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C0TS
Sebiestor Field Sappers Minmatar Republic
0
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Posted - 2014.02.17 08:14:00 -
[1] - Quote
After reading forums I plan to change build from Logi to Scout with what I assume will be a 1.8 re-spec. I have planned out my build as followed with my expect SP to be around the 15.5-16m by release date.
Shotgun: Optimization: 1.865 Proficiency: 1.554 Operation: 0.621 Weaponry: 0.068 LW Operation: 0.621 Total: 4.729
Drop suit: Command: 0.024 Light: 0.273 Scout: 2.487 Total: 2.784
Drop suit fittings: Shield Extension: 0.932 Cardiac Reg: 0.932 Biotic: 0.621 Core: 0.621 Electronics: 1.554 Engineering: 1.554 Drop suit: 0.155 Kinetic: 0.932 Total: 8.700
3 totals: 16.213 million SP
Although CCP has not set anything in stone it appears to me that Cal and Gal scouts will be the real winners post 1.8 patch. I also know this skill outline doesn't include Cloak, so I might have to sacrifice shield extension for cloaks until I am able to up my SP. I also realize i will eventually need profile dampener, precision scanning, and armor rep to maximize a scout's role fully.
First, is my skill planning going to maximize my scout shotgun build? I have no need to waste SP on nades, hives, sidearms until I feel my suit fittings are complete and maximize my suit of choice. I know i need things like prof damp, Scanning and armor rep are essential for a scout complete role but wouldn't I rather lv5 skills to maximize CPU/PG and lv5 biotics because movement is so important. So maximize loadout possibility, maximize speed, then work on prof damp, scanning & armor rep??
Secondly, after a lot of reading about scouts 1.8 loadouts, racial bonuses, etc... What class between Cal and Gal are going to be superior given my early skills selections and shotgun weapon choices. I read the class choice depends on play style Cal (frontline) vs Gal (stealth). Many players in forums seem to be favouring the Gal cuz of the passive dampening effects and arguing that its ability to stay off the radar is worth more than Cal's high Shields/Dam mods.
I'm thinking: Cal Scout would need damp & kinetic red + 2 Complex Shield and a precision mod sort of build = stealth, speed and minor survivability. Vs. Gal scout would need damp & red, green + 1 Complex Shield sort of build = stealth. speed and great stamina
I would love some advice on the skills and which scout suit or mods would work best on each suit. I know many don't like to give skill tree or builds away but if you at least point me in the right direction I would really appreciate the help.
Thanks, Cots
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Bayeth Mal
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
55
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Posted - 2014.02.17 08:22:00 -
[2] - Quote
I'll be going Gal+shotty but that's because I have BPOs and might as well get more bang for my buck.
Other wise best to wait and see. The folks in the Scouts United channel are really nice and can give some really good advice. |
HYENAKILLER X
Subsonic Synthesis RISE of LEGION
605
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Posted - 2014.02.17 08:37:00 -
[3] - Quote
Im no help. Cant decide between gal logi or comando.
I would completely ignore shotties though and go combat rifle. More ammo, better range. If you want sneaky go blades or pistols. New ones look crazy.
Proto cr on a scout would be hell to pay once mastered.
Everyone knows the shotty sound. With one feild dampener it is scary where you can stand and kill guys.
Tanks are for pussies.
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Brokerib
Lone Wolves Club
544
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Posted - 2014.02.17 09:41:00 -
[4] - Quote
Gal will be your best bet for a shotgun scout come 1.8. Because of the additional dampening and focus on armor, the Gal is better for close to medium range setup, while the Cal leans towards medium to long range.
And I'd also consider skilling up your electronics and biotic based skills before you worry about armor/shields. The main defences of a scout are stealth, mobility and scanning. Armor and shields is for when you make a mistake.
