that spkr has made, I've tried that too many times and to be honest I already have an exercise in futility at home.
However when it comes to pilot suits, their main job is not to give bonuses to the vehicle user (not saying I'm opposed to them doing so, it just isn't the primary use). Their priority job is to turn vehicles into a fully fledged role, that the player entirely commits themself to. To stop the current situation where a player can stroll round in a tank, take a few hits, get out amd continue to slay as infantry.
To stop pilots operating as their own ground support, to stop vehicles being a very expensive second suit for a player. I don't think the vehicles in the current state of play are ready for pilot suits, but they need to be introduced before(or as) the vehicle roster is completed. That depends on what bonuses we're talking about.
For instance, IWS mentioned having Pilot Suits allow you quicker entry and exit with vehicles and having other suits take time to do so.
That way there'd be no more driving around in your tank with a Sentinel and HMG or Forge Gun.
Real talk, though: I may dislike Spkr, but as someone who had my chosen asset (ADS) made utterly useless against vehicles in a heavy-handed attempt to stop the supposed "farming" of infantry (which didn't even work), I can get behind the idea of being pissed about infantry dictating the capability of vehicles.
Was Pilot Stacking stupidly OP? Yes. Was it fixed? No.
Is being able to one-shot most suits OP? Yes. Was THAT fixed? No.
Instead they reduced the Rate-of-Fire which limits my ability to attack vehicles, which is honestly what I preferred. That reduction to RoF did nothing about the ability of my missiles to instantly blap any suit that doesn't fit more than 500 hp.
Everybody INCLUDING CCP Rattati just went "50% fire rate bonus? NERF IT!", and thereby did nothing to address the inability of infantry to fight back against the ADS, at the same time as Swarms were eventually buffed up to become the ultimate easymode destroyer of everything based on the insistance of infantry players who can't even be bothered to aim.
Someone explain to me how it's fair that my good friend who has maxed out Forge Guns and has damn good aim with them does LESS damage to vehicles than a Swarm Launcher that's fire-and-forget, and thereby requires absolutely no player skill whatsoever?
I want pilot suits because I want to see a return to days where people weren't hiding Sentinels inside their vehicles in order to try and stop their **** from dying to easymode Swarms. I specced into Wyrkomis with the Specialization and even put damage mods on them, and the only vehicle that doesn't die in seconds to those things are LAVs which can speed behind buildings. Tanks or Dropships of any kind will just die.
You want a suggestion of a bonus? How about as well as that suggestion about vehicle boarding, that you ALSO get lock-on warnings for Swarm Launchers when using a Pilot Suit inside of a vehicle. I guarantee you that'll make all of us pilots happy, AND you won't have us jumping out of our vehicles in Slayer or Heavy suits that we wear inside them because we're ******* pissed.
Amidst the blue skies
A link from past to future
The sheltering wings of the protector
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