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Harpyja
DUST University Ivy League
152
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Posted - 2013.07.02 09:27:00 -
[1] - Quote
Currently large missile turrets are still recovering from their nerfs in the past. Let's look at the large missile turrets as they stand now.
Pros
- Low PG usage
- Deals up to max damage up to max range
- Highest alpha damage of any current turret (if all missiles hit)
- Largest blast radius of current turrets
- Explosive damage great against armor
- No heat build up
Cons
- High CPU usage
- Becomes outgunned if a single missile does not hit
- Poor accuracy at range (with the exception of the Accelerated variant having better accuracy at range)
- Flight time makes it tricky to hit moving targets at range
- Majority of infantry tanks with shield
- Set-in-stone fire rate of 2.5s can cost the operator a fight
- Tiny blast radius (for a missile 3 or 4m is rather tiny)
- Almost impossible to hit infantry at close to medium ranges (missiles fly past their heads, requires luck and very little skill)
The biggest problems I've been having with missile turrets is their accuracy and their rather small blast radius.
Accuracy As mentioned above, it is rather hard to hit a moving vehicles at range, and LAVs are near damn impossible to hit unless they are moving towards or away from the missile operator. Also, there's this problem of hitting infantry at close to medium ranges as missiles fly past them due to the nature of the turret itself. I have to rely on luck to hit infantry. If there's a forge gunner on a downward slope, I can kiss my chances of killing him goodbye and I run for cover because I can't hit him nor the ground at his feet.
Solution? Give turrets slight tracking against vehicles and air burst capabilities. Not as much as a swarm launcher, but enough so that all missiles hit a slow moving vehicle at max range (the current role of ranged bombardment they are supposed to fill is unfulfilled). A modern day XM25 CDTE is better than Dust's missiles thanks to its air burst capabilities. How will this air burst capability work? The turret recognizes if the crosshairs are trained onto an infantry drop suit, determines the range to target, and sets the missiles to explode at that range. All of the anti-infantry nightmares missile users are experiencing are now gone.
Blast Radius It's simply too small for what the blast radius looks like in game. If someone's hiding behind a shallow corner, I've even fired 10 salvos of splash damage and constant hit markers. Then they go running out in low armor to find better cover. It seems that splash damage drops off too steeply for what seems like just a couple of meters.
Solution? Restore blast radius to 5m for all turrets and 7.5m for fragmented turrets. |
ChromeBreaker
SVER True Blood Public Disorder.
610
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Posted - 2013.07.02 09:37:00 -
[2] - Quote
Pro: Sounds awesome when missiles fly past you |
Harpyja
DUST University Ivy League
153
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Posted - 2013.07.02 09:43:00 -
[3] - Quote
ChromeBreaker wrote:Pro: Sounds awesome when missiles fly past you I'm hoping that it would sound nicer when they explode in the air around you |
shaman oga
Nexus Balusa Horizon DARKSTAR ARMY
236
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Posted - 2013.07.02 10:02:00 -
[4] - Quote
Harpyja wrote: Almost impossible to hit infantry at close to medium ranges (missiles fly past their heads, requires luck and very little skill)
True, the missilistic is the less "flexible" turret. I hope they will fix all explosions in the game, i bet the problem with AoE is causing this. |
Harpyja
DUST University Ivy League
170
|
Posted - 2013.07.03 06:51:00 -
[5] - Quote
I want to hear your thoughts. |
Aizen Intiki
Ghost Wolf Industries Alpha Wolf Pack
19
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Posted - 2013.07.03 07:26:00 -
[6] - Quote
Buff splash radius, nerf the splash damage, direct damage stays. That's all should be done with it. My 2 iSK's.
Peace, Aizen |
Harpyja
DUST University Ivy League
171
|
Posted - 2013.07.03 07:32:00 -
[7] - Quote
Aizen Intiki wrote:Buff splash radius, nerf the splash damage, direct damage stays. That's all should be done with it. My 2 iSK's. Peace, Aizen No. Buff splash radius, give tracking against vehicles, and give air burst abilities against infantry and missiles will be fine.
Stop posting in shield/missile threads. You are hurting their development. You must be an armor tanker who doesn't want to lose his I-Win button. |
Harpyja
DUST University Ivy League
174
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Posted - 2013.07.03 16:52:00 -
[8] - Quote
This is my perspective on how to buff missiles. What are the thoughts of other missile users and of the infantry on the receiving end? |
Aizen Intiki
Ghost Wolf Industries Alpha Wolf Pack
34
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Posted - 2013.07.04 07:11:00 -
[9] - Quote
Harpyja wrote:Aizen Intiki wrote:Buff splash radius, nerf the splash damage, direct damage stays. That's all should be done with it. My 2 iSK's. Peace, Aizen No. Buff splash radius, give tracking against vehicles, and give air burst abilities against infantry and missiles will be fine. Stop posting in shield/missile threads. You are hurting their development. You must be an armor tanker who doesn't want to lose his I-Win button.
