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Veigar Mordekaiser
Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire
676
|
Posted - 2012.10.02 08:50:00 -
[1] - Quote
I'm confused. Plain and simple. How in the hell does character movement relate to "dumbing down"? I've seen multiple posts (threads and replies) about how the strafe speed and HP are "dumbed down". Do you mean to tell me, that if I start huffing paint and giving myself brain damage, that my HP will be increased?
I think what you should be complaining about, is that CCP is trying to make everything in the game balanced, it has nothing to do with the intelligence level of the game. CCP is trying to make every piece of the game, balanced in respect to every other piece of the game. They are turning their game into an arena type shooter, made to rely solely on foot soldiers that don't use cover, when cover and vehicles would make the game significantly better.
The reality is that a scout should be able to run circles around a heavy, a heavy should be able to withstand obscene amounts of damage, logi guys should be able to carry tons of equipment, and an assault merc should be very well rounded. LAV's should be agile and weak, tanks should be slow and strong as F... Dropships should be able to fly high, get on top buildings, or camp on the MCC if they desire.
So quit complaining about how this game is getting "stupider" because it isn't, if anything it's getting smarter, working better, and doing what it's supposed to be doing. Unfortunately, what it's supposed to be doing, is annoyingly casual, and reflects arena type gameplay far to much. You all need to start complaining about the over done -Balance- in Dust 514. Balancing this game is what's causing it problems. Nerfing tanks, buffing AV, nerfing dropships, nerfing forge guns (are they un-nerfed now?), nerfing the HMG. It's all unnecessary and uncalled for, and it's taking the competitive, tactical, and strategic values out of the game. |
Laurent Cazaderon
Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation
1155
|
Posted - 2012.10.02 08:54:00 -
[2] - Quote
Veigar Mordekaiser wrote:I'm confused. Plain and simple. How in the hell does character movement relate to "dumbing down"? I've seen multiple posts (threads and replies) about how the strafe speed and HP are "dumbed down". Do you mean to tell me, that if I start huffing paint and giving myself brain damage, that my HP will be increased?
I think what you should be complaining about, is that CCP is trying to make everything in the game balanced, it has nothing to do with the intelligence level of the game. CCP is trying to make every piece of the game, balanced in respect to every other piece of the game. They are turning their game into an arena type shooter, made to rely solely on foot soldiers that don't use cover, when cover and vehicles would make the game significantly better.
The reality is that a scout should be able to run circles around a heavy, a heavy should be able to withstand obscene amounts of damage, logi guys should be able to carry tons of equipment, and an assault merc should be very well rounded. LAV's should be agile and weak, tanks should be slow and strong as F... Dropships should be able to fly high, get on top buildings, or camp on the MCC if they desire.
So quit complaining about how this game is getting "stupider" because it isn't, if anything it's getting smarter, working better, and doing what it's supposed to be doing. Unfortunately, what it's supposed to be doing, is annoyingly casual, and reflects arena type gameplay far to much. You all need to start complaining about the over done -Balance- in Dust 514. Balancing this game is what's causing it problems. Nerfing tanks, buffing AV, nerfing dropships, nerfing forge guns (are they un-nerfed now?), nerfing the HMG. It's all unnecessary and uncalled for, and it's taking the competitive, tactical, and strategic values out of the game.
People say dumbed down, but it's "aim-skill" wise. And i think you know it. At the moment, individual deplacement skills in a gunfight have no meaning as aim-assist is fast enough to track any movement. Thus "dumbing down" the skill needed in AIM to track an kill a guy that moves better than you. |
Crimson Moon V
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
184
|
Posted - 2012.10.02 08:57:00 -
[3] - Quote
Veigar Mordekaiser wrote:I'm confused. Plain and simple. How in the hell does character movement relate to "dumbing down"? They are making the game easier for people who can't aim. Plain and simple. This has already been explained several times.
This thread needs an IQ boost tbh. |
HK-40
120
|
Posted - 2012.10.02 08:58:00 -
[4] - Quote
Turning off Aim Assist would be a good start.
