I hope your clone never reanimates.

You get a like from me. It takes skill to hit a moving target it's amazing to pull the trigger and see someone 500m away go flying like a ragdoll. And on the note of being unseen I have dropsuit command at lvl 5 and use an assault type II for my sniper load out. So any idea on how long that chevron appears over my head? I'm using it for the extra CPU and shields so I can take a hit or two, but if the scout suit hides me faster than I would probably switch

What a shame neither is going to happen anytime soon.

This post pretty much sums it up. +1 from me, and kudos for proper grammar and spelling.

Snipers are only problematic if people don't deal with them. There are quite a few ways to deal with snipers:

1. The easiest way to deal with a sniper is to snipe them right back. If I can kill your counter-sniper, does that make snipers overpowered? Nope. If he kills me, is it safe to assume that I'm not coming back? Not in the least. It boils down to skill vs. skill in this case, and is actually extremely fun for both snipers if they're evenly matched.

2. Assault rifles will tear up snipers in a heartbeat. It's fairly easy to sneak up on snipers that are toward the edges of the map. If you can get behind cover near the edge of the map, the chances of anyone seeing your are pretty much nill. You will fall my radar, and have free reign to sneak up behind me and light me up. And at that point, you deserve it, since I should have been paying attention to my local area as much as the battlefield. Once again, skill can overcome snipers.

3. LAVs are cheap (or free), fast, and practically un-snipable. The driver is practically immune to snipers (especially DS3 snipers), and if they have a gunner there's really no reason for them to ever stop moving. I think I've managed to shoot a moving gunner once, in an extremely lucky shot. The moment the LAV stops moving, the gunner is dead; consider this a warning LAV drivers. If you get lucky, you can run over a sniper in a bad perch, but they would need to be pretty ******** to not hear/see you coming. The gunner can keep a sniper occupied potentially forever, or until they get in a lucky shot and kill the sniper. Out skill and outmaneuver the sniper and he's dead.

4. Tanks. Lol. I think we all can imagine what a tank can do to a sniper, and vice versa. There is no skill (or honor) involved here.

5. Dropships are probably the safest way to deal with snipers. It's extremely difficult to hit the gunners in a dropship from pretty much any angle, and the height advantage granted by flying pretty much nullifies any cover the sniper may have. No skill required here, just SP.

So the common theme here is skill. Do you have the skills to take out a target that has low health, minimal short range defenses, tunnel vision, and is almost always solo? Or is it easier to just complain about snipers that fill the exact role that they intend to perform and hope for CCP intervention? Use your head.

Oh NOOOO. I look bad on an Internet forum. Omgz. I don't really care. I'm sure I look terrible.
Your right more would die though we'd take the objective. Omgz NOoo KDR dropping.

Just ignore him Van Aewulf, this is probably all that he has.

Van, thank you for your post. As someone who also plays the sniper role, I find it funny when people state snipers have it easier. Sure there are things that have been implemented to make this easier (i.e KB/M) but they also have their disadvantages (slow as kitten turn speed).

Snipers are a great thing to have in your squad/corporation, especially since they provide great over watch to the battlefield. My squad has had a great number of successful encounters because they were warned ahead of time. A sniper who knows what he/she is doing is a valuable to any battle.

+1

I think we should also address the difference between sniper rifles. I have maxed sniper skills but find I'm only using the charge rifle with damage mods. There is no reason to currently use proto weapons. Snipers are dedicated to their roles and invest large amounts of it to to be effective. Rather than nerfing a class, we should encourage people to counter it effectively; I hate tanks, but-áI -árespect the time, isk and skill needed to spec into armour tanking so I've also learned to deal with this.

Hello Van,

I have to say you're pretty much spot on when it comes to snipers and LAVs my man. As a big Saga driver myself, my partner in crime and turret man Don "Big Daddy" Bobben finds it very pleasing to shoot those snipers that sit in obvious places like on top of mountains or in the middle of the map, behind some small rock. Granted the smarter ones can be harder to get a clear shot at with that missile launcher so we might have to get up close and personal with them. But honestly most of the time I leave them alone... Smart or not? You tell me.

Now generally I have nothing against snipers even though Don gets taken out by one from time to time. Actually I have to take my hat off to the ones doing good job. Sometimes I even see snipers protecting objectives and that's great. The problem is that you rarely see the benefits of an allied sniper, but it can be annoying to get shot by an enemy one.

As a side note Van. You're doing one heck offa job promoting yourself with this thread and you seem like a stand up guy, a true team player. I'd roll in the same squad with you any day of the week man. Any day of the week.

One final thing. As far as this dude "Tony Calif" running his mouth, hating on these snipers goes... Well Tony there's an old saying and I've got a message for you brother. If you can't stand the heat, stay the heck out of the kitchen, brother! Hide in a tank, hide behind a rock, do whatever you do, man, stay in your comfort zone dude BUT don't come here and start running your mouth because a my man Van has taken your head off too many times!

Best regards,
Zane Hollgren

I would just like to say that having read this in the voice of Hulk Hogan just made my day.

