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![Beren Hurin Beren Hurin](https://web.ccpgamescdn.com/dust/img/character_creator/male_minmatar_128.jpg)
Beren Hurin
The Vanguardians
887
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Posted - 2013.07.31 17:05:00 -
[1] - Quote
Hear me out...everyone wants to mess with damage in some way, but there are other options... So lets table the damage discussion for now to talk about alternatives to a damge nerf...first defining the problem.
The problem that I've heard is:
-Its hard to strafe explosive damage (accuracy) -Noobs with some skillz can land 100% splash damage pretty easily (accuracy). -Its hard to shoot back when I'm getting shot (accuracy related) -The combo with Flux makes it super powerful (damage type)
As I see it 3/4 cmain complaints is that it is TOO easy to land good hits with the thing.
Therefore alternative balance passes could include:
A) Some noticeable and consequential sway, especially if moving. Could be eliminated if ADSing.
B) Like sway, you could make the weapon's kickback (returning to original target) significantly slower than the base RoF. Meaning spamming too fast means missing much further.
C) A reduction to the amound of knockback caused by splash damage. Basically a falloff to the target's knockback effect.
D) Alternative firing mechanic. Click once to rotate chamber, click again to fire. Spammers could lose count and timing long range shots could be more difficult. |
![Buster Friently Buster Friently](https://web.ccpgamescdn.com/dust/img/character_creator/male_minmatar_128.jpg)
Buster Friently
Rosen Association
1368
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Posted - 2013.07.31 17:06:00 -
[2] - Quote
Beren Hurin wrote:Hear me out...everyone wants to mess with damage in some way, but there are other options... So lets table the damage discussion for now to talk about alternatives to a damge nerf...first defining the problem.
The problem that I've heard is:
-Its hard to strafe explosive damage (accuracy) -Noobs with some skillz can land 100% splash damage pretty easily (accuracy). -Its hard to shoot back when I'm getting shot (accuracy related) -The combo with Flux makes it super powerful (damage type)
As I see it 3/4 cmain complaints is that it is TOO easy to land good hits with the thing.
Therefore alternative balance passes could include:
A) Some noticeable and consequential sway, especially if moving. Could be eliminated if ADSing.
B) Like sway, you could make the weapon's kickback (returning to original target) significantly slower than the base RoF. Meaning spamming too fast means missing much further.
C) A reduction to the amound of knockback caused by splash damage. Basically a falloff to the target's knockback effect.
D) Alternative firing mechanic. Click once to rotate chamber, click again to fire. Spammers could lose count and timing long range shots could be more difficult.
Hail AR 514. Go AR or go home.
Hint: (There's nothing wrong with the MD except that it's still a little UP) |
![Delta90212 Delta90212](https://web.ccpgamescdn.com/dust/img/character_creator/male_gallente_128.jpg)
Delta90212
Dust2Dust. Top Men.
17
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Posted - 2013.07.31 17:16:00 -
[3] - Quote
Buster Friently wrote:Beren Hurin wrote:Hear me out...everyone wants to mess with damage in some way, but there are other options... So lets table the damage discussion for now to talk about alternatives to a damge nerf...first defining the problem.
The problem that I've heard is:
-Its hard to strafe explosive damage (accuracy) -Noobs with some skillz can land 100% splash damage pretty easily (accuracy). -Its hard to shoot back when I'm getting shot (accuracy related) -The combo with Flux makes it super powerful (damage type)
As I see it 3/4 cmain complaints is that it is TOO easy to land good hits with the thing.
Therefore alternative balance passes could include:
A) Some noticeable and consequential sway, especially if moving. Could be eliminated if ADSing.
B) Like sway, you could make the weapon's kickback (returning to original target) significantly slower than the base RoF. Meaning spamming too fast means missing much further.
C) A reduction to the amound of knockback caused by splash damage. Basically a falloff to the target's knockback effect.
D) Alternative firing mechanic. Click once to rotate chamber, click again to fire. Spammers could lose count and timing long range shots could be more difficult. Hail AR 514. Go AR or go home. Hint: (There's nothing wrong with the MD except that it's still a little UP) There's absolutely nothing wrong with the MD ^ |
![Cody Sietz Cody Sietz](https://web.ccpgamescdn.com/dust/img/character_creator/male_gallente_128.jpg)
Cody Sietz
Bullet Cluster
637
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Posted - 2013.07.31 17:17:00 -
[4] - Quote
Buster Friently wrote:Beren Hurin wrote:Hear me out...everyone wants to mess with damage in some way, but there are other options... So lets table the damage discussion for now to talk about alternatives to a damge nerf...first defining the problem.
The problem that I've heard is:
-Its hard to strafe explosive damage (accuracy) -Noobs with some skillz can land 100% splash damage pretty easily (accuracy). -Its hard to shoot back when I'm getting shot (accuracy related) -The combo with Flux makes it super powerful (damage type)
As I see it 3/4 cmain complaints is that it is TOO easy to land good hits with the thing.
