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Kermit DeSade THE MID-WEST DYNASTY 8	Posted - 2013.02.03 01:51:00 - [1] - Quote Only about 2 or 3 from each teem seem to be attacking everyone else is hiding way way back in places and just sniping. I tried sniping myself and now I understand why. Its way way way too easy. Please consider editing the snipers down a little. I got bored of sniping after a wile and went back to another game. I love the way the game works and the concept is killer. However unless you want a snipers only game its not balanced at all. This game has a great deal of potential and I do plan on buying it . Well.. I want too anyway I dont need another sniper game I have plenty of those. I hope you guys dont mistake this for a hate post I really love the content and the idea/concept of this and look forward to the finished product.
Y0UR NAME HERE Imperfects Negative-Feedback 445	Posted - 2013.02.03 01:53:00 - [2] - Quote Kermit DeSade wrote: Only about 2 or 3 from each teem seem to be attacking everyone else is hiding way way back in places and just sniping. I tried sniping myself and now I understand why. Its way way way too easy. Please consider editing the snipers down a little. I got bored of sniping after a wile and went back to another game. I love the way the game works and the concept is killer. However unless you want a snipers only game its not balanced at all. This game has a great deal of potential and I do plan on buying it . Well.. I want too anyway I dont need another sniper game I have plenty of those. I hope you guys dont mistake this for a hate post I really love the content and the idea/concept of this and look forward to the finished product. Big issue here is the red line snipping. Which is being looked at by the Dev team in their last update. Remove the redline abuse and things will change a bit.
Sleepy Zan Internal Error. Negative-Feedback 2048	Posted - 2013.02.03 01:56:00 - [3] - Quote Ballistics, that is all
Y0UR NAME HERE Imperfects Negative-Feedback 445	Posted - 2013.02.03 01:57:00 - [4] - Quote Sleepy Zan wrote: Ballistics, that is all Still love to see this, we'll wait a berry berry long time Zan.
KalOfTheRathi CowTek 168	Posted - 2013.02.03 02:26:00 - [5] - Quote Ballistics, Sleepy? The digital scopes should offset for bullet drop automatically. They can today. These devices report distance to target down to a meter as well as success possibilities so adjusting for bullet drop (even though they are not bullets per se) would be easy to do in software as it is very simple math to solve. The description of how projectiles work in DUST and EVE are consistent and neither involve bullet drop. Whether that is realistic doesn't mix well, for me, with twenty centuries in the future and somewhere off into to space. I don't think that bullet drop would make any real difference unless there is a significant gain in zoom level. At range the target is rarely more than a dozen or so pixels tall. The scope target spot is can cover the torso and moving by as little as the width of the spot is the difference between a hit or a miss. My longest hit so far was 750m and even though it was a kill I have no idea if it was a head shot.
Vaerana Myshtana ScIdama Endless Renaissance 205	Posted - 2013.02.03 02:31:00 - [6] - Quote KalOfTheRathi wrote: Ballistics, Sleepy? The digital scopes should offset for bullet drop automatically. They can today. These devices report distance to target down to a meter as well as success possibilities so adjusting for bullet drop (even though they are not bullets per se) would be easy to do in software as it is very simple math to solve. The description of how projectiles work in DUST and EVE are consistent and neither involve bullet drop. Whether that is realistic doesn't mix well, for me, with twenty centuries in the future and somewhere off into to space. I don't think that bullet drop would make any real difference unless there is a significant gain in zoom level. At range the target is rarely more than a dozen or so pixels tall. The scope target spot is can cover the torso and moving by as little as the width of the spot is the difference between a hit or a miss. My longest hit so far was 750m and even though it was a kill I have no idea if it was a head shot. Honestly, the bullet drop is less of an issue than the travel time. I wrote up a whole mathy thing about it, and travel time could allow people to effectively run out of the path at the velocities given. The drop, however, would not cause many misses.
Full Metal Kitten Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 152	Posted - 2013.02.03 03:33:00 - [7] - Quote Just keep moving (not in a straight line FFS) and stop being an easy target. This will resolve most of the problem. On a related note, I saw Sleepy Zan kill a dude with a sniper rifle WHILE he was on the move. Sleep is OP. Also, don't ask how I even saw him to begin with. I'm not sure myself.