Thanks for the info I'll look into a good scout suit fit. I loved the charged rifle for its power but the ishukone is amazing once I got the hang of it I was dropping guys just as fast and often able to get that second shot to finish off heavies.

Please understand that I'm quoting without quoting due to the amount of text involved.

Yes CCP sniper is overpowered. There is no sway on the sniper rifle anymore. Half the damage and triple the sway. I mean imagine if all us snipers had to get and mouseboard and key.

I mean the list of people screaming snipers are op would jump to 5 of us. Listen to us please CCP. I hate these damn snipers.

Guys relax a little too,if you read around tony likes taking the ****. 2 of my clan mates are navy men from the south and I must just say their hate for the northeners and wicked sense of humor is awesome.

But seriously nerf all these damn snipers. Make the scout suits hit box twice the size. Make the damage half and add marshmellows. Please bring back last builds horrific sway. Nerf keyboards and mice. You have to listen to us! We don't want to ruin the infantry game. I'm also talking to you damn tanks and dropships. This is called infantry 514!!

Havent read posts except for OP. Reason why most hate snipers is that they GENERALLY are less useful than players "in the middle of the action". Reason being:
Good snipers can be VERY helpful, problem is that bad snipers are pretty useless. If they cant kill, they arent doing anything... and if not in a good location, cant even spot enemy positions. Atleast with assault/heavy in the action, even if theyre bad, they can arm objectives, throw down nanohives, revive, or even just be a target that'll distract opponents, until better players can kill and get stuff done.

have to say increasing the sway is the best solution as well as moving the charge to at least an advanced sniper taking up 93 cpu. Sniping was more difficult last build, i miss it.

read the other posts, people hate snipers because they are OP

Yes, you can kill someone across the map but only if you have put the sp into the right skill in order to have the range. My k/d is only 2.0 because I don't try to be a kill *****. In other words I tend to stay in one spot and try to clear off an objective instead of just taking one shot and ducking to hide.

I must be doing something right to **** off the other team because in three different matches over the last week or so I have had precision strikes called in on little ole me, twice while sniping and once after I switched out my rifle for a proto swarm and killed a drop ship and then the squad leaders sagaris.

If it doesn't take some skill, then why do I have 6 mill or so sp and only be able to field a pretty good sniper? Generally the rewards suck unless I have a tremendously good match and go 18/2. I also hack objectives when the match starts and when I see the other team not paying attention, I'll hack and run back to cover it and try to stop them from rehacking.

I don't carry nano hives so I also hack supply depots, clone vats, and I carry uplinks that I deploy on the assault maps so I don't have to do a random spawn and my team mates can use them to get into the map without much risk.

So you saying southeners aren't awesome? Don't pretend to know my motives. You have convinced me of one thing. Ccp need to look at the stats of people who played with the controller last build then look at those same people using the mouse this build. They then need to look at the numbers of everyone playing snipers and look at the real kd numbers.

I don't pretend to be the leader of anti snipers,I just hate being part of the new in. The number of snipers have gone out of control. I'm not complaining at all. My kd is skyrocketing with all these op snipers neg bombing.

Lol with tips like wear a assault suit and wear a heavy suit when sniping I'd swear you are just setting up easy targets.

But hey,what do I know?

This is why snipers are disliked. 'Getting objectives' is what wins games. But most snipers aren't even covering hack points.

Here's a tip. South east spawn on plateau (the one with big towers and pipes) has an open view of B hack point from your Redzone. From here you can prevent anyone ever taking B from your team. 25% of the game won by a single player.

Edit: Rank is right, I do like taking the ****. Only a little.

About thouse good ole boys from the south, the army and marines look for good ole boys from the south that grew up handling a .22 and a 12 ga. from the time they could keep the butt off the ground. Those are the guys who make the best snipers in real life. Of course, I'm one of those good ole boys myself, born in Texas and raised in La. and Miss., hunting squirrels with a .22 and deer with a 30.06.

Lol I laugh at snipers that try to kill me since I have 323 shield with a very quick shield regen. So even if I do get hit I can easily go into cover for a couple of seconds before going back out.

Also any sniper that kills me better be ready to be confronted by me at close range (Unless you have an awesome sniping spot, and I mean an awesome spot)

I'm still waiting to hear this part. You should make a post where you aren't ranting and being sarcastic and just say things logically and concisely.

You know what,just cancel that invite. You are too complicated. I was talking to infinity. If you can't follow the conversation which isn't long just forget about it. I would rather play against you.

So damn serious too. The marshmellow should have been a clear indicator I was being sarcastic.

The last thing I will say ever about anything sniping related will be increase the sway to last build.

I'm on your side,except for the sway. I'm used to it that way already. No learning curve for me so I don't care.

I will not hate my clan mates due to the fact that they hate the northeners. That would be continuing the circle of hate. I love them, it warps their minds.

Sorry if I raised your blood pressure slightly. Any time you are keen to do some sniping with me you can send an invite. I'm really not in this to make enemies. Ask my fellow corp mates. When things are serious I'll do anything to help anyone on my team anywhere on the field. So you will have to lose the mountain only sniping if contrabanjoe gives you an order.

