DUST Search - So CCP decided to reward the speculators...

Fiddlestaxp wrote:

Israckcatarac wrote:

Panther Alpha wrote:

IamI3rian wrote:

They're going to get their assets removed. Zeroing them out is only a temporary solution.

Also, I happen to not mind one bit. I'm banking more isk from killing them then I ordinarily do.

That is not the only problem... what about the ISK that was donated to Corps ? I'm sure that is the "Billions" of ISK, Corps could potentially supply their Elite players none stop, with tanks and Proto gear for months.

Trust me the Elite players your talking about have no need for corp wallet money. Most were sitting on 200+ mil each and climbing before this mistake was made. They realy have no need for the "BILLIONS" speak of. Besides when markets merge and trade between DUST and EVE begins you will see trillions in corp wallet's. (That is if you have good friends and alliances in EVE)

I don't want to hear about how it won't matter once they make the game that they intend to.
I want them to keep the game fair as they get it to that point.
You are talking about WEEKS of PC attacks that a corp can launch on others. If we as a playerbase are concerned about balance... Well it isn't balanced. It is just about as balanced as caldari logi, shield LAVs, and the TAC. If they fix 90% of the players who have exploited this it still won't be fair. Does 90% seem like a low estimate? I don't think so... given CCP's track record with this game.

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Fiddlestaxp TeamPlayers EoN. 70	Posted - 2013.06.01 08:35:00 - [1] - Quote I don't get it. You ****(mess) up and give everyone loads of extra ISK. That is fine. Worse mistakes have been made. At least it isn't SP. Now some of those mercs spend all this extra ISK. Why? Those that don't read the forums or the announcement may have accidentally spent into negative. That can't have been many. The rest of them were speculating. And you rewarded this. You(CCP) gave people MILLIONS of ISK because they made a bet that you would "fix" the problem. I put fix is quotes because any competent dev team would find a better solution to the issue. Good job. What about the people who listened to the announcment and didn't spend the money? I guess we should be welcomed to new eden... Welcome to New Eden... where the DEVs mess up and you should try to anticipate them catering to people who try to exploit this. Did you talk to the CPMs about this? Did they tell you it was a bad idea, or did they run to their playerbase and instruct them on how to exploit further?
Otoky DIOS EX. Gentlemen's Agreement 119	Posted - 2013.06.01 08:43:00 - [2] - Quote They had 2 "good" day and you QQing? Less QQ, more constructive suggestion pls.
IamI3rian OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 116	Posted - 2013.06.01 08:44:00 - [3] - Quote link wrote: In the meantime we are working on a system to reclaim ISK from over-spending that will review player purchases and corp donation histories on a case by case basis in order to fairly correct each characters ISK wallet and assets as soon as possible. Link = https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=83775&find=unread
Panther Alpha Commando Perkone Caldari State 356	Posted - 2013.06.01 08:45:00 - [4] - Quote Yeah, i don't understand that either, is actually more Proto gear in PUB matches now, that it was a week ago... I feel sorry for any noobs that have the "illusion" that this game is enjoyable. I'm yes... i'm also no sure what the CPM job is..They should be looking after the interest of the majority of players in Dust 514, not only their friends. Of course... maybe that is the CPM job all alone, considering that the majority of them are from EvE, and is not Dust 514 player base representation.
IamI3rian OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 116	Posted - 2013.06.01 08:48:00 - [5] - Quote They're going to get their assets removed. Zeroing them out is only a temporary solution. Also, I happen to not mind one bit. I'm banking more isk from killing them then I ordinarily do.
Fiddlestaxp TeamPlayers EoN. 70	Posted - 2013.06.01 08:49:00 - [6] - Quote IamI3rian wrote: They're going to get their assets removed. Zeroing them out is only a temporary solution. Also, I happen to not mind one bit. I'm banking more isk from killing them then I ordinarily do. Believe it when I see it. Someone will slip through the cracks. And they will be rewarded. Systematic fixes = good. Case by case fixes to a problem that the devs made trying to fix a problem that they also made = bad.
Matticus Monk Ordus Trismegistus 47	Posted - 2013.06.01 08:55:00 - [7] - Quote I'm not sure what more you want. Maybe you can fill us in? A mistake was made. There's no going back and un-making it now. A temporary solution was administered. A permanent solution is in the works to correct the issue. I'm not seeing how they rewarded anyone on this. Perhaps temporarily some folks got a free ISK loan, but it seems like they will need to pay it back from ISK (which has been done already), or assets, etc..... Sure maybe someone will slip through the cracks. Let's hope not though, and I'd hardly call the potential for someone sneaking by unintentionally CCP rewarding speculators. And given that all these transactions are logged somewhere this should be correctable.
Panther Alpha Commando Perkone Caldari State 356	Posted - 2013.06.01 08:57:00 - [8] - Quote IamI3rian wrote: They're going to get their assets removed. Zeroing them out is only a temporary solution. Also, I happen to not mind one bit. I'm banking more isk from killing them then I ordinarily do. That is not the only problem... what about the ISK that was donated to Corps ? I'm sure that is the "Billions" of ISK, Corps could potentially supply their Elite players none stop, with tanks and Proto gear for months.
mollerz Minja Scouts 351	Posted - 2013.06.01 08:59:00 - [9] - Quote It really sucks they have to devote time and resources to this vs fixing game mechanics
IamI3rian OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 117	Posted - 2013.06.01 08:59:00 - [10] - Quote Panther Alpha wrote: IamI3rian wrote: They're going to get their assets removed. Zeroing them out is only a temporary solution. Also, I happen to not mind one bit. I'm banking more isk from killing them then I ordinarily do. That is not the only problem... what about the ISK that was donated to Corps ? I'm sure that is the "Billions" of ISK, Corps could potentially supply their Elite players none stop, with tanks and Proto gear for months. It's also slated to be removed and returned. The devs have posted all of this a few times...

Fiddlestaxp TeamPlayers EoN. 70	Posted - 2013.06.01 09:00:00 - [11] - Quote Otoky wrote: They had 2 "good" day and you QQing? Less QQ, more constructive suggestion pls. Why don't you respond to the points that I make instead of just saying that I am crying? Do you really think that their handful of employees are really going to be able to fix every case? Constructive suggestions are out the window. They have already implemented an illogical solution to a problem that they created. I would understand if the respec and ISK issues that happened were all taken care of 15 days ago. But they have had half a month to test this stuff. If that isn't incompetence, I don't know what is.
Israckcatarac Opus Arcana Orion Empire 22	Posted - 2013.06.01 09:01:00 - [12] - Quote You are on Team Players how could you have not known? Your corp is very well informed of what's going on in DUST. Lets try this scenario, you listened to the people on the forums and purchased all your mod's, weapons and dropsuits and got yourself a pretty good stock pile figuring you would have every thing you need for a long time and you could dig yourself out of the negative while using this stock pile. But what you didn't figure is you may change some things up in your build and did not purchase those items. Average best guess -100 mil 1 month+ just to break the red line. Rember this is just a scenario.
UK-Shots Internal Error. Negative-Feedback 121	Posted - 2013.06.01 09:02:00 - [13] - Quote know1 cares just stop making threads and lket it end
Fiddlestaxp TeamPlayers EoN. 70	Posted - 2013.06.01 09:02:00 - [14] - Quote Matticus Monk wrote: Sure maybe someone will slip through the cracks. Let's hope not though, and I'd hardly call the potential for someone sneaking by unintentionally CCP rewarding speculators. And given that all these transactions are logged somewhere this should be correctable. You think that they have messed up this many times and that they are going to do a good job fixing this in the future? I bet you speced into the laser and the mass driver(A dig at myself more than anyone else :( )
IamI3rian OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 117	Posted - 2013.06.01 09:03:00 - [15] - Quote mollerz wrote: It really sucks they have to devote time and resources to this vs fixing game mechanics The customer assistance people aren't the same people who code bug fixes (or balance guns etc...).
Panther Alpha Commando Perkone Caldari State 356	Posted - 2013.06.01 09:04:00 - [16] - Quote IamI3rian wrote: Panther Alpha wrote: IamI3rian wrote: They're going to get their assets removed. Zeroing them out is only a temporary solution. Also, I happen to not mind one bit. I'm banking more isk from killing them then I ordinarily do. That is not the only problem... what about the ISK that was donated to Corps ? I'm sure that is the "Billions" of ISK, Corps could potentially supply their Elite players none stop, with tanks and Proto gear for months. It's also slated to be removed and returned. The devs have posted all of this a few times... I believed when i see it too...Is not way to check that it truly happen, Only CEO's and officers have access to the Corp finances. It will be to easy for CCP to say : Yeah we did that ( Not really, Ha ha )
Fiddlestaxp TeamPlayers EoN. 70	Posted - 2013.06.01 09:07:00 - [17] - Quote Israckcatarac wrote: You are on Team Players how could you have not known? Your corp is very well informed of what's going on in DUST. Lets try this scenario, you listened to the people on the forums and purchased all your mod's, weapons and dropsuits and got yourself a pretty good stock pile figuring you would have every thing you need for a long time and you could dig yourself out of the negative while using this stock pile. But what you didn't figure is you may change some things up in your build and did not purchase those items. Average best guess -100 mil 1 month+ just to break the red line. Rember this is just a scenario. Just FYI. Teamplayers has as much intel from devs as Orion does. The only people who have more are the ones with CPMs amongst their ranks. If even one person slips through, as much as 300 MILLION ISK will end up in a corp wallet. And we will never know. Except for the attacks that end up on your districts.
Synthetic Perception Venilen Eugenics Agency 34	Posted - 2013.06.01 09:08:00 - [18] - Quote Why would this even upset you this much? Someone needs a nap! All this really does is make it easier for us to get more ISK in matches. Plus they already said they are going to do individual account reviews. Let it go broski!
Israckcatarac Opus Arcana Orion Empire 22	Posted - 2013.06.01 09:11:00 - [19] - Quote Panther Alpha wrote: IamI3rian wrote: They're going to get their assets removed. Zeroing them out is only a temporary solution. Also, I happen to not mind one bit. I'm banking more isk from killing them then I ordinarily do. That is not the only problem... what about the ISK that was donated to Corps ? I'm sure that is the "Billions" of ISK, Corps could potentially supply their Elite players none stop, with tanks and Proto gear for months. Trust me the Elite players your talking about have no need for corp wallet money. Most were sitting on 200+ mil each and climbing before this mistake was made. They realy have no need for the "BILLIONS" speak of. Besides when markets merge and trade between DUST and EVE begins you will see trillions in corp wallet's. (That is if you have good friends and alliances in EVE)
Panther Alpha Commando Perkone Caldari State 356	Posted - 2013.06.01 09:17:00 - [20] - Quote Synthetic Perception wrote: Why would this even upset you this much? Someone needs a nap! All this really does is make it easier for us to get more ISK in matches. Plus they already said they are going to do individual account reviews. Let it go broski! The bottom line is; that the CPM credibility has been damage, people is going to straggle to trust anything that the CPM or CCP says in the future. Plus it reinforces the fears, that EvE politics are having a big impact in Dust 514, and is nothing Dusters can do about it. We need a more balanced CPM, with representation front all the playerbases in Dust 514.

