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Gore Bog
Lardo incorporated
1
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Posted - 2013.05.08 19:26:00 -
[1] - Quote
Before this update I had a good assault class and a decent loadout for all my other dropsuits along with a bunch of vehicle loadouts. now I can't even get the first level assault dropsuit because costs so many skill points.
also when the update came out I looked at all the stuff they added and I saw a dropship with a forward facing gun and got really excited, then I get in game and it costs over 6 million skillpoints just to get the first level assault dropship, WHY!!!!!!!!!!
to top it all off ccp, has completely ignored the complaints about the cost of skills, which in my opinion is the biggest problem with the new update. |
BobThe843CakeMan
Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz
Noir. Mercenary Group
291
|
Posted - 2013.05.08 19:27:00 -
[2] - Quote
Gore Bog wrote:Before this update I had a good assault class and a decent loadout for all my other dropsuits along with a bunch of vehicle loadouts. now I can't even get the first level assault dropsuit because costs so many skill points.
also when the update came out I looked at all the stuff they added and I saw a dropship with a forward facing gun and got really excited, then I get in game and it costs over 6 million skillpoints just to get the first level assault dropship, WHY!!!!!!!!!!
to top it all off ccp, has completely ignored the complaints about the cost of skills, which in my opinion is the biggest problem with the new update.
just use the medium frames they r just as good as the assault dropsuits. |
Draco Dustflier
Planetary Response Organisation
45
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Posted - 2013.05.08 19:28:00 -
[3] - Quote
itsbecause the "top players", the imperfects, have the most influence over development and they dont want us to be as good as them. |
Buster Friently
Rosen Association
378
|
Posted - 2013.05.08 19:42:00 -
[4] - Quote
Gore Bog wrote:Before this update I had a good assault class and a decent loadout for all my other dropsuits along with a bunch of vehicle loadouts. now I can't even get the first level assault dropsuit because costs so many skill points.
also when the update came out I looked at all the stuff they added and I saw a dropship with a forward facing gun and got really excited, then I get in game and it costs over 6 million skillpoints just to get the first level assault dropship, WHY!!!!!!!!!!
to top it all off ccp, has completely ignored the complaints about the cost of skills, which in my opinion is the biggest problem with the new update.
Because the point of the respec was that with things changing so much, you'd need to respec, not you'd get exactly back what you had.
The sp model is built for longevity. It needed to be widened and depend. By definition this means that you'll need more sp.
Everyone is in the same position, sp wise, so there's not a problem.
Dev's ignoring things that aren't a problem? Seems about right to me. |
Naquiri
ExcelsiCorp Securities
48
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Posted - 2013.05.08 19:53:00 -
[5] - Quote
this is my interpretation.
all Builds of DUST prior to Uprising were BETA builds designed to improve gameplay, balancing, and other technical elements.
as such, it was in CCPs best interest to make access to a lot skills and equipment. this would give them more data to work with.
Uprising is a commercial release build, and the focus shifts away from testing, so the need to make everything accesible in short order is no longer a priority.
I can understand how frustrating it can be to have the values of things change, but I can see some logic to it on CCPs end.
One side note-
I have participated in several Betas over the years. This is the first i have been in which players are allowed to keep their BETA Characters. thats 3 months of our time that CCP didnt have to give us, but they chose to.
TLDR
beta is over.