Go read some sniping tips for the ladies. If you have followed infinity even his own thread of 'help' turned into his crusade for the infantry. He is playing games now. I already told him he won and that is why I am agreeing to have the sway increased.

When we reached end game last build you could make a glass cannon that would ohk a heavy. He would die from gun powder residue though. If you made a scout tank you would not even ohk another proto scout. I asked infinity if he has faced a proto suit yet. He didn't even know that the suits were black except for scout proto thus meaning he hasn't been end game. Opinion null and void until that date. That's where the majority will be playing. Well the hardcore atleast.

I would like ccp to follow stats and decide nerfs,not us. Any game that the community has begged for nerf after nerf has turned into crap.

Totally agree. You can't please everyone. I think CCP do both. Take small missiles and the breach AR as examples.

I've been sniping with nothing more than the standard starter recon kit. I've got TONS of sway, usually takes between 2-5 shots to take somebody out, and a lot of the times when I spawn into battle I end up in the middle of the enemy's current spawn camp and get taken out effortlessly.

However, I still enjoy it somewhat, although the lag makes a hard situation, significantly harder. if I actually hit all the people that should have been hit due to lag, I would have much better stats and points.

I do get annoyed when my Assault suit with shield extenders and such gets OHK'd by a charge sniper rifle from out of nowhere that I couldn't even see... But it all comes with the game...

Pretend text is here... lol.

We really need to have a cross-corp sniper "convention" next build... I can hear the screaming already. It will be a thing of Beauty.

People will always hate us, Hide and Seek is a frustrating game at times. Terribly rude of us to not stand there and duke it out , nose-to-nose.

I see just enough of bad/greedy snipers to get my use from them, and I see a handful of very cover-and-objective conscious snipers... Usually not long enough to say "hello" without a major position change, or greater exposure.

Keep shooting folks.

#71Posted: 2012.09.10 18:36 | Report
Tony Calif wrote:
I love your rage. LoL. Feed me sniper tears lol. I could do another thread before my "tony's quick guide to skirmish." I could do one all about sniping, and how it's ineffective, KBM advantage, why people get killed with AR's when they're a sniper, that kinda thing. But I'd really rather concentrate on getting those who are actually going to the objectives, hacking them too. And getting there alive (mostly).


You get there alive from Intel and covery fire from a sniper position.

What are you on dude? Sniper tears? Do you take drugs, son? C'mon man, what the hell do you know about tactical combat? Did you serve as a private in the military for 4 years? Think that makes you a master of tactical skirmish combat?

Maybe you don't get there alive very often because you're incorrectly utilizing the combat roles available to you. Perhaps you should rethink what you think you know about combat.

And lastly, what you did is considered hate speech. You wished a detrimental outcome (permanent death) on a specific class of persons (snipers) for nothing more than being what they are. Are you also a white supremacist from the deep south who attacks blacks and gays randomly for nothing more than being who they are? What do you stand for? You act like a child who only recently received internet privileges. Retaliating the way I did was unacceptable, I'll admit that.

Do you even have a job?

It is all good,it was late last night and in hindsight only people that have been following infinity would have known what I was talking about.

I didn't see Tony get upset and I'm nearly 100% sure he laughed it off. It has something to do with that wicked sense of humor. The whole southener and northener thing was just me pointing out my experience from my clanmates. I really do love them.

There is nothing better in this world than listening to a southerner crap a northener out because he tuned me, a south african. That is just borderline xenophobic. I would fight with french,english and americans in cod. Until I met leggyuk and andy-skills. They made me readjust my opinion on people from different cultures.

I would also recommend reading some of tonys other threads and posts. The majority you notice will contain juicy tips for any noob and skilled person. He is constructive regularly.

Sorry I brought an old argument back here into your thread. I could see the whole op argument coming a mile away.

So hopefully no hard feelings.

Fivetimes, I've seen some of your other posts and clearly you're a skilled sniper but there are two aspects in all your posts about sniping (that I've seen/read) which you overlook.

#1. Define "minimal investment". Minimal for who? In what context? As compared to what? Now granted I'm still new to the beta so I certainly don't have the SP bank that some players do but I have yet to even finish out my basic sniper skills much less support skills that would allow me to use better gear etc and I've already put over 4 million SP into being a sniper and I haven't even maxed out all the skills with sniper in their name yet. Then there are the general weapon skills which apply to sniping and again all of that is excluding the support/upgrade skills which unlock gear or give a little bit more durability.

So how many million skillpoints invested does it take before, in your estimation, the SP investment is no longer "minimal"?

#2. And frankly this may be more important so I'll be marking it out clearly you are NOT the standard the very fact that you're near the top of the leader board when it comes to sniping means that you shouldn't, and cannot be the correct metric for game wide class balance. Just because *someone* can go 30-0 in a given role or with a given fit/skill spec does not mean that fit/skill spec is imbalanced. Those conclusions have to be drawn game wide and based on a cross section of data not the experiences of one player. Certainly not the experiences of one player who's at the top of the heap when it comes to performance/player skill. Just because Michael Jordan could play circles around most other players in the NBA does not make the number 23 overpowered or imbalanced, and while that is clearly not an exact parallel the reasoning still applies.


In conclusