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Zarr Du'Kar
Pro Hic Immortalis RISE of LEGION
66
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Posted - 2013.05.23 12:16:00 -
[1] - Quote
I hope you guys raise this with CCP.
As it stands, the assault dropsuit bonus only appeals to shield tanking which in the mythos of EVE and more importantly the high and low slots of each race doesn't seem to jive with.
Basing on the high and low slots:
1.) Only Caldari and Minmitar benefit with the recharge bonus due to their high number of high slots which they can put shield extenders 2) Amarr and Gallente only has 3 high slots. Not to mention that they are in the best position to choose armor tanking over shield tanking.
The assault dropsuit bonus should be neutral and beneficial for all races regardless of what they specialize in (thats what racial bonus is for). I suggest either to make it a 1% bonus per level to CPU & PG since God knows Assaults need more of it than its Logi counterpart. Another would be 5% bonus per level for Light Weapon ammo regardless of type! Hell, the logi dropsuit bonus would be great! Assaults are the forefront yet its the logis who has more slots, CPU/PG who gets a free complex armor repairer at level 5?!?!
Next, Racial bonuses they need to be at par or even better with the Logi Racial bonuses in terms of combat viability. The Amarr one is actually not bad since they are known for their Laser technology but compare that to its logi counter part... a bonus to armor repair again?
Caldari Logi gets bonus to shield extender efficiency on top of 5 high slots? At least CCP got gallentes right... an actual support racial bonus.
To keep it short... Logi Racial bonus should be more geared towards support skills rather than combat while the Assault racial bonuses should be geared more to combat and be at par with the current Logi racial bonuses.
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Lyndboss
Forsaken Immortals
5
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Posted - 2013.06.12 20:38:00 -
[2] - Quote
Zarr Du'Kar wrote:I hope you guys raise this with CCP.
As it stands, the assault dropsuit bonus only appeals to shield tanking which in the mythos of EVE and more importantly the high and low slots of each race doesn't seem to jive with.
Basing on the high and low slots:
1.) Only Caldari and Minmitar benefit with the recharge bonus due to their high number of high slots which they can put shield extenders 2) Amarr and Gallente only has 3 high slots. Not to mention that they are in the best position to choose armor tanking over shield tanking.
The assault dropsuit bonus should be neutral and beneficial for all races regardless of what they specialize in (thats what racial bonus is for). I suggest either to make it a 1% bonus per level to CPU & PG since God knows Assaults need more of it than its Logi counterpart. Another would be 5% bonus per level for Light Weapon ammo regardless of type! Hell, the logi dropsuit bonus would be great! Assaults are the forefront yet its the logis who has more slots, CPU/PG who gets a free complex armor repairer at level 5?!?!
Next, Racial bonuses they need to be at par or even better with the Logi Racial bonuses in terms of combat viability. The Amarr one is actually not bad since they are known for their Laser technology but compare that to its logi counter part... a bonus to armor repair again?
Caldari Logi gets bonus to shield extender efficiency on top of 5 high slots? At least CCP got gallentes right... an actual support racial bonus.
To keep it short... Logi Racial bonus should be more geared towards support skills rather than combat while the Assault racial bonuses should be geared more to combat and be at par with the current Logi racial bonuses.
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Zarr Du'Kar
Pro Hic Immortalis
87
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Posted - 2013.06.13 11:22:00 -
[3] - Quote
Unfortunately, for me, I took the kool-aid and joined the Logi bandwagon....
The equipment, dropsuit and racial bonus plus CPU/PG was just too good.
I feel Assault is a lost cause now. |
Heinrich Jagerblitzen
D3LTA FORC3 Orion Empire
392
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Posted - 2013.06.13 20:31:00 -
[4] - Quote
While this sort of thread really belongs in Feedback/Requests, I think I can speak for the entire CPM when I say no one is happy with the state of dropsuit bonuses. Many feel useless/not worth the cost of speccing into, there's still basic imbalance in slot counts across the racial variants - and you're absolutely right, Logi reigns supreme. Rest assured we will continue to speak to CCP about this regularly until it is resolved.