Fiddlestaxp TeamPlayers EoN. 70	Posted - 2013.06.01 09:18:00 - [21] - Quote Israckcatarac wrote: Panther Alpha wrote: IamI3rian wrote: They're going to get their assets removed. Zeroing them out is only a temporary solution. Also, I happen to not mind one bit. I'm banking more isk from killing them then I ordinarily do. That is not the only problem... what about the ISK that was donated to Corps ? I'm sure that is the "Billions" of ISK, Corps could potentially supply their Elite players none stop, with tanks and Proto gear for months. Trust me the Elite players your talking about have no need for corp wallet money. Most were sitting on 200+ mil each and climbing before this mistake was made. They realy have no need for the "BILLIONS" speak of. Besides when markets merge and trade between DUST and EVE begins you will see trillions in corp wallet's. (That is if you have good friends and alliances in EVE) I don't want to hear about how it won't matter once they make the game that they intend to. I want them to keep the game fair as they get it to that point. You are talking about WEEKS of PC attacks that a corp can launch on others. If we as a playerbase are concerned about balance... Well it isn't balanced. It is just about as balanced as caldari logi, shield LAVs, and the TAC. If they fix 90% of the players who have exploited this it still won't be fair. Does 90% seem like a low estimate? I don't think so... given CCP's track record with this game.
Matticus Monk Ordus Trismegistus 48	Posted - 2013.06.01 09:21:00 - [22] - Quote Fiddlestaxp wrote: Matticus Monk wrote: Sure maybe someone will slip through the cracks. Let's hope not though, and I'd hardly call the potential for someone sneaking by unintentionally CCP rewarding speculators. And given that all these transactions are logged somewhere this should be correctable. You think that they have messed up this many times and that they are going to do a good job fixing this in the future? I bet you speced into the laser and the mass driver(A dig at myself more than anyone else :( ) I don't know what to tell you man. Yes, I expect them to fix it. Applying a patch that has un-intentional consequences to the entire population (1 mistake effecting many) could happen to anyone. Maybe this particular problem could not be identified in pre-roll out testing. I'm not sure - I don't care. I obviously have more faith than you do that a fix will be implemented completely. And yes - I spec'd into dropships, laser rifles, mass drivers and my own form of badassery which is known only to me. Good guess.
Mregomies The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 0	Posted - 2013.06.01 09:22:00 - [23] - Quote Israckcatarac wrote: Panther Alpha wrote: IamI3rian wrote: They're going to get their assets removed. Zeroing them out is only a temporary solution. Also, I happen to not mind one bit. I'm banking more isk from killing them then I ordinarily do. That is not the only problem... what about the ISK that was donated to Corps ? I'm sure that is the "Billions" of ISK, Corps could potentially supply their Elite players none stop, with tanks and Proto gear for months. Trust me the Elite players your talking about have no need for corp wallet money. Most were sitting on 200+ mil each and climbing before this mistake was made. They realy have no need for the "BILLIONS" speak of. Besides when markets merge and trade between DUST and EVE begins you will see trillions in corp wallet's. (That is if you have good friends and alliances in EVE) I had 72mil before mixup, gained +100mil extra... Didn't use a penny.I run with proto logistic (+100kISK) and get killed approx 0-7 times per battle and don't give a duck.see you in fields!
Fiddlestaxp TeamPlayers EoN. 70	Posted - 2013.06.01 09:23:00 - [24] - Quote Synthetic Perception wrote: Plus they already said they are going to do individual account reviews. A proper fix would have been systematic. By doing case by case reviews you open the door for error. I think that people that program computer games and manage computer games should understand this. It isn't that hard. I don't have a burning bush telling me these things. It is common sense.
Panther Alpha Commando Perkone Caldari State 356	Posted - 2013.06.01 09:31:00 - [25] - Quote Mregomies wrote: Israckcatarac wrote: Panther Alpha wrote: IamI3rian wrote: They're going to get their assets removed. Zeroing them out is only a temporary solution. Also, I happen to not mind one bit. I'm banking more isk from killing them then I ordinarily do. That is not the only problem... what about the ISK that was donated to Corps ? I'm sure that is the "Billions" of ISK, Corps could potentially supply their Elite players none stop, with tanks and Proto gear for months. Trust me the Elite players your talking about have no need for corp wallet money. Most were sitting on 200+ mil each and climbing before this mistake was made. They realy have no need for the "BILLIONS" speak of. Besides when markets merge and trade between DUST and EVE begins you will see trillions in corp wallet's. (That is if you have good friends and alliances in EVE) I had 72mil before mixup, gained +100mil extra... Didn't use a penny.I run with proto logistic (+100kISK) and get killed approx 0-7 times per battle and don't give a duck.see you in fields! And i run around with a tier 2 M-Scout suit, with 197hp shields / 70hp armor, and i finish in the top 3 almost every match...Your point is ? ...I was talking more about PC battles, i wasn't trying to feed your ego.
