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(feedback) Potential vehicle calling abuse in future games.

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iceyburnz Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 283	Posted - 2013.02.04 09:24:00 - [1] - Quote This scenerio is unlikely to happen now but may happen in future when players have more resources or access to manufacturing. At present once you hack a vehicle or once the pilot has bailed or died anyone can take the vehicle and drive it, regardless of actual skill levels. Therefore it is likely at some point in the future a cleverly minded corporation may designate one or more "vehicle callers". Guys skilled with Sagaris or some suitably powerful vehicle. All they have to do is call a vehicle and jump in and jump out again and basically you can have every friendly player in the match driving a sagaris. Even new players. So with some game training, any corp with a few older players has an semi-instant army of tanks. To be honest Im surprised others havn't thought of this already.
Samantha Spoor Teknomen 24	Posted - 2013.02.04 11:58:00 - [2] - Quote I get what you are saying and I agree it can be pretty cheap, but A: It's expensive and yes later on if the prices stay the same it will be easier but the cost will be there. B: Not everyone will drive the tank well or have the right infantry backup so they can be killed. C: You can already get 2 tanks in a battle possible more I don't drive so I don't know the limit D: If there are several tanks on the field most likely everyone and there dog is Anti-Armor on the other team It's early so those are the main reasons people probably won't abuse it to much. Oh and Pride of the tank driver/requester. Nothing bother me more then when I die by something stupid, just imagine how they feel when they lose a tank.
Chunky Munkey Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 285	Posted - 2013.02.04 12:10:00 - [3] - Quote +1 This is basically the equivalent of spawning in a proto suit and handing it over to another team member not skilled into it. Vehicles also don't suffer the same drawbacks that a suit fitting does when it comes to skills, e.g. stamina recharge, scan profile, recoil, heat build up, etc etc. So long as somebody has some base skills like mechanics & perhaps shield management, they really have access to fully funtioning proto tanks, provided they have the contacts to supply them.
I-Shayz-I ZionTCD Legacy Rising 172	Posted - 2013.02.04 12:11:00 - [4] - Quote I tried having my squad run all tanks once. We had 4 militia tanks running around. Even though most people on the other team chose anti-armor we still stayed up for quite some time. The problem is that tanks can't capture objectives or get to every place that infantry can. Even though we were winning by clone count, we still lost the battle from low cooperation of the rest of the team. Also unless you're an experienced tank driver, it's hard to get a lot of kills as a tank without blowing yourself up in the process. two times during this battle members of my squad ran into each other which destroyed both of the tanks. I honestly think that having more than two tanks on the field at a time is actually a burden to your team than something that could be abused. Also even if these two tanks were just spawned in for blueberries to drive, I doubt they could be very effective in them for long.
Aeon Amadi Maverick Conflict Solutions 1003	Posted - 2013.02.04 12:31:00 - [5] - Quote +1 if only because it just makes sense.
Grit Breather BetaMax. 660	Posted - 2013.02.04 13:43:00 - [6] - Quote What do you mean new or nobody has thought of it? This was and is a common tactic for at least 4 builds now. The first time I heard of it was in the E3 build back in June 2012. As for being an exploit, not really so much. The higher tier vehicles are pretty rubbish without the proper skills trained. Sure, a skilled driver could call them in and let a non skilled player use them, but that player would be very ineffective with them. I personally do not see this as an issue. Bring on the easy target practice!