|
Z Prowler
Mannar Focused Warfare
Gallente Federation
2
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Posted - 2013.07.13 09:45:00 -
[6] - Quote
the reason they don't respond to complaints is simply wether its about the game or about specific elements. for example
i have complained about the lenght of the battles and about the wait time inbetween battles. but no response. so
I pointed out that they are advertising 15 minute battles when in fact most of the battles are only around 5 minutes. the
initial battle clock is set at 15 minutes but the clone reserves counters are set at 50. so if most of the battles are 5 minutes then why arent the clone reserves counters set to 100 or 150 instead of 50. now this has nothing to do with who i am or my ip address but the response that i received was for my ip address ??? next i asked why at the end of a battle sometimes
we are taken directly to the end of battle screen "defeat" or "Victory" or most of the time left on the redeploy screen for
10 to 15 seconds to as long as a minute before being taken to the end of battle "defeat" or "Victory" screen. so if sometimes we are taken directly to the end of battle "defeat" or "Victory" screen and other times forced to languish on the redeploy screen what the hell is going on. according to dust definitions and protocol a battle ends when the clone reserves counter is zero then how come sometimes that takes us to the end of battle screen bust most of the time it takes us to the redeploy screen even though the battle is effectively over. please forgive me for saying so but that is just stupid. now anyone who has played dust for lets say 100 hours or more (i am in the 1000s) has figured out that the only thing that matters is earning skill points as rapidly as possible. EVERYTHING ELSE IS IRRELEVANT. if a player wants to languish in perusing their stats then they are crazy if they spend more than 5 minutes a month doing that because the only thing that truly matters in dust is proceeding from one battle to the next as rapidly as possible. but thats where the biggest bitches come in. like i said most of the battles are actually about 5 minutes where the battle timer would lead players to think that they may be getting 15 minutes worth of battle time but that is not only false advertising but bs. then the reality is that we get to battle for maybe 5 or so minutes but then have to wait for 3 to 4 or 5 minutes to get to battle again. all that i want to do and all that i am paying for ( and yes we do pay for it) is to battle - not to waste our time on bs screen after bs screen. i have also been playing kill zone 3 online and inbetween battles you only have one screen to deal with befor you can get back into a battle. in dust its 3 mininum and they are all a waste of time. i just cant believe that ccp thinks that players want to waste 3 or 4 or 5 minutes in between battles to get to play for 5 or so minutes. excuse me but whatever their business model may be it looks to me like they are depending on players enjoying beding bored for nearly as long as they are getting to play. speaking only for my self i am only sticking with dust until the ps4 comes out and destiny and planet side 2 are available to play on the ps4. what i truly dont understand about ccp is that they really dont seem to grasp the idea that all of their bs screens are not as lovely to players who have to suffer through for 1000s of times pointlessly as they maybe to the designers and art people and programmers who are responsible for them and who obviously do NOT play dust. what i would really like to point out here is that ccp is mostly about a bunch of techno types and bean counters and accountant types who do NOT play the game. the other point that i want to make manifest is that they obviously do not employ anyone who tests their revisions and updates and changes. we get to do that and then they essentially ignore us. seriously why not battles that actually last for 15 minutes instead of just 5 ??? how many skill points could we earn in a straight forward 15 minute battle than a 5 minute battle. and if so how much less time would we have to spend playing and grinding it out if battles were really 15 minutes? and the only barrier to that is to make the clone counter intiliaze to 100 or 150 instead of 50 as it does now. i mean seriously does anyone at ccp actually play the game or is all they are interested in as far as complaints go is my ip address - as if it matters !!! |
Godin Thekiller
Ghost Wolf Industries
Alpha Wolf Pack
262
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Posted - 2013.07.13 10:21:00 -
[7] - Quote
1: I'm not going to read that gigantic ass post above mine. shorten it up or make small points.
2: All I see from the OP is *****, *****, moan, complain. stop whining.
Peace, Godin  |
RINON114
B.S.A.A.
General Tso's Alliance
280
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Posted - 2013.07.13 10:49:00 -
[8] - Quote
Sorry guys, but there is a massive issue. Half the skills we have are useless SP sinks that give us nothing. I have always made the point that skills should have cheap buy-ins with exponentially more expensive skills later down the line. At the moment we have too many skills which escalate much quicker than they should. |
Aikuchi Tomaru
Subdreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
83
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Posted - 2013.07.13 10:51:00 -
[9] - Quote
Maybe because you aren't meant to fly a proto Dropship after 1 week of playing? They are planning to let this game run as long as they run Eve. That can mean 10 years or more. They won't release a new game in a year or too. If you want to use the good stuff you have to show some dedication. And that's good if you ask me.