I still haven't specced into Logistics suits myself though - I have a personal rule that I never put points into something I'm lobbying to have re-balanced. Same reason I didn't invest in TAC rifles during the boom. That, if anything, should tell you my level of interest in seeing this fixed. If I felt dropsuit bonuses were a lost cause I'd be there with the rest of you dumping points into Caldari logistics*.
*I've never understood this bonus anyways. The buffer bonus makes way more sense for a logistics recipient, such as a Caldari heavy suit. |
Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
5133
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Posted - 2013.06.13 22:25:00 -
[5] - Quote
To keep you in the update of the public knowledge.
CCP Remnant stated that the bonus system responsible for making things do weirder things is not fully implemented for example there is no way to tell an armor plate to weigh less on any gallente suit or getting logistics suit to bonus equipment effects.
CCP Remnant also expressed he would like to resolve that issue as soon as possible so that future more interesting roles and skills can take part. |
Laurent Cazaderon
What The French CRONOS.
1565
|
Posted - 2013.06.14 08:08:00 -
[6] - Quote
Everything s been said. But do believe me when i say i will never stop harassing them on bonuses and over role\suits balance. |
Zatara Rought
TeamPlayers EoN.
214
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Posted - 2013.06.14 10:00:00 -
[7] - Quote
Laurent Cazaderon wrote:Everything s been said. But do believe me when i say i will never stop harassing them on bonuses and over role\suits balance.
Please continue. We the players have no idea what it's like to be CPM, but we trust you'll yell and kick and scream and shout and parlay and sell your kidney to make this game better. |
Deluxe Edition
TeamPlayers EoN.
403
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Posted - 2013.06.14 12:18:00 -
[8] - Quote
Heinrich Jagerblitzen wrote:While this sort of thread really belongs in Feedback/Requests, I think I can speak for the entire CPM when I say no one is happy with the state of dropsuit bonuses. Many feel useless/not worth the cost of speccing into, there's still basic imbalance in slot counts across the racial variants - and you're absolutely right, Logi reigns supreme. Rest assured we will continue to speak to CCP about this regularly until it is resolved. I still haven't specced into Logistics suits myself though - I have a personal rule that I never put points into something I'm lobbying to have re-balanced. Same reason I didn't invest in TAC rifles during the boom. That, if anything, should tell you my level of interest in seeing this fixed. If I felt dropsuit bonuses were a lost cause I'd be there with the rest of you dumping points into Caldari logistics*. *I've never understood this bonus anyways. The buffer bonus makes way more sense for a logistics recipient, such as a Caldari heavy suit.
Hans you may want to try to spec into them. They aren't OP as many in the community feel it is. Before the recent respec I was gallante assault, and this build moved to caladari logi. First their really isn't the CPU and PG to support the stacking of crazy modules, especially if you want to use equipment (which if you don't your a slower version of an assault with no side arm)
Second is that logi's are much slower than their assault counterpart (with A LOT less stam). This point is huge because nano-tanking is much more effective than hp stacking in this game where your largest HP pool is bullets dodged and the extra speed and stam allows you to quickly find cover.
Third the lack of a side arm REALLY shows up in 1v1 fights between skilled opponents as usually both end up with around 10% armor at reload time (AR vs AR) allowing the assault to easily dominate with the side arm (This also allows assault to double stack core flaylock pistols and become gods in even the most competitive of PC matches).
Lastly I believe that people need to get it out of their minds that logi's are suppsed be a role that sits behind a heavy with his repair tool out. In all reality they are designed to be support killers. Assaults are designed to quickly get in your face with their extra speed, larger base hp, light weapon and side arm, whereas the killer bee logi is designed to carry remote explosive, uplinks, nanohives, proxy mines, and their largest advantage coming from the pure flexibility in how you choose to eliminate your opponent.
