DUST Search - Heavy discussion

Ner'Zul Nexhawk wrote:

dust badger wrote:

I know yesterday there was a discussion of sorts about how heavies are spray an pray and COD players and all that Jazz.

But in a lot of games yesterday it was dominated by heavies, A lot of the time there would be 2 or 3 of them roaming around together, so the normal tactic of trying to out tract them is a bit pointless when there's a heavy to the left and to the right spraying rounds at your general direction.

I like that heavies have a nice tank and are slow and they should be (could do with an even bigger tank if you ask me) what i dont like( here is the QQ part) is the frequency of them, i feel the role of heavies should be do soak up damage, basically a meat shield for the rest of the squad but when the whole squad is heavies whats the point.

So i was thinking ab out a way so that heavies would be the minority and specialized and not the majority jack of all trades, one way i could think of doing this is by increasing the cost , i know they cost more at the moment, but to be fair they die a lot less, another way would make them harder to skill in to them, but i can see this being un-popular, final answer put a limit on the amount of heavies in the match.

any way bored at work and was just thinking, let me know what you think

Cheers badger

I think this rising of the heavies' count is cause by the fact that if your character is a Sentinel, he will automatically have a Dire sentinel Fitting (Heavy with a Forge Gun) and 50 militia heavy suits. You don't even need to skill up to use those. That's why I believe there are so many of them in this build.

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dust badger BetaMax. 283	Posted - 2013.01.15 11:28:00 - [1] - Quote I know yesterday there was a discussion of sorts about how heavies are spray an pray and COD players and all that Jazz. But in a lot of games yesterday it was dominated by heavies, A lot of the time there would be 2 or 3 of them roaming around together, so the normal tactic of trying to out tract them is a bit pointless when there's a heavy to the left and to the right spraying rounds at your general direction. I like that heavies have a nice tank and are slow and they should be (could do with an even bigger tank if you ask me) what i dont like( here is the QQ part) is the frequency of them, i feel the role of heavies should be do soak up damage, basically a meat shield for the rest of the squad but when the whole squad is heavies whats the point. So i was thinking ab out a way so that heavies would be the minority and specialized and not the majority jack of all trades, one way i could think of doing this is by increasing the cost , i know they cost more at the moment, but to be fair they die a lot less, another way would make them harder to skill in to them, but i can see this being un-popular, final answer put a limit on the amount of heavies in the match. any way bored at work and was just thinking, let me know what you think Cheers badger
Bendtner92 Imperfects Negative-Feedback 369	Posted - 2013.01.15 11:35:00 - [2] - Quote No thank you. Die less? A noob in a heavy suit dies just as much as a noob in an assault suit. Limit the amount of heavies in a match? No thank you, if I skilled for heavy and I can't use it just because there's x amount of other heavies in the battle I would be mad. People should be able to play as what they want. There shouldn't ever be the kind of restrictions that say "in this match 4 of you need to be assaults, 2 heavies, 2 scouts, 2 logis etc". That's just dumb. In my opinion the standard heavy is balanced currently. Advanced and proto heavy not so much.