Have a look at this: A Primer for the Scouterly Arts for some basic tips and playstyle advice, is written for people new to scouts in 1.8, and feel free to put questions to the scout thread here: The Barbershop if you want to chat to full time scouts about your setup.
o7
Knowledge is power
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Floyd20 Azizora
L.O.T.I.S. D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
8
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Posted - 2014.02.17 10:09:00 -
[5] - Quote
could take a lv from shotgun opt and pro, maybe elect and eng (work out if you need them or not first). the points saved should give you an adv cloak and lv3 in passive scanning skills |
Oswald Rehnquist
1249
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Posted - 2014.02.17 10:25:00 -
[6] - Quote
Tier l) Gal Scout Tier ll) Min/Cal Scout Tier lll) Ama Scout
The gal scout is the best scout because their bonus is something all other scouts require via modules so this essentially gives the gal scout a module it can ignore and go for more tank, plus built in reps, ultimately making this the premier stealth combat scout.
The cal scout's precision is only useful in picking up the ama/min scout with a lot of investment, medium suits can already be picked up without much investment as the gal scout will be beyond the cal scouts detection (3 complex precision mods on a cal scout is defeated by 1 complex dampener on a gal scout), so its use is limited. You would pick the cal scout only if you are interested in the slot load out, which essentially is if you prefer shield combat.
The min scout is actually quite fun, they are your infiltrators with a real solid role. CR/Nking point defenders and quick hacks is thy most legitimate and secure role of any scout in the game. Excluding the given weapons, it was my previous function as a scout. It will also be highly popular for PC matches.
The Amarr scout is lacking unfortunately as that was (still is) eventually going to be my second scout of choice. If the racial stays it would be nice to see even better cpu/pg numbers to fit some really expensive equipment on there and to use it as a runner.
Below 28 dB
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Cotsy8
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY
8
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Posted - 2014.02.18 18:13:00 -
[7] - Quote
Thanks for your amazing links, here is what I've come up with (doesn't take into account 2% per shield skill or 5% shield/armor skills yet):
S= shields A= Armor C= CPU P=PG
Cal: 130S 70A 5% scan radius/precision (complex enhancer, basic range amp) Precision: 45-11.25= 33.75-9 =24.75 Build:.w/ 2 complex extenders on H and complex green, complex damp on L Scout Adv: 262S 70A (332) +1H C/1 3H 2L: 153/244C 30/46P + 1H C/P Ups + Cape Pro: 235.5/317C 47.5/59P -OR- Build: w/ 3 complex extenders on H and complex green, complex damp on L Scout Adv: 328S 70A (398) C/1 3H: 206/244C 41/46P C/P Ups + Cape Pro: 289.5/317C 58.5/59P *a lower tier cape would work, not proto*
Scout Pro: 262S 70A (332) Build: w/ 2 complex extenders on H and complex green, complex damp on L CK 4H 2L: 116/348C 30/66P + 2H C/P Ups + Cape Pro: 198.5/452C 47.5/91P +2H -OR- Build: w/ 3 complex extenders on H and Complex red, complex green, complex damp on L Scout Pro: 328S 70A (398) CK 3H: 170/348C 41/66P + 1H C/P Ups + Cape Pro: 252.5/452C 58.5/91P + 1H
----------------------------- VS -----------------------
Gal: 70S 130A 5% scan radius/scan profile (complex damp, basic range amp) Damp: 45-8.75 = 26.25-8.75 =17.5 Build: 2 complex extenders on H and Complex red, complex green, complex damp on L Scout Adv: 202S 130A (332) G/1 2H 3L: 180/231C 45/52P C/P Ups + Cape Pro: 262.5/300C 62.5/67P *lower tier cape would wrk, not proto*
Build: w/ 2 complex extenders on H and Complex red, complex green, complex damp on L and one empty L slot Scout Pro: 202S 130A (332) + 1L GK 2H 4L: 180/330C 45/74P +1L slot C/P Ups + Cape Pro: 262.5/429C 62.5/96P +1L
It seems to be that the cal precision enhancer racial bonus + a Complex enhancer isn't able to even pick up a Gal scout due to its racial bonus + a Complex Dampener. And due to Cal needing a damp to stay under 25 himself, he couldn't use kinetic red speed boost. So he is slower, easier to find, cannot find Gal scouts and its given a L slot at the cost of 66 shields.