Y0UR NAME HERE Imperfects Negative-Feedback 445	Posted - 2013.02.03 03:37:00 - [8] - Quote Full Metal Kitten wrote: Just keep moving (not in a straight line FFS) and stop being an easy target. This will resolve most of the problem. On a related note, I saw Sleepy Zan kill a dude with a sniper rifle WHILE he was on the move. Sleep is OP. Also, don't ask how I even saw him to begin with. I'm not sure myself. Yes, yes he is OP. Hate when he's not on meh team.. Pfff who runs and snipes, I mean really.
Patoman Radiant ZionTCD Legacy Rising 53	Posted - 2013.02.03 04:04:00 - [9] - Quote Everyone must have weird luck in encountering stuff on average I get 75% people with assault suits and assault rifles. And that is pretty much what kills me, 75% to 90% of the time.
Y0UR NAME HERE Imperfects Negative-Feedback 445	Posted - 2013.02.03 04:06:00 - [10] - Quote Patoman Radiant wrote: Everyone must have weird luck in encountering stuff on average I get 75% people with assault suits and assault rifles. And that is pretty much what kills me, 75% to 90% of the time. Dude I've been on teams where there are 3 people being active, the rest in the redline doing god knows what.

Templar EDge Ikomari-Onu Enforcement Caldari State 0	Posted - 2013.02.03 09:39:00 - [11] - Quote Pro tip here, don't run out into the open, I have killed some many people that way. Bullet drop in this game would be kind of stupid don't you think? It's the future, bullet drop would be somewhat stupid with such powerful weapons.
Iam Krogan Tuchanka Wrecking Crew 6	Posted - 2013.02.03 11:11:00 - [12] - Quote Ballistic sniper rounds would be very cool. You could then shoot people from behind hills, with zero LoS. Be careful what you wish for. EDIT: It seems to me that main complaint with snipers is the ability to one-shot or two-shot from completely safe distance... so why is everyone suggesting so complicated fixes? Just ask for lower damage outside optimal range (bullets slow down due to air resistance, the futuristic physics got nothing to prevent that). From all the complicates solutions, I'd prefer flight delay (based on distance of course).
Hexen Trickster The Southern Legion 10	Posted - 2013.02.03 11:54:00 - [13] - Quote Snipers arnt overpowerd or anything.. just a pain every now and again most red line snipers will never help getting points to help destroy the mcc leaving there team-mates short handed also if there that much of an issue get ur own sniper rifle and shoot them 2-3 times.. they normally give up then
DrSheepbringer3 Darkstar Mercs 11	Posted - 2013.02.03 12:48:00 - [14] - Quote I know what you mean. Still a sniper who isn't a one shot? They are one shots! (Even today) and their scopes fix stuff today. Snipers are meant to be deadly, but CHOOSE their targets. Solution? Map design and serious bonus to WHO they hit. Normal men 10 points. Gunners 100 points, leaders 150 points, "tank drivers" 150 points. I'm not saying there are all the options currently, but make sniping what it should be. Not just perfect aim, but perfect choosing too. Make them VERY dangerous, but not for "greens".
Ted Cougarjuice Resheph Interstellar Strategy Gallente Federation 11	Posted - 2013.02.03 19:34:00 - [15] - Quote I don't see the point in changing the sniping mechanic. Fix the redline, sure. But on your average game of Ambush, the map is too small for a sniper to stay out of effective range of everyone. On Skirmish, a sniper is useful in a few scant situations: Counter-sniping other stationary targets Defending hackable objectives Picking off folks who aren't paying attention/aren't moving intelligently and evasively from one objective to the next. Not to mention, only a good sniper is going to have high effectiveness in the more cramped and urban areas. As for modifying damage output, with the beginning rifles you only get three shots. When someone has sufficiently tough heavy armor, unless you score some criticals, they might survive all three of them. Leave the damage alone. A headshot should be a kill. Two or three body shots against an averagely-armored opponent should be a kill. It's balanced. Especially when you consider the 4-second reload time. If you're getting picked off by snipers, step up your game. There will be campers and folks not playing the objective and sniping from deployment in every shooter you play. Battlefield, MAG, MoH etc. This is nothing new.
