DUST Search - [Feedback] Nanite Injectors

ugg reset wrote:

Bendtner92 wrote:

I really like the mechanic, because it somewhat prevents all the chain rezzing from MAG especially. However, there are some other major flaws with the current setup.

1. The warpoints recieved for revives need to be dependant on which injector you're using. Milita/Standard should give 40 points, Advanced 60 and Prototype 80. This shouldn't be too hard to implement, so I fully expect it to be done by next build.

2. Right now you have to find an exact spot to revive someone. That is obivously not optimal. It needs to be changed to a small area around the body. And I said small, it shouldn't really be that big, but just big enough so it's easy to revive people. I also said it should be around the BODY, and not around the place of death!

3. The friendly collision thing is stupid. Whenever you revive someone you're guaranteed to collide and get stuck, which is just bullshit. Making it so you can revive someone within a small area around him, instead of an exact spot, would help a little on this problem I suppose, but I still think the friendly collision thing is beyond stupid.

That is all I could think of right now, and I really hope all of this happen.

I disagree with your first point for two reasons:

1. for example: take two guys with AR's. one guy has milita the other has a proto and they both get a kill. Each get the same amount of WP. The difference is that the guy with the proto gun has better gear and therefore has a better chance to stay combat effective and hopefully making his investment worth the extra isk.

2. I think a lot of people would look at this at face value and think to themselves "Well, did a beter job with just my proto injector than that milita guy with the res and repper". I think this idea is flawed when you realize that WP's are collective to the squad. Not only do you save your buddy a Drop suit load out, you also keep your group close. By doing that, you indirectly give your squad and other squads more WP. Buying a better Nanite injector only serves to make this more true.

One other downside to the injector is that they can't rep people who aren't daed.

you guys are running Logi right? you're not the force, you just multiply it. Cool