If someone as incompetent as me can come out using militia equipment and no Aim Assist with a better than 1 ranking then the leets can certainly play without it. (assuming the problem you are referring to is the effect that the reduced sidestep has when faced with Aim Assist). |
Veigar Mordekaiser
Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire
676
|
Posted - 2012.10.02 08:59:00 -
[5] - Quote
Laurent Cazaderon wrote:People say dumbed down, but it's "aim-skill" wise. And i think you know it. At the moment, individual deplacement skills in a gunfight have no meaning as aim-assist is fast enough to track any movement. Thus "dumbing down" the skill needed in AIM to track an kill a guy that moves better than you. Hand-eye coordination and controller skills have nothing to do with intelligence, and the whole argument still falls under the category of balance. Slower movement, combo'd with aim assist, means that low skill players will be on a more even playing field with high skill players, which in the end, means that fights are more balanced. Again, balance is ultimately going to be the death of this game.
Honestly, I'm enjoying the build and over all I think it's fun, but there are definitely changes I would like to see made.
Crimson Moon V wrote:Veigar Mordekaiser wrote:I'm confused. Plain and simple. How in the hell does character movement relate to "dumbing down"? They are making the game easier for people who can't aim. Plain and simple. This has already been explained several times. This thread needs an IQ boost tbh. You need an IQ boost. What does hand-eye coordination have to do with intelligence level? You're pissed about balance, not intelligence or the lack there of.
HK-40 wrote:Turning off Aim Assist would be a good start.
If someone as incompetent as me can come out using militia equipment and no Aim Assist with a better than 1 ranking then the leets can certainly play without it. (assuming the problem you are referring to is the effect that the reduced sidestep has when faced with Aim Assist). I'm referring to people that don't even know what they're complaining about. People that just want to complain. Personally, I have no issue with the current movement. |
Crimson Moon V
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
184
|
Posted - 2012.10.02 09:07:00 -
[6] - Quote
For someone who is making IQ jokes you are pretty ******* stupid. The gun game has been has been dumbed down not the intelligence level. Someone just explained that to you yet you are willfully ignorant. Good job.
The gun game has been made easier with the fail strafe speeds. What part are you having trouble understanding? |
Veigar Mordekaiser
Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire
676
|
Posted - 2012.10.02 09:11:00 -
[7] - Quote
Crimson Moon V wrote:For someone who is making IQ jokes you are pretty ******* stupid. The gun game has been has been dumbed down not the intelligence level. Someone just explained that to you yet you are willfully ignorant. Good job. The gun game hasn't been "dumbed down" at all. Saying that implies that it is easier for someone of lower intelligence to play. The gun game has been -balanced- and you just don't understand what that means.
A side note, are you completely incapable of being civil? Every thread I see you on, you're a complete assh0le to anyone who thinks you're wrong. Honestly, do you feel the need to type out F*cking when you know the chat filter will just fill it with stars? I mean, if you feel so inclined to swear at me, you should at least bypass the f.ucking chat filter.
Edit: *Waits for GM to edit with the pretty Edited mark of shame*
Edit: If you would really like to prove that the gun game indeed has been "dumbed down" you should use more than two sentences to do it as well. It's hard to provide a valid, detailed, well thought out and established point with only a couple lines of text and some vulgar language. Food for thought.
Edit: Just had to bypass the chat filter again, looks like they may have updated it for assh0le. |
Crimson Moon V
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
184
|
Posted - 2012.10.02 09:17:00 -
[8] - Quote
Veigar Mordekaiser wrote:Crimson Moon V wrote:For someone who is making IQ jokes you are pretty ******* stupid. The gun game has been has been dumbed down not the intelligence level. Someone just explained that to you yet you are willfully ignorant. Good job. The gun game hasn't been "dumbed down" at all. Saying that implies that it is easier for someone of lower intelligence to play. The gun game has been -balanced- and you just don't understand what that means. You are playing semantics. Someone else started that thread using that term. I was just making a reference what you brought up. You are arguing semantics with the wrong person.
