DUST Search - Armor tanking and WHY it IS viable.

Cat Merc wrote:

Marston VC wrote:

Ok so this is sort of a response to this thread here

The problem here is that people look at armor tanking the wrong way..... and so im going to try and explain how this all works. To start.... will begin with the introduction of the new armor plates. People like me who do armor tank were looking forward to these new additions because of what they could potentially provide. However, to many peoples disappointment they weren't as "good" as was previously hoped. People were expecting these plates to make armor tanking "really good, and viable" but in truth... armor tanking was already viable to begin with.

As for the new plates and their seemingly "gimped" stats. I look at them likes this...... The new armor plates are, in my opinion, plates that are geared to making shield tanking even stronger. The reactive plates are amazing for shield suits because you can fit one reactive plate on, get some bonus hp AND have armor regen. This would be especially useful for the minmatar assault because of its base 1 armor hp/s repair it has on default. Basically the reactive plates are like having Two semi-gimped modules that fit into 1 module slot, and when you consider that most shield tanking suits only have 2-3 low slots, these plates are actually pretty useful in conserving space.

The ferroscale plates are sort of half and half in my eyes...... Its basically a slightly gimped version of the shield extenders. No movement penalties for the cost of reduced total hp overall. Which is fine in my opinion. If I wanted to I could peel off about 100 hp and run just about as fast as a caldari suit, but I simply wont because I like having more upfront HP. As for this plates role in shield tanking...... imagine what the caldari logi will be like now! Most of them already used a method called "brick tanking" (maximum shields and armor) but now that they can shed off the old plates with nice mobile ones there going to be, in my eyes, even more potent.

In conclusion about the new plates..... I consider them supplementary sets for shield tanking (giving the shield tanker just a bit more hp) REAL armor tankers will most likely stick with the already established plates and ill get into that now.

Armor tanking is totally viable in the current game build. My main battle suit nets 450 HP with 18 armor repair per second. In addition to this, I use damage mods, and triage nanohives. The damage mods give me an absurd advantage over any shield tanker, and my triage nanohive literally lets me win 3 v 1 fights. The only exception to these fights is if the other side is using either A.) grenade spam, or B.) flaylock spam. However im not complaining...... explosives are the hard counter to armor tanking after all. But yeah..... in summary I have a 450 armor suit that at max potential is repping almost 90 armor per second, doing far more damage then most other suits, and having about as much hp as any well tanked ADV suit (and most proto suits). The only suits I ever lose to these days are heavy suits, and proto caldari logi suits. I lose to heavies because I get cocky and try to take them on 1 v 1. Then they end up using a burst HMG, or a boundless HMG and I just lose cuz its too much DPS. The caldari logi is just...... its a beasty suit if its fitted properly. Very difficult to fight against if the player behind it is at-least semi-good.

But yeah..... that's armor tanking in a nutshell.

I call bullshit.
Give me that fit, and your sprint/walk speed.
Lets see, with 4 low slots, you use 3 complex armor repairers, that puts you at 18.75 armor rep speed if you have the skill at V.
Then we add a complex plate, and including all the HP skills, that nets you 389 armor.
How the hell are you getting 450 armor?

Note that damage mods don't do jack **** if shield tankers strafe faster than we can turn. (Yes, plates reduce your turn speed)

Also, all anti armor weaponry is more effective against armor than anti shield weaponry is against shields, so 450 armor < 450 shields.

You should also note, shield tanks get an inherent 25hp/s regeneration.
25.
And a SINGLE MODULE can bump it to the 40's.
They also eventually get more than your 450 armor, simply because we need to use half our slots for armor repairers while they can just stack shield extenders.

