DUST Search - FOTM, Respecs, COMPETITIVE GAME

All Channels

General Discussions

FOTM, Respecs, COMPETITIVE GAME

» Click here to find additional results for this topic using Google

Monitor this thread via RSS [?]

Pages: [1] 2 3 :: one page

Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Tebu Gan Dem Durrty Boyz Renegade Alliance 441	Posted - 2014.01.23 13:54:00 - [1] - Quote Let's stop and take a step back here. Dust 514 is a competitive game. But what does that mean? Let's take it's counterpart, EVE, for comparison. I can safely say EVE is a competitive game. In both PVP and PVE. But EvE has many non competitive aspects as well, like mining and producing. The main source of competition though comes from PVP, Ship vs Ship battles. Like Dust, there are strength in numbers, so it's not all about having the best gear, but it still plays a huge part. In EVE, having a better ship, and in some cases bigger ship, than the one you are going up against will win you the encounter. In equal matchups between ships, it comes down to the persons skills. And then you have your Fleets (squads) coordinating together to take down enemies. The biggest thing though for both EVE and Dust, is the competition, you play to win. When it comes to competing against another person, you look for every way possible to win. I don't think there is any such thing as a cheap tactics or FOTM. We are here to compete, we are here to win. In Dust how is it that you interact with other players? There are Red dots and Blue dots! Dust has a hint of RPG elements to it, but it IS a competitive team based shooter. People go into the FOTM, not because they are scrubs! Because they, like anyone else, WANT TO WIN. Like back when everyone was running around in a Cal Logi, that suit was the **. Even then people were crying FOTM and hating them for it. You know why you feel that hate, because there is an imbalance between your choices, and their choices. It has nothing to do with the person that chooses the FOTM, no doubt you would feel differently if that had been your first choice. People don't choose the FOTM to be *** dicks, they choose it because they want to win. That is the POINT of the game!** The fault lies fully with CCP, and no one else. People get so happy when something gets nerfed, and they make sure to let FOTM chasers know. Oh sorry, your suit sucks now, how does it feel? Oh, so what, you were jealous, and now you have to rub it in a players face, when it was CCP who allowed these imbalances! And people LOVE to bring this up in Respec discussions. Here is what is happening though. Player A chooses gimped weapon Player B chooses FOTM Player B murders Player A for several months, until CCP makes another crack at balancing. Player B gets nerfed Player A and B on more equal footing. So, you wouldn't want an FOTM chaser to get a respec, because they made you suffer for 3 months. So they should suffer too. Does anyone else see how childish this all is. THE PLAYERS HAVE NEVER BEEN AT FAULT FOR DOING ANY WRONG. They just play to win, which is how you SHOULD play. So people did their homework, and choose the most powerful suit. Sorry you didn't do the same? FOTM has no place in a respec discussion, I mean jesus how often can a FOTM player be an FOTM player. After they nerf them, they cease to be FOTM, and now must grind out new suits. WHICH AT THIS POINT THEY NO DOUBT HAVE DONE. Is everyone that went into the new rail rifle and combat rifle FOTM chasers! Should they be fair and just put down their shiny toys in place of something on your level! NO, adapt or die. Oh they have rail rifles, well guess I'll pull mine to counter. Tactics 101. If you are not playing to win, you are not playing the game! Nuff Said
stlcarlos989 SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 1021	Posted - 2014.01.23 13:59:00 - [2] - Quote They went overboard with the cal logi CPU nerf, the buff to armor and cal logi shield bonus change was enough, its now gimped as far true logi work goes. Still a decent suit but pales in comparison to gallente logi, but my combat rifle puts gallente logis in their place. STB Director, #1 in Warpoints E3 Closed Beta Build, Water Pipe Aficionado
Atiim Living Like Larry Schwag 3847	Posted - 2014.01.23 14:05:00 - [3] - Quote I see what you did there. Next On To-Do List: Particle Cannons
Reav Hannari Red Rock Outriders 2761	Posted - 2014.01.23 14:10:00 - [4] - Quote Saying DUST is competitive in this way is like saying war is competitive. I think most equate competitive with level stats and equipment and using player skill as the difference. DUST is about brutal combat and intentionally stacking the odds in your favor. What DUST does need is a means of letting the rookies have more time to mature before they have to face the hardened veterans running their best gear. // Venge Captain // Matari Logistics / Scout / Pilot // @ReesNoturana
axis alpha Red Star. EoN. 164	Posted - 2014.01.23 14:12:00 - [5] - Quote By god... This community..... Pf The best part of waking up, is whiskey in my cuuuuup!
Maken Tosch Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 6542	Posted - 2014.01.23 14:27:00 - [6] - Quote Tebu Gan wrote: Player A chooses gimped weapon Player B chooses FOTM Alternative Ending: Player A masters the art of the gimped weapon and succeeds in slaughtering Player B for a long time because Player A was smart enough to play it safe and take advantage of the FOTM's weakness. OK, CCP. When are knives finally going to be improved? *CLOSED BETA VETERAN SINCE REPLICATION BUILD*
Bethhy Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance 902	Posted - 2014.01.23 14:27:00 - [7] - Quote Quote: A scrub is a player who is handicapped by self-imposed rules that the game knows nothing about. A scrub does not play to win. There is the mistaken notion, though, that by merely continuing to play or GÇ£learnGÇ¥ the game, one can become a top player. In reality, the GÇ£scrubGÇ¥ has many more mental obstacles to overcome than anything actually going on during the game. The scrub has lost the game even before it starts. HeGÇÖs lost the game even before deciding which game to play. His problem? He does not play to win. The scrub would take great issue with this statement for he usually believes that he is playing to win, but he is bound up by an intricate construct of fictitious rules that prevents him from ever truly competing. These made-up rules vary from game to game, of course, but their character remains constant.
