DUST Search - Is it posible ?

trollsroyce wrote:

Let me expand on this. In EVE, you have tiers of competitiveness: start out as a competitive tackler from week1 in the best case scenario, be competitive in supercapital level in a few years. Newbies don't need the latter but they definitely need the first
tier.

Now, the sole reason a newbie can be a competitive tackler in a week is that EVE is pvppppppppp. Dust has currently equally sized teams, which IMHO is a design undersight. In order for someone to be competitive in dust, you need to be on a realistically equal footing gear wise. The exception is forge gun, which kills infantry 1 shot. Another example is tactical scout play with shotgun and drop uplinks. For these roles, 1 mill sp is sufficient to get the basic support right. IMHO newbies need that fast, so that they can play the specific role properly.

So in short, newbies need fast accessible roles they can fill properly to support older chars. They need the very basic SP for it quickly, more than the vets need to keep their advantage.

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 2 post(s)
Sergey Topchiy Academy Inferno 0	Posted - 2013.02.27 07:14:00 - [1] - Quote To reset skill points that was put in large and small turet operation after fix misile turrets ?As I think it will be fair for people.that right now have no choice what weapon to train,.But trained Caldari tanks.
Exmaple Core UnReaL. 140	Posted - 2013.02.27 07:16:00 - [2] - Quote no. there will be no SP resets what-so-ever
Sergey Topchiy Academy Inferno 0	Posted - 2013.02.27 07:20:00 - [3] - Quote Don't need character reset, only like in eve, when they removed learning skills, they give back all SP that were in this skills. Just reset skill points in large and small turets. I prefer use class weapon instead of blasters, but just if it is possible.

ChribbaX Otherworld Enterprises Dust Control Otherworld Empire Productions 136	Posted - 2013.02.27 09:29:00 - [4] - Quote In New Eden one learns by their mistakes especially in SP. I kinda like it that it's not just spent SP on something and then be able to switch it around. I put SP into stuff I really don't need as well but that makes the game so much variable imo /c


CCP Eterne C C P C C P Alliance 770	Posted - 2013.02.27 09:52:00 - [5] - Quote Exmaple Core wrote: no. there will be no SP resets what-so-ever Just a note, we've said we won't reset skill points to 0. There might still conceivably be a time where we reset skill point allocation.

Bald Crusader Chatelain Rapid Response Gallente Federation 35	Posted - 2013.02.27 09:56:00 - [6] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: Just a note, we've said we won't reset skill points to 0. So is this the caveat free statement people have always asked for? Never under any circumstances?
Citpaan Hacos BetaMax. 23	Posted - 2013.02.27 09:58:00 - [7] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: There might still conceivably be a time where we reset skill point allocation. By any chance, does this mean something like what's going on with destroyers and battlecruisers in EVE?

CCP Eterne C C P C C P Alliance 770	Posted - 2013.02.27 09:58:00 - [8] - Quote Bald Crusader wrote: CCP Eterne wrote: Just a note, we've said we won't reset skill points to 0. So is this the caveat free statement people have always asked for? Never under any circumstances? Good point. I've added in the caveat.

Bald Crusader Chatelain Rapid Response Gallente Federation 35	Posted - 2013.02.27 10:08:00 - [9] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: Bald Crusader wrote: CCP Eterne wrote: Just a note, we've said we won't reset skill points to 0. So is this the caveat free statement people have always asked for? Never under any circumstances? Good point. I've added in the caveat. Well an SP re-allocation mention is fair enough, and for anyone familiar with the EVE universe this should come as no surprise. I am however interested in your post now as the definitive statement that CCP will not "gimp" or reset SP in response to "unforeseen circumstances". And while we are at it, when your game goes "gold" what assurances do the beta players receive that new players will not receive benefits such as "training bonuses" as have been tried in EVE to reduce skill gaps between new and old players? And if such a thing is not planned at this time, but is then decided to be implemented how that will be communicated?
trollsroyce Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 166	Posted - 2013.02.27 10:34:00 - [10] - Quote New players absolutely need to receive training bonuses for the first mill sp. The sooner they can get to a competitive level SP and gearwise, the better. Hint: militia forge fit is a fast ticket to start off :)

