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Volgair
Tritan-Industries
Legacy Rising
200
   |
Posted - 2012.12.28 05:26:00 -
[1] - Quote
Before I began this, i will list my intentions for individual reply within this thread. Please adhere to elaborating on minimum one or more of the below topic of conversation. (NOTE: this thread will not include the Soma or Sica in any meaningful way.) (NOTE 2: Please include the number to which you are applying your opinion)
1) Garner general consensus on current in game vehicles, preferably from current or previous Tank Pilots.
2) Balance between Shield and Armor in terms of SP requirements to introductory/base line fittings. The comparative difference between low end fittings and high end fittings respectfully.
3) General performance difference between armor and shield compared to incoming damage Sources.
4) Comparative damage output to EHP sacrifices between the platforms.
5) Weapon comparison cross platform. General Large Turret comparison.
6) Should CCP elaborate more on currently unavailable information for things such as passive and base resistance, EHP, Active HP returns, or weapon optimal and fall off.
7) The current remote reping interface.
8) General Light turret comparison.
9) Shields Vs Armor
10) Ammunition limits and Reloading
And now i began with my input.
1) Gunlogi- Base line shield platform handles the best in terms of agility of the current standard tanks. Has the best defensive capabilities in my opinion. has the least play room with its highs and lows for bonus damage with out crippling the tanks defensive capabilities.
Sagaris- Much the same as the Funlogi except it has more play room and a now nearly worthless 80% passive damage bonus to missiles. Manages to stay the top dog on the food chain due to shields seemingly having more stay power then armor.
Madrugar- Base line Armor platform, sluggish reaction times due to plates. Soft defenses even with modification. has the most play room for active offensive modules. easy to balance tank and damage.
Surya- The blaster tank, the potential for this boat with currently available weapons is fantastic... on paper, 80% damage bonus to blasters 60% bonus to rails. easy to fit for a good balance of damage and defense. still feels much softer then the Sagaris, is much certainly much less agile even with mods to compensate for torque.
2) Yes, Engineering is the larger subcategory. However, the way i spec'ed my toon's i had to go further out of my way to accommodate the necessities of an armor tank, as i purchased most of the available shield skills for maximizing survival probability on my drop suit. to go past mechanic L5 and Armor Repair L4 seemed laborious with little reward.
On the low end (below 8k Shields 8.5k Armor) Shield seems harder, has a passive regen, does not have a movement penalty but does not allow for as much play room in the fittings.
The High end is much the same differing only in the respect that the Surya fits seem to average about 200k isk cheaper, on a platform that costs 3mil who's fingering pennies.
3) Shield/ Armor damage taken on Gunlogi (8.1khp shield 22% resistance passive) to Madrugar (9.2khp armor 30% resistance passive)
-Swarm: (assuming all missiles hit) ~1200-1300/ ~1500-1700
-Forge: ~1000-1900/ ~1500-2200
-AV Grenade: ~700-1100/ ~1200-1500
-Orbital: ~3-7k/ 6k-OHK
-Blaster: ~800-1000DPS/ ~1000-1500DPS
-Rail: ~1200-1500DPV/ ~1300-1600DPV
-Missile: 400-700DPV/ 500-800DPV
4) As a general rule, armor is far softer and more sluggish then shield, but you can easily get a 9k+ buffer without sacrificing your damage modules. This is because of the near uselessness, of the high slots on the Madruger and Surya. With shield those high slots become vital, you usually need to use lows to increase PG to to add a slightly larger buffer. Making shield a bit trickier IMO to fit for damage without needlessly risking your investment. this becomes less an issue with the Segaris due to its 3rd low.
5) Gunlogi- 40% bonus damage at all L5
Segaris- 40% bonus damage to hybrid, 80% bonus to missile damage with Caldari HAV L5, and Maruder L5.
Madrugar- 40% bonus damage at all L5
Surya- 40%bonus to missile. 60% bonus to Hybrid (Rails) with Maruder L5. 80% bonus to Blasters specifically with Galente HAV L5.
Missile- return this weapon to the way it was, it was fine. The spamming issues with it can be solved by adding a manual/auto reload function after a set number of volleys with a limited capacity for ammo.