It's like in Eve online. You can't fly a Titan with a few months of skilling there either. Let alone buy it. If you want to fly an assault dropship be patient and save your SP instead of whining why you can't get it faster. |
Godin Thekiller
Ghost Wolf Industries
Alpha Wolf Pack
262
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Posted - 2013.07.13 10:58:00 -
[10] - Quote
RINON114 wrote:Sorry guys, but there is a massive issue. Half the skills we have are useless SP sinks that give us nothing. I have always made the point that skills should have cheap buy-ins with exponentially more expensive skills later down the line. At the moment we have too many skills which escalate much quicker than they should.
This is a legit issue. Also, some skills (vehicle engineering) gives some **** ******* poor bonuses. |
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KalOfTheRathi
Talon Strike Force LTD
Covert Intervention
516
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Posted - 2013.07.13 11:55:00 -
[11] - Quote
CCP doesn't care. Why would you even think they did? The current plan is multiple years (7+) to max out a Merc.
The Beta level of SP was so we would test out all the shiny toys. Beta is gone. The current situation is exactly what CCP wants. This was the design from the beginning. Multi-year efforts to play a space shooter.
Although, now we have Events to entice us to play*.
My mistake was thinking that the plan was to add to the game, not throttle the progression to a crawl. Like adding Heavies to all races, then adding all suit types to all races would be great. Plus the famously deleted Pilot Suit. Now, who knows and more importantly, who cares?
* We will see if rewards for these events are worth the time. Since most of the actual rewards are either not usable nor able to be sold, what is the actual point? Maybe its all an experiment for someone's thesis.  |
Malkai Inos
Opus Arcana
Covert Intervention
658
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Posted - 2013.07.13 13:03:00 -
[12] - Quote
This is a thread necro. 08.05.13
The OPs issue has been largely adressed with the later skilltre redesign. The Minimum skill point requirement to get into a ADS is down to below 200k SP and i'm not even sure if the 6m figure was even accurate back then. |
RINON114
B.S.A.A.
General Tso's Alliance
280
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Posted - 2013.07.13 14:38:00 -
[13] - Quote
KalOfTheRathi wrote:CCP doesn't care. Why would you even think they did? The current plan is multiple years (7+) to max out a Merc. The Beta level of SP was so we would test out all the shiny toys. Beta is gone. The current situation is exactly what CCP wants. This was the design from the beginning. Multi-year efforts to play a space shooter. Although, now we have Events to entice us to play*. My mistake was thinking that the plan was to add to the game, not throttle the progression to a crawl. Like adding Heavies to all races, then adding all suit types to all races would be great. Plus the famously deleted Pilot Suit. Now, who knows and more importantly, who cares? * We will see if rewards for these events are worth the time. Since most of the actual rewards are either not usable nor able to be sold, what is the actual point? Maybe its all an experiment for someone's thesis.
This isn't aimed directly at you, but more this particular attitude that many players share. Dust is supposed to last seven years, but I'm not going to max out my merc because I will lose interest before that happens. There are only so many strategies I care about, only so many skills I can bear to grind into and only so many times I can pay for boosters before SP becomes meaningless.
The solution to this is to make characters take longer to max out, but give more meaningful skills and bonuses. Take Nanocircuitry for example, it governs nanite injectors and nanohives. Instead, I propose two skills:
- Nanite Injectors (1x/2x) : +1% efficacy of nanite injectors per level.
- Nanohives (1x/2x) : +1 Nanite Clusters per level.
Using the above method we have either more total SP needed for proto nanite injectors and proto nanohives, or we have less total SP with reduced buyins for each skill. I believe this solution would be great as it would encourage specialisation much more. This would be adding depth.
What we currently have is equivalent to a 100 square foot kiddie pool.