Thankyou

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Bendtner92 Imperfects Negative-Feedback 369	Posted - 2012.10.30 12:14:00 - [1] - Quote I really like the mechanic, because it somewhat prevents all the chain rezzing from MAG especially. However, there are some other major flaws with the current setup. 1. The warpoints recieved for revives need to be dependant on which injector you're using. Milita/Standard should give 40 points, Advanced 60 and Prototype 80. This shouldn't be too hard to implement, so I fully expect it to be done by next build. 2. Right now you have to find an exact spot to revive someone. That is obivously not optimal. It needs to be changed to a small area around the body. And I said small, it shouldn't really be that big, but just big enough so it's easy to revive people. I also said it should be around the BODY, and not around the place of death! 3. The friendly collision thing is stupid. Whenever you revive someone you're guaranteed to collide and get stuck, which is just bullshit. Making it so you can revive someone within a small area around him, instead of an exact spot, would help a little on this problem I suppose, but I still think the friendly collision thing is beyond stupid. That is all I could think of right now, and I really hope all of this happen.
I-Shayz-I ZionTCD Legacy Rising 172	Posted - 2012.10.30 18:12:00 - [2] - Quote I agree completely with WP. Revives are the biggest WP gain for me and it sucks that I don't get more for healing more health. Before the fix to the repair tools, I'd just use militia ones so that I could repair and get more points that way. It should be something like 50 WP for a revive + 10 WP for basic, 25 WP for advanced, and 40 WP for prototype. So 60, 75, and 90
ugg reset ZionTCD Legacy Rising 234	Posted - 2012.10.30 20:04:00 - [3] - Quote Bendtner92 wrote: I really like the mechanic, because it somewhat prevents all the chain rezzing from MAG especially. However, there are some other major flaws with the current setup. 1. The warpoints recieved for revives need to be dependant on which injector you're using. Milita/Standard should give 40 points, Advanced 60 and Prototype 80. This shouldn't be too hard to implement, so I fully expect it to be done by next build. 2. Right now you have to find an exact spot to revive someone. That is obivously not optimal. It needs to be changed to a small area around the body. And I said small, it shouldn't really be that big, but just big enough so it's easy to revive people. I also said it should be around the BODY, and not around the place of death! 3. The friendly collision thing is stupid. Whenever you revive someone you're guaranteed to collide and get stuck, which is just bullshit. Making it so you can revive someone within a small area around him, instead of an exact spot, would help a little on this problem I suppose, but I still think the friendly collision thing is beyond stupid. That is all I could think of right now, and I really hope all of this happen. I disagree with your first point for two reasons: 1. for example: take two guys with AR's. one guy has milita the other has a proto and they both get a kill. Each get the same amount of WP. The difference is that the guy with the proto gun has better gear and therefore has a better chance to stay combat effective and hopefully making his investment worth the extra isk. 2. I think a lot of people would look at this at face value and think to themselves "Well, did a beter job with just my proto injector than that milita guy with the res and repper". I think this idea is flawed when you realize that WP's are collective to the squad. Not only do you save your buddy a Drop suit load out, you also keep your group close. By doing that, you indirectly give your squad and other squads more WP. Buying a better Nanite injector only serves to make this more true. One other downside to the injector is that they can't rep people who aren't daed. you guys are running Logi right? you're not the force, you just multiply it. Thankyou
Bendtner92 Imperfects Negative-Feedback 369	Posted - 2012.10.31 07:50:00 - [4] - Quote I-Shayz-I wrote: I agree completely with WP. Revives are the biggest WP gain for me and it sucks that I don't get more for healing more health. Before the fix to the repair tools, I'd just use militia ones so that I could repair and get more points that way. It should be something like 50 WP for a revive + 10 WP for basic, 25 WP for advanced, and 40 WP for prototype. So 60, 75, and 90 Yeah that would work too. As long as there's a noticeable difference in the points given. ugg reset wrote: I disagree with your first point for two reasons: 1. for example: take two guys with AR's. one guy has milita the other has a proto and they both get a kill. Each get the same amount of WP. The difference is that the guy with the proto gun has better gear and therefore has a better chance to stay combat effective and hopefully making his investment worth the extra isk. No offense, but that's a horrible comparison. If they're equally skilled, the Prototype AR guy will kill the Milita AR guy. Prototype guy gets 50 points, while Militia guy gets 0. Reviving someone with a Prototype Injector should give more points than reviving someone with a Militia. Likewise I also believe that a Prototype Nanohive should give more points than a Militia, and a Prototype Repair Tool should give more points than a Militia etc.
Cross Atu Conspiratus Immortalis 775	Posted - 2012.10.31 11:19:00 - [5] - Quote ugg reset wrote: Bendtner92 wrote: I really like the mechanic, because it somewhat prevents all the chain rezzing from MAG especially. However, there are some other major flaws with the current setup. 1. The warpoints recieved for revives need to be dependant on which injector you're using. Milita/Standard should give 40 points, Advanced 60 and Prototype 80. This shouldn't be too hard to implement, so I fully expect it to be done by next build. 2. Right now you have to find an exact spot to revive someone. That is obivously not optimal. It needs to be changed to a small area around the body. And I said small, it shouldn't really be that big, but just big enough so it's easy to revive people. I also said it should be around the BODY, and not around the place of death! 3. The friendly collision thing is stupid. Whenever you revive someone you're guaranteed to collide and get stuck, which is just bullshit. Making it so you can revive someone within a small area around him, instead of an exact spot, would help a little on this problem I suppose, but I still think the friendly collision thing is beyond stupid. That is all I could think of right now, and I really hope all of this happen. I disagree with your first point for two reasons: 1. for example: take two guys with AR's. one guy has milita the other has a proto and they both get a kill. Each get the same amount of WP. The difference is that the guy with the proto gun has better gear and therefore has a better chance to stay combat effective and hopefully making his investment worth the extra isk. 2. I think a lot of people would look at this at face value and think to themselves "Well, did a beter job with just my proto injector than that milita guy with the res and repper". I think this idea is flawed when you realize that WP's are collective to the squad. Not only do you save your buddy a Drop suit load out, you also keep your group close. By doing that, you indirectly give your squad and other squads more WP. Buying a better Nanite injector only serves to make this more true. One other downside to the injector is that they can't rep people who aren't daed. you guys are running Logi right? you're not the force, you just multiply it. Thankyou The comparison isn't quite accurate because it doesn't account for the loss of other potential war points. The Repair Tool gives War Points as well (the current lack is a farming hotfix only not a game mechanic) and as such having one WP value for all injectors actually punishes the use of higher Meta gear over lower. With the lower gear there is more remaining damage on the revived Merc, damage that may then award WP as it is repaired via tool. Thus operating on one flat rate for all Injectors is a net loss for the Logi and does not reward the use of more skill and ISK intensive upper Meta gear. An AR by contrast will kill faster with the use of upper level gear, and becomes more more efficient in a number of ways with the investment of SP. While the award rate on AR use may be flat the system still on balance provides better rewards for the use of better gear and the investment of SP. The investment of SP and ISK into a specialization and the use of upper Meta gear should be rewarded, for the AR it is for the Injector it is not. The proper way to implement Nano Injector WP is quite simple, take the base rate for a revive (as defined by CCP, currently 60 WP but whatever s balanced) and then add to that the number of WP that would be gained by repairing the difference between the base Injector and the more effective one used. You are after all repairing that damage, why should one way of repairing the same amount of armor award more than another? This would then bring the Injector in line with the AR where a given result (a single kill in the case of the AR or a revived Merc with armor repaired to X%) awards the same WP, the upper Meta gear and improvements from SP invested simply allow a Merc to attain that result better & faster. For a more detailed examination on how the current Logi system is broken and needs improvement (even before the farmers caused the hotfix to temp remove Repper WPs) see this thread. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=39238 Cheers, Cross
Mister Hunt Sanmatar Kelkoons Minmatar Republic 230	Posted - 2012.10.31 15:34:00 - [6] - Quote "Fully expect this to be done by next build". Wow, bit full of yourself much?
Obama DAT Doomheim 389	Posted - 2012.10.31 15:58:00 - [7] - Quote The collision that occurs after rezzing someone is very annoying. I tend to bunny hop as soon as I rez to avoid getting all tangled up in case there is incoming bullets.
ugg reset ZionTCD Legacy Rising 234	Posted - 2012.10.31 16:25:00 - [8] - Quote OK. you don't rep people to get WP, this should be an after thought. You rep people so they can stay in the fight and get more WP for your squad and your teams squads. No one is being punished for using better res tools. As is, you can get up to 72 points per pick up! that's 3/4 what you get for capping a Null cannon! Also you don't "rep" people with an injector, repping takes time and that takes your gun out of the fight. That the beauty if the injector, it's fire and forget. Edit: just took a look at https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=39238. If you feel that then entire point of Logistics is to GRIND WARPOINTS then keep pushing for change. At the moment you get wp for performing an action regardless of what you paid in the market for it. I wouldn't have it any other way
Chosokabe Ite Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 72	Posted - 2012.10.31 17:29:00 - [9] - Quote I tried bringing one of your beefs to CCP's attention before, I hope you have better luck at this than I did. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=31456&find=unread
ugg reset ZionTCD Legacy Rising 234	Posted - 2012.10.31 17:57:00 - [10] - Quote Chosokabe Ite wrote: I tried bringing one of your beefs to CCP's attention before, I hope you have better luck at this than I did. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=31456&find=unread "the plannet accepts my offering and rewarded me with a res" I lol'ed. well said sir.



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