Blaster- +8 damage to standard, +11 damage to proto extend optimal 70 meters. reload function needed.
Rail- Function's well, reload function needed.
6) Yes...yes.
7) Remote repping. This is a travesty, and needs to be changed. not just the interface, which is awful. But the vehicles that are supposed to use them as a primary role. The Logistics LAV's are far too soft to follow a HAV. Barring any incidental contact with the back of the friendly HAV it will regardless have a very short life span. HAV to HAV fails to work because of the range of the repper will cause the tanks to sacrifice mobility to such and extent that it becomes a liability. DS to HAV... this is the worst oversight thus far. the DS is too soft to stay afloat over a HAV in combat when it is needed the most. and this is where the horrible interface interferes to the point where it almost cannot be used by even skilled pilots without nose diving into a friendly vehicle.
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Volgair
Tritan-Industries
Legacy Rising
200
|
Posted - 2012.12.28 05:27:00 -
[2] - Quote
8) All current small turrets in game are broken, here is how i see them being fixed.
-Missile: Same as Large Missiles.return this weapon to the way it was, it was fine. The spamming issues with it can be solved by adding a manual/auto reload function after a set number of volleys with a limited capacity for ammo.
-Blaster: increase damage by 20 keep optimal and increase 2 fold falloff
-Rail: direct damage is fine, needs a bigger splash, to avoid spamming it needs what i recommended for missiles.
9)Shields soak blows better and have a passive regen. this combined with the fact shield HAV's are generally are more agile makes for a convincing argument that shields are broken and armor needs a buff to compensate. in terms of available platforms to current weapons this is the only leg the Surya has to stand on. which in its own right is something that needs to be addressed.
10)Vehicles receive a lot of flak, im pulling a number out of my ass here but from what ive seen about 70% of that comes from senseless, tactless and skilless spamming. This could be resolved easily by adding the need to replenish available ammunition stores. it would work much like the current dropsuit round counter in that it could be replenished manually or automatically and add to current from the available maximum potential. Just a dropsuit needs replenishment. So would a tank. |
slap26
Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz
RISE of LEGION
462
|
Posted - 2012.12.28 07:29:00 -
[3] - Quote
Surya gets a bonus to rails? |
Volgair
Tritan-Industries
Legacy Rising
200
|
Posted - 2012.12.28 09:53:00 -
[4] - Quote
via the Marauder skill, should apply to both hybrid weapons. Galente HAV 1-5 effect blasters exclusively. |
Wako 75
SVER True Blood
Unclaimed.
76
|
Posted - 2012.12.28 10:33:00 -
[5] - Quote
3) forge does work on shields but armor it is harder to kill with the opposite for swarms though. it is really determined how you will use your tank if you want to be up close and personal i suggest armor but if you want to sit back and be cautious shield. then again i havent driven tanks but i have killed alot proto forge lol. and i find when there is a surya right next to me it is very hard to kill without help but a sagaris bring it on. now i dont use swarms but most use scout suit and move quickly around map so i would use a sagaris around them. but also never underestimate your opponent doesnt matter if they an assault scout logi or heavy. they may have av grenades which take out anything in a heartbeat if you arent smart about it. tell me if im wrong on any of this and if im on other team call in your best tanks i love a good fight. |
Mavado V Noriega
SyNergy Gaming
2282
|
Posted - 2012.12.28 12:45:00 -
[6] - Quote
slap26 wrote:Surya gets a bonus to rails?
no tank gets a bonus to rails idk wtf the OP is smoking
clearly didnt read the surya's description that said gets 4% bonus to BLASTERS via the marauder skill
Surya bonus to Blasters
Sagaris bonus to Missiles
Also NOTHING in the Gallente HAV skill says it gives any bonus either
where is this kid even gettin these numbers from? does he even tank?