CRYPT3C W0LF Eyniletti Rangers Minmatar Republic 265	Posted - 2014.01.23 14:29:00 - [8] - Quote IMO I dont think you cant justify using a FoTM Item that way :P You're Friendly Scout Youtuber, A Merc With a Passion! :)
Sigberct Amni Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 345	Posted - 2014.01.23 14:34:00 - [9] - Quote Bethhy wrote: Quote: A scrub is a player who is handicapped by self-imposed rules that the game knows nothing about. A scrub does not play to win. There is the mistaken notion, though, that by merely continuing to play or GÇ£learnGÇ¥ the game, one can become a top player. In reality, the GÇ£scrubGÇ¥ has many more mental obstacles to overcome than anything actually going on during the game. The scrub has lost the game even before it starts. HeGÇÖs lost the game even before deciding which game to play. His problem? He does not play to win. The scrub would take great issue with this statement for he usually believes that he is playing to win, but he is bound up by an intricate construct of fictitious rules that prevents him from ever truly competing. These made-up rules vary from game to game, of course, but their character remains constant.
devonus durga P.L.A.N. B 178	Posted - 2014.01.23 14:58:00 - [10] - Quote Tebu Gan In EVE, having a better ship, and in some cases bigger ship, than the one you are going up against will win you the encounter. In equal matchups between ships, it comes down to the persons skills. And then you have your Fleets (squads) coordinating together to take down enemies. The biggest thing though for both EVE and Dust, is the competition, you play to win. When it comes to competing against another person, you look for every way possible to win. I don't think there is any such thing as a cheap tactics or FOTM. We are here to compete, we are here to win. In Dust how is it that you interact with other players? There are Red dots and Blue dots! Dust has a hint of RPG elements to it, but it IS a competitive team based shooter. People go into the FOTM, not because they are scrubs! Because they, like anyone else, WANT TO WIN. Like back when everyone was running around in a Cal Logi, that suit was the **. Even then people were crying FOTM and hating them for it. You know why you feel that hate, because there is an imbalance between your choices, and their choices. It has nothing to do with the person that chooses the FOTM, no doubt you would feel differently if that had been your first choice. People don't choose the FOTM to be ***** dicks, they choose it because they want to win. [b wrote: That is the POINT of the game![/b] The fault lies fully with CCP, and no one else. People get so happy when something gets nerfed, and they make sure to let FOTM chasers know. Oh sorry, your suit sucks now, how does it feel? Oh, so what, you were jealous, and now you have to rub it in a players face, when it was CCP who allowed these imbalances! And people LOVE to bring this up in Respec discussions. Here is what is happening though. Player A chooses gimped weapon Player B chooses FOTM Player B murders Player A for several months, until CCP makes another crack at balancing. Player B gets nerfed Player A and B on more equal footing. So, you wouldn't want an FOTM chaser to get a respec, because they made you suffer for 3 months. So they should suffer too. Does anyone else see how childish this all is. THE PLAYERS HAVE NEVER BEEN AT FAULT FOR DOING ANY WRONG. They just play to win, which is how you SHOULD play. So people did their homework, and choose the most powerful suit. Sorry you didn't do the same? FOTM has no place in a respec discussion, I mean jesus how often can a FOTM player be an FOTM player. After they nerf them, they cease to be FOTM, and now must grind out new suits. WHICH AT THIS POINT THEY NO DOUBT HAVE DONE. Is everyone that went into the new rail rifle and combat rifle FOTM chasers! Should they be fair and just put down their shiny toys in place of something on your level! Your reasoning is well though out, but it also shows why no respec is needed. People will grind out the fotm suit if that's what they want, if I wanted to run the form suit I would have to grind it out. Its equal footing, everyone has to grind it out unless the current fotm happens to be something their already skilled into. Now let's give people respec. Well I have 3m sp, OK I can go for the best fotm suit I can, which will probably be the first to get nerfed . Now let's give someone with 10m sp, they spec out the top two fotm suits, and its even longer before both their suits get fixed. It increases with sp. A respec isn't needed, for medium suits anyways, immediately. Chances are if you have less then 10m sp you can see the imbalance that will come of this, and the stomping that will in sue. Those with 10m sp+, cha ces are, though your suit may not be as powerful as it is now, 1 or 2 of the suits your specced into will remain as effective, if not more so. So there is no need fr an immediate respec game balance wise. Economicly speaking, a respec is also not needed. Players will run fotm regardless of if they have the sp for it or not. They will stick what sp they can into it, and either grind out the faction version, or spend aur. Either way most players can gain access to the new suit they want in a reasonable amount of time, without a respec, and if players by aur versions, t helps the game. And then there is the balance and testing. With so many new suits and changes coming, a medium respec will hurt the game and the time to achieve balance. Roughly 1/4 of the player base. Belongs to large corps well known for their use of fotm, and as such a full respec will result in some suits not being tested properly, and will delay the time to proper game balance.does t caldari suit need a buff? Or is the issue because gallente suits need a nerf? Such decisions are difficult without adequate numbers across the spectrum of suits, and though the current suits are not at their intended place, thuer relatively balanced and a good number of players are spread across them. All a respec will do is result ina large number of players moving to certain suits and will lead to an imbalance in statistics and testing, and will delay the proper implementation of fixes. That's half the reason nerfs, usually come down so hard IMO. Be cause everyone is using it the statistics of that item vs another are imbalanced. Is the rail rifle as op as it seems? Or is it the fact that 3/4 of the assault player base using it that makes it seem that way? You have waited this long, a few months more while they balance things won't hurt. And your right the fault does lie with CCP on the current imbalances. So, to fix those imbalances, they need time, and people playing the things that need to be balanced. Giving a respec just will slow that process down. So if you want a balanced game, clamouring for a respec isn't going to help it. And also, in eve, you might have the biggest badest ship, and so will beat me, but I can take my miner out until I can afford and have the skills to fight you. There is no equivalent of that he so the comparison. Is null and void. Newbiest newberry to ever spawn a 12 page Debate