Edit: To make matters worse, we have completely nonsensical training timers on some skills. Systems Hacking has a 5x multiplier!? The rest of the module based skills in dropsuit upgrades only have 3x multipliers. This is the kind of weird junk that needs fixing. |
Orin Issa
Kirkinen Risk Control
Caldari State
5
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Posted - 2013.07.13 16:53:00 -
[14] - Quote
I can tell you for a fact that the assault dropship doesn't take 6 million SP to unlock. Heck, with half that amount (3 million SP) you can get the assault dropship, some proto turrets, and some proto mods. |
RINON114
B.S.A.A.
General Tso's Alliance
280
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Posted - 2013.07.13 17:55:00 -
[15] - Quote
Orin Issa wrote:I can tell you for a fact that the assault dropship doesn't take 6 million SP to unlock. Heck, with half that amount (3 million SP) you can get the assault dropship, some proto turrets, and some proto mods.
I'm not sure that this is really the point. I think the OP is trying to convey the message that skills are put of whack. Perhaps it would be better to break down skills into their fundamental parts? You must get dropship command level five first, but the multiplier would be 2x instead of 6x? |
Malkai Inos
Opus Arcana
Covert Intervention
667
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Posted - 2013.07.13 18:24:00 -
[16] - Quote
RINON114 wrote:Orin Issa wrote:I can tell you for a fact that the assault dropship doesn't take 6 million SP to unlock. Heck, with half that amount (3 million SP) you can get the assault dropship, some proto turrets, and some proto mods. I'm not sure that this is really the point. I think the OP is trying to convey the message that skills are put of whack. Perhaps it would be better to break down skills into their fundamental parts? You must get dropship command level five first, but the multiplier would be 2x instead of 6x? Sorry to go into aggro mode but look at the damn date of the OP. This was before the skill tree redesign so going ADS required racial DS V and both skills had +2x(?) multipliers.
His concern has been adressed just days after this post and the first announcement that these change would be happending was by the time or very shortly after this thread has been opened. |
RINON114
B.S.A.A.
General Tso's Alliance
280
|
Posted - 2013.07.14 02:44:00 -
[17] - Quote
Malkai Inos wrote:RINON114 wrote:Orin Issa wrote:I can tell you for a fact that the assault dropship doesn't take 6 million SP to unlock. Heck, with half that amount (3 million SP) you can get the assault dropship, some proto turrets, and some proto mods. I'm not sure that this is really the point. I think the OP is trying to convey the message that skills are put of whack. Perhaps it would be better to break down skills into their fundamental parts? You must get dropship command level five first, but the multiplier would be 2x instead of 6x? Sorry to go into aggro mode but look at the damn date of the OP. This was before the skill tree redesign so going ADS required racial DS V and both skills had +2x(?) multipliers. His concern has been adressed just days after this post and the first announcement that these change would be happending was by the time or very shortly after this thread has been opened.
That's the first time I've ever been called out on replying to an ancient thread. Well done!
I still think these points raised are still valid however. |
Soldiersaint
Deepspace Digital
104
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Posted - 2013.07.14 04:43:00 -
[18] - Quote
Godin Thekiller wrote:1: I'm not going to read that gigantic ass post above mine. shorten it up or make small points. 2: All I see from the OP is *****, *****, moan, complain. stop whining. Peace, Godin
dude your a jerk.... everything he said is right on target......jerks like you need to stop posting..... |
Skipper Jones
Molon Labe.
League of Infamy
380
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Posted - 2013.07.14 05:11:00 -
[19] - Quote
Soldiersaint wrote:Godin Thekiller wrote:1: I'm not going to read that gigantic ass post above mine. shorten it up or make small points. 2: All I see from the OP is *****, *****, moan, complain. stop whining. Peace, Godin dude your a jerk.... everything he said is right on target......jerks like you need to stop posting.....
All of what he said might have been true, but that only affects ambush players, I give 0 ***** about ambush.
He basically is saying "CCP LOOK AT THIS IRRELEVANT ISSUE! WHY U NO FIX IT! THIS NEEDS TO BE ADDED BEFORE ANYTHING ELSE!"
IMO, what he said really wasn't even an issue. |
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