Jack Hawthorn BlueCorp 6	Posted - 2013.02.03 19:43:00 - [16] - Quote I completely disagree with the idea of most of the team sniping. Most of the time my problem is those prototype heavies that seem to never die.
DAMIOS82 Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 3	Posted - 2013.02.03 20:21:00 - [17] - Quote I Love snipers or atleast to play as one. But i will say that if you've got armor mods or are a heavy, it would take severall shots, before you die. Most kills i take are if they are close by one to the head. ( you can see it better) and two/three shots if further away or if they are to the body, sometimes more if i keep on missing, but that's the part you never notice. Not to mention the further you are away, the harder it get's like pixel on pixel. Like alott of people say just keep on moving and don't stop or make your motions predictable, that's when you die. Some people like to run and then jump, then run and hide, etc. you don't think those are easy to kill do you. Not to mention and this is what most people don't do is when they get shot or die, then go to a supply module, switch to a sniper and return some fire. For most snipers it only takes one shot to kill them, since they have low armor. i've even seen some guy's or girls sneak up on me and take me out. And i think to myself well played. If you don't go to the effort to take your enemy out, then don't whine about them killing you. I do see an increase in snipers lately and i believe it comes from the fact that sometimes you know when your in a ****** team and alott of people then feel like why the effort of losing my gear. In most matches in the beginning you do see people trying to make an effort. If you're winning then everybody joins in, but if you know your losing, then why bother.
AUSSIE-ELITE Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 0	Posted - 2013.02.04 11:59:00 - [18] - Quote i reckon they should increase the cost of sniper rifles. snipers dont die very often, so they can just bank up an have tones of fits. not like us guys on foot die often enough, we lose plenty of isk.
Fivetimes Infinity Immobile Infantry 1086	Posted - 2013.02.04 12:36:00 - [19] - Quote Sleepy Zan wrote: Ballistics, that is all Yep. Been saying it for months and months myself. Ballistic properties to sniper rifle shots will solve the situation. Sniping at extreme ranges will be harder, and people will have to rely more on skill rather than hitscan mechanics. Fewer snipers, fewer snipers on hills, and when you get one-shot at 600 m you know it was by someone either really good or really lucky. Done and done.
Temujin Khasar Mannar Focused Warfare Gallente Federation 0	Posted - 2013.03.09 13:36:00 - [20] - Quote Just add gunships or fighters, or any type of air support controlled by pilots and not gunners. We need escorts for the dropships anyway. Problem solved. Snipers are everywhere because the classic counter to them, air support, is missing. Hopefully CCP intends to add some awesome gunships with huge automatic guns to counter them. I play as sniper sometimes, and air support would counter it easily. Snipers would need a bit more cover though to balance...maybe covert ops cloaking devices like from EVE?

Rachoi HavoK Core 30	Posted - 2013.03.09 13:55:00 - [21] - Quote @all that want balistics: look at railgun tech in real world... no way in hell does that need drop, since the slugs are going mach 10+, there would be only an incremental drop. what we need is to be able to force snipers out of redline, but not screw up the one spot that is supposed to give those spawning from the MCC some safety for landing. without redline we'd have some asshat in a tank sitting right by the area where people would drop from MCC, and effictively cripple the game's ability to do anyhting productive
Ulysses Knapse Nuevo Atlas Corporation 106	Posted - 2013.03.10 14:53:00 - [22] - Quote Sniping is only easy when you make it easy. Snipers have pitiful close-range damage and tunnel vision. Not a good combination.
calisk galern BurgezzE.T.F Orion Empire 29	Posted - 2013.03.10 15:15:00 - [23] - Quote when the entire opposing team is sniping, a single counter sniper will shut down the entire opposing team. I do it all the time. on rare occasions you'll hit a pro sniper who will take you to town, but most are just blue dot scrubs looking for free points and they are easy to take down. also they are guaranteed to lose the match, so really what's the problem...
Scheneighnay McBob Bojo's School of the Trades 1100	Posted - 2013.03.10 23:03:00 - [24] - Quote Today, I saw someone go 17-5 as a starter fit sniper (according to the killfeed and the 2 times I ran into them) They weren't camping the redline. They were actively moving around the map, occupying hiding spots only shotgun scouts seem to know of, and harassing my team whenever we moved out of cover. Something for snipers to think about.