I have a alt that does Caldari HAV's so see what the fuss was about. I honestly don't see any other problem other than passive shield tanking is impossible, and Missiles although has a really powerful splash damage, it's so tiny. So no, I do both. You haven't, so you sir, have no clue what the **** you're talking about. You just want to have a I-win weapon system. Weird, how Caldari always want it all, and when they don't get it all, they create massive **** storms like a bunch of babies |
pegasis prime
The Shadow Cavalry Mercenaries DARKSTAR ARMY
372
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Posted - 2013.07.04 07:15:00 -
[10] - Quote
Aizen Intiki wrote:Harpyja wrote:Aizen Intiki wrote:Buff splash radius, nerf the splash damage, direct damage stays. That's all should be done with it. My 2 iSK's. Peace, Aizen No. Buff splash radius, give tracking against vehicles, and give air burst abilities against infantry and missiles will be fine. Stop posting in shield/missile threads. You are hurting their development. You must be an armor tanker who doesn't want to lose his I-Win button. I have a alt that does Caldari HAV's so see what the fuss was about. I honestly don't see any other problem other than passive shield tanking is impossible, and Missiles although has a really powerful splash damage, it's so tiny. So no, I do both. You haven't, so you sir, have no clue what the **** you're talking about. You just want to have a I-win weapon system. Weird, how Caldari always want it all, and when they don't get it all, they create massive **** storms like a bunch of babies
oooohh ***** fest begins |
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Harpyja
DUST University Ivy League
177
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Posted - 2013.07.04 07:18:00 -
[11] - Quote
Aizen Intiki wrote:Harpyja wrote:Aizen Intiki wrote:Buff splash radius, nerf the splash damage, direct damage stays. That's all should be done with it. My 2 iSK's. Peace, Aizen No. Buff splash radius, give tracking against vehicles, and give air burst abilities against infantry and missiles will be fine. Stop posting in shield/missile threads. You are hurting their development. You must be an armor tanker who doesn't want to lose his I-Win button. I have a alt that does Caldari HAV's so see what the fuss was about. I honestly don't see any other problem other than passive shield tanking is impossible, and Missiles although has a really powerful splash damage, it's so tiny. So no, I do both. You haven't, so you sir, have no clue what the **** you're talking about. You just want to have a I-win weapon system. Weird, how Caldari always want it all, and when they don't get it all, they create massive **** storms like a bunch of babies You just won't stop, will you? You are completely ignorant to the problems shield tanks are facing as well as the problems missiles are facing, because railguns and blasters are clearly better.
How come with blaster turrets, I can go 30-0 while with missile turrets I can go around 20-0? And these are infantry only kills. How come with railguns, chances of taking out vehicles are higher than with missiles? Pre-1.2, I could kill any Bolas with an advanced railgun at any range. While with proto accelerated missiles, I had to be practically underneath the RDV to take it out. The ONLY advantage missiles have is they are better at taking out installations, and that's it. |
Harpyja
DUST University Ivy League
177
|
Posted - 2013.07.04 12:43:00 -
[12] - Quote
Updated post to include comparison of missile turrets with blaster and railgun turrets and how missiles are inferior to blasters and railguns, even for the intended purposes of missiles. |
darkiller240
INGLORIOUS-INQUISITION
25
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Posted - 2013.07.04 12:58:00 -
[13] - Quote
+1 |
Harpyja
DUST University Ivy League
185
|
Posted - 2013.07.05 16:31:00 -
[14] - Quote
I would like to hear from a dev if they are looking at missile turrets |
ladwar
Dead Six Initiative Lokun Listamenn
702
|
Posted - 2013.07.05 18:10:00 -
[15] - Quote
my suggestion to fix missiles: fragment- instead of spreading outwards focus inwards toward cross hairs but cut some range out, maybe down to 120m cycled- have them cycled!!!! one missiles per fire and each reload on their own(reload of 1.8second with RoF limit of .3seconds/per missile, yes i know it brings overall RoF higher) and have a slightly greater outward spread then current fragment. accelerated- add range and speed to them. i would say 350m range |
Aeon Amadi
A.N.O.N.Y.M.O.U.S. League of Infamy
1805
|
Posted - 2013.07.05 18:40:00 -
[16] - Quote
From my experience these damned things are amazing at siege warfare. You can pin a lot of infantry into a single objective very easily from 100m+ with Fragmented and two Accelerated/Cycled small turrets.
The tricky part is landing direct hits (the strong suit of the Large ML) at short-medium range as the missiles like to go on the sides of the dot reticle.