After someone already explained it to you... Willfully ignorant for the sake of trolling? |
Veigar Mordekaiser
Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire
676
|
Posted - 2012.10.02 09:20:00 -
[9] - Quote
Crimson Moon V wrote:You are playing semantics. Someone else started that thread using that term. I was just making a reference what you brought up. You are arguing semantics with the wrong person.
After someone already explained it to you... Yes, I am aware someone started a thread using the term "dumbed down", hence this thread. Unless your point is something else and it is lost among that little jumble there.
I'm also wondering why you are incapable of making an explanation for yourself. Do you need others to defend you? |
Crimson Moon V
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
184
|
Posted - 2012.10.02 09:29:00 -
[10] - Quote
Veigar Mordekaiser wrote:Crimson Moon V wrote:You are playing semantics. Someone else started that thread using that term. I was just making a reference what you brought up. You are arguing semantics with the wrong person.
After someone already explained it to you... Yes, I am aware someone started a thread using the term "dumbed down", hence this thread. Unless your point is something else and it is lost among that little jumble there. I'm also wondering why you are incapable of making an explanation for yourself. Do you need others to defend you? Someone already explained it to you. The game has been made easier for people who can't aim. Its not a matter of intelligence. Its a matter of the game overly catering to casuals and scrubs. I shouldn't even have to explain this to you.
It seems like you just want to argue semantics for the sake of trolling. |
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fenrir storm
Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic
314
|
Posted - 2012.10.02 09:37:00 -
[11] - Quote
Calm down people it's a game (not even a finished one) just agree to disagree |
birdog's duster
Nevec Task Force Orbis Imperialis
13
|
Posted - 2012.10.02 10:03:00 -
[12] - Quote
Crimson Moon V wrote:Veigar Mordekaiser wrote:Crimson Moon V wrote:You are playing semantics. Someone else started that thread using that term. I was just making a reference what you brought up. You are arguing semantics with the wrong person.
After someone already explained it to you... Yes, I am aware someone started a thread using the term "dumbed down", hence this thread. Unless your point is something else and it is lost among that little jumble there. I'm also wondering why you are incapable of making an explanation for yourself. Do you need others to defend you? Someone already explained it to you. The game has been made easier for people who can't aim. Its not a matter of intelligence. Its a matter of the game overly catering to casuals and scrubs. I shouldn't even have to explain this to you. It seems like you just want to argue semantics for the sake of trolling.
Think about it, people don't play games if they don't enjoy them. People don't enjoy games if they don't feel they are competing CCP needs LOTS of gamers to make this work. They will optimise the game for the majority of players. Not just the elite. The ones who can play the game well will no doubt find themselves getting fat and rich in 0.0 not too long after the game goes fully live.
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Veigar Mordekaiser
Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire
676
|
Posted - 2012.10.02 19:26:00 -
[13] - Quote
Crimson Moon V wrote:Someone already explained it to you. The game has been made easier for people who can't aim. Its not a matter of intelligence. Its a matter of the game overly catering to casuals and scrubs. I shouldn't even have to explain this to you. It seems like you just want to argue semantics for the sake of trolling. Tada, point made. "It's not a matter of intelligence".
Zekain Kade wrote:op is a full ******. Kitten? Or did you mean F*cker? |
Khortez D
Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation
51
|
Posted - 2012.10.02 19:37:00 -
[14] - Quote
Dumbing down usually is in the same boat with nerf, which means to reduce something. and for most of us strafing has been nerfed (it's speed), but i think its all good. i can still dodge a bullet or two.
if im wrong about the meaning feel free to correct. |
J'Jor Da'Wg
KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION
648
|
Posted - 2012.10.02 19:51:00 -
[15] - Quote
Tbh I like the new patch.
I was regularly on the top of the leaderboard last build when I played.
I think the QQ is the result of "l33ts" getting killed and being on an even playing field now... |
Khortez D
Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation
51
|
Posted - 2012.10.02 19:56:00 -
[16] - Quote
J'Jor Da'Wg wrote:Tbh I like the new patch.
I was regularly on the top of the leaderboard last build when I played.