If you take a hard look at the bonus from the calidari logi you will realize its only an extra 2 bullets worth of HP from and AR which will easily be mitigated by your slower strafe speed.
I don't really believe the assault class bonus is broken at all either. Even armor tanked assault suites must wear shield extenders, because if they don't anytime a militia locust grenade lands near them they will be OHK. IMHO opinion the best way to fix any imbalance between logi's and assaults is to give assaults their 2nd equipment slot back (give it to the scouts too). |
Zarr Du'Kar
Pro Hic Immortalis
102
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Posted - 2013.06.15 00:44:00 -
[9] - Quote
Heinrich Jagerblitzen wrote:While this sort of thread really belongs in Feedback/Requests
I posted it here for several reasons:
1. feedback is littered with these already 2. I dont get as much clout/attention as others 3. You are in direct contact with them so chances of this reaching their ears is higher :D |
Heinrich Jagerblitzen
D3LTA FORC3 Orion Empire
407
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Posted - 2013.06.15 01:45:00 -
[10] - Quote
Zarr Du'Kar wrote:Heinrich Jagerblitzen wrote:While this sort of thread really belongs in Feedback/Requests I posted it here for several reasons: 1. feedback is littered with these already 2. I dont get as much clout/attention as others 3. You are in direct contact with them so chances of this reaching their ears is higher :D
It's fine this time, but If the forums are already littered with threads on a topic, the last thing we need is one more thread. And if Council Chamber starts being the the place where people bring their Feedback/Requests, it'll quickly become too littered to fulfill ITS intended purpose.
Easiest thing to do if you want to be noticed is to just send us a message and say "here, reply to my thread" regardless of whether its here or not. I don't give a crap about clout, I only care if its a good thread needing attention. |
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BL4CKST4R
WarRavens League of Infamy
256
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Posted - 2013.06.15 05:28:00 -
[11] - Quote
Zarr Du'Kar wrote:I hope you guys raise this with CCP.
As it stands, the assault dropsuit bonus only appeals to shield tanking which in the mythos of EVE and more importantly the high and low slots of each race doesn't seem to jive with.
Basing on the high and low slots:
1.) Only Caldari and Minmitar benefit with the recharge bonus due to their high number of high slots which they can put shield extenders 2) Amarr and Gallente only has 3 high slots. Not to mention that they are in the best position to choose armor tanking over shield tanking.
The assault dropsuit bonus should be neutral and beneficial for all races regardless of what they specialize in (thats what racial bonus is for). I suggest either to make it a 1% bonus per level to CPU & PG since God knows Assaults need more of it than its Logi counterpart. Another would be 5% bonus per level for Light Weapon ammo regardless of type! Hell, the logi dropsuit bonus would be great! Assaults are the forefront yet its the logis who has more slots, CPU/PG who gets a free complex armor repairer at level 5?!?!
Next, Racial bonuses they need to be at par or even better with the Logi Racial bonuses in terms of combat viability. The Amarr one is actually not bad since they are known for their Laser technology but compare that to its logi counter part... a bonus to armor repair again?
Caldari Logi gets bonus to shield extender efficiency on top of 5 high slots? At least CCP got gallentes right... an actual support racial bonus.
To keep it short... Logi Racial bonus should be more geared towards support skills rather than combat while the Assault racial bonuses should be geared more to combat and be at par with the current Logi racial bonuses.
You just went from "Fix racial for assault" to "need logistics" unless youv'be played a logisitcs you would realize how weak we ate even with proto modules. I can't eve get 700 EHP and I'm a proto gallente logistic. |
Zarr Du'Kar
Pro Hic Immortalis
102
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Posted - 2013.06.19 11:21:00 -
[12] - Quote
BL4CKST4R wrote:Zarr Du'Kar wrote:I hope you guys raise this with CCP.