Synthetic Perception Venilen Eugenics Agency 34	Posted - 2013.06.01 09:32:00 - [26] - Quote Fiddlestaxp wrote: Synthetic Perception wrote: Plus they already said they are going to do individual account reviews. A proper fix would have been systematic. By doing case by case reviews you open the door for more errors. I think that people that program computer games and manage computer games should understand this. It isn't that hard. I don't have a burning bush telling me these things. It is common sense. You should apply for a job with your extensive programing knowledge, show them how to do things properly. It is possible you're missing certain details of the situation that makes this the "best" fix for everyone involved. What do I know though? I want it all reset back to nothing.
Fiddlestaxp TeamPlayers EoN. 70	Posted - 2013.06.01 09:42:00 - [27] - Quote Synthetic Perception wrote: Fiddlestaxp wrote: Synthetic Perception wrote: Plus they already said they are going to do individual account reviews. A proper fix would have been systematic. By doing case by case reviews you open the door for more errors. I think that people that program computer games and manage computer games should understand this. It isn't that hard. I don't have a burning bush telling me these things. It is common sense. You should apply for a job with your extensive programing knowledge, show them how to do things properly. It is possible you're missing certain details of the situation that makes this the "best" fix for everyone involved. What do I know though? I want it all reset back to nothing. I've killed many thousands of people like you because they didn't reset SP at release. It isn't fair and they should have reset my skill points on May 15th. If I ever encounter you, there is at least a 66% chance you will lose. Not because I am better than you, but because I have been playing longer and more diligently. There are best solutions to problems. Finding them is often difficult work. Substituting a bad solution for an optimal one is lazy and demoralizing.
Bucktooth Badger Buck's Intergalactic Pawn Shop 85	Posted - 2013.06.01 09:43:00 - [28] - Quote The issue just isn't the ISK itself or the assets purchased illicitly, it is the long term effect that this error has caused. The impact of which increases with the time it takes CCP to resolve this satisfactorily. Take this scenario, a tanker gets a surprise bonus of 200m ISK. With that money they purchase a load of their best HAVs. CCP take the money back, leaving the tanker in the red but is then reset back to 0. The tanker still has all the tanks & now consequently spams HAVs, with little risk to investment, pub stomping galore earning thousands of SP & millions of ISK. Also if the tanker is involved in PC, their corp has an advantage in conquering districts. CCP are likely to recover the missing ISK either directly, or through liquidation of assets. But what about the gains people have made indirectly through this error? I'm not suggesting people should be stripped of SP for this period. I'm just highlighting the fact of what a mistake & a not very well thought out solution will impact the universe/game as a whole. This is a very complicated issue that CCP have caused & have to deal with. A situation where there will be winners & losers, no matter how unfair it will be. Unless they say kitten it, and decide to roll back before the incident or a complete reset. This is another incident in a long list of events that CCP have annoyed me with, but mainly because the game has so much potential & the biggest thing going against the game is CCP themselves with these silly mistakes, going back on their word, lack of communication etc. But I'm still here, at least for the time being. Faith is a fickle mistress.
ladwar Dead Six Initiative Lokun Listamenn 538	Posted - 2013.06.01 09:53:00 - [29] - Quote Fiddlestaxp wrote: Israckcatarac wrote: Panther Alpha wrote: IamI3rian wrote: They're going to get their assets removed. Zeroing them out is only a temporary solution. Also, I happen to not mind one bit. I'm banking more isk from killing them then I ordinarily do. That is not the only problem... what about the ISK that was donated to Corps ? I'm sure that is the "Billions" of ISK, Corps could potentially supply their Elite players none stop, with tanks and Proto gear for months. Trust me the Elite players your talking about have no need for corp wallet money. Most were sitting on 200+ mil each and climbing before this mistake was made. They realy have no need for the "BILLIONS" speak of. Besides when markets merge and trade between DUST and EVE begins you will see trillions in corp wallet's. (That is if you have good friends and alliances in EVE) I don't want to hear about how it won't matter once they make the game that they intend to. I want them to keep the game fair as they get it to that point. You are talking about WEEKS of PC attacks that a corp can launch on others. If we as a playerbase are concerned about balance... Well it isn't balanced. It is just about as balanced as caldari logi, shield LAVs, and the TAC. If they fix 90% of the players who have exploited this it still won't be fair. Does 90% seem like a low estimate? I don't think so... given CCP's track record with this game. I think 90% is pretty high. its clear that some people will make it though the cracks with a ton of ISK as a reward and even a single one is way to many people, I think we should all know this.
ShakeMS Red and Silver Hand Amarr Empire 37	Posted - 2013.06.01 09:54:00 - [30] - Quote I don't know why they just can't stop picking sides and loving on their favorite boot lickers. Stop showing favoritism and and just make the game balanced all around.