devonus durga P.L.A.N. B 178	Posted - 2014.01.23 15:01:00 - [11] - Quote Bethhy wrote: Quote: A scrub is a player who is handicapped by self-imposed rules that the game knows nothing about. A scrub does not play to win. There is the mistaken notion, though, that by merely continuing to play or GÇ£learnGÇ¥ the game, one can become a top player. In reality, the GÇ£scrubGÇ¥ has many more mental obstacles to overcome than anything actually going on during the game. The scrub has lost the game even before it starts. HeGÇÖs lost the game even before deciding which game to play. His problem? He does not play to win. The scrub would take great issue with this statement for he usually believes that he is playing to win, but he is bound up by an intricate construct of fictitious rules that prevents him from ever truly competing. These made-up rules vary from game to game, of course, but their character remains constant. Yes, its called ethics. By that notion, the us is scrubs, for not nuking everyone. Definition noted, lulled at, and discarded. Newbiest newberry to ever spawn a 12 page Debate
DUST Fiend OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 10285	Posted - 2014.01.23 15:02:00 - [12] - Quote People seem to think dust is real life, and not a video game Videos / Fiction Closed Beta Vet; Incubus Pilot
devonus durga P.L.A.N. B 178	Posted - 2014.01.23 15:05:00 - [13] - Quote DUST Fiend wrote: People seem to think dust is real life, and not a video game No, I know its a game. So is football, should I poison the cowgirls? GO EAGLES!!?.... next year -sigh- Newbiest newberry to ever spawn a 12 page Debate
devonus durga P.L.A.N. B 178	Posted - 2014.01.23 15:08:00 - [14] - Quote Also, I think all of dust needs to go watch sword art online, the lot of you are like the pk players there. Its just a game, I don't have to be nice or civil, blah blah blah, Newbiest newberry to ever spawn a 12 page Debate
Melchiah ARANeAE The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 434	Posted - 2014.01.23 15:14:00 - [15] - Quote Whilst I agree that FOTM should be kept out of respec discussions, there are a lot of things you are wrong about. Video games are all about enjoyment. Some people prefer a more casual non-competitive environment where winning isn't everything. Others prefer a very competitive and hostile environment where everyone will abuse anything within their power to win. Both groups of players should be respected as 2 important demographics and should be catered for. Even EVE, considered one of the most hostile games around, has lots of non-competitive elements and caters quite nicely for casuals. As you've said so yourself: Tebu Gan wrote: But EvE has many non competitive aspects as well However, Dust currently fails to cater to casuals. The casuals are forced to play against tryhards who ruin their experience as they can't play in an environment they feel comfortable in. However, they tryhards never consider the fact that different people get enjoyment from different things. They only see it like this: Tebu Gan wrote: If you are not playing to win, you are not playing the game! And as the people they're fighting aren't challenging this, they're relatively comfortable. They don't see what they're doing wrong and expect the casuals to change their play style to conform to their hyper-competitive, testosterone fueled opinion on how it 'should' be. The two groups should have environments (hi sec, low sec and null sec) that suit the level of competition and 'asshattery'. We want cake and tea.
Tebu Gan Dem Durrty Boyz Renegade Alliance 443	Posted - 2014.01.23 15:23:00 - [16] - Quote Melchiah ARANeAE wrote: Whilst I agree that FOTM should be kept out of respec discussions, there are a lot of things you are wrong about. Video games are all about enjoyment. Some people prefer a more casual non-competitive environment where winning isn't everything. Others prefer a very competitive and hostile environment where everyone will abuse anything within their power to win. Both groups of players should be respected as 2 important demographics and should be catered for. Even EVE, considered one of the most hostile games around, has lots of non-competitive elements and caters quite nicely for casuals. As you've said so yourself: Tebu Gan wrote: But EvE has many non competitive aspects as well However, Dust currently fails to cater to casuals. The casuals are forced to play against tryhards who ruin their experience as they can't play in an environment they feel comfortable in. However, they tryhards never consider the fact that different people get enjoyment from different things. They only see it like this: Tebu Gan wrote: If you are not playing to win, you are not playing the game! And as the people they're fighting aren't challenging this, they're relatively comfortable. They don't see what they're doing wrong and expect the casuals to change their play style to conform to their hyper-competitive, testosterone fueled opinion on how it 'should' be. The two groups should have environments (hi sec, low sec and null sec) that suit the level of competition and 'asshattery'. Totally agree with ya there. But the only element currently in game is the Competitive aspect. This IS a first person shooter, calling them try hards is just redick man. What was the point to COD, MAG, ect ect ect. What was in it for the casual? There are softer elements missing from the game, yes. But considering the only environment available is low sec, yes you should conform to the try hards if you want to win. Otherwise yr gonna have to wait. And I get it, you want FUN games, not one sided stomps. Even the ones doing the stomping hate it. Matchmaking is TERRIBLE in this game. "Testosterone fueled opinion on how it 'should' be", No my friend, this is how it is. Until they expand the environments available (low sec, high sec), competition will be the main aim of the game. Nuff Said
Tebu Gan Dem Durrty Boyz Renegade Alliance 443	Posted - 2014.01.23 15:35:00 - [17] - Quote Bethhy wrote: Quote: A scrub is a player who is handicapped by self-imposed rules that the game knows nothing about. A scrub does not play to win. There is the mistaken notion, though, that by merely continuing to play or GÇ£learnGÇ¥ the game, one can become a top player. In reality, the GÇ£scrubGÇ¥ has many more mental obstacles to overcome than anything actually going on during the game. The scrub has lost the game even before it starts. HeGÇÖs lost the game even before deciding which game to play. His problem? He does not play to win. The scrub would take great issue with this statement for he usually believes that he is playing to win, but he is bound up by an intricate construct of fictitious rules that prevents him from ever truly competing. These made-up rules vary from game to game, of course, but their character remains constant. Well put! Self-imposed rules that the game knows nothing about. This is it. The reason so many people go into FOTM, is because you assume the enemy will as well. If someone fights dirty, you fight dirty back. It's like bringing a knife to a gunfight. You got a lot of balls buddy, I'll give you that, but you ain't got **** on this gun. You really should have brought a gun. For SOO many months, I drove that gunnlogi, and I KNEW that if I went into maddies, I would be viable. I lost and I died to maddies so many times, but I got it. It wasn't totally a fault in my own skills, it was an imbalance between the 2 tanks, so to counter, I changed my tactics accordingly, and speced into a logi suit for times I couldn't run my tank! Nuff Said
