DUST Search - Clone costs versus equipment costs...

Bones McGavins wrote:

Skihids wrote:

I brought this up back when clones were "only" 200k each.
Keep in mind the defender is unable to purchase more clones so they will be quite literally priceless.

PC is most definitely going to be absolute top of the line gear and only your A-Team is going to be invited.

PC will in no way replace instant battles for anyone as all that ISK is going to be farmed from pub matches. I don't expect PC districts to be anything but a trophy purchased with blood and ISK.

Why can't defenders purchase clones?

I believe there is a 300 clone limit per district, so once you have excess you will be selling it to corps that need them (for defense and for attack).

Apparently the cost is estimated at 100k per clone. Which does help to alleviate SOME of the concern I have.

At 100k:

Starter Fit Clone: 120k

Advanced Fit clone: 200k

Proto Fit clone: 500K

Though not nearly as extreme as the pub matches, this still makes it reasonable to use advanced gear as opposed to proto. Starter would still likely be out the window, but meh, i dont think that impacts anyone really. My concern with 500k was since it would limit it to really proto fit making any sense, it would reduce ability to generalize skills and force folks into proto gear down one specific.

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Bones McGavins Forty-Nine Fedayeen Minmatar Republic 46	Posted - 2013.04.05 15:13:00 - [1] - Quote So we have seen a couple of dev blogs outlying the PC model. The newest one goes into some of the pricing info on clones, moving clones etc. My concern is, the cost of individual clones makes the difference between gear costs negliable. A starter clone costs over 500k ISK. So this means, a clone with equipment would range between like 510k and like 1M or so. Point is, the balance between proto gear and lower gear made sense when the price increase was 10k to like 500k, 50X price for an advantage. But when its simply 2X, it wouldnt remotely make ANY sense to not use proto gear. So whats the point of the lower gear even existing? Are you really gunna suit a 500k clone with cheap gear, ever? This also means that any corp with half a brain will only allow soldiers who have enough SP to run proto gear to use their clones. So now, newer players are pretty much cut off from enjoying the meta aspects of the game.
Kane Brackman Anonymous Killers Mercenary Corporation 13	Posted - 2013.04.05 15:15:00 - [2] - Quote I guess it really depends if you buy the clone packs or make them your self in the end. If you make the clones at your district your less concerned about the cost as it was essentially free.
Judy Maat Rebelles A Quebec Orion Empire 14	Posted - 2013.04.05 15:21:00 - [3] - Quote I asgree with CCPNullarbor on this.. making them expensive will make the battles more epic :-) <[CCP]Nullarbor> the corp battles are supposed to be more epic than instant battle <[CCP]Nullarbor> we want people earning more and spending more <[CCP]Nullarbor> provides an arena for the cool stuff
Bones McGavins Forty-Nine Fedayeen Minmatar Republic 46	Posted - 2013.04.05 15:25:00 - [4] - Quote Well I was under the assumption "arms races" would make corp battles epic. Youd be busting out your best stuff anyway. Youd be seeing armies of prototype versus prototype. The difference is, a standard or advanced would still have a role, and could still help the team without an issue with cheaper clones. Corps would still be throwing tons of isk in gear at eachother. But now, with the cost of gear marginalized by the cost of the clone, your pretty much eliminating a majority of the player base from even participating. Like the ticket to even get in costs 500k, you arent going to let someone who is running standard gear in, since the clones themselves will be the isk sink, not the gear.
ZiwZih The Tritan Industries 104	Posted - 2013.04.05 16:04:00 - [5] - Quote Kane Brackman wrote: I guess it really depends if you buy the clone packs or make them your self in the end. If you make the clones at your district your less concerned about the cost as it was essentially free. Nothing in New Eden is free, my dear. Everything asks for certain work, by you or by other player. If you spend your and yours friends time and ISK to plan, conquer, build and defend a district that will eventually produce certain number of clones, how come you call it 'free'?
Skihids The Tritan Industries 1143	Posted - 2013.04.05 16:37:00 - [6] - Quote I brought this up back when clones were "only" 200k each. Keep in mind the defender is unable to purchase more clones so they will be quite literally priceless. PC is most definitely going to be absolute top of the line gear and only your A-Team is going to be invited. PC will in no way replace instant battles for anyone as all that ISK is going to be farmed from pub matches. I don't expect PC districts to be anything but a trophy purchased with blood and ISK.
Skihids The Tritan Industries 1143	Posted - 2013.04.05 16:50:00 - [7] - Quote ZiwZih wrote: Kane Brackman wrote: I guess it really depends if you buy the clone packs or make them your self in the end. If you make the clones at your district your less concerned about the cost as it was essentially free. Nothing in New Eden is free, my dear. Everything asks for certain work, by you or by other player. If you spend your and yours friends' time and ISK to plan, conquer, build and defend a district that will eventually produce certain number of clones, how come you call it 'free'? It won't be free by any stretch. Since clones are both your income stream and your means of defense it's sort of like playing poker with potato chips when you are hungry.
Bones McGavins Forty-Nine Fedayeen Minmatar Republic 47	Posted - 2013.04.05 17:25:00 - [8] - Quote Skihids wrote: I brought this up back when clones were "only" 200k each. Keep in mind the defender is unable to purchase more clones so they will be quite literally priceless. PC is most definitely going to be absolute top of the line gear and only your A-Team is going to be invited. PC will in no way replace instant battles for anyone as all that ISK is going to be farmed from pub matches. I don't expect PC districts to be anything but a trophy purchased with blood and ISK. Why can't defenders purchase clones? I believe there is a 300 clone limit per district, so once you have excess you will be selling it to corps that need them (for defense and for attack). Apparently the cost is estimated at 100k per clone. Which does help to alleviate SOME of the concern I have. At 100k: Starter Fit Clone: 120k Advanced Fit clone: 200k Proto Fit clone: 500K Though not nearly as extreme as the pub matches, this still makes it reasonable to use advanced gear as opposed to proto. Starter would still likely be out the window, but meh, i dont think that impacts anyone really. My concern with 500k was since it would limit it to really proto fit making any sense, it would reduce ability to generalize skills and force folks into proto gear down one specific.
Gilbatron Free-Space-Ranger Nulli Secunda 85	Posted - 2013.04.05 19:42:00 - [9] - Quote ZiwZih wrote: Kane Brackman wrote: I guess it really depends if you buy the clone packs or make them your self in the end. If you make the clones at your district your less concerned about the cost as it was essentially free. Nothing in New Eden is free, my dear. Everything asks for certain work, by you or by other player. If you spend your and yours friends' time and ISK to plan, conquer, build and defend a district that will eventually produce certain number of clones, how come you call it 'free'? duh ! the minerals i mine are free, didn't you know ? so the clones i mine are also free. everyone knows !
KalOfTheRathi Talon Strike Force LTD 318	Posted - 2013.04.05 19:51:00 - [10] - Quote Bones McGavins wrote: Well I was under the assumption Well, there's your problem right there. Why would you assume Anything with DUST much less with CCP, CCP/Shanghai? If you think hopefully, you will be wrong. If you don't think EVE, you will be wrong. If you Only think EVE, you will be wrong. Anything not based on actual Verified information from the Devs is, at best, based on assumptions from someone else. Never Assume is a good rule. In Real Life and even more so down here in the DUST.

