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Raven Tesio Liandri Hel-Jumpers Liandri Covenant 35	Posted - 2013.04.11 03:16:00 - [1] - Quote So this week we finally were given 30-Day Boosters for everything, which are "on sale" for 21,000 AUR (R.R.P. 28,000 AUR). Yet while I was happy to finally see the addition of these as they provide a unified platform to provide a 30-Day (aka 1-Month) system to be implemented, which really should've been there from the start ... what was troubling me was the price. Right now -ú15 / $40 / Gé¼40 will afford you 40,000 Aurum (AUR) then in-game Premium Currency, which given that the game is Free-to-Play this is understandable. As a Developer, you (CCP) wish to be paid to keep providing a service the customers and cover the cost of continual development. Still when you compare the prices of the Passive Booster, Active Booster and Universal Voice Transmitter for a 30-Day Period that the total comes to 49,800 AUR this is essentially $50 / month. While you can argue that these are not essential components of the game, the speed at which normal Skill Points are earned in DUST 514 is quite considerably lower than in EVE Online. So again we can argue that "DUST Skillpoints are not specialised as they are in EVE Online", so their worth isn't quite the same ... but as the EXACT same values are given to the x1 Skills as to EVE you can actually make a very direct comparison between the two, with high-end skills requiring Millions of Skillpoints. As an EVE Player, to me these are not exactly "optional" aspects of the game; but really essential to remain competitive. Now I have no issues paying for a game I love to play, right now I have 3 EVE Accounts; so I am actually paying roughly the same amount for EVE each month ... but here is the difference. With EVE that gives me 3 Characters with Passive SP, with a further 6 Characters I can specialise as I see fit; what is more important here is on a single computer I can run ALL 3 of those characters at the same time (often don't, but I could) as they have their own uses and reasons for being online at once. DUST 514 however, the chances of people having multiple PlayStation 3's (or any other console) is possible but being able to actively use more than one doesn't take multi-tasking talent but some form of multi-arm mutation. People don't multibox First Person Shooters because what you do each second MATTERs, you can't simply cloak up one character off-map simply to provide boosts; or have another who has a rubber band around the controller mining... and NO that is not a suggestion to make even more mistakes you're trying to fix in EVE for DUST. What I'm saying here is you're looking at the Console Market in completely the wrong way, you're looking at it as if it is the very small nitch+¬ PC market. Right now there are 72million PlayStation 3 Consoles worldwide, there are (according to Sony) 60million PSN Accounts ... couldn't tell you how active they are but a conservative estimate would likely be 30million Active Unique Users. We already know that games like Battlefield 3 and Call of Duty (which honestly aren't the same games) are capable of drawing 5-6million Users on the PlayStation 3 Platform. This is a 20% attachment rate to most games, and those games are incredibly expensive at $60 Retail + 5x DLC ($15 Each) = Total Investment $135 over 18-24months. That is a considerably investment to a single game, but about half of what a normal MMO Player would spend in the same period. The thing is these games make considerably profits, and it isn't because they require less overhead; in-fact Battlefield 3 costs EA more than SWTOR to maintain, because the same team is working on the sequel while also maintaining all of the servers and providing the DLC. Realistically it is how an MMO is done without the genre tag associated with it. So why do these games turn such a huge profit? Hell why does World of Warcraft earn Blizzard >$1billion / annum in revenue? Simply because of the attachment rate, now with Free-to-Play games you can argue that it is much more difficult to get return income as "Not everyone is going to pay for a Micro-transaction" so the knee-jerk reaction is to increase the prices on the goods sold. The problem is when you do this you actually put off a larger portion of people who would've otherwise financially supported the project. Now the key component in "Micro-Transaction Business Model" is the "Micro" part. Basically Customers will be willing to buy something that to them seems cheap, $1 here or there ... you don't notice as much, but it soon adds up to A LOT. That way is a little bit of a nickel & dime route to take, which often is a bit more evil feeling when a customer realises this is the case - but as a business practise it is actually very sound and sensible. Problem is income from such a method will actually vary quite wildly based on several factors, especially when tied to equipment regularly used by the players ... most of the time your greatest enemy becomes yourselves as balance will change spending habbits and it becomes easy to lean towards balancing the paid items to be better (even if by a margin) than the "available via in-game currency" ones. As Yoda said "Down the Dark Path that Leads..." What disappoints me really is that you (CCP) have really had the perfect Free-to-Play Solution staring you in the face. In-fact with something as a company you pioneered and perfected in such a way that should you decided tomorrow that EVE Online was going to be Free-to-Play, it could be! -- More Next Post --