Laurent Cazaderon Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 1155	Posted - 2013.01.15 11:37:00 - [3] - Quote Real problem with heavies atm is that their HMG is way more accurate than it use to be when they start firing, even at mid range. When by design (just check out old gameplay vids published on the matter), they are supposed to be more accurate while maintaining fire. Forcing heavies to pretty much stand still or slow down while firing so they can gain accuracy. Now, they can chase mostly anyone, fire short burst whenever they get a sight at an enemy and all this with an extreme accuracy. Also, compared to older builds, the difference in mobility isnt as striking as it use to be outside of sprinting. Which, added to the better HMG accuracy at range makes the whole thing even more tricky. I agree with Bendtner regarding restrictions. Would be a wrong design choice.
Guinevere Bravo SVER True Blood Unclaimed. 140	Posted - 2013.01.15 11:42:00 - [4] - Quote If i saw three heavies running (plodding) round the corner i'd GTFO and grab some height or distance with a clear LOS. It's seriously not that hard to comprehend you have to "pick" your fights? And if things are stacked heavily against you (PUNNY) you can either die or run away like a lil girl. I choose the latter... AND THEN COME REAP REVENGE ONCE IM BEHIND THEM
SCAT mania Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 76	Posted - 2013.01.15 11:42:00 - [5] - Quote IMO there too easy now. I took on 2 heavies with a smg in an logi 1 suit before reset. No problem didn't even get my sheilds down. If you really having a problem with them then add flux grenades, get in close and strafe to the side.
iceyburnz Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 282	Posted - 2013.01.15 11:43:00 - [6] - Quote Heavies are fine. Im doing a heavy stint at the moment. Im okay but Im not great at it. Basically I tend to die to a good player with good situational awareness who has a steady aim and grenades, or an organised squad. People who run into HMG fire solo spraying there assault rifle and expect to win don't know the game yet. Good solo players use the heavies slowness as their advantage and understand how, intuitively or otherwise, transversal velocity verses manual tracking speed works. Also heavies have a huge scan profile and poor scan awareness. Ive died more than once to scouts creeping up from behind. Heavies are heavily armoured but the HMG is a short medium to close range weapon, the forge gun is great against vehicles and buildings but its hard to get an infantry kill due to people running for cover after the first shot. On open field, Ive noticed heavies are sniper and laser bait.
Stinker Butt Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 103	Posted - 2013.01.15 12:14:00 - [7] - Quote Heavy is far from jack of all trades. I suspect the OP hasnt played one, but they have a lot of limitations as icyburns has pointed out a few. When you know the limits, they are fantastic. Please do NOT suggest raising the price. Prototype is very significantly overpriced atm. 1 death with a type b suit and boundless (plus slots) means you will likely lose isk on the match. Limiting number of heavies in a match? I would have to leave if I couldnt get in, but if it was done prior to matchmaking, I probably wouldnt notice or care.
Musta Tornius BetaMax. 265	Posted - 2013.01.15 12:19:00 - [8] - Quote I actually think they got a nice balance for heavies atm. It's nothing like the killing machines in replication or the crap they were after that. If I come upon a heavy facing me with a hmg when rounding a corner I know I'm most certainly going to die if I don't gtfo. Then again if I catch one in the open with laser or ar I just think easy kill. So +1 to ccp for heavies atm even if I do miss their heavy tanking ability.
Stinker Butt Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 103	Posted - 2013.01.15 12:24:00 - [9] - Quote I will add this though, if you are on one of those small ambush maps with all the cover and close up fighting, then you are in the middle of a heavies wet dream. If there are a lot of red heavies, then be prepared for bukkake. Dont worry, there will be selectable maps in the future, im fairly sure.
PIMP MAC DADDY 2100374163 A.I. 41	Posted - 2013.01.15 12:27:00 - [10] - Quote There meant to be feared. Don't charge up to one. I learned -_-