Tebu Gan Dem Durrty Boyz Renegade Alliance 443	Posted - 2014.01.23 15:54:00 - [18] - Quote devonus durga wrote: Bethhy wrote: Quote: A scrub is a player who is handicapped by self-imposed rules that the game knows nothing about. A scrub does not play to win. There is the mistaken notion, though, that by merely continuing to play or GÇ£learnGÇ¥ the game, one can become a top player. In reality, the GÇ£scrubGÇ¥ has many more mental obstacles to overcome than anything actually going on during the game. The scrub has lost the game even before it starts. HeGÇÖs lost the game even before deciding which game to play. His problem? He does not play to win. The scrub would take great issue with this statement for he usually believes that he is playing to win, but he is bound up by an intricate construct of fictitious rules that prevents him from ever truly competing. These made-up rules vary from game to game, of course, but their character remains constant. Yes, its called ethics. By that notion, the us is scrubs, for not nuking everyone. Definition noted, lulled at, and discarded. Fella, I think you missed a lot of the points I was trying to make. Something you need to understand, there will always be FOTM chasers. As long as this is a competitive game, people will always be looking for the next best thing. A single respec isn't going to flip the whole world upside down. Some will go into the FOTM, yeah. A lot will go right back into what they had. Some will go for something totally new. I find it foolish to assume that every single person will go into the FOTM to be competitive. It takes all kinds of suits to make a PC match result in a win! We will still need heavies, tanks, logis, slayers, scouts, ect ect ect. Something else, I really don't think CCP listens as heavily as you think to feedback. Yes they will take in issues player bring up, and then look to find why there might or might not be an issue there. I don't think it has anything to do with player feedback, if anything players are warning of the next FOTM, yet CCP does nothing to change it. As for respecs, they are needed. This game is becoming stagnant, and needs a little bump. The EVE comparison, was meant to only compare what it means to PVP combat. Yeah I know you can take a miner out and PVE, but hey, YOU CAN'T DO THAT ON DUST. What you can do is PVP. And Ethics. You call it Ethics. You know, the early colonist and soldiers feared the Native Americans (my people). They were big on honor in combat, so standing in clear view of one another was the way to go. No sneaky bullshit, all ethical. The natives, they used camo, surprise, deceit. They would slit your throat while you slept, never giving you the chance to fight back. The warriors, they fought with honor too. They understood well, that a superior force was only as superior as their tactics. That is what dust currently is. Play to win. Yeah yea, you want pve blah blah blah. Guess what, THIS is what you have. It's not changing anytime soon. Nuff Said
Jake Diesel BIG BAD W0LVES 65	Posted - 2014.01.23 15:58:00 - [19] - Quote Tebu Gan wrote: Let's stop and take a step back here. Dust 514 is a competitive game. But what does that? Let's take it's counterpart, EVE, for comparison. I can safely say EVE is a competitive game. In both PVP and PVE. But EvE has many non competitive aspects as well, like mining and producing. The main source of competition though comes from PVP, Ship vs Ship battles. Like Dust, there are strength in numbers, so it's not all about having the best gear, but it still plays a huge part. In EVE, having a better ship, and in some cases bigger ship, than the one you are going up against will win you the encounter. In equal matchups between ships, it comes down to the persons skills. And then you have your Fleets (squads) coordinating together to take down enemies. The biggest thing though for both EVE and Dust, is the competition, you play to win. When it comes to competing against another person, you look for every way possible to win. I don't think there is any such thing as a cheap tactics or FOTM. We are here to compete, we are here to win. In Dust how is it that you interact with other players? There are Red dots and Blue dots! Dust has a hint of RPG elements to it, but it IS a competitive team based shooter. People go into the FOTM, not because they are scrubs! Because they, like anyone else, WANT TO WIN. Like back when everyone was running around in a Cal Logi, that suit was the **. Even then people were crying FOTM and hating them for it. You know why you feel that hate, because there is an imbalance between your choices, and their choices. It has nothing to do with the person that chooses the FOTM, no doubt you would feel differently if that had been your first choice. People don't choose the FOTM to be *** dicks, they choose it because they want to win. That is the POINT of the game!** The fault lies fully with CCP, and no one else. People get so happy when something gets nerfed, and they make sure to let FOTM chasers know. Oh sorry, your suit sucks now, how does it feel? Oh, so what, you were jealous, and now you have to rub it in a players face, when it was CCP who allowed these imbalances! And people LOVE to bring this up in Respec discussions. Here is what is happening though. Player A chooses gimped weapon Player B chooses FOTM Player B murders Player A for several months, until CCP makes another crack at balancing. Player B gets nerfed Player A and B on more equal footing. So, you wouldn't want an FOTM chaser to get a respec, because they made you suffer for 3 months. So they should suffer too. Does anyone else see how childish this all is. THE PLAYERS HAVE NEVER BEEN AT FAULT FOR DOING ANY WRONG. They just play to win, which is how you SHOULD play. So people did their homework, and choose the most powerful suit. Sorry you didn't do the same? FOTM has no place in a respec discussion, I mean jesus how often can a FOTM player be an FOTM player. After they nerf them, they cease to be FOTM, and now must grind out new suits. WHICH AT THIS POINT THEY NO DOUBT HAVE DONE. Is everyone that went into the new rail rifle and combat rifle FOTM chasers! Should they be fair and just put down their shiny toys in place of something on your level! NO, adapt or die. Oh they have rail rifles, well guess I'll pull mine to counter. Tactics 101. If you are not playing to win, you are not playing the game! So in essence, if this "competitive player" found a way to constantly call in an orbital strike for the entire match, this would be ok with you? Because it's the same thing. And if you so no, then you've just proved yourself wrong. Racing is a competitive game too. Do think it's ok for an F1 car to go up against a NASCAR car in the same race? There's a reason why people complain about these things and that's all thanks to these KDR whores whole have gotten every weapon, build, vehicle that has ever dominated the game at any point in the history if Dust to have that high KDR. And no. Constant orbital strikes are not ok.