Raven Tesio Liandri Hel-Jumpers Liandri Covenant 35	Posted - 2013.04.11 03:17:00 - [2] - Quote The answer here of course is the Pilot License Extension (PLEX) ... alright so you might be a little confused for a second by this, but think about it for a second with what you already offer in DUST 514. Right now you offer a Passive Skill Booster, Active Skill Booster and Universal Voice Chat. So why am I picking on these three items when you sell far more? Because these 3 aspects are not essential to enjoying the game, but they do offer an obvious advantage to those who use them. Sure most of the advantage they provide is mostly psychological (except for the Voice, seriously sort that out, improve the quality allow it to link with TeamSpeak, Ventrilo, Mumble and Vivox for both EVE and DUST... trust me it will stop being a "luxury item" and start being a "MUST HAVE" item) but that need for someone to "level" quicker is the reason why in EVE we will spend millions on implants knowing full well they're likely to get destroyed - we spend BILLIONs on Implants and Equipment to gain that serious edge, if we can skill faster we will take it but only if the value is right. There will always be people who want to play for Free, and in their minds; sure they can in EVE, earn all the ISK in-game and purchase a PLEX on the market. Blam! Instant Subscription. Still you know what the awesomesauce part of that is: 1 GÇó Party A is Playing for Free with in-game Currency ... Happy Camper 2 GÇó Party B has just sold his PLEX for in-game Currency without grinding... Happy Camper 3 GÇó CCP earned $20 from Party A, but will also get $15 from Party B as they likely are a Subscriber... Happy Camper It is a scenario where EVERYONE wins. Now think about this, when you use a License Extension; it grants you Boosters to your Account. The exact same boosters you COULD get if you Subscribed for $15 / month, soon players start thinking ... and they will. "Hey you know what it is cheaper to subscribe than keep buying these" - you've just converted a micro-transaction to a subscriber. Even more so you offer the deals, get a 3-month Sub get 5% off... 6-month 7.5%... 12-month 10%... the better the deal the more people will seriously think about it, that then becomes guaranteed income for that period. I mean it seems almost stupid for me to be explaining this to a company who have been running an MMO for a Decade, but with Free-to-Play and Freemium business models floating around; I think it become lost in translation to think you can have these systems not only work side-by-side but actually to each others benefit. Free Players provide 2 very key ingredients to your game. People to Play Against and they are the ones that will grind until the small hours to fill the market with everything a Premium Member could desire; and is likely to get PLEX so they can afford that new "must have" item that they'll never find in Deadspace or such. Think about it, you are literally Selling Time not the Game.
Raven Tesio Liandri Hel-Jumpers Liandri Covenant 35	Posted - 2013.04.11 03:17:00 - [3] - Quote If you want my advice, although you (CCP) will likely not take it GÇó Add a DUST Player Market GÇó Add Player vs Environment Deadspace Gameplay Elements, this can be as simple as Horde Mode but I'd actually suggest looking at things like Battlefield 3 Co-op, Halo 4 Spartan Ops or Call of Duty Special Ops ... make these areas challenging, rewarding and with some good variation. These should primarily be "Grinding" but that isn't a reason to make them the same generic stuff you find in other FPS games, don't try to compete with them try to innovate. GÇó Remove the Aur Cost from Deadspace Equipment, look at EVE as your inspiration here; these items should be a pain to come across with it more being luck based (you can add specialised Skills for Hacking, Salvaging and Analysing) but they should be rare rewards. GÇó Active Skillpoints should be changed to Loyalty Points - Seriously they were a bad idea in EVE a decade ago, they're still a pants-on-head-******** idea unless they are something that doesn't affect character growth. In this respect this would then be a very OBVIOUS form of Grinding. Grind Loyalty Points, Get Faction Gear, Sell / Use Faction Gear. That honestly is EVE Faction Warfare 101, you turned it into a farm-fest; run with it for DUST 514, at least there it makes sense rather than annoying the veteran players. GÇó Remove Salvage from Matches, move this to being a skill requiring "Salvaging" equipment ... trust me on this one GÇó Keep the Passive Booster, Active Booster (increases LP Gains) and Universal Voice Translator as separate items sold via NPC Corporations set their price against AUR so all 3 together cost $30 GÇó Provide a License Extension to DUST 514, make it the exact same item as EVE it can be your initial "universal" item when the markets balance out; honestly you can use it as your milestone for that very aspect. (obviously RRP $20) In DUST this item would provide a Mercenary with the 3 Boosters for 30-Days GÇó Provide a Subscription System for those who want to use it same price scheme as EVE Online, but add the bonus that IF someone has accounts linked for both EVE and DUST with Active Subscriptions they gain an extra bonus It would provide a good incentive for those on one of the games to try out the other, especially if the bonus was for both accounts. Outside of that... keep Aurum, but use it like it is in EVE for vanity items.
Raven Tesio Liandri Hel-Jumpers Liandri Covenant 35	Posted - 2013.04.11 03:18:00 - [4] - Quote Alright, so pure Wall of Text ... cause I know everyone loves reading that, but grab a coffee and sit down with it for a bit. It makes the most sense for everyone here.