Rasatsu Much Crying Old Experts 443	Posted - 2013.02.27 10:41:00 - [11] - Quote trollsroyce wrote: New players absolutely need to receive training bonuses for the first mill sp. The sooner they can get to a competitive level SP and gearwise, the better. Hint: militia forge fit is a fast ticket to start off :) No they don't.
Bald Crusader Chatelain Rapid Response Gallente Federation 35	Posted - 2013.02.27 10:51:00 - [12] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: Exmaple Core wrote: no. there will be no SP resets what-so-ever Just a note, we've said we won't reset skill points to 0 (without a HUGE GIANT CURRENTLY-UNFATHOMABLE reason). There might still conceivably be a time where we reset skill point allocation. Edit: Edited to add in caveat. OK, so I guess its still the caveats in place for this one. That's fine because it will be clearer to people who keep making statements about this and that with regards to skill point resets.
Zarr Du'Kar Pro Hic Immortalis RISE of LEGION 13	Posted - 2013.02.27 11:07:00 - [13] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: Exmaple Core wrote: no. there will be no SP resets what-so-ever Just a note, we've said we won't reset skill points to 0 (without a HUGE GIANT CURRENTLY-UNFATHOMABLE reason). There might still conceivably be a time where we reset skill point allocation. Edit: Edited to add in caveat. The question is, what does that statement entail for SP refund be it partial or total for re-allocation. Can you expound on what you mean when you say reset skill point allocation?
trollsroyce Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 166	Posted - 2013.02.27 11:10:00 - [14] - Quote Rasatsu wrote: trollsroyce wrote: New players absolutely need to receive training bonuses for the first mill sp. The sooner they can get to a competitive level SP and gearwise, the better. Hint: militia forge fit is a fast ticket to start off :) No they don't. Let me expand on this. In EVE, you have tiers of competitiveness: start out as a competitive tackler from week1 in the best case scenario, be competitive in supercapital level in a few years. Newbies don't need the latter but they definitely need the first tier. Now, the sole reason a newbie can be a competitive tackler in a week is that EVE is pvppppppppp. Dust has currently equally sized teams, which IMHO is a design undersight. In order for someone to be competitive in dust, you need to be on a realistically equal footing gear wise. The exception is forge gun, which kills infantry 1 shot. Another example is tactical scout play with shotgun and drop uplinks. For these roles, 1 mill sp is sufficient to get the basic support right. IMHO newbies need that fast, so that they can play the specific role properly. So in short, newbies need fast accessible roles they can fill properly to support older chars. They need the very basic SP for it quickly, more than the vets need to keep their advantage.
Baal Omniscient L.O.T.I.S. Legacy Rising 259	Posted - 2013.02.27 11:24:00 - [15] - Quote Tagging as favorite topic so I can quote Eterne in the event that the SP reallocation issue is brought up again in the future. Thanks for an official response on the issue, even if it is just a possibility. =)
Sergey Topchiy Academy Inferno 0	Posted - 2013.02.27 12:57:00 - [16] - Quote I an not interesting in cases when people training something by mistake, I am not interesting how fast people getting SP. I am asked, will it possible to relocate SP from hybrid weapon to missile weapon couse at this stage of beta i had no choice, only one weapon atm is working, it is hybrid, but on my Caldari tank it is useless. After patch I hope missile turets will work correct, dont want spend 2 more millions SP just to make my tank work correct. Sorry for my English, I am from Ukraine.
KalOfTheRathi CowTek 169	Posted - 2013.02.27 14:27:00 - [17] - Quote No. Once spent SP is there to stay. Don't Skill while under the influence.
GeneralButtNaked Burnwall Industries 69	Posted - 2013.02.27 15:32:00 - [18] - Quote trollsroyce wrote: Let me expand on this. In EVE, you have tiers of competitiveness: start out as a competitive tackler from week1 in the best case scenario, be competitive in supercapital level in a few years. Newbies don't need the latter but they definitely need the first tier. Now, the sole reason a newbie can be a competitive tackler in a week is that EVE is pvppppppppp. Dust has currently equally sized teams, which IMHO is a design undersight. In order for someone to be competitive in dust, you need to be on a realistically equal footing gear wise. The exception is forge gun, which kills infantry 1 shot. Another example is tactical scout play with shotgun and drop uplinks. For these roles, 1 mill sp is sufficient to get the basic support right. IMHO newbies need that fast, so that they can play the specific role properly. So in short, newbies need fast accessible roles they can fill properly to support older chars. They need the very basic SP for it quickly, more than the vets need to keep their advantage. This is a well thought out, and VERY valid argument. Maybe making the first two weeks of a players career have a higher cap?
