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Sinclair ZX81
DUST University
Ivy League
0
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Posted - 2013.07.23 12:57:00 -
[1] - Quote
For instant battles, have different levels of battles based on drop suit meta levels only.
Militia: militia drop suit and vehicles only ---25% normal ISK reward, 60% normal SP reward
Standard: standard drop suit and vehicles or lower ---50% normal ISK reward, 70% normal SP reward
Advanced: advanced drop suit and vehicles or lower ---75% normal ISK reward, 80% normal SP reward
Proto: any drop suits and vehicles -- normal ISK reward, normal SP reward
Modules weapons and equipment, any are allowed that you can cram into the drop suit.
This will protect new players as they level up, ensuring there is no proto stomping as soon as you come out the academy. But new players can also choose to play with the big boys still and gain more ISK and SP with greater risk.
Advanced players with the right skills can fit equipment to their advantage, but it won't be as uneven as at present.
Give players the option of what level they want to play at, instead of it being a random lottery of coming against 16 random newbies or 2 squads from an elite corp in proto gear.
I imagine this would be the simplest solution to code, as you only need to look at the drop suit level as the player selects it to enter battle. (And check vehicles that are called)
~ZX81~ |
caroline farrell
The Phoenix Templars
6
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Posted - 2013.07.23 13:25:00 -
[2] - Quote
+1
Even if they just made 2 tiers for mlt and std then one for adv and pro. Just something to help the poor newbs. New players are sorely needed and we need to keep them around rather than them all leaving due to being stomped every match. |
Brasidas Kriegen
The Southern Legion
8
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Posted - 2013.07.23 13:39:00 -
[3] - Quote
Just set any option that isn't the accepted level red as if the fitting is invalid. Still means better SP players will have advantages, like faster reload etc but it will even the playing field more. I would prefer this to one based on SP purely, as I do like to run militia gear as well occasionally.
At the same time I feel like limiting people in this way would firstly not make sense from any lore based perspective, and would prefer having more options with game types to stagger rewards. So rather than gear limitations have game modes, like Faction Warfare provide greater rewards to attract the players with the higher SP. With this the cost of proto gear could even be increased (or normal pub game rewards reduced) to make it so that losing one or two proto suits will net you a loss to strongly discourage people "pubstomping". Then with the increased reward in the other modes (like FW) people will be able to use their proto or adv gear and at least break even.
Equally, with pub games being the equivalent of EVE High Sec, perhaps proto gear can be treated like capital ships. Very few capital ships are allowed in High Sec in EVE, so just ban proto suits? If you gave people an isk efficiency stat that would help...I could go 1/10 in militia gear and come out with a great efficiency, take the focus away from KDR.
In my experience though most of the problem isnt the gear, but instead its the fact that most players running proto gear are in corporations, who run squads. So you don't have 6 guys running around by themselves in top gear, you have 6 guys running around in top gear using voice comms and teamwork to annihilate their opposition. 6 man militia working together will beat 6 "solo-man 5,000" proto players. |
Jane Craft
Ikomari-Onu Enforcement
Caldari State
1
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Posted - 2013.07.23 15:07:00 -
[4] - Quote
I would be fine with a no squad type game choice. Just anything to stop the new players from getting ROFL stomped and leaving |
Meeko Fent
Seituoda Taskforce Command
Caldari State
350
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Posted - 2013.07.23 16:07:00 -
[5] - Quote
Haven't we been screaming this on the forums for the entirety of last month? |
Tal-Rakken
DUST University
Ivy League
32
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Posted - 2013.07.23 16:25:00 -
[6] - Quote
Meeko Fent wrote:Haven't we been screaming this on the forums for the entirety of last month?
I believe that statement is wrong as I've heard the matchmaking complaints since I started actively playing 2-3 months ago. Over the past three months this has gotten worse and as players who started playing at release are getting into proto level gear and wantin to use it the problem is just going to get worse. Real matchmaking at this point is more important than any balancing however overpowered some suits and weapons are right now. Can't hav a lasting game without new players. |
Malkai Inos
Opus Arcana
Covert Intervention
789
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Posted - 2013.07.23 16:39:00 -
[7] - Quote
I said this on other occasions:
Giving players the ability to choose what enemies they want to face is completely counter the concept of New Eden and pretty much defeats the purpose of higher tier suits.