Mregomies The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 0	Posted - 2013.06.01 10:11:00 - [31] - Quote Panther Alpha wrote: Mregomies wrote: Israckcatarac wrote: Panther Alpha wrote: IamI3rian wrote: They're going to get their assets removed. Zeroing them out is only a temporary solution. Also, I happen to not mind one bit. I'm banking more isk from killing them then I ordinarily do. That is not the only problem... what about the ISK that was donated to Corps ? I'm sure that is the "Billions" of ISK, Corps could potentially supply their Elite players none stop, with tanks and Proto gear for months. Trust me the Elite players your talking about have no need for corp wallet money. Most were sitting on 200+ mil each and climbing before this mistake was made. They realy have no need for the "BILLIONS" speak of. Besides when markets merge and trade between DUST and EVE begins you will see trillions in corp wallet's. (That is if you have good friends and alliances in EVE) I had 72mil before mixup, gained +100mil extra... Didn't use a penny.I run with proto logistic (+100kISK) and get killed approx 0-7 times per battle and don't give a duck.see you in fields! And i run around with a tier 2 M-Scout suit, with 197hp shields / 70hp armor, and i finish in the top 3 almost every match...Your point is ? ...I was talking more about PC battles, i wasn't trying to feed your ego. I didn't want to make you mad... My point was that I don't want to use CCP mistakes to gain advantage. I play for fun, mostly solo and help random team mates.
ladwar Dead Six Initiative Lokun Listamenn 538	Posted - 2013.06.01 10:31:00 - [32] - Quote I think the odds of people getting away with it are the same odds of getting to be a Templar 1 of 15 and that's actually a low in favor of CCP not messing a ton up and I do believe there are more that went negative then the wanted to be a Templar so im betting more the 300 are going to slip pass.


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