Maken Tosch Planetary Response Organisation Test Friends Please Ignore 1602	Posted - 2013.02.27 16:15:00 - [19] - Quote If you don't like the choice you made about where to allocate your SP, or part of your SP, then you have to live with your choices for the rest of your life like the rest of us. It is extremely rare for CCP to allow reallocation of ANY amount of SP (even rarer if dealing with ALL of the SP). This is because there has to be certain circumstances that are so ground breaking and impacting towards every player that they have no choice but to do it. Case in point: The removal of the 'Learning Skill Books' in Eve Online a few years ago. CCP removed them because the skills forced trial users to waste a good chunk of their trial time learning skills that really don't even allow you to fly anything better than a newbie ship and maybe a stock frigate. By the time they finished training the 'Learning' skills their trial time was already over and they gained no experience. Once CCP decided to remove them, they reimbursed the users of the SP they gained from learning those skill books which amounted to around 2-3million SP on average per player. That is a relatively small amount compared to the overall SP amount that Eve players usually have (about 50million to 150milion on average per player) which didn't impact player interaction too much. Another case in point: The current rebalancing of the skill books covering destroyers, cruisers, battlecruisers and battleships. If you read the dev blogs covering this, you will see that in some cases players will gain SP if they train up certain skill books to level 5 or might get reimbursed a certain amount depending on what and how much they invested in while for some players they may not see anything happen at all other than changes to the prerequisites depending on what they invested in. Dust may see something like this several years down the road. If you are talking about reallocating SP because of a fix to Missile Turrets as an example, then it will depend on what that fix was. Is the fix a 'change' in the prerequisites? If so then you may see some SP reimbursement. But if we ever talk about reallocating SP just because you or I don't like the skill books we invested in, well... too bad. Live with those choices.
Sergey Topchiy Academy Inferno 0	Posted - 2013.02.27 16:39:00 - [20] - Quote I don't know, have u used tanks or not, but if u will try missile turrets u will understand why nobody use em, they don't work. That's why 95% people that using shield tank as i, must use hybrid weapon, that's mean that shield tank atm weaker, couse they don't have bonuses to this kind of weapon, I have 4,5kk sp, all of em in tank, I didn't spend even 1 sp on anything except tank skill, believe me, if I am telling u that missile turrets not work, it is tru. And I am not crying or asking for something, just want to know, will we have chance to relocate or no. And don't tell about what is fair or no, how works EVE and skills, u can chek char in EVe GodFromHell, look when I started play, there only 30kk skill points for more than 10+ years, but it is good for killing and nothing more. Couse I didn't interesting in anything else.

General Tiberius1 ZionTCD Legacy Rising 219	Posted - 2013.02.27 18:04:00 - [21] - Quote CCP Eterne wrote: Exmaple Core wrote: no. there will be no SP resets what-so-ever Just a note, we've said we won't reset skill points to 0 Quote: (without a HUGE GIANT CURRENTLY-UNFATHOMABLE reason). There might still conceivably be a time where we reset skill point allocation. Edit: Edited to add in caveat. like your servers catching fire and blowing up?
Cortez The Killer Immobile Infantry 193	Posted - 2013.02.27 18:19:00 - [22] - Quote How nice it would be to be able to cough up $20-50 to get a skill point reset. Especially with 100m+ SP Eve characters. Unfortunately everyone feels the burn at some point of having SP in places they wish they hadn't put them in. The only upside is that eventually everything gets "rebalanced" at some point so the useless skill you have now may have a window of awesomeness at some unexpected time down the road.


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