Honestly, you could fix a lot of the issues you mentioned just by giving the turret a better reticle that shows where eachmissile is going individually, rather than on either side of the dot
But I would like to throw in a request for a Large ML Turret that fires all four missiles at once |
ladwar
Dead Six Initiative Lokun Listamenn
705
|
Posted - 2013.07.05 18:48:00 -
[17] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:From my experience these damned things are amazing at siege warfare. You can pin a lot of infantry into a single objective very easily from 100m+ with Fragmented and two Accelerated/Cycled small turrets. The tricky part is landing direct hits (the strong suit of the Large ML) at short-medium range as the missiles like to go on the sides of the dot reticle. Honestly, you could fix a lot of the issues you mentioned just by giving the turret a better reticle that shows where eachmissile is going individually, rather than on either side of the dot But I would like to throw in a request for a Large ML Turret that fires all four missiles at once all 4 or the full missiles shown for 16 missile? |
Harpyja
DUST University Ivy League
191
|
Posted - 2013.07.05 19:38:00 -
[18] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:From my experience these damned things are amazing at siege warfare. You can pin a lot of infantry into a single objective very easily from 100m+ with Fragmented and two Accelerated/Cycled small turrets. The tricky part is landing direct hits (the strong suit of the Large ML) at short-medium range as the missiles like to go on the sides of the dot reticle. Honestly, you could fix a lot of the issues you mentioned just by giving the turret a better reticle that shows where eachmissile is going individually, rather than on either side of the dot But I would like to throw in a request for a Large ML Turret that fires all four missiles at once I've had both good and bad games with missiles. One of the best was where I parked up on the hillside to the west of the supply depot that sits between Bravo and Charlie in Line Harvest. Every time enemies tried to rush Bravo from Charlie, I'd decimate them all. I was even lucky to get quite a few direct hits on people running beneath the "tabletop". But games like these really only happen because I'm at an elevated position (and dont get threatened out of my hilllside by AV or rail tanks hehe)and I can easily apply splash damage, where as if I'm on level ground, it's very tricky to get direct hits on infantry, just as you agree with how missiles fly past the target at short to medium range. Also the ground at their feet becomes a smaller target as well when I'm on level ground as opposed to an elevated position. |
Aeon Amadi
A.N.O.N.Y.M.O.U.S. League of Infamy
1805
|
Posted - 2013.07.05 19:42:00 -
[19] - Quote
Harpyja wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:From my experience these damned things are amazing at siege warfare. You can pin a lot of infantry into a single objective very easily from 100m+ with Fragmented and two Accelerated/Cycled small turrets. The tricky part is landing direct hits (the strong suit of the Large ML) at short-medium range as the missiles like to go on the sides of the dot reticle. Honestly, you could fix a lot of the issues you mentioned just by giving the turret a better reticle that shows where eachmissile is going individually, rather than on either side of the dot But I would like to throw in a request for a Large ML Turret that fires all four missiles at once I've had both good and bad games with missiles. One of the best was where I parked up on the hillside to the west of the supply depot that sits between Bravo and Charlie in Line Harvest. Every time enemies tried to rush Bravo from Charlie, I'd decimate them all. I was even lucky to get quite a few direct hits on people running beneath the "tabletop". But games like these really only happen because I'm at an elevated position (and dont get threatened out of my hilllside by AV or rail tanks hehe)and I can easily apply splash damage, where as if I'm on level ground, it's very tricky to get direct hits on infantry, just as you agree with how missiles fly past the target at short to medium range. Also the ground at their feet becomes a smaller target as well when I'm on level ground as opposed to an elevated position.
Ive actually done some researchinto all of the large turret UI and made a thread on how to make it better overall. If you have the time to readthrough it, Id love to get your thoughts on the matter =) |
Harpyja
DUST University Ivy League
196
|
Posted - 2013.07.06 05:16:00 -
[20] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:Harpyja wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:From my experience these damned things are amazing at siege warfare. You can pin a lot of infantry into a single objective very easily from 100m+ with Fragmented and two Accelerated/Cycled small turrets. The tricky part is landing direct hits (the strong suit of the Large ML) at short-medium range as the missiles like to go on the sides of the dot reticle. Honestly, you could fix a lot of the issues you mentioned just by giving the turret a better reticle that shows where eachmissile is going individually, rather than on either side of the dot But I would like to throw in a request for a Large ML Turret that fires all four missiles at once I've had both good and bad games with missiles. One of the best was where I parked up on the hillside to the west of the supply depot that sits between Bravo and Charlie in Line Harvest. Every time enemies tried to rush Bravo from Charlie, I'd decimate them all. I was even lucky to get quite a few direct hits on people running beneath the "tabletop". But games like these really only happen because I'm at an elevated position (and dont get threatened out of my hilllside by AV or rail tanks hehe)and I can easily apply splash damage, where as if I'm on level ground, it's very tricky to get direct hits on infantry, just as you agree with how missiles fly past the target at short to medium range. Also the ground at their feet becomes a smaller target as well when I'm on level ground as opposed to an elevated position. Ive actually done some researchinto all of the large turret UI and made a thread on how to make it better overall. If you have the time to readthrough it, Id love to get your thoughts on the matter =) A missile UI that shows predicted flight path and any points of contact would make hitting infantry much easier at close range |
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