Tebu Gan Dem Durrty Boyz Renegade Alliance 443	Posted - 2014.01.23 16:11:00 - [20] - Quote Jake Diesel wrote: Tebu Gan wrote: Let's stop and take a step back here. Dust 514 is a competitive game. But what does that? Let's take it's counterpart, EVE, for comparison. I can safely say EVE is a competitive game. In both PVP and PVE. But EvE has many non competitive aspects as well, like mining and producing. The main source of competition though comes from PVP, Ship vs Ship battles. Like Dust, there are strength in numbers, so it's not all about having the best gear, but it still plays a huge part. In EVE, having a better ship, and in some cases bigger ship, than the one you are going up against will win you the encounter. In equal matchups between ships, it comes down to the persons skills. And then you have your Fleets (squads) coordinating together to take down enemies. The biggest thing though for both EVE and Dust, is the competition, you play to win. When it comes to competing against another person, you look for every way possible to win. I don't think there is any such thing as a cheap tactics or FOTM. We are here to compete, we are here to win. In Dust how is it that you interact with other players? There are Red dots and Blue dots! Dust has a hint of RPG elements to it, but it IS a competitive team based shooter. People go into the FOTM, not because they are scrubs! Because they, like anyone else, WANT TO WIN. Like back when everyone was running around in a Cal Logi, that suit was the **. Even then people were crying FOTM and hating them for it. You know why you feel that hate, because there is an imbalance between your choices, and their choices. It has nothing to do with the person that chooses the FOTM, no doubt you would feel differently if that had been your first choice. People don't choose the FOTM to be *** dicks, they choose it because they want to win. That is the POINT of the game!** The fault lies fully with CCP, and no one else. People get so happy when something gets nerfed, and they make sure to let FOTM chasers know. Oh sorry, your suit sucks now, how does it feel? Oh, so what, you were jealous, and now you have to rub it in a players face, when it was CCP who allowed these imbalances! And people LOVE to bring this up in Respec discussions. Here is what is happening though. Player A chooses gimped weapon Player B chooses FOTM Player B murders Player A for several months, until CCP makes another crack at balancing. Player B gets nerfed Player A and B on more equal footing. So, you wouldn't want an FOTM chaser to get a respec, because they made you suffer for 3 months. So they should suffer too. Does anyone else see how childish this all is. THE PLAYERS HAVE NEVER BEEN AT FAULT FOR DOING ANY WRONG. They just play to win, which is how you SHOULD play. So people did their homework, and choose the most powerful suit. Sorry you didn't do the same? FOTM has no place in a respec discussion, I mean jesus how often can a FOTM player be an FOTM player. After they nerf them, they cease to be FOTM, and now must grind out new suits. WHICH AT THIS POINT THEY NO DOUBT HAVE DONE. Is everyone that went into the new rail rifle and combat rifle FOTM chasers! Should they be fair and just put down their shiny toys in place of something on your level! NO, adapt or die. Oh they have rail rifles, well guess I'll pull mine to counter. Tactics 101. If you are not playing to win, you are not playing the game! So in essence, if this "competitive player" found a way to constantly call in an orbital strike for the entire match, this would be ok with you? Because it's the same thing. And if you say no, then you've just proved yourself wrong. Racing is a competitive game too. Do think it's ok for an F1 car to go up against a NASCAR car in the same race? There's a reason why people complain about these things and that's all thanks to these KDR whores whole have gotten every weapon, build, vehicle that has ever dominated the game at any point in the history if Dust to have that high KDR. And no. Constant orbital strikes are not ok. No, and if something like that happens, they would hotfix it. It is not the same thing. Non stop orbis would give you an insane advantage over the battle, it's not even the same man. And even still, a competitive player will continue expanding SP growth into multiple areas anyways. So let's imagine those OP Cal logis, that got nerfed into the ground. They probably have 3 suits by now, and more than a few core skills and weapons. Now they could have gotten lucky, and chose Gal logi as another suit choice, but all of a sudden, those are the bomb. What about heavies, they murder now with the HMG. Oh no, what about mass driver users and laser rifles. Half these FOTM chasers are not FOTM chaser by choice, they just went into a suit they wanted and they happen to be OP. Some CHOOSE to go for the FOTM, like milita tankers, but I was a tanker before all this. Am I cheating now because I choose to stick with tanks?? See this is your logic, we don't really know what the future holds for our SP. All we can do is spend it and hope for the best, and use new SP to keep aiming for a competitive weapon or suit. Nuff Said