As it stands, the assault dropsuit bonus only appeals to shield tanking which in the mythos of EVE and more importantly the high and low slots of each race doesn't seem to jive with.
Basing on the high and low slots:
1.) Only Caldari and Minmitar benefit with the recharge bonus due to their high number of high slots which they can put shield extenders 2) Amarr and Gallente only has 3 high slots. Not to mention that they are in the best position to choose armor tanking over shield tanking.
The assault dropsuit bonus should be neutral and beneficial for all races regardless of what they specialize in (thats what racial bonus is for). I suggest either to make it a 1% bonus per level to CPU & PG since God knows Assaults need more of it than its Logi counterpart. Another would be 5% bonus per level for Light Weapon ammo regardless of type! Hell, the logi dropsuit bonus would be great! Assaults are the forefront yet its the logis who has more slots, CPU/PG who gets a free complex armor repairer at level 5?!?!
Next, Racial bonuses they need to be at par or even better with the Logi Racial bonuses in terms of combat viability. The Amarr one is actually not bad since they are known for their Laser technology but compare that to its logi counter part... a bonus to armor repair again?
Caldari Logi gets bonus to shield extender efficiency on top of 5 high slots? At least CCP got gallentes right... an actual support racial bonus.
To keep it short... Logi Racial bonus should be more geared towards support skills rather than combat while the Assault racial bonuses should be geared more to combat and be at par with the current Logi racial bonuses.
You just went from "Fix racial for assault" to "need logistics" unless youv'be played a logisitcs you would realize how weak we ate even with proto modules. I can't eve get 700 EHP and I'm a proto gallente logistic.
I play Gallente Logi as well. ADV in Pubs with over 450 EHP and close to 600 EHP on Proto in PC.
I am unsure how Logis are weak as compared to the Assault? With my Proto set up I fit 1/2 Complex Damage mods with 1/2 Complex Shield extender on top of my 2 Basic Armor Plates with over 15 armor rep per sec while having enough CPU/PG for Armor Rep Nanohives, Rep tool and Drop Uplink.
We're like the Swiss army knife! :D
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Laurent Cazaderon
What The French CRONOS.
1599
|
Posted - 2013.06.19 12:14:00 -
[13] - Quote
BL4CKST4R wrote:Zarr Du'Kar wrote:I hope you guys raise this with CCP.
As it stands, the assault dropsuit bonus only appeals to shield tanking which in the mythos of EVE and more importantly the high and low slots of each race doesn't seem to jive with.
Basing on the high and low slots:
1.) Only Caldari and Minmitar benefit with the recharge bonus due to their high number of high slots which they can put shield extenders 2) Amarr and Gallente only has 3 high slots. Not to mention that they are in the best position to choose armor tanking over shield tanking.
The assault dropsuit bonus should be neutral and beneficial for all races regardless of what they specialize in (thats what racial bonus is for). I suggest either to make it a 1% bonus per level to CPU & PG since God knows Assaults need more of it than its Logi counterpart. Another would be 5% bonus per level for Light Weapon ammo regardless of type! Hell, the logi dropsuit bonus would be great! Assaults are the forefront yet its the logis who has more slots, CPU/PG who gets a free complex armor repairer at level 5?!?!
Next, Racial bonuses they need to be at par or even better with the Logi Racial bonuses in terms of combat viability. The Amarr one is actually not bad since they are known for their Laser technology but compare that to its logi counter part... a bonus to armor repair again?
Caldari Logi gets bonus to shield extender efficiency on top of 5 high slots? At least CCP got gallentes right... an actual support racial bonus.
To keep it short... Logi Racial bonus should be more geared towards support skills rather than combat while the Assault racial bonuses should be geared more to combat and be at par with the current Logi racial bonuses.
You just went from "Fix racial for assault" to "need logistics" unless youv'be played a logisitcs you would realize how weak we ate even with proto modules. I can't eve get 700 EHP and I'm a proto gallente logistic.
