DUST Search - Report from a night of testing the Creodron breach AR.

KingBabar wrote:

The short answer is: its useless.

This was off course something I suspected, so for the record I did get 35 of these babies as salvage, I haven't bought them.

I dunno why it got nerfed in the first place, was there something OP about it? I don't think so. Could it simply be that all the AR users with actual gun game used them? A more precise, harder hitting gun with less bullets seems like a perfect choice for everyone that now how to aim. I used it a lot two builds ago, l loved it, hell I was even very comfortable with the GB-9 wich was my most used gun.

I'm sure that someone with the patience for it could calculate the difference in DPS, I'm pretty sure it would lose to most of the other ARs, certainly all the other Proto ARs.

So how is it to play with? Well, bad. In long range situations its seriously out matched by the tactical ARs, by an enourmous margin. Used at medium distance its ok, but I'd much rather use a Gek or not least a Duvolle. In cqc its almost useless. Yes its supposed to have a tighter hipfire spread and yes I could see that more of my bullets actually hit the target during the classical circle strafing manouvers. But I got owned over and over again by the anyone with a GEK, even though almost all of my shots landed, I just couldn't kill them fast enough to survive the bullets hitting me.

For the record: I used a type-B assault suit with 357 shields and I have accumulated + 21% ekstra damage on the gun. So I'm not exactly using a newb loadout. I bet many of the guys owning me front to front with a GEK doesn't have as good a setup as I do.

The point everyone forgets.
I'm not 100% sure on this one but this is how I remember it: Much QQ on the forums probably combined with the CCPs own data of the KDR or whatnot of the players using them. They nerfed the gun almost unto total uselessness. As mentioned earlier, I think it was more of a magnet for good players. Then they introduced the "I slow down my movement when getting hit by enemy fire thingy". As we all now, getting behind cover quick enough is harder now, and I'm ok with that. This slow down effect is much less in effct when wielding a breach AR due to its low ROF. This is a major dissadvantage that wasn't a factor when it got nerfed, if I remember correctly that is.

All I'm asking for is a buff to ROF, is that too much to ask?