Darken-Soul Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 121	Posted - 2014.01.23 16:13:00 - [21] - Quote Tebu Gan wrote: Let's stop and take a step back here. Dust 514 is a competitive game. But what does that mean? Let's take it's counterpart, EVE, for comparison. I can safely say EVE is a competitive game. In both PVP and PVE. But EvE has many non competitive aspects as well, like mining and producing. The main source of competition though comes from PVP, Ship vs Ship battles. Like Dust, there are strength in numbers, so it's not all about having the best gear, but it still plays a huge part. In EVE, having a better ship, and in some cases bigger ship, than the one you are going up against will win you the encounter. In equal matchups between ships, it comes down to the persons skills. And then you have your Fleets (squads) coordinating together to take down enemies. The biggest thing though for both EVE and Dust, is the competition, you play to win. When it comes to competing against another person, you look for every way possible to win. I don't think there is any such thing as a cheap tactics or FOTM. We are here to compete, we are here to win. In Dust how is it that you interact with other players? There are Red dots and Blue dots! Dust has a hint of RPG elements to it, but it IS a competitive team based shooter. People go into the FOTM, not because they are scrubs! Because they, like anyone else, WANT TO WIN. Like back when everyone was running around in a Cal Logi, that suit was the **. Even then people were crying FOTM and hating them for it. You know why you feel that hate, because there is an imbalance between your choices, and their choices. It has nothing to do with the person that chooses the FOTM, no doubt you would feel differently if that had been your first choice. People don't choose the FOTM to be *** dicks, they choose it because they want to win. That is the POINT of the game!** The fault lies fully with CCP, and no one else. People get so happy when something gets nerfed, and they make sure to let FOTM chasers know. Oh sorry, your suit sucks now, how does it feel? Oh, so what, you were jealous, and now you have to rub it in a players face, when it was CCP who allowed these imbalances! And people LOVE to bring this up in Respec discussions. Here is what is happening though. Player A chooses gimped weapon Player B chooses FOTM Player B murders Player A for several months, until CCP makes another crack at balancing. Player B gets nerfed Player A and B on more equal footing. So, you wouldn't want an FOTM chaser to get a respec, because they made you suffer for 3 months. So they should suffer too. Does anyone else see how childish this all is. THE PLAYERS HAVE NEVER BEEN AT FAULT FOR DOING ANY WRONG. They just play to win, which is how you SHOULD play. So people did their homework, and choose the most powerful suit. Sorry you didn't do the same? FOTM has no place in a respec discussion, I mean jesus how often can a FOTM player be an FOTM player. After they nerf them, they cease to be FOTM, and now must grind out new suits. WHICH AT THIS POINT THEY NO DOUBT HAVE DONE. Is everyone that went into the new rail rifle and combat rifle FOTM chasers! Should they be fair and just put down their shiny toys in place of something on your level! NO, adapt or die. Oh they have rail rifles, well guess I'll pull mine to counter. Tactics 101. If you are not playing to win, you are not playing the game! this is how it is going with the AV vs V debate. Tankers hate the new patch as much as everyone else but they feel entitled to seeing other people suffer. Read their posts. They have nothing to do with the health of the game. Only poor me. Their balance ideas favor themselves, which is funny when considering an idea of balance. I agree with the statements you have made. I hope we can all grow up a bit and help this game succeed. I am the real Darken
Jake Diesel BIG BAD W0LVES 65	Posted - 2014.01.23 18:29:00 - [22] - Quote So in essence, if this "competitive player" found a way to constantly call in an orbital strike for the entire match, this would be ok with you? Because it's the same thing. And if you say no, then you've just proved yourself wrong. Racing is a competitive game too. Do think it's ok for an F1 car to go up against a NASCAR car in the same race? There's a reason why people complain about these things and that's all thanks to these KDR whores whole have gotten every weapon, build, vehicle that has ever dominated the game at any point in the history if Dust to have that high KDR. And no. Constant orbital strikes are not ok.[/quote] No, and if something like that happens, they would hotfix it. It is not the same thing. Non stop orbis would give you an insane advantage over the battle, it's not even the same man. And even still, a competitive player will continue expanding SP growth into multiple areas anyways. So let's imagine those OP Cal logis, that got nerfed into the ground. They probably have 3 suits by now, and more than a few core skills and weapons. Now they could have gotten lucky, and chose Gal logi as another suit choice, but all of a sudden, those are the bomb. What about heavies, they murder now with the HMG. Oh no, what about mass driver users and laser rifles. Half these FOTM chasers are not FOTM chaser by choice, they just went into a suit they wanted and they happen to be OP. Some CHOOSE to go for the FOTM, like milita tankers, but I was a tanker before all this. Am I cheating now because I choose to stick with tanks?? See this is your logic, we don't really know what the future holds for our SP. All we can do is spend it and hope for the best, and use new SP to keep aiming for a competitive weapon or suit.[/quote] The message I was trying to convey with that orbital strike example is not about glitches. What I am saying is this - if you give the weapons that could decimate the enemy with ease, players WILL flock to it. And the players I refer to are the KDR whores who care nothing for tanks, weapons, LAV's, RE's, or dropsuits. The only thing they care about is their KDR. And what combination of anything that would get them the most kills quickly with the least amount of deaths. These are the players who would've gotten everything from murder taxis, flaylocks, redline sniping, tower forging, and now militia tanks. Whatever the FOTM is/was. They've been there and done that. And the ones who get the loss are players like you and me who happen to spec into something we are passionate with and has nothing to do with KDR. I love my forge gun and nothing will ever replace it. No matter how much they nerf it.