Further reading: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=87752&find=unread


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True Adamance PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 303	Posted - 2013.07.05 06:08:00 - [1] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Marston VC wrote: Ok so this is sort of a response to this thread here The problem here is that people look at armor tanking the wrong way..... and so im going to try and explain how this all works. To start.... will begin with the introduction of the new armor plates. People like me who do armor tank were looking forward to these new additions because of what they could potentially provide. However, to many peoples disappointment they weren't as "good" as was previously hoped. People were expecting these plates to make armor tanking "really good, and viable" but in truth... armor tanking was already viable to begin with. As for the new plates and their seemingly "gimped" stats. I look at them likes this...... The new armor plates are, in my opinion, plates that are geared to making shield tanking even stronger. The reactive plates are amazing for shield suits because you can fit one reactive plate on, get some bonus hp AND have armor regen. This would be especially useful for the minmatar assault because of its base 1 armor hp/s repair it has on default. Basically the reactive plates are like having Two semi-gimped modules that fit into 1 module slot, and when you consider that most shield tanking suits only have 2-3 low slots, these plates are actually pretty useful in conserving space. The ferroscale plates are sort of half and half in my eyes...... Its basically a slightly gimped version of the shield extenders. No movement penalties for the cost of reduced total hp overall. Which is fine in my opinion. If I wanted to I could peel off about 100 hp and run just about as fast as a caldari suit, but I simply wont because I like having more upfront HP. As for this plates role in shield tanking...... imagine what the caldari logi will be like now! Most of them already used a method called "brick tanking" (maximum shields and armor) but now that they can shed off the old plates with nice mobile ones there going to be, in my eyes, even more potent. In conclusion about the new plates..... I consider them supplementary sets for shield tanking (giving the shield tanker just a bit more hp) REAL armor tankers will most likely stick with the already established plates and ill get into that now. Armor tanking is totally viable in the current game build. My main battle suit nets 450 HP with 18 armor repair per second. In addition to this, I use damage mods, and triage nanohives. The damage mods give me an absurd advantage over any shield tanker, and my triage nanohive literally lets me win 3 v 1 fights. The only exception to these fights is if the other side is using either A.) grenade spam, or B.) flaylock spam. However im not complaining...... explosives are the hard counter to armor tanking after all. But yeah..... in summary I have a 450 armor suit that at max potential is repping almost 90 armor per second, doing far more damage then most other suits, and having about as much hp as any well tanked ADV suit (and most proto suits). The only suits I ever lose to these days are heavy suits, and proto caldari logi suits. I lose to heavies because I get cocky and try to take them on 1 v 1. Then they end up using a burst HMG, or a boundless HMG and I just lose cuz its too much DPS. The caldari logi is just...... its a beasty suit if its fitted properly. Very difficult to fight against if the player behind it is at-least semi-good. But yeah..... that's armor tanking in a nutshell. I call bullshit. Give me that fit, and your sprint/walk speed. Lets see, with 4 low slots, you use 3 complex armor repairers, that puts you at 18.75 armor rep speed if you have the skill at V. Then we add a complex plate, and including all the HP skills, that nets you 389 armor. How the hell are you getting 450 armor? Note that damage mods don't do jack **** if shield tankers strafe faster than we can turn. (Yes, plates reduce your turn speed) Also, all anti armor weaponry is more effective against armor than anti shield weaponry is against shields, so 450 armor < 450 shields. You should also note, shield tanks get an inherent 25hp/s regeneration. 25. And a SINGLE MODULE can bump it to the 40's. They also eventually get more than your 450 armor, simply because we need to use half our slots for armor repairers while they can just stack shield extenders. Further reading: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=87752&find=unread This I've been armour tanking since before Uprising and even with all of these goodies it makes jack all difference to how I armour tank. Issue is that even if you do hit 450 EHP with 18.5 Armour Reps per sec then I can get 600+ EHP on the caldari equivalent with a base of 20+ Shield rep and that requires no mods what so ever, now tac on the fact I can no boost shield regen rate with energisers with no skill investment, then tac on the armour plates I can hit well over 680 EHP with better rep and regen than armour tankers..... that means I have about 230 more EHP than you a faster regen rate, and I using the modules that make your tanking variant special to benefit the opposite type. On this toon I can hit about 180 Shield and 391 Armour now and Im slowed to a crawl, essentially have no rep rate..... Im failing to see the balance at all.