I might not be the best at this build stuff but it seems clear to me for scouts that Gal is better than Cal. Granted, I didn't add the shield% effect and I don't plan on running nades, or equipment and I prob won't even use more than a basic sidearm so my build is very linear. Building a K2 shotgun to keep CPU and PG use low and maximize suit capabilities by dumping all my SP into it makes me think that Gal seems like a far superior choice now.
Thanks for you help guys
Cots
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Son-Of A-Gun
3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance
1295
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Posted - 2014.02.18 18:35:00 -
[8] - Quote
Didn't take a look a all your math here but, a Gal scout with max skills and a complex dampener comes out with a profile of 22.78 dB. With two or a cloak (while cloak is active) comes out to 17.83 dB.
{edit >>> recalculating. Made a mistake.
{:)}{3GÇó>
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Son-Of A-Gun
3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance
1295
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Posted - 2014.02.18 18:42:00 -
[9] - Quote
Son-Of A-Gun wrote:Didn't take a look a all your math here but, a Gal scout with max skills and a complex dampener comes out with a profile of 17.72 dB. With two or a cloak (while cloak is active) comes out to 13.87 dB. {edit >>> recalculating. Made a mistake. Fixed.
Ok fixed. Sorry about that.
{:)}{3GÇó>
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Son-Of A-Gun
3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance
1295
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Posted - 2014.02.18 19:00:00 -
[10] - Quote
Here's what I'll be running after 1.8 drops, if the RR isn't totally recked by nerfs/is still useful:
(taken from here: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=138004&find=unread)
My two main proto Gal Scout fittings with the cloak:
Comp damage mod (can replace with comp shield extender on either fit) Comp shield extender
Kaalakiota RR Visiam SP
Allotek nanohive Proto cloak field (alternate fitting: std cloak field)
Comp range amp 2x basic plate Militia CPU enhancer (alternate fitting: comp kin cat)
(sum total CPU/PG)
474.5/72.9 (alternate fitting: 432/87.9)
(Dropsuit CPU/PG max capacity)
476.43/97.12 (alternate fitting: 433.12/97.12)
Shield HP: 160.1 (alternate fitting: 232.7) Armor HP: 349.5 eHP: 509.6 (alternate fitting: 582.2) Movement: 5.23 Sprint speed: 7.69 (alternate fitting: 8.66)
{:)}{3GÇó>
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Cotsy8
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY
10
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Posted - 2014.02.21 06:30:00 -
[11] - Quote
I have a few more questions:
1. Is it possible for any scout class to run nova knife? I do not plan on using a secondary weapon mod, and if i don't choose min race and get racial benefit... Is it possible to be affective because min adv scout suits aren't going to support my desired drop suit Hi and Lo slot load out. (Damp, Kin CAt, Cardaic)
2. Would it be possible to run a scrambler pistol as your main weapon on a scout suit. I haven't seen a single youtube dust video on someone doing it. If i pair nova knife with something, it would be scrambler pistol but i don't want to be stuck spending massive SP into a set up and then have scrambler pistols be terrible. 2 b. I haven't seen anyone using the flaylock pistol since it was nerf'd last patch either. Is it a viable weapon or is it be completely useless.
3. At advanced scout min suit it seems impossible due to slot load out to be effective. Using Kin Cats is a must but then you would need stamina/dampeners and there's only one slot at advanced. Does this mean min advanced suits are going to suck compared to Amar and Gal whose loadouts can provide Kin Cat, with both stamina and Dampener due to racial bonuses?!?