Jake Diesel BIG BAD W0LVES 67	Posted - 2014.01.23 18:43:00 - [23] - Quote But the reality of it all, there's no such thing as a perfect balance in fps games. There's just way too many variables that would allow it. But we can at least come close. In my opinion, CCP is waaay off course. Tanks should be relying on infantry for support when attacking a well defended set of redberry infantry. This promotes team play. But now every Sica tank goes out and solos an all infantry enemy stronghold. This is the direction CCP took the 1.7 update to. And it's not good.
Scheneighnay McBob Learning Coalition College 3663	Posted - 2014.01.23 19:07:00 - [24] - Quote I personally can't wait until PVE so I don't have to deal with everyone jumping onto the FOTM. We used to have a time machine
Scheneighnay McBob Learning Coalition College 3664	Posted - 2014.01.23 19:10:00 - [25] - Quote Jake Diesel wrote: But the reality of it all, there's no such thing as a perfect balance in fps games. There's just way too many variables that would allow it. But we can at least come close. In my opinion, CCP is waaay off course. Tanks should be relying on infantry for support when attacking a well defended set of redberry infantry. This promotes team play. But now every Sica tank goes out and solos an all infantry enemy stronghold. This is the direction CCP took the 1.7 update to. And it's not good. We also need to remember that there are 2 types of balance: stat balance and community balance. It doesn't matter if armor vs shield is balanced if everyone is using anti-shield weapons, for example. We used to have a time machine
Yelhsa Jin-Mao TheLostLegion 251	Posted - 2014.01.23 19:19:00 - [26] - Quote Reav Hannari wrote: Saying DUST is competitive in this way is like saying war is competitive. I think most equate competitive with level stats and equipment and using player skill as the difference. DUST is about brutal combat and intentionally stacking the odds in your favor. What DUST does need is a means of letting the rookies have more time to mature before they have to face the hardened veterans running their best gear. I believe what you mean is this game needs a means for players of equal skill and equipment rating to be matched against eachother, this way, the game is more competitive for people and player skill and squad tactics actually counts for something, instead of people in proto suits simply zerg rushing the opposing team and crushing them into 'DUST'. I give you, 'Tiercide'. I can has ISK
Soldiersaint Deepspace Digital 687	Posted - 2014.01.23 19:29:00 - [27] - Quote Tebu Gan wrote: Let's stop and take a step back here. Dust 514 is a competitive game. But what does that mean? Let's take it's counterpart, EVE, for comparison. I can safely say EVE is a competitive game. In both PVP and PVE. But EvE has many non competitive aspects as well, like mining and producing. The main source of competition though comes from PVP, Ship vs Ship battles. Like Dust, there are strength in numbers, so it's not all about having the best gear, but it still plays a huge part. In EVE, having a better ship, and in some cases bigger ship, than the one you are going up against will win you the encounter. In equal matchups between ships, it comes down to the persons skills. And then you have your Fleets (squads) coordinating together to take down enemies. The biggest thing though for both EVE and Dust, is the competition, you play to win. When it comes to competing against another person, you look for every way possible to win. I don't think there is any such thing as a cheap tactics or FOTM. We are here to compete, we are here to win. In Dust how is it that you interact with other players? There are Red dots and Blue dots! Dust has a hint of RPG elements to it, but it IS a competitive team based shooter. People go into the FOTM, not because they are scrubs! Because they, like anyone else, WANT TO WIN. Like back when everyone was running around in a Cal Logi, that suit was the **. Even then people were crying FOTM and hating them for it. You know why you feel that hate, because there is an imbalance between your choices, and their choices. It has nothing to do with the person that chooses the FOTM, no doubt you would feel differently if that had been your first choice. People don't choose the FOTM to be *** dicks, they choose it because they want to win. That is the POINT of the game!** The fault lies fully with CCP, and no one else. People get so happy when something gets nerfed, and they make sure to let FOTM chasers know. Oh sorry, your suit sucks now, how does it feel? Oh, so what, you were jealous, and now you have to rub it in a players face, when it was CCP who allowed these imbalances! And people LOVE to bring this up in Respec discussions. Here is what is happening though. Player A chooses gimped weapon Player B chooses FOTM Player B murders Player A for several months, until CCP makes another crack at balancing. Player B gets nerfed Player A and B on more equal footing. So, you wouldn't want an FOTM chaser to get a respec, because they made you suffer for 3 months. So they should suffer too. Does anyone else see how childish this all is. THE PLAYERS HAVE NEVER BEEN AT FAULT FOR DOING ANY WRONG. They just play to win, which is how you SHOULD play. So people did their homework, and choose the most powerful suit. Sorry you didn't do the same? FOTM has no place in a respec discussion, I mean jesus how often can a FOTM player be an FOTM player. After they nerf them, they cease to be FOTM, and now must grind out new suits. WHICH AT THIS POINT THEY NO DOUBT HAVE DONE. Is everyone that went into the new rail rifle and combat rifle FOTM chasers! Should they be fair and just put down their shiny toys in place of something on your level! NO, adapt or die. Oh they have rail rifles, well guess I'll pull mine to counter. Tactics 101. If you are not playing to win, you are not playing the game! If your not playing to win your not playing the game? who the hell do you think you are? This worthless trash isnt real i feel sorry for all of you fools who spew trash like this. we can play this game however we want. you have no power or say on who is and is not a gamer. a gamer can be whatever the hell we want it to be. until the creator of games says what a gamer is you and everyone else like you can stuff a sock in it.