Ner'Zul Nexhawk Talos Incorporated 153	Posted - 2013.01.15 12:29:00 - [11] - Quote dust badger wrote: I know yesterday there was a discussion of sorts about how heavies are spray an pray and COD players and all that Jazz. But in a lot of games yesterday it was dominated by heavies, A lot of the time there would be 2 or 3 of them roaming around together, so the normal tactic of trying to out tract them is a bit pointless when there's a heavy to the left and to the right spraying rounds at your general direction. I like that heavies have a nice tank and are slow and they should be (could do with an even bigger tank if you ask me) what i dont like( here is the QQ part) is the frequency of them, i feel the role of heavies should be do soak up damage, basically a meat shield for the rest of the squad but when the whole squad is heavies whats the point. So i was thinking ab out a way so that heavies would be the minority and specialized and not the majority jack of all trades, one way i could think of doing this is by increasing the cost , i know they cost more at the moment, but to be fair they die a lot less, another way would make them harder to skill in to them, but i can see this being un-popular, final answer put a limit on the amount of heavies in the match. any way bored at work and was just thinking, let me know what you think Cheers badger I think this rising of the heavies' count is cause by the fact that if your character is a Sentinel, he will automatically have a Dire sentinel Fitting (Heavy with a Forge Gun) and 50 militia heavy suits. You don't even need to skill up to use those. That's why I believe there are so many of them in this build.
PIMP MAC DADDY 2100374163 A.I. 41	Posted - 2013.01.15 12:36:00 - [12] - Quote Ner'Zul Nexhawk wrote: dust badger wrote: I know yesterday there was a discussion of sorts about how heavies are spray an pray and COD players and all that Jazz. But in a lot of games yesterday it was dominated by heavies, A lot of the time there would be 2 or 3 of them roaming around together, so the normal tactic of trying to out tract them is a bit pointless when there's a heavy to the left and to the right spraying rounds at your general direction. I like that heavies have a nice tank and are slow and they should be (could do with an even bigger tank if you ask me) what i dont like( here is the QQ part) is the frequency of them, i feel the role of heavies should be do soak up damage, basically a meat shield for the rest of the squad but when the whole squad is heavies whats the point. So i was thinking ab out a way so that heavies would be the minority and specialized and not the majority jack of all trades, one way i could think of doing this is by increasing the cost , i know they cost more at the moment, but to be fair they die a lot less, another way would make them harder to skill in to them, but i can see this being un-popular, final answer put a limit on the amount of heavies in the match. any way bored at work and was just thinking, let me know what you think Cheers badger I think this rising of the heavies' count is cause by the fact that if your character is a Sentinel, he will automatically have a Dire sentinel Fitting (Heavy with a Forge Gun) and 50 militia heavy suits. You don't even need to skill up to use those. That's why I believe there are so many of them in this build. Agreed
ChromeBreaker SVER True Blood Unclaimed. 197	Posted - 2013.01.15 12:46:00 - [13] - Quote Just wait till all those heavies have skilled up with bigger better everythings... and all those new peeps turn up on open beta... nom nom nom
dust badger BetaMax. 283	Posted - 2013.01.15 12:53:00 - [14] - Quote ChromeBreaker wrote: Just wait till all those heavies have skilled up with bigger better everythings... and all those new peeps turn up on open beta... nom nom nom well i think at that point they will become more expensive so a loss will mean more than it currently does, at the moment you can chuck a heavy in a game and not care if you loose it or not
Stinker Butt Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 103	Posted - 2013.01.15 12:54:00 - [15] - Quote ChromeBreaker wrote: Just wait till all those heavies have skilled up with bigger better everythings... and all those new peeps turn up on open beta... nom nom nom I dont think so. Im already running with type II suit and a broadside, which is what I ended the last build with. Heavies start great, but they really dont get much better like the other classes. Shield control, and hmg proficiency will help, but gear is about the same.
Vyzion Eyri The Southern Legion 155	Posted - 2013.01.15 12:57:00 - [16] - Quote Whilst we can all agree outmaneuvering a heavy is easy (I've done it so it must be easy), we need to take into account other factors. Namely, the rest of the bloody team. While we spend our time dancing around the fatty, skinny teammates come to assist the fatty and we die. It takes time to juke, trick, mislead, and that time we don't always have. If a heavy sticks with an assault/scout who has a teaspoon of common sense, then we are hard pressed indeed to stop the fat kitten. Hence, I really need a mic.
Captain-Awesome Internal Error. Negative-Feedback 349	Posted - 2013.01.15 13:02:00 - [17] - Quote we are supposed to get matchmaking proto cost > militia cost easily flanked easily naded easily ganged on easily out paced use the above.
Stinker Butt Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 103	Posted - 2013.01.15 14:06:00 - [18] - Quote I admit, I'm doing ok as a heavy right now, and I can understand why they are popular. I tear through militia gear like it's made of warm butter. My K/D ratio is probably still over 3, but I barely ended the last build at 2.00. I'm certain we will see a shift of power as there are more prototype assaults - especially with scope modules added. And the prototype assault suit is easily the best suit in the game (just my opinion). I'm not downplaying assaults in game now either. I still get easily owned in a number of situations. But I also have my moments. :)
Michael Cratar Red and Silver Hand Amarr Empire 179	Posted - 2013.01.15 14:25:00 - [19] - Quote SCAT mania wrote: IMO there too easy now. I took on 2 heavies with a smg in an logi 1 suit before reset. No problem didn't even get my sheilds down. If you really having a problem with them then add flux grenades, get in close and strafe to the side. OH MY GAWHD WHY!?!?!? Why would you tell EVERYBODY out weakness??? Meany! In all seriousness, yes. This is a great trick to use on heavies.
Tectonious Falcon The Southern Legion 395	Posted - 2013.01.15 14:27:00 - [20] - Quote Michael Cratar wrote: SCAT mania wrote: IMO there too easy now. I took on 2 heavies with a smg in an logi 1 suit before reset. No problem didn't even get my sheilds down. If you really having a problem with them then add flux grenades, get in close and strafe to the side. OH MY GAWHD WHY!?!?!? Why would you tell EVERYBODY out weakness??? Meany! In all seriousness, yes. This is a great trick to use on heavies. An even better trick is to just use normal grenades which damage armour as well.



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