Jathniel G I A N T 73	Posted - 2013.03.10 23:31:00 - [25] - Quote OP, if sniping is as easy as you claim, please post some numbers from a match. Or post your general kdr. There exist master snipers whose KDRs and battle numbers don't even compare to their ground unit master counterparts. If sniping really was that easy, they would dominate everything. Reality says otherwise. Teams that have majority snipers, often lose. Snipers often don't get as many kills as everyone else, especially the snipers that people hate the most (the redline snipers), those have little to no consequence to a fight to begin with. What is it that people generally hate about newbies sniping from the redline? 1. They don't usually hit anything. 2. They don't usually die. 3. They don't capture anything. 4. They don't snipe to support allies. Sounds like we are complaining about trees, honestly. It's far-fetched to assume that ballistics will change any of this. Ballistics will cause the following. 1. They WON'T usually hit anything, and if they do, it will instant kill. 2. They WON'T usually die, because now you can't counter-snipe them as easily. 3. They WON'T capture objectives, because they still prefer sniping. That's their choice. 4. They WON'T snipe to support allies. If anything, they will keep sniping more, because they'll want the reward of the 1-shot kill, and they will still choose that over coming down to get killed up close. They don't want close-range action. Ballistics won't change that. Ballistics would make sniping more rewarding, but it will simply upset the balance more, because once people get it down to a science, you're going to get a bunch of 1-shot and 2-shot gods. I want the ballistics, but SRs are fine as they are now. All we need is a hit to the maximum effective range of the MLT and STD rifles (since that's what redliners use anyway). That's it. That will reduce the effectiveness of redline snipers, and IF that redline sniper uses a more expensive fit... You can counter-snipe him, and cost him money now. If he wants to shoot across a map, he better field some high-risk equipment.
Charlotte O'Dell Planetary Response Organisation Test Friends Please Ignore 28	Posted - 2013.03.11 01:35:00 - [26] - Quote This sounds like a case of scissors complaning about rock. if you dont like snipers, you have 2 options: be a counter-sniper or be a tank. Otherwise, adapt and overcome, srcub-berry.
bacon blaster VENGEANCE FOR HIRE 0	Posted - 2013.03.11 01:46:00 - [27] - Quote As a sniper, I will tell you that we really aren't op. There are some really good advantages we have, like range and power. With some skill, and a decent fit, you can do a lot of damage. However, we do suffer some rather crippling handicaps. First, we are useless and close range. Utterly, useless. Getting in close with an ar or a shotgun is an excellent way to take out a sniper, and this is easier than you think. We have tunnelvision while sniping, without radar, we would not in anyway see someone standing next to us while among. Half the time when I get killed, it's some guy in a scout suit with a shotgun. one dude running that fit can clear off a whole mountain of snipers and not really need much skill to do it. I grant you, my sniper suits will have an smg if I was mindful while fitting, but that still doesn't help me survive unless I get lucky. Just means I get to damage you a bit before I go down. Second, the heavy sniper. This is an excellent counter sniper, as it will usually take several shots to take down a guy in a heavy suit. The scout, sniper, on the other hand, tends to take one shot to pop. The heavy wont be able to get into as many good sniping places, but he will be much better able to deal with other snipers. You put a logibro behind him, and you have a serious force to fight. Third is cover. We cannot shoot through barriers. Pop in and out of cover. Don't just stand around in the open like a stupid blue berry. This also limits, if not almost voids, our use on certain maps. Range is really our only good defense, and with some of the more urban maps, you don't get that range, or positioning. There are a few places to work from on some of these urban maps, but everyone knows those spots and you are not outside of their range. You'll probably get a few shots off, and then the whole neighborhood is trying to kill you. And, in ambush, you will never be out or range for long. It is often better to go with a laser instea The last disadvantage we face is vehicle support. We can;t do much about vehicles. We can carry AV grenades, sure, but they don't save your ass against tanks or dropships. You might get lucky against a buggy, but a tank will ******* waste you ass, and a dropship with good gunners can wipe you out from the air, or move a team around to wipe out snipers. Now, there is still redline sniping, but that can be dealth with through the use of orbitals and heavy snipers. Also, there are rumors of the return of the artillary turret for tanks, which would make for really effective anti-sniper work anywhere on the map. So, no, snipers are not op, just potent when used well.


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