True Adamance Kameira Lodge Amarr Empire 6102	Posted - 2014.01.23 19:35:00 - [28] - Quote Tebu Gan wrote: Let's stop and take a step back here. Dust 514 is a competitive game. But what does that mean? Let's take it's counterpart, EVE, for comparison. I can safely say EVE is a competitive game. In both PVP and PVE. But EvE has many non competitive aspects as well, like mining and producing. The main source of competition though comes from PVP, Ship vs Ship battles. Like Dust, there are strength in numbers, so it's not all about having the best gear, but it still plays a huge part. In EVE, having a better ship, and in some cases bigger ship, than the one you are going up against will win you the encounter. In equal matchups between ships, it comes down to the persons skills. And then you have your Fleets (squads) coordinating together to take down enemies. The biggest thing though for both EVE and Dust, is the competition, you play to win. When it comes to competing against another person, you look for every way possible to win. I don't think there is any such thing as a cheap tactics or FOTM. We are here to compete, we are here to win. In Dust how is it that you interact with other players? There are Red dots and Blue dots! Dust has a hint of RPG elements to it, but it IS a competitive team based shooter. People go into the FOTM, not because they are scrubs! Because they, like anyone else, WANT TO WIN. Like back when everyone was running around in a Cal Logi, that suit was the **. Even then people were crying FOTM and hating them for it. You know why you feel that hate, because there is an imbalance between your choices, and their choices. It has nothing to do with the person that chooses the FOTM, no doubt you would feel differently if that had been your first choice. People don't choose the FOTM to be *** dicks, they choose it because they want to win. That is the POINT of the game!** The fault lies fully with CCP, and no one else. People get so happy when something gets nerfed, and they make sure to let FOTM chasers know. Oh sorry, your suit sucks now, how does it feel? Oh, so what, you were jealous, and now you have to rub it in a players face, when it was CCP who allowed these imbalances! And people LOVE to bring this up in Respec discussions. Here is what is happening though. Player A chooses gimped weapon Player B chooses FOTM Player B murders Player A for several months, until CCP makes another crack at balancing. Player B gets nerfed Player A and B on more equal footing. So, you wouldn't want an FOTM chaser to get a respec, because they made you suffer for 3 months. So they should suffer too. Does anyone else see how childish this all is. THE PLAYERS HAVE NEVER BEEN AT FAULT FOR DOING ANY WRONG. They just play to win, which is how you SHOULD play. So people did their homework, and choose the most powerful suit. Sorry you didn't do the same? FOTM has no place in a respec discussion, I mean jesus how often can a FOTM player be an FOTM player. After they nerf them, they cease to be FOTM, and now must grind out new suits. WHICH AT THIS POINT THEY NO DOUBT HAVE DONE. Is everyone that went into the new rail rifle and combat rifle FOTM chasers! Should they be fair and just put down their shiny toys in place of something on your level! NO, adapt or die. Oh they have rail rifles, well guess I'll pull mine to counter. Tactics 101. If you are not playing to win, you are not playing the game! Pulling the same weapon to counter another of the same weapon is not tactics. Its poor balancing. "My Faith in you is absolute; my sword is Yours, My God, and Your will guides me now and for all eternity."
Jake Diesel BIG BAD W0LVES 70	Posted - 2014.01.23 20:03:00 - [29] - Quote Scheneighnay McBob wrote: Jake Diesel wrote: But the reality of it all, there's no such thing as a perfect balance in fps games. There's just way too many variables that would allow it. But we can at least come close. In my opinion, CCP is waaay off course. Tanks should be relying on infantry for support when attacking a well defended set of redberry infantry. This promotes team play. But now every Sica tank goes out and solos an all infantry enemy stronghold. This is the direction CCP took the 1.7 update to. And it's not good. We also need to remember that there are 2 types of balance: stat balance and community balance. It doesn't matter if armor vs shield is balanced if everyone is using anti-shield weapons, for example. I somewhat agree. But from what I've learned observing CCP's nack for relying on stat numbers is this - all of those fancy stats and concepts are thrown out the window when it comes time to seeing them in action on the battlefield. What happens on the battlefield will tell the truth of all those stats and ideas when the KDR whores grab a hold of them.
CaoticFox Axis of Chaos 125	Posted - 2014.01.23 20:44:00 - [30] - Quote Bethhy wrote: Quote: A scrub is a player who is handicapped by self-imposed rules that the game knows nothing about. A scrub does not play to win. There is the mistaken notion, though, that by merely continuing to play or GÇ£learnGÇ¥ the game, one can become a top player. In reality, the GÇ£scrubGÇ¥ has many more mental obstacles to overcome than anything actually going on during the game. The scrub has lost the game even before it starts. HeGÇÖs lost the game even before deciding which game to play. His problem? He does not play to win. The scrub would take great issue with this statement for he usually believes that he is playing to win, but he is bound up by an intricate construct of fictitious rules that prevents him from ever truly competing. These made-up rules vary from game to game, of course, but their character remains constant. im a scrub by these standards



Pages: [1] 2 3 :: one page
First page \| Previous page \| Next page \| Last page

COPYRIGHT NOTICE
EVE Online/DUST514, the EVE/DUST514 logo, EVE/DUST514 and all associated logos and designs are the intellectual property of CCP hf. All artwork, screenshots, characters, vehicles, storylines, world facts or other recognizable features of the intellectual property relating to these trademarks are likewise the intellectual property of CCP hf. EVE Online and the EVE logo are the registered trademarks of CCP hf. All rights are reserved worldwide. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners. CCP hf. has granted permission to OMG Labs to use EVE Online/DUST514 and all associated logos and designs for promotional and information purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not in any way affiliated with, OMG Labs. CCP is in no way responsible for the content on or functioning of this website, nor can it be liable for any damage arising from the use of this website.