Skihids The Tritan Industries 1144	Posted - 2013.04.05 20:08:00 - [11] - Quote Bones McGavins wrote: Skihids wrote: I brought this up back when clones were "only" 200k each. Keep in mind the defender is unable to purchase more clones so they will be quite literally priceless. PC is most definitely going to be absolute top of the line gear and only your A-Team is going to be invited. PC will in no way replace instant battles for anyone as all that ISK is going to be farmed from pub matches. I don't expect PC districts to be anything but a trophy purchased with blood and ISK. Why can't defenders purchase clones? I believe there is a 300 clone limit per district, so once you have excess you will be selling it to corps that need them (for defense and for attack). Apparently the cost is estimated at 100k per clone. Which does help to alleviate SOME of the concern I have. At 100k: Starter Fit Clone: 120k Advanced Fit clone: 200k Proto Fit clone: 500K Though not nearly as extreme as the pub matches, this still makes it reasonable to use advanced gear as opposed to proto. Starter would still likely be out the window, but meh, i dont think that impacts anyone really. My concern with 500k was since it would limit it to really proto fit making any sense, it would reduce ability to generalize skills and force folks into proto gear down one specific. Gentec only sells starter clone packs to corps with no districts (200k ISK each last I heard). Once you have possession of a district you have to manufacture your own. You can sell excess clones back to Gentec at 100k ISK each (nice racket eh?), or you can use them to defend the district. Run out of clones and you lose your district. So in effect you have two valuations for a clone: 1) Excess clones = 100k ISK 2) Clones used for defense = Priceless Your CEO is the only one dealing with the first. All other mercs are dealing with the second.


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