develsgun Phyrexian Engineering Legacy Rising 19	Posted - 2013.02.04 15:36:00 - [7] - Quote iceyburnz wrote: This scenerio is unlikely to happen now but may happen in future when players have more resources or access to manufacturing. At present once you hack a vehicle or once the pilot has bailed or died anyone can take the vehicle and drive it, regardless of actual skill levels. Therefore it is likely at some point in the future a cleverly minded corporation may designate one or more "vehicle callers". Guys skilled with Sagaris or some suitably powerful vehicle. All they have to do is call a vehicle and jump in and jump out again and basically you can have every friendly player in the match driving a sagaris. Even new players. So with some game training, any corp with a few older players has an semi-instant army of tanks. To be honest Im surprised others havn't thought of this already. Been there done this ccp never knew what was coming. We actually did this and found the vehicle limit while testing corp battles against ccp. I believe we had 5 tanks on the field plus dropships and lavs but it was kinda cool especially since I did this with stb on the team. Most beta testers would remember them as the scourge of infantry always riding around in there top level tanks though it was partly infantry fault as they didnt know what s swarm launcher was. There is a vehicle limit and it does force people to play infantry but I do agree unless u know how to drive the car u shouldnt just like in eve when ur boarding someone elses abanddoned ship
Noc Tempre Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1170	Posted - 2013.02.04 16:55:00 - [8] - Quote This goes alllllll the way back to fanfest build of last year (you remember, the infinite tanks right?). No SP should mean you can't get in the driver seat. Should be that simple.
Iskandar Zul Karnain Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 176	Posted - 2013.02.04 16:56:00 - [9] - Quote Grit Breather wrote: What do you mean new or nobody has thought of it? This was and is a common tactic for at least 4 builds now. The first time I heard of it was in the E3 build back in June 2012. As for being an exploit, not really so much. The higher tier vehicles are pretty rubbish without the proper skills trained. Sure, a skilled driver could call them in and let a non skilled player use them, but that player would be very ineffective with them. I personally do not see this as an issue. Bring on the easy target practice! This. Proto tank with no skills to back it is crap. High health low damage.
Y0UR NAME HERE Imperfects Negative-Feedback 445	Posted - 2013.02.04 17:00:00 - [10] - Quote Samantha Spoor wrote: I get what you are saying and I agree it can be pretty cheap, but A: It's expensive and yes later on if the prices stay the same it will be easier but the cost will be there. B: Not everyone will drive the tank well or have the right infantry backup so they can be killed. C: You can already get 2 tanks in a battle possible more I don't drive so I don't know the limit D: If there are several tanks on the field most likely everyone and there dog is Anti-Armor on the other team It's early so those are the main reasons people probably won't abuse it to much. Oh and Pride of the tank driver/requester. Nothing bother me more then when I die by something stupid, just imagine how they feel when they lose a tank. For A I'd say, Corp funded would be a good way around this.

arimal lavaren L.O.T.I.S. Legacy Rising 186	Posted - 2013.02.04 17:09:00 - [11] - Quote I'm not really seeing a problem with this seems a valid corporate warfare tactic to me.
Cross Atu Conspiratus Immortalis 775	Posted - 2013.02.04 17:13:00 - [12] - Quote Samantha Spoor wrote: I get what you are saying and I agree it can be pretty cheap, but A: It's expensive and yes later on if the prices stay the same it will be easier but the cost will be there. B: Not everyone will drive the tank well or have the right infantry backup so they can be killed. C: You can already get 2 tanks in a battle possible more I don't drive so I don't know the limit D: If there are several tanks on the field most likely everyone and there dog is Anti-Armor on the other team It's early so those are the main reasons people probably won't abuse it to much. Oh and Pride of the tank driver/requester. Nothing bother me more then when I die by something stupid, just imagine how they feel when they lose a tank. ^This is accurate, but there's another key factor here not addressed above or by the OP. Character skill The skills on a character effect many things about vehicle function. Shields, Armor, Shield Regen, DPS, etc. are all directly effected by the skills of the using character as such even a 'best fit' HAV dropped in will not preform at peak it's normal efficiency if driven/used by a character without the proper investment of SP. A smart Corp that wants more than one HAV on the field will simply ensure they have the proper character builds (and for that matter driver player skills) to field it. A well fit HAV with a proficient player driving it can be match altering, a HAV without SP support or a seasoned driver is just an expensive "hit me" sign. Having a such a "hit me" sign on the field may be useful as a faint but it's no where near broken. 0.02 ISK Cross
amarrian victorian Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 52	Posted - 2013.02.04 20:24:00 - [13] - Quote not sure if still in the game but there used to be a team vehicle limit.