Paying the premium price of proto gear should be a viable option, even in pubmatches, to risk ones own profitability in favor of an advantage in combat where needed. Matchmaking should make sure that both sides are of equal ability but should not completely remove variation of skill and gear within each team.
Knowing what enemy to engage and who to avoid is a critical player skill in dust and gear based matchmaking removes this aspect from the game. All we are left with is several tiers that only allow skill bonuses to be a factor in combat besides the player skill. Tiered matches mean that the battle feels the same throughout all tiers with just a higher TTK due to a shifted dmg/eHP ratio in later tiers.
Another side effect is that protobears still dominate their enemies through skill bonuses, even if to a lesser extend because skills are now the only possible difference between players. Specializing in just a PRO weapon for example is no longer a sensible decision as you can't use it in lower tier matches and can't achieve anything with it in higher tier ones. It basically raises the barrier of entry with every higher tier exponentionally.
The real problem is that everyone from beta can run proto all day long due to their massive backlog of ISK from salvage refunds. They don't care if they go negative. This ISK has to go to make the loss of up to 180k isk per suit meaningfull again. Then using proto will be a tradeoff again. |
Jane Craft
Ikomari-Onu Enforcement
Caldari State
1
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Posted - 2013.07.23 16:40:00 -
[8] - Quote
Tal-Rakken wrote:
Real matchmaking at this point is more important than any balancing however overpowered some suits and weapons are right now. Can't hav a lasting game without new players.
This is probably one of the most true statements i have seen on these forums |
Jane Craft
Ikomari-Onu Enforcement
Caldari State
1
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Posted - 2013.07.23 17:58:00 -
[9] - Quote
Malkai Inos wrote:
Knowing what enemy to engage and who to avoid is a critical player skill in dust and gear based matchmaking removes this aspect from the game.
Aside from playing the game and learning names of people who run proto so you can run away from them how are you suppose to know? By the little tool tip that flashes for a split second when you hover over someone? Running proto is fine and dandy and I like killing mlt as much as the next guy but dust needs new players to survive. No one will grind out millions of sp while getting stomped every match.
I do understand your points about running proto and earning it and what not but something has to be done to help noobs along. Not saying noobs should be able to go toe to toe with a proto but something needs to be done to keep the new.players playing or proto gear won't mean anything when they shut the game down |
Fortunato Wanzer
S.e.V.e.N.
Top Men.
8
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Posted - 2013.07.23 20:14:00 -
[10] - Quote
See some valid points but what everyone is missing is that even in a basic suit someone with 7mil skill points is probably going to stomp someone with 500k skill points. Why not make matchmaking a skill point based affair. If you are over a certain amount of skill points you are locked out of matches for newer players to have more even footing. The idea of the Academy thing was for new players to experience the game without the elites being there. After the article I read in game informer the game may suffer from lack of new recruits as they pointed out every flaw of the game with an electron microscope. |
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Aikuchi Tomaru
Subdreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
117
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Posted - 2013.07.23 20:22:00 -
[11] - Quote
You're not the first who wants to split the small playerbase and ignores the fact that the main problem isn't gear, but that you can leave the match as soon as you see that there's a corp-squad in the enemy team, but not in yours.
Gear is the smallest problem. Wouldn't even consider it a problem at all. But the game should try to match up corp squads against other corp squads. That would balance it far better than just saying "Yeah, we just don't let protos play in advanced matches anymore". Because trust me: Wouldn't really change anything. On contrary: It would make it far worse. |
Jane Craft
Ikomari-Onu Enforcement
Caldari State
1
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Posted - 2013.07.23 21:01:00 -
[12] - Quote
By sp is fine. Any idea that gives newbs a better chance at actually staying and playing. One team calling in 4 very well fit out havs kinda ruins the game for newbs. |
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