I think the QQ is the result of "l33ts" getting killed and being on an even playing field now...
jus sayin, that could go 2 ways
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Veigar Mordekaiser
Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire
676
|
Posted - 2012.10.02 20:36:00 -
[17] - Quote
Khortez D wrote:J'Jor Da'Wg wrote:Tbh I like the new patch.
I was regularly on the top of the leaderboard last build when I played.
I think the QQ is the result of "l33ts" getting killed and being on an even playing field now... jus sayin, that could go 2 ways Not sure I understand what you mean. |
Khortez D
Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation
51
|
Posted - 2012.10.02 20:40:00 -
[18] - Quote
the argument that "leet players are QQing because they are on a even playing field" can also be said in reverse
IE: players that could not aim or dodge now have a handicap and now its easier for them. so they dont want strafing back because of how easy things are.
note: im not saying this at all. i dont flame other arguments, i just give another view. CCP already heard what we have to say, its now ultimately up to them to do whatever. |
Veigar Mordekaiser
Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire
676
|
Posted - 2012.10.03 04:15:00 -
[19] - Quote
Oh okay I see what you're saying. Honestly, I don't think the movement in Precursor really made for any type of notable skill difference. I liked the movement in E3 the best though, not sure why people QQ'd about scouts so much, they were fine. |
Khortez D
Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation
51
|
Posted - 2012.10.03 04:21:00 -
[20] - Quote
i play mostly assaults, i like being the jack-of-all-trades person. i just feel like assaults were leaning more on the "heavy" side and it sucks when your trying to not get shot. i remember scouts moving like a cheetah, but that never concerned me, they die pretty easily. and finding them is the fun part to begin with. |
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drake sadani
Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation
42
|
Posted - 2012.10.03 04:32:00 -
[21] - Quote
just a random person strolling trough . ..
but i agree with the whole heavies should be juggernauts scouts should be ninjas. tanks should be a pain.. (a manageable one though) dropships should be for the terrain edge , . each unit has its role. if you make every build equal then they might as well issue the same weapon to every player and say go at it . . and i still see lots of aspects not in play yet which lend to the game. if a dropship sits on top of a building . i could use a artillery turret to evict him , not sure though because we "don't have them yet"
derp derp kitten kitten .. also if good weapons and suits get nerfs for being to good against players in the wrong place for their build then i am going to remove dust but meh that has yet to happen ....
yet |
Khortez D
Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation
51
|
Posted - 2012.10.03 04:35:00 -
[22] - Quote
i do like the idea of being able to shoot mortars |
drake sadani
Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation
42
|
Posted - 2012.10.03 04:43:00 -
[23] - Quote
Khortez D wrote:i do like the idea of being able to shoot mortars
as do friend .. as do i . even though it will be camper heaven . which is why they should cost a arm and a leg . |
Khortez D
Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation
51
|
Posted - 2012.10.03 04:45:00 -
[24] - Quote
until tanks, cars, and a mass army roll up on em. believe me theyd be targets, should have a ammo capacity too. |
drake sadani
Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation
42
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Posted - 2012.10.03 04:48:00 -
[25] - Quote
hmm well the turrets attach to vehicles so maybe they should make you really really slow but no ammo cap. >< this is the future darn it i want unlimited ammo that goes boom me want big boom >< ........
maybe five shots then a long cool down
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Khortez D
Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation
51
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Posted - 2012.10.03 05:07:00 -
[26] - Quote
lol some type of handicap, or the mortars will be the new Orbital strike |
Smoke2Bowls
ZionTCD Legacy Rising
93
|
Posted - 2012.10.03 05:08:00 -
[27] - Quote
This thread deserves to be stabbed by bullets... |
Veigar Mordekaiser
Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire
676
|
Posted - 2012.10.03 07:34:00 -
[28] - Quote
This is largely off topic at the moment. My main issue, is that CCP is over balancing things so that they don't have/need real "counters" as they aren't "strong" in many situations. Though the whole point of this particular thread, was to show people that they are using the wrong terms to make their arguments.
When I saw the first "dumbed down" thread, I thought "Are skills easier to get/understand? Are dropships easier to use? Is the learning curve somehow lower than it was before?" But instead, I see "strafe speed is to low" and "aim assist scrubs". |
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