Blaster and rails dont need a reload function they both can overheat which stops the spam
and reload function for missiles was suggested months ago |
EnglishSnake
Zumari Force Projection
Caldari State
1012
|
Posted - 2012.12.28 12:56:00 -
[7] - Quote
I know i have never seen his name in tank at all in this build, maybe hes in a BO HAV with a cloak lol |
NAV HIV
The Generals
151
|
Posted - 2012.12.28 13:16:00 -
[8] - Quote
EnglishSnake wrote:I know i have never seen his name in tank at all in this build, maybe hes in a BO HAV with a cloak lol
Should explain the random RG shots on the maps sometimes LOL |
Tectonious Falcon
The Southern Legion
395
|
Posted - 2012.12.28 13:18:00 -
[9] - Quote
Wako 75 wrote:3) forge does work on shields but armor it is harder to kill with the opposite for swarms though. it is really determined how you will use your tank if you want to be up close and personal i suggest armor but if you want to sit back and be cautious shield. then again i havent driven tanks but i have killed alot proto forge lol. and i find when there is a surya right next to me it is very hard to kill without help but a sagaris bring it on. now i dont use swarms but most use scout suit and move quickly around map so i would use a sagaris around them. but also never underestimate your opponent doesnt matter if they an assault scout logi or heavy. they may have av grenades which take out anything in a heartbeat if you arent smart about it. tell me if im wrong on any of this and if im on other team call in your best tanks i love a good fight.
Forge guns work equally on shields and armour, I think. |
NAV HIV
The Generals
151
|
Posted - 2012.12.28 13:22:00 -
[10] - Quote
Mavado V Noriega wrote:slap26 wrote:Surya gets a bonus to rails? no tank gets a bonus to rails idk wtf the OP is smoking clearly didnt read the surya's description that said gets 4% bonus to BLASTERS via the marauder skill Surya bonus to Blasters Sagaris bonus to Missiles Also NOTHING in the Gallente HAV skill says it gives any bonus either where is this kid even gettin these numbers from? does he even tank? Blaster and rails dont need a reload function they both can overheat which stops the spam and reload function for missiles was suggested months ago
Surya is a beast. But i miss my Type A plates. TBH it was unnecessary to remove those and the F series Extenders. I dont know what they were thinking when they removed the decent plates, made the Surya/Mad slower and let loose the MT Forge guns. I still dont use Proto Turrets. IMO its not worth the cost ISK/PG/CPU considered. |
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Mavado V Noriega
SyNergy Gaming
2282
|
Posted - 2012.12.28 13:39:00 -
[11] - Quote
NAV HIV wrote:Mavado V Noriega wrote:slap26 wrote:Surya gets a bonus to rails? no tank gets a bonus to rails idk wtf the OP is smoking clearly didnt read the surya's description that said gets 4% bonus to BLASTERS via the marauder skill Surya bonus to Blasters Sagaris bonus to Missiles Also NOTHING in the Gallente HAV skill says it gives any bonus either where is this kid even gettin these numbers from? does he even tank? Blaster and rails dont need a reload function they both can overheat which stops the spam and reload function for missiles was suggested months ago Surya is a beast. But i miss my Type A plates. TBH it was unnecessary to remove those and the F series Extenders. I dont know what they were thinking when they removed the decent plates, made the Surya/Mad slower and let loose the MT Forge guns. I still dont use Proto Turrets. IMO its not worth the cost ISK/PG/CPU considered.