Thanks again,
Cots |
MINA Longstrike
2Shitz 1Giggle
311
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Posted - 2014.02.21 06:54:00 -
[12] - Quote
Cotsy8 wrote:I have a few more questions:
1. Is it possible for any scout class to run nova knife? I do not plan on using a secondary weapon mod, and if i don't choose min race and get racial benefit... Is it possible to be affective because min adv scout suits aren't going to support my desired drop suit Hi and Lo slot load out. (Damp, Kin CAt, Cardaic)
2. Would it be possible to run a scrambler pistol as your main weapon on a scout suit. I haven't seen a single youtube dust video on someone doing it. If i pair nova knife with something, it would be scrambler pistol but i don't want to be stuck spending massive SP into a set up and then have scrambler pistols be terrible. 2 b. I haven't seen anyone using the flaylock pistol since it was nerf'd last patch either. Is it a viable weapon or is it be completely useless.
3. At advanced scout min suit it seems impossible due to slot load out to be effective. Using Kin Cats is a must but then you would need stamina/dampeners and there's only one slot at advanced. Does this mean min advanced suits are going to suck compared to Amar and Gal whose loadouts can provide Kin Cat, with both stamina and Dampener due to racial bonuses?!?
Thanks again,
Cots
1) yes, especially if you plan on running nk + pistol with sidearm mods. Adv/pro nk's are really good even if you're not minmatar. 2) scp's hit really hard as is and can body shot people down, you'll also have the option of the full auto bolt pistol, avoid ion & flaylock 3) kin cats and cardiac regs are good but not necessary, I use range amps more often than not. |
Denak Kalamari
Intaki Liberation Front Intaki Prosperity Initiative
1150
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Posted - 2014.02.21 06:58:00 -
[13] - Quote
Cotsy8 wrote:I have a few more questions:
1. Is it possible for any scout class to run nova knife? I do not plan on using a secondary weapon mod, and if i don't choose min race and get racial benefit... Is it possible to be affective because min adv scout suits aren't going to support my desired drop suit Hi and Lo slot load out. (Damp, Kin CAt, Cardaic) Any suit can use nova knives, but Minmatar scouts get the best benefit out of it due go their speed and bonuses to nova knife damage. You can always make it work with other scout fits, but Minmatar scouts natively make the most ouf of them.
Cotsy8 wrote:2. Would it be possible to run a scrambler pistol as your main weapon on a scout suit. I haven't seen a single youtube dust video on someone doing it. If i pair nova knife with something, it would be scrambler pistol but i don't want to be stuck spending massive SP into a set up and then have scrambler pistols be terrible. Check some videos from Cyrus Li-Moody, he rocks the pistol and knives combo. I don't know much about neither of them, so ask someone else.
Cotsy8 wrote:2 b. I haven't seen anyone using the flaylock pistol since it was nerf'd last patch either. Is it a viable weapon or is it be completely useless? They are very situational weapons, and from what I've heard not really worth using anymore. Then again plasma cannons, shotguns and laser rifles are considered useless, but people still rock them.
Cotsy8 wrote:3. At advanced scout min suit it seems impossible due to slot load out to be effective. Using Kin Cats is a must but then you would need stamina/dampeners and there's only one slot at advanced. Does this mean min advanced suits are going to suck compared to Amar and Gal whose loadouts can provide Kin Cat, with both stamina and Dampener due to racial bonuses?!? You're basing this off of 1.8 stats, according to the spreadsheet, Minmatar scouts get three high slots at advanced level, so I don't see the problem.
And I'd like to note that 1.8 is still at least a few weeks away, and we don't k ow for sure what is going to be changed. If I were you, I'd hold any major decisions on what you will do with your fits until it actually hits.
Grahisha of ILF // Writer of Thoughts of a Clone Soldier // Latest entry published Feb. 10th
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Crimson ShieId
Psygod9 D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
79
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Posted - 2014.02.21 07:03:00 -
[14] - Quote
Cotsy8 wrote:I have a few more questions:
1. Is it possible for any scout class to run nova knife? I do not plan on using a secondary weapon mod, and if i don't choose min race and get racial benefit... Is it possible to be affective because min adv scout suits aren't going to support my desired drop suit Hi and Lo slot load out. (Damp, Kin CAt, Cardaic)
2. Would it be possible to run a scrambler pistol as your main weapon on a scout suit. I haven't seen a single youtube dust video on someone doing it. If i pair nova knife with something, it would be scrambler pistol but i don't want to be stuck spending massive SP into a set up and then have scrambler pistols be terrible. 2 b. I haven't seen anyone using the flaylock pistol since it was nerf'd last patch either. Is it a viable weapon or is it be completely useless.