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KingBabar Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 442	Posted - 2012.11.07 08:13:00 - [1] - Quote The short answer is: its useless. This was off course something I suspected, so for the record I did get 35 of these babies as salvage, I haven't bought them. I dunno why it got nerfed in the first place, was there something OP about it? I don't think so. Could it simply be that all the AR users with actual gun game used them? A more precise, harder hitting gun with less bullets seems like a perfect choice for everyone that now how to aim. I used it a lot two builds ago, l loved it, hell I was even very comfortable with the GB-9 wich was my most used gun. I'm sure that someone with the patience for it could calculate the difference in DPS, I'm pretty sure it would lose to most of the other ARs, certainly all the other Proto ARs. So how is it to play with? Well, bad. In long range situations its seriously out matched by the tactical ARs, by an enourmous margin. Used at medium distance its ok, but I'd much rather use a Gek or not least a Duvolle. In cqc its almost useless. Yes its supposed to have a tighter hipfire spread and yes I could see that more of my bullets actually hit the target during the classical circle strafing manouvers. But I got owned over and over again by the anyone with a GEK, even though almost all of my shots landed, I just couldn't kill them fast enough to survive the bullets hitting me. For the record: I used a type-B assault suit with 357 shields and I have accumulated + 21% ekstra damage on the gun. So I'm not exactly using a newb loadout. I bet many of the guys owning me front to front with a GEK doesn't have as good a setup as I do. The point everyone forgets. I'm not 100% sure on this one but this is how I remember it: Much QQ on the forums probably combined with the CCPs own data of the KDR or whatnot of the players using them. They nerfed the gun almost unto total uselessness. As mentioned earlier, I think it was more of a magnet for good players. Then they introduced the "I slow down my movement when getting hit by enemy fire thingy". As we all now, getting behind cover quick enough is harder now, and I'm ok with that. This slow down effect is much less in effct when wielding a breach AR due to its low ROF. This is a major dissadvantage that wasn't a factor when it got nerfed, if I remember correctly that is. All I'm asking for is a buff to ROF, is that too much to ask?
Gauder Berwyck Deadly Blue Dots RISE of LEGION 217	Posted - 2012.11.07 08:34:00 - [2] - Quote Let's compare the stats; Rate of Fire: ca 400 for the Creodron, 750 for the normal AR. Damage: 48 for the Creodron, 36 for the Duvolle. DPS Creodron: ca. 330 DPS Duvolle: ca. 450 No wonder it's useless.................
Laurent Cazaderon Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 1155	Posted - 2012.11.07 08:53:00 - [3] - Quote KingBabar wrote: The short answer is: its useless. This was off course something I suspected, so for the record I did get 35 of these babies as salvage, I haven't bought them. I dunno why it got nerfed in the first place, was there something OP about it? I don't think so. Could it simply be that all the AR users with actual gun game used them? A more precise, harder hitting gun with less bullets seems like a perfect choice for everyone that now how to aim. I used it a lot two builds ago, l loved it, hell I was even very comfortable with the GB-9 wich was my most used gun. I'm sure that someone with the patience for it could calculate the difference in DPS, I'm pretty sure it would lose to most of the other ARs, certainly all the other Proto ARs. So how is it to play with? Well, bad. In long range situations its seriously out matched by the tactical ARs, by an enourmous margin. Used at medium distance its ok, but I'd much rather use a Gek or not least a Duvolle. In cqc its almost useless. Yes its supposed to have a tighter hipfire spread and yes I could see that more of my bullets actually hit the target during the classical circle strafing manouvers. But I got owned over and over again by the anyone with a GEK, even though almost all of my shots landed, I just couldn't kill them fast enough to survive the bullets hitting me. For the record: I used a type-B assault suit with 357 shields and I have accumulated + 21% ekstra damage on the gun. So I'm not exactly using a newb loadout. I bet many of the guys owning me front to front with a GEK doesn't have as good a setup as I do. The point everyone forgets. I'm not 100% sure on this one but this is how I remember it: Much QQ on the forums probably combined with the CCPs own data of the KDR or whatnot of the players using them. They nerfed the gun almost unto total uselessness. As mentioned earlier, I think it was more of a magnet for good players. Then they introduced the "I slow down my movement when getting hit by enemy fire thingy". As we all now, getting behind cover quick enough is harder now, and I'm ok with that. This slow down effect is much less in effct when wielding a breach AR due to its low ROF. This is a major dissadvantage that wasn't a factor when it got nerfed, if I remember correctly that is. All I'm asking for is a buff to ROF, is that too much to ask? Yeah breaches took a heavy nerf before when precursor got out. But, nerf wasnt fully unjustified. You mention that Breach AR should be a weapon of choice for anyone who can aim. But i can guarantee you it was used by many dudes that didnt, and it was doing heavy damage. I can remember heavies running around with it as HMG was of no use back then. Also, a gun that hits harder requires less precision on the hitbox to deal good damage, thus not making it imo a "PGM" weapon. Last but not least, breaches were way too good at long range, and didnt have the recoil a more powerfull gun should have compared to a regular AR. So nerf may have been needed but it sadly wasnt done right.
Jack Boost Zarena Family 194	Posted - 2012.11.07 09:03:00 - [4] - Quote All breach now: ROF is fine. DMG is ok. (DMGROF->DPS is still good) but... Range is bad (and this is bad not ROF). Why was prefered? Because I spended less bullets* to get kill. That was 'my' factor to choose breaches in last builds and this maked breaches unique. I can go witch low ROF. I can manage put dmg at target. I see target, engage, end... So it was ok. Now range (dmg fall off and spreed of bullets) is so bad that in mid range it is pointles to fight. Long distance - forget CQC - when I see target from mid to cqc, it dont take enough dmg and it going close to me, simply I dont have enough time to deploy rest dmg because of bullet spreed. So more pew pew... less bullets after ... less fun... If you want better ROF breaches loose its uniqueness. It will use more ammo + less precise then rest AR + short range = bad choice. Put breaches now on shelfs...
Gauder Berwyck Deadly Blue Dots RISE of LEGION 217	Posted - 2012.11.07 09:03:00 - [5] - Quote Laurent, part of the problem was that it was also popular in the build which had ****** hit detection, bad framerate and lag. It was said then that if they fixed those things, the CreoDron won't be as OP as it was back then, because it was the best option to counter lag, framerate and hit detection... I agree with the range nerf, it says the breach ARs are supposed to be CQC weapons. I don't agree with the damage nerf. Right now, the easy option would be to either increase damage or RoF for the Breach guns. In fact, in my mind, the decreased range of the breach rifles over EVERY other AR suggest to me it should have a higher DPS than the other ARs as a counter to their increased range. Not a lot, mind you, but something to give it an edge in CQC.
KingBabar Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 442	Posted - 2012.11.07 10:18:00 - [6] - Quote Jack Boost wrote: All breach now: ROF is fine. DMG is ok. (DMGROF->DPS is still good) but... Range is bad (and this is bad not ROF). Why was prefered? Because I spended less bullets* to get kill. That was 'my' factor to choose breaches in last builds and this maked breaches unique. I can go witch low ROF. I can manage put dmg at target. I see target, engage, end... So it was ok. Now range (dmg fall off and spreed of bullets) is so bad that in mid range it is pointles to fight. Long distance - forget CQC - when I see target from mid to cqc, it dont take enough dmg and it going close to me, simply I dont have enough time to deploy rest dmg because of bullet spreed. So more pew pew... less bullets after ... less fun... If you want better ROF breaches loose its uniqueness. It will use more ammo + less precise then rest AR + short range = bad choice. Put breaches now on shelfs... First off, as a fatsuit you might wanna consider using the tactical ARs, they conserve ammo like no other gun especially useful if you run around in a heavy suit without the possibility to equip a nanohive. I don't want the Breach to be a long range gun, thats what the tacticals are for. If its true that it has 330 DPS and the Duvolle has 600, then there are a serious difference in DPS that shouldn't be this big when the gun are on the same tier and none of them have any other sort of special advantage... Remember our little engagement yesterday? I barely scraped your armor... Edit: A little bird of mine did the calculations and its actually 450 for the Duvolle and about 330 for the breach. Shouldn't the breach do more or at least the same amount of damage?
Rasatsu Much Crying Old Experts 437	Posted - 2012.11.07 10:43:00 - [7] - Quote Isn't the issue that the normal AR is over-powered now due to the lack of any kind of recoil? The Breach is supposed to be good for good aiming during sustained fire while the normal AR is more uncontrollable, hence the lower DPS.


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