My Madrugar and Surya are AWESOME
yea takin away Type-A plates and w/e Shield extender was harsh but i think they did it to force ppl to give up some tank if they wanna fit more gank
Proto Turrets are awesome imo
but i dont use them in pubs only if i got a 1v2 tank fight to deal with might bring out the surya but other than that my surya is strictly corp battles, my Maddy is more than enough to deal with pub tankers
PS: played some pubs yesterday and seems swarms arent as bad as they were last build. Still too easy to use tbh but the bending around corners dont happen much anymore at all.....or maybe i was just lucky that match :P |
NAV HIV
The Generals
151
|
Posted - 2012.12.28 13:47:00 -
[12] - Quote
Mavado V Noriega wrote:NAV HIV wrote:Mavado V Noriega wrote:slap26 wrote:Surya gets a bonus to rails? no tank gets a bonus to rails idk wtf the OP is smoking clearly didnt read the surya's description that said gets 4% bonus to BLASTERS via the marauder skill Surya bonus to Blasters Sagaris bonus to Missiles Also NOTHING in the Gallente HAV skill says it gives any bonus either where is this kid even gettin these numbers from? does he even tank? Blaster and rails dont need a reload function they both can overheat which stops the spam and reload function for missiles was suggested months ago Surya is a beast. But i miss my Type A plates. TBH it was unnecessary to remove those and the F series Extenders. I dont know what they were thinking when they removed the decent plates, made the Surya/Mad slower and let loose the MT Forge guns. I still dont use Proto Turrets. IMO its not worth the cost ISK/PG/CPU considered. My Madrugar and Surya are AWESOME yea takin away Type-A plates and w/e Shield extender was harsh but i think they did it to force ppl to give up some tank if they wanna fit more gank Proto Turrets are awesome imo but i dont use them in pubs only if i got a 1v2 tank fight to deal with might bring out the surya but other than that my surya is strictly corp battles, my Maddy is more than enough to deal with pub tankers PS: played some pubs yesterday and seems swarms arent as bad as they were last build. Still too easy to use tbh but the bending around corners dont happen much anymore at all.....or maybe i was just lucky that match :P
But Type A plates had less armor. it was 2900+ and the ones they have now are 3100+
I like the Turret options in this build. But i'm still getting some good kills with my old cheapy Maddy fitting with a LVL 4 blaster. I lost two maddy's in this build. One two a well fitted Sagaris RG (It was no match) and the other to a million MT Forge gunner + MT Swarmers near a suppply depot.
I dont like the fact that they changed the DCU from passive to active. I cant focus on so many active modules, drive, shoot, evade and get lucky at the same time lol |
Sytonis Auran
Valor Coalition
RISE of LEGION
52
|
Posted - 2012.12.29 00:47:00 -
[13] - Quote
NAV HIV wrote:Mavado V Noriega wrote:NAV HIV wrote:Mavado V Noriega wrote:slap26 wrote:Surya gets a bonus to rails? no tank gets a bonus to rails idk wtf the OP is smoking clearly didnt read the surya's description that said gets 4% bonus to BLASTERS via the marauder skill Surya bonus to Blasters Sagaris bonus to Missiles Also NOTHING in the Gallente HAV skill says it gives any bonus either where is this kid even gettin these numbers from? does he even tank? Blaster and rails dont need a reload function they both can overheat which stops the spam and reload function for missiles was suggested months ago Surya is a beast. But i miss my Type A plates. TBH it was unnecessary to remove those and the F series Extenders. I dont know what they were thinking when they removed the decent plates, made the Surya/Mad slower and let loose the MT Forge guns. I still dont use Proto Turrets. IMO its not worth the cost ISK/PG/CPU considered. My Madrugar and Surya are AWESOME yea takin away Type-A plates and w/e Shield extender was harsh but i think they did it to force ppl to give up some tank if they wanna fit more gank Proto Turrets are awesome imo but i dont use them in pubs only if i got a 1v2 tank fight to deal with might bring out the surya but other than that my surya is strictly corp battles, my Maddy is more than enough to deal with pub tankers PS: played some pubs yesterday and seems swarms arent as bad as they were last build. Still too easy to use tbh but the bending around corners dont happen much anymore at all.....or maybe i was just lucky that match :P But Type A plates had less armor. it was 2900+ and the ones they have now are 3100+ I like the Turret options in this build. But i'm still getting some good kills with my old cheapy Maddy fitting with a LVL 4 blaster. I lost two maddy's in this build. One two a well fitted Sagaris RG (It was no match) and the other to a million MT Forge gunner + MT Swarmers near a suppply depot. I dont like the fact that they changed the DCU from passive to active. I cant focus on so many active modules, drive, shoot, evade and get lucky at the same time lol
The 3100 ones, polycrystaline were about in Codex too. Not new to Chromosome.
I'm finding my madrugar has just as much survivability now (driving error excluded), even changing from max buffer to dual rep, dual hardner fit. The speed, acceleration and cornering difference between madrugar and gunloggi is so noticeable.
While forges due reduced damage to armour HAVs, they still feel just as effective due to how long it takes to get cover. |
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