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Coleman Gray
GunFall Mobilization Covert Intervention
228
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Posted - 2013.05.04 13:02:00 -
[1] - Quote
Because packed grenades dmg goes from standard=2000 adv= 3000 and proto is 4000, so lets go off protogear comparisons here.
Proto swarm launches 6 missles each doing a base damage of 300, so 6x300= 1800 dmg a barrage with missles that A: need to travel and could miss by hitting terrain ect. Forge guns require you to charge up and maintain LOS with the target and deals something like 1700-1800 per hit.
But Proto AV grenades deal 4000 base, as long as you throw it into the general direction of the target it'll home in and hit, you can throw them over terrain so you don't need LOS, and even if they miss they'll either home into the nearest target or lay on the ground still active for awhile. So it does really take mulitple people to take a tank out using swarm launchers and Forge guns but only one grenadier to take the tank out with supreme ease in comparison while still having an effective primary weapon for infantry.
The real problem is simply AV grenades, they defeat the purpose of over AV weapons. Why should one man be able to take out 500,000+ isk of tank with 25,000 of gear that doesn't hamper you in anyway?
I understand the arguement people have for "well you need to get close to the target for grenades" yes this is true, but have any of you struggled with that issue REALLY with anytihng but a railtank or dropship? |
Jathniel
G I A N T EoN.
214
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Posted - 2013.05.04 22:29:00 -
[2] - Quote
Nanites injected.
This addresses the only real problem with AV.
AV Grenades.
That homing ability is absolutely ********. |
slypie11
Planetary Response Organisation
258
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Posted - 2013.05.04 23:08:00 -
[3] - Quote
Coleman Gray wrote:Because packed grenades dmg goes from standard=2000 adv= 3000 and proto is 4000, so lets go off protogear comparisons here.
Proto swarm launches 6 missles each doing a base damage of 300, so 6x300= 1800 dmg a barrage with missles that A: need to travel and could miss by hitting terrain ect. Forge guns require you to charge up and maintain LOS with the target and deals something like 1700-1800 per hit.
But Proto AV grenades deal 4000 base, as long as you throw it into the general direction of the target it'll home in and hit, you can throw them over terrain so you don't need LOS, and even if they miss they'll either home into the nearest target or lay on the ground still active for awhile. So it does really take mulitple people to take a tank out using swarm launchers and Forge guns but only one grenadier to take the tank out with supreme ease in comparison while still having an effective primary weapon for infantry.
The real problem is simply AV grenades, they defeat the purpose of over AV weapons. Why should one man be able to take out 500,000+ isk of tank with 25,000 of gear that doesn't hamper you in anyway?
I understand the arguement people have for "well you need to get close to the target for grenades" yes this is true, but have any of you struggled with that issue REALLY with anytihng but a railtank or dropship? Actually yes, I have. Railtanks are easy. It's the blaster tanks that are hard. Rocket tanks I don't know, since nobody uses them. Even so, AV grenades should have a longer time to prime, so they can't be as easily spammed |
slypie11
Planetary Response Organisation
258
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Posted - 2013.05.04 23:09:00 -
[4] - Quote
Jathniel wrote:Nanites injected.
This addresses the only real problem with AV.
AV Grenades.
That homing ability is absolutely ********. Never in my entire AV life have I ever seen an AV nade home in on a target. Maybe it's because I just suck so hard, or maybe it's because I'm just too pro to not aim |
Heathen Bastard
Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation
245
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Posted - 2013.05.05 03:41:00 -
[5] - Quote
uh what? I have to get within 15 feet to hit you, and I've never seen them home in more than 5 feet, they were already going to hit you anyways at that point(since I actually aim, I pelt 'em dead center) |
Jathniel
G I A N T EoN.
216
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Posted - 2013.05.05 07:33:00 -
[6] - Quote
Heathen Bastard wrote:uh what? I have to get within 15 feet to hit you, and I've never seen them home in more than 5 feet, they were already going to hit you anyways at that point(since I actually aim, I pelt 'em dead center)
lol?
Run to a tank, and just mindlessly throw the av nade into the air.
Try to throw it OVER the tank. See what happens. It will quite literally pull away and come back to the tank. As if a demon caught it, and did a alley-oop with the damned thing.
Slam dunk, tank dead.
lol people would be crying foul if Core Locus nades homed in on infantry.
In fact, ANY kind of homing for a grenade is imbalanced and ridiculous, lore be damned. If it homes, the explosive has no business being in a grenade delivery medium.
Tankers have those extra thrusters, etc. specifically to get them out of tight spots. A homing grenade makes this completely useless.
AV nades, DEFINITELY need a timed primer, just like every other grenade. 3-5 seconds depending on the power of the grenade. Why the hell should they be allowed to insta pop AND be thrown with such impunity? |
Cosgar
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY
461
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Posted - 2013.05.05 07:41:00 -
[7] - Quote
The effectiveness of AV grenades is not proportionate to their versatility.
Every class is able to carry a different type of AV, but there's no healthy counterplay when effectiveness > versatility. Assaults (or any suit class) can carry an AV grenade with the ability to solo a tank on the fly. Why switch to swarmers, forge gun or a plasma cannon at all when you can get the job done for ~100,000SP and without having to change fittings? Grenades should deal less damage since anyone can carry them and anything requiring a Light Weapon slot should be the real damage dealer depending on what kind of AV it is. Instead we have a situation where versatility > effectiveness and everyone on the field can carry AV at all times. It's not fair for anyone that uses vehicles when there's a potential 16 (and soon to be) 24 people, which translates to up to 72 overly effective and versatile counters to vehicles on Monday. Did I mention they had homing too? |
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