Skihids Tritan-Industries Legacy Rising 970	Posted - 2013.02.04 20:36:00 - [14] - Quote The thing is that all the defensive skills (shield and armor) are shared by dropsuits and vehicles, so a proto tank won't necessarily become a paper tank. Once fit shield or armor boosters and resists don't require skills to operate, so the driver doesn't even need to skill Shield Enhancements or Adaptation. The only vehicle exclusive skills are for fitting and unlocking. If a HAV has a proto level large turret it won't even matter much if the driver had no bonus. The base damage is pretty decent. It's a quite usable tactic.
Necrodermis GunFall Mobilization Covert Intervention 460	Posted - 2013.02.04 20:42:00 - [15] - Quote i did that for a corp battle. called in 5 tanks in a corp battle against a corp that only brought 1 member.
G Torq ALTA B2O 88	Posted - 2013.02.04 21:34:00 - [16] - Quote Noc Tempre wrote: No SP should mean you can't get in the driver seat. Should be that simple. I concur! +1
iceyburnz Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 283	Posted - 2013.02.04 22:00:00 - [17] - Quote I wasn't aware that it had happened already. I don't think its an issue right now, I mean militia tanks LOL. The problem I forsee is in the future with more resources giving newbs big powerful tanks and mechs and swarming over the battlefield. Imagine 2006 with goonswarm only four older members handed out battleships and carriers to everyone.
Coleman Gray Coalition Of Goverments 47	Posted - 2013.02.04 22:16:00 - [18] - Quote You know a tank wars coming, 16 on 16 tanks XD
Irish Syn Chernova Industries 123	Posted - 2013.02.04 22:25:00 - [19] - Quote Why not just make it that if you call in a tank you can't call in another tank until that one gets destroyed? Makes no sense for one person who skilled in tanks to request two or more unless you are trying to do this exploit.
develsgun Phyrexian Engineering Legacy Rising 19	Posted - 2013.02.04 23:11:00 - [20] - Quote There is a vehicle limit we dont hit it much. Cause most of us hike rather than try to show are toys off and get blown up cause pubs have no teamwork. The point is hear that even a great tank needs a great driver to keep from getting his ass killed. Ofcoarse if we want to introduce the thought of skill requirement to "steal" anouther vehicle keep it to that dont start making other ideas that would potentially unnecessarily hurt the meta game as that is the uniqness of eve and this game. The meta game is ccp hook its what causes people to play for 3 years straight or complete noobs rags quite after the first mission and come back a year later dieing to play. The meta game just gets hooked in the brain and it never comes loose

Severus Smith ZionTCD Legacy Rising 163	Posted - 2013.02.04 23:14:00 - [21] - Quote Just make it so that if you don't have the skills to drive it, you can't. Same with turrets on vehicles.
Breakin Stuff Immobile Infantry 680	Posted - 2013.02.04 23:45:00 - [22] - Quote Irish Syn wrote: Why not just make it that if you call in a tank you can't call in another tank until that one gets destroyed? Makes no sense for one person who skilled in tanks to request two or more unless you are trying to do this exploit. because it makes more sense that if you don't know how to drive a Surya or use the guns and modules the game should disallow you from driving the surya, or using it's guns or modules.
Noc Tempre Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1170	Posted - 2013.02.05 00:11:00 - [23] - Quote As someone who has spec'd vehicles to some degree since the very first closed beta build, I can say I've always disapproved of the ability for unskilled people to hijack the vehicle, both blue and red. The fact of the matter is if we hit 24+ corp battles and things stay the way they are, a corp will only need one or two people with SP in vehicles. It delegates you to "cyno alt" status, something you do with a throwaway toon in EVE. Many problems would be fixed by not letting people without the command skills in the driver seat. I don't think no SP to use the small turrets is nearly as serious an issue, but it could be a way to differentiate non-militia fit vehicles as harder to operate.


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