Bojo The Mighty Bojo's School of the Trades 865	Posted - 2013.04.11 05:37:00 - [5] - Quote You raise a good point on Micro Transactions. I'm more enticed to pay for a few cheap cool things, like Vanity gear or paint scheming or to unlock options (like Aurum skill books)
BlG MAMA PLAYSTATION4 47	Posted - 2013.04.11 08:34:00 - [6] - Quote Dust514 is a money milking machine and a PAY 2 WIN model. FACT
KalOfTheRathi Talon Strike Force LTD 330	Posted - 2013.04.11 11:47:00 - [7] - Quote Play Team Fortress 2. Buy a hat. Buy two.
Amorale Lyadstafer Zumari Force Projection Caldari State 2	Posted - 2013.04.11 17:22:00 - [8] - Quote I'd prefer Dust to be like TF2, or like Dota 2, when we could buy cosmetics and something like strange modifiers only, but well P2W it is
Daedric Lothar Onslaught Inc 190	Posted - 2013.04.11 17:44:00 - [9] - Quote They will figure out the AUR market eventually. I for example will not buy Boosters, but I did fork over money for a UVT and the Merc pack and spent my AUR on the two suit blueprints (Raven/Logi) It doesn't matter what anyone else thinks. If the stuff sells well then they will keep selling it for the price they are selling it for and since you consider it not "optional" then you are just feeding them to think their price point is correct and likely they will just raise the price eventually or at the least, never lower it. As for me, Militia dropsuit stuff is to cheap ISK wise and to high AUR wise, no reason not to spend like 100 isk for an item. Vehicle gear is like 11k Isk vs fairly cheap AUR, that seems like a good deal. People may buy this The dropsuits are fair priced. The boosters are overpriced. The Aur per items market will probably fall out of the bottom once they release ISK items of equivelent rank. Like right now T1 logi suit is ISK, second tier is AUR only and 3rd tier is ISK. If they release a second tier Isk suit, I don't see anyone paying AUR for it anymore.
Llan Heindell One-Armed Bandits Atrocitas 10	Posted - 2013.04.11 18:56:00 - [10] - Quote I agree with OP's micro transaction point of view. I very much dislike OP's suggestion for the market, thou. Cosmetic Items would make more sense for being cheap cash items. Llan Heindell.

Ulysses Knapse Nuevo Atlas Corporation 223	Posted - 2013.04.11 21:25:00 - [11] - Quote BlG MAMA wrote: Dust514 is a money milking machine and a PAY 2 WIN model. FACT What are you talking about? Every item you can get using Aurum is equivalent to any other item you can get without Aurum... with a few minor exceptions. Even then, some items you can't even get with Aurum.
Buster Friently Rosen Association 259	Posted - 2013.04.11 22:18:00 - [12] - Quote So, I haven't looked in a while, but last I looked, $20 gets you 40k aurum. Is this still the case? Assuming that this is still the case, the price per month of both boosters runs at about $30 dollars, not the $50 you mention. While I still think that's about twice what it should cost, this doesn't seem ridiculous to me. I'm not by a ps3,so I can't verify the pricing. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
Karl Koekwaus Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 49	Posted - 2013.04.11 23:21:00 - [13] - Quote Ulysses Knapse wrote: BlG MAMA wrote: Dust514 is a money milking machine and a PAY 2 WIN model. FACT What are you talking about? Every item you can get using Aurum is equivalent to any other item you can get without Aurum... with a few minor exceptions. Even then, some items you can't even get with Aurum. many of the items you can get with AUR have better fitting requirements than ISK items, which makes them better. Buying items with RL money which are better than items you can buy with ingame money, makes it P2W.
Mary Sedillo XERCORE E X T E R M I N A T U S 3	Posted - 2013.04.12 09:45:00 - [14] - Quote Karl Koekwaus wrote: Ulysses Knapse wrote: BlG MAMA wrote: Dust514 is a money milking machine and a PAY 2 WIN model. FACT What are you talking about? Every item you can get using Aurum is equivalent to any other item you can get without Aurum... with a few minor exceptions. Even then, some items you can't even get with Aurum. many of the items you can get with AUR have better fitting requirements than ISK items, which makes them better. Buying items with RL money which are better than items you can buy with ingame money, makes it P2W. I love how I kill proto-sutis with my militia assault rifles and shotguns. (^.^ My answer to p2w folks
trollsroyce Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 281	Posted - 2013.04.12 10:51:00 - [15] - Quote 1) The rough equivalent, if not better deal, of what OP proposes is for a player to purchase Merc Pack monthly. Premium model would indeed be a viable strategy to think of, as lots of players have alt accounts which they could choose to premium or not in excess to their main. 2) Dust514 is very much pay to win, because you insert gear in the economy through AUR in addition to ISK. If you can save ISK by running AUR items regularly, your corp will win the endgame through taxes and donations, and you will win by having surplus ISK to buy the best gear available. 3) However, since the items in Dust "economy" are not yet manufactured, it's debateable how the whole thing will turn out and what needs to be done in the big picture. Could you imagine EVE online with AURUM battleships, that require less SP to use and no ISK? Russian oligarchs would fund endless fleets of p2w destruction, as they are already paying RL salary to fleet commanders. Similiarly, every aspect in Dust that can be accelerated by cash will be, if the game begins to meaningfully affect EVE online.


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