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Shijima Kuraimaru
WarRavens
168
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Posted - 2012.12.03 05:00:00 -
[1] - Quote
I wish a tank would sit still for just 30 seconds and not fire at me. Then I might be able to take one out with my FG.
Comparing cost is a waste of breath. When it comes to comparisons in Dust, you have to weigh the ability to apply damage and the ability to survive.
Compared to a FG, a fully smart fitted rail tank with full crew can lay down more damage at longer range with more accuracy than any single FGer can. Rocket tanks have it harder now, and blaster tanks will eat a FGer. This is in the supposition that, like your cost based argument, it's a one(FG) on three(fully crewed tank).
Survivability... Well fitted FGer has around 1k EHP. Well fitted tank has what... Over 10k EHP? That should be easy to figure out.
Speed... There is no way a FGer can outrun a tank unless he's driving an LAV. But if the FGer is driving, then the FGer isn't shooting.
Rail guns charge and fire faster and can be aimed with pinpoint accuracy, and have longer range, and OHK any infantry with a direct hit. FG guns don't have scope mode and, max skilled, with standard FG like the 9K330, have to wait 2.5 secs between shots, and it's extremely hard to hit infantry.
Blasters, if in range, will eat a heavy really quickly. Not in range? Tanks are much quicker than the FGer and could definitely close the range before a lone FGer could take it out.
Rockets aren't as over powered as they were, but they got nerfed too hard with too much range reduction and too much scatter. Still, I bet that tank could take down a lone FGer.
No matter how you lay it out. A fully crewed tank, fitted and driven smartly, will always eat a comparably skilled and fitted FGer in a one on one situation. So your argument is flawed. Under optimal one on one conditions, tanks eat FGs. |
Shijima Kuraimaru
WarRavens
168
|
Posted - 2012.12.03 05:18:00 -
[2] - Quote
DarkShadowFox wrote:Shijima Kuraimaru wrote:I wish a tank would sit still for just 30 seconds and not fire at me. Then I might be able to take one out with my FG.
Comparing cost is a waste of breath. When it comes to comparisons in Dust, you have to weigh the ability to apply damage and the ability to survive.
Compared to a FG, a fully smart fitted rail tank with full crew can lay down more damage at longer range with more accuracy than any single FGer can. Rocket tanks have it harder now, and blaster tanks will eat a FGer. This is in the supposition that, like your cost based argument, it's a one(FG) on three(fully crewed tank).
Survivability... Well fitted FGer has around 1k EHP. Well fitted tank has what... Over 10k EHP? That should be easy to figure out.
Speed... There is no way a FGer can outrun a tank unless he's driving an LAV. But if the FGer is driving, then the FGer isn't shooting.
Rail guns charge and fire faster and can be aimed with pinpoint accuracy, and have longer range, and OHK any infantry with a direct hit. FG guns don't have scope mode and, max skilled, with standard FG like the 9K330, have to wait 2.5 secs between shots, and it's extremely hard to hit infantry.
Blasters, if in range, will eat a heavy really quickly. Not in range? Tanks are much quicker than the FGer and could definitely close the range before a lone FGer could take it out.
Rockets aren't as over powered as they were, but they got nerfed too hard with too much range reduction and too much scatter. Still, I bet that tank could take down a lone FGer.
No matter how you lay it out. A fully crewed tank, fitted and driven smartly, will always eat a comparably skilled and fitted FGer in a one on one situation. So your argument is flawed. Under optimal one on one conditions, tanks eat FGs. not when swarms that can avert cover and dont go to your last positon and two of those coupled with a forge gun, yup say bye bye..
Ah but you missed that my argument is, like the cost based argument, on a one on one basis. So SWARMs don't figure into the numbers. |
Shijima Kuraimaru
WarRavens
168
|
Posted - 2012.12.04 19:27:00 -
[3] - Quote
Garrett Blacknova wrote:Lavirac JR wrote:Sorry 3 Forge Gunners should be able to take out a tank quickly if it does not retreat, that is what they do. Your problem is you want to solo this game in a tank, that should not happen. Get infantry support and those Swarmers die and so do the forge gunners.
BTW some comparisons you forgot with regard to rail guns and forge guns.
1- Rail Guns have infinite ammo (Forge Guns do not). 2- The Best Heavy suits have over 1K HP total, Tanks start at 3K HP for militia I believe... 3- Rail Guns can zoom in, forge guns can not. 4- Hybrid Turret users can use Blasters free of charge no extra training, Heavy users have to train up HMG to get access to anti-infantry weapons.
And as a guy with a shield tank alt, I laugh in my Gunnlogi at swarm missiles with my 7.5K shields (that's without shield adaptation trained yet). In fact Forge gunners only get me when I'm aggressive, stupid, and unsupported by a team. Just adding to point 3, Forge Guns have a small amount of scatter applied to their shots - they don't fire precisely straight. Railguns do. They're MUCH better able to land direct hits than a Forge Gun can.
Not to mention, or what everyone seems to forget or gloss over, is that Forge Guns are actually man portable heavy railguns. Read the description if you doubt me. |
Shijima Kuraimaru
WarRavens
168
|
Posted - 2012.12.06 09:42:00 -
[4] - Quote
E-Dino wrote:Sylwester Dziewiecki wrote:DarkShadowFox wrote:
Eh I still think dropping the range to where they have to get in close to use AV, you have to use AV grenades to get in close right? Why not have forge guns have a 50 meter range... or something really really short like AV grenades.
That is poor example and you know it That's some severe gimpage for forge gunners :(
Yeah. I don't see a kinetic slug three to four time the size of a .50 caliber round, traveling at 7000+ meters per second, only making it 50 meters. Applying realistic physics, It should have an effective range way beyond what the game already limits it too. |
Shijima Kuraimaru
WarRavens
168
|
Posted - 2012.12.07 05:57:00 -
[5] - Quote
Garrett Blacknova wrote:Khal V'Rani wrote:Shijima Kuraimaru wrote: Yeah. I don't see a kinetic slug three to four time the size of a .50 caliber round, traveling at 7000+ meters per second, only making it 50 meters. Applying realistic physics, It should have an effective range way beyond what the game already limits it too.
I've tried that argument with map size and sniper rifles. Apparently no one cares if they believe there's some sort of injustice done to them and there personal sense of order and play style or strategy. Sniper rifles, per description, state 2500m/s. That means almost zero travel time at 200 meters, 400 meters, 1000 meters. People apparently can't read descriptions and reason things out. A basic militia sniper rifle says 2500m/s, The only argument I can think of is... is that number shown in the descriptions operational distance, planning distance, optimal distance, max distance? And it still really doesn't matter at this point as the map size is small enough to make travel time irrelevant at those speeds. Sorry, had to get it out of my system. And another example is Railgun turrets on tanks. By DUST standards, those should have practically infinite range and no travel time on their projectiles as well.
And something else that needs to be kept in mind is that we're limited to a tiny area of the full maps to force us into tight conflict. Things are going to drastically change when we're using the full map. I believe those "infinite" range complaints will suddenly become complaints about not having enough range. |
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