3. At advanced scout min suit it seems impossible due to slot load out to be effective. Using Kin Cats is a must but then you would need stamina/dampeners and there's only one slot at advanced. Does this mean min advanced suits are going to suck compared to Amar and Gal whose loadouts can provide Kin Cat, with both stamina and Dampener due to racial bonuses?!?
Thanks again,
Cots
Nova knives can indeed be run on any class, though the minmatar scout is obviously the first choice due to the 25% damage bonus. Wonderful toys they are, and being able to one shot proto suits is a life saver in many situations.
Pistols... pistols... Ya know, I'm not even gonna bother with this one. I'll let Moody do the explaining.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bv5Yw4YT7MA
Advanced Minmatar has two lows and two highs I believe at advanced levels, and I believe they're getting a slot buff come 1.8 as well, so they'll be doing anything but sucking. However, at advanced, I believe the gallente scouts are probably the most viable option right now as they get 3 lows and 2 highs (I think, not 100% on this one)
All in all, it depends on what you want. Frankly, I prefer the minmatar scouts as E-ware scouts simply because of the nova knives. They might not get the best bonuses for it, but because of that alpha damage (1000 from proto at lv5 scout) you've got a major advantage against a lot of players. I'd recommend making an alt to test the knives first though if you haven't spent time with them. They're excellent weapons, but not for everyone.
Sometimes I miss never seeing tanks in a battle... then I remember the mystical flying soma, and I can't help but smile.
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Ghosts Chance
Inf4m0us
1117
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Posted - 2014.02.21 07:23:00 -
[15] - Quote
my advice is wait for 1.8 since we still dont really know how gameplay is going to be effected and therefore whats going to be nessesary or possable in builds. |
Mortishai Belmont
G.L.O.R.Y
12
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Posted - 2014.02.21 08:49:00 -
[16] - Quote
scrap all that and go Gallente heavy with me >.>
G.L.O.R.Y solider,
Master of the Heavy
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Django Quik
Dust2Dust.
2224
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Posted - 2014.02.21 08:50:00 -
[17] - Quote
Pretty sure the CK0 layout was 4 hi 2 low and not the 3/3 you've listed (but I have been known to be wrong before).
You seem to prefer shields to armor, so naturally caldari would suit you best.
You don't necessarily have to run dampeners on all your suits - scanners are getting a major tweaking with the change to snapshot scans and stat nerfs, so you'll see them a lot less in 1.8 and dampeners will become less important. You can always have copy suits with damps on to change into if you do ever see the "You have been scanned" warning pop up.
If you do choose to go gallente, you get a LOT of flexibility - the free 3hp/s armor repair and natural dampening and range are possibly the best native skill bonuses in the game (note that the caldari shield regen is awesome and they also get the scanning range buff).
Pistols are my thing and have been for a long long time. They rock - if you know how to aim! I go for the breaches but most prefer the fast firing of the assaults. That said, the ammo count is low, so not something I would pair with other low ammo weapons like shotguns or situational weapons like knives - in those cases I'd probably choose the magsec SMG = lots of ammo, decent range and dps/rof.
There are a few select people using flaylocks to good effect but they are very rare and still considered garbage. Ion pistol will need major buffs to be considered of use. Bolt pistol looks great but I think I'll stick to my scrambler pistol/SMG combo personally.
Min scouts can be very effective but remember that you can't charge knives while sprinting. The new slot layout and stats in 1.8 and extra hacking buff is going to make them so much better than they are now, so I wouldn't discount them entirely from your consideration. I'm probably going to pick it up for my hacking suit and keep my gal for combat purposes.
Make sure you pop into the Barbershop and say hi, if you want to talk to more scouts and ask any more questions you might have there.
Dedicated sidearm scout - Watch out for that headshot
Scout community is the nuts
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