I also use proto gallente logistic. And i use it as an assault. And 700 EHP is easy to reach. Problem here is not to punish logistic players. It's to discourage using a logi suit as way to stockpile HP.
Now if you ask me, logistic shouldnt top 700 EHP. They support the team and it's only fair for the team to protect them back.
That's why there needs to be some thinking done about roles, suits, specialisations and so forth.
What are suits for ? What are their strong points ? Flaws ? How many HP should they be able to have ? What firepower ? what speed ? etc...
Every player has a clear idea in its head and is sure as hell he's got it right. But it's sadly more complicated than that ^^ |
Zarr Du'Kar
Pro Hic Immortalis
102
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Posted - 2013.06.19 17:16:00 -
[14] - Quote
Laurent Cazaderon wrote:BL4CKST4R wrote:Zarr Du'Kar wrote:I hope you guys raise this with CCP.
As it stands, the assault dropsuit bonus only appeals to shield tanking which in the mythos of EVE and more importantly the high and low slots of each race doesn't seem to jive with.
Basing on the high and low slots:
1.) Only Caldari and Minmitar benefit with the recharge bonus due to their high number of high slots which they can put shield extenders 2) Amarr and Gallente only has 3 high slots. Not to mention that they are in the best position to choose armor tanking over shield tanking.
The assault dropsuit bonus should be neutral and beneficial for all races regardless of what they specialize in (thats what racial bonus is for). I suggest either to make it a 1% bonus per level to CPU & PG since God knows Assaults need more of it than its Logi counterpart. Another would be 5% bonus per level for Light Weapon ammo regardless of type! Hell, the logi dropsuit bonus would be great! Assaults are the forefront yet its the logis who has more slots, CPU/PG who gets a free complex armor repairer at level 5?!?!
Next, Racial bonuses they need to be at par or even better with the Logi Racial bonuses in terms of combat viability. The Amarr one is actually not bad since they are known for their Laser technology but compare that to its logi counter part... a bonus to armor repair again?
Caldari Logi gets bonus to shield extender efficiency on top of 5 high slots? At least CCP got gallentes right... an actual support racial bonus.
To keep it short... Logi Racial bonus should be more geared towards support skills rather than combat while the Assault racial bonuses should be geared more to combat and be at par with the current Logi racial bonuses.
You just went from "Fix racial for assault" to "need logistics" unless youv'be played a logisitcs you would realize how weak we ate even with proto modules. I can't eve get 700 EHP and I'm a proto gallente logistic. I also use proto gallente logistic. And i use it as an assault. And 700 EHP is easy to reach. Problem here is not to punish logistic players. It's to discourage using a logi suit as way to stockpile HP. Now if you ask me, logistic shouldnt top 700 EHP. They support the team and it's only fair for the team to protect them back. That's why there needs to be some thinking done about roles, suits, specialisations and so forth. What are suits for ? What are their strong points ? Flaws ? How many HP should they be able to have ? What firepower ? what speed ? etc... Every player has a clear idea in its head and is sure as hell he's got it right. But it's sadly more complicated than that ^^
It's really having too much of everything. I really think limiting the slots of Logi would make them concentrate on their alleged role which is to provide support with their equipment. With the numerous slots and endless CPU/PG compared to the assault they can afford to put in the complex modules with abandon.
Which is why if Assaults have the slots they are limited with their CPU/PG. It balances it out |
Colonel Killar
DUST CORE DARKSTAR ARMY
87
|
Posted - 2013.07.02 22:07:00 -
[15] - Quote
look, assaults are meant to kill so why not make their bouns related to this 1% damage per level
Logis should get PG/CPU reduction to Equipment
and the Cal Logi needs to lose a low slot.
Armor speed penalties need reduced and HP need buffed (slightly)
How do you CPM members tank? Shield? Speed? Armor? Brick? |
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