Therefore alternative balance passes could include:
A) Some noticeable and consequential sway, especially if moving. Could be eliminated if ADSing.
B) Like sway, you could make the weapon's kickback (returning to original target) significantly slower than the base RoF. Meaning spamming too fast means missing much further.
C) A reduction to the amound of knockback caused by splash damage. Basically a falloff to the target's knockback effect.
D) Alternative firing mechanic. Click once to rotate chamber, click again to fire. Spammers could lose count and timing long range shots could be more difficult. Hail AR 514. Go AR or go home. Hint: (There's nothing wrong with the MD except that it's still a little UP) Someone bashing the AR and saying the MD is UP?
Unheard of! |
![Celeste Cyra Celeste Cyra](https://web.ccpgamescdn.com/dust/img/character_creator/female_amarr_128.jpg)
Celeste Cyra
Red and Silver Hand Amarr Empire
0
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Posted - 2013.07.31 17:35:00 -
[5] - Quote
This wasn't such a big issue 2 days ago. Does this mean you want them to unnerf flaylock or are you just going to keep on finding more and more things to ***** about if it doesn't fit your playstyle? |
![Beren Hurin Beren Hurin](https://web.ccpgamescdn.com/dust/img/character_creator/male_minmatar_128.jpg)
Beren Hurin
The Vanguardians
888
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Posted - 2013.07.31 17:39:00 -
[6] - Quote
Celeste Cyra wrote:This wasn't such a big issue 2 days ago. Does this mean you want them to unnerf flaylock or are you just going to keep on finding more and more things to ***** about if it doesn't fit your playstyle?
Honestly I'm totally fine with where MDs were at. It was my first and is my favorite weapon. I just want to change the conversation from a direct damage nerf change to something else. Get people to think more broadly about mechanics rather than damage.
Frankly, I think that when aim-assist works we will see people dying at longer ranges, more accuracy from longer ranged rifles, and MDs given a run for their money. |
![NaglfarBP NaglfarBP](https://web.ccpgamescdn.com/dust/img/character_creator/male_minmatar_128.jpg)
NaglfarBP
Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
44
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Posted - 2013.07.31 17:41:00 -
[7] - Quote
The MD is finally in a good place. Please leave it alone. |
![Buster Friently Buster Friently](https://web.ccpgamescdn.com/dust/img/character_creator/male_minmatar_128.jpg)
Buster Friently
Rosen Association
1370
![View only posts by author View only posts by author](/images/icon_filter.gif) |
Posted - 2013.07.31 17:42:00 -
[8] - Quote
Beren Hurin wrote:Celeste Cyra wrote:This wasn't such a big issue 2 days ago. Does this mean you want them to unnerf flaylock or are you just going to keep on finding more and more things to ***** about if it doesn't fit your playstyle? Honestly I'm totally fine with where MDs were at. It was my first and is my favorite weapon. I just want to change the conversation from a direct damage nerf change to something else. Get people to think more broadly about mechanics rather than damage. Frankly, I think that when aim-assist works we will see people dying at longer ranges, more accuracy from longer ranged rifles, and MDs given a run for their money.
Yeah, because aim assists will only work for hitscan weapons, which shouldn't be in the game anyway (except for lasers and maybe rails).
What should be happening is ARs should be given flight time for projectiles. There's a non dmg based change that needs to happen, and it doesn't even involve nerfing the MD.
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![Luthien Tinu Luthien Tinu](https://web.ccpgamescdn.com/dust/img/character_creator/female_amarr_128.jpg)
Luthien Tinu
Red and Silver Hand Amarr Empire
8
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Posted - 2013.07.31 17:44:00 -
[9] - Quote
Buster Friently wrote:Beren Hurin wrote:Celeste Cyra wrote:This wasn't such a big issue 2 days ago. Does this mean you want them to unnerf flaylock or are you just going to keep on finding more and more things to ***** about if it doesn't fit your playstyle? Honestly I'm totally fine with where MDs were at. It was my first and is my favorite weapon. I just want to change the conversation from a direct damage nerf change to something else. Get people to think more broadly about mechanics rather than damage. Frankly, I think that when aim-assist works we will see people dying at longer ranges, more accuracy from longer ranged rifles, and MDs given a run for their money. Yeah, because aim assists will only work for hitscan weapons, which shouldn't be in the game anyway (except for lasers and maybe rails). What should be happening is ARs should be given flight time for projectiles. There's a non dmg based change that needs to happen, and it doesn't even involve nerfing the MD.
See my recommendation for Hybrid and Laser weapons and cap warfare kind of related |
![Beren Hurin Beren Hurin](https://web.ccpgamescdn.com/dust/img/character_creator/male_minmatar_128.jpg)
Beren Hurin
The Vanguardians
888
![View only posts by author View only posts by author](/images/icon_filter.gif) |
Posted - 2013.07.31 17:45:00 -
[10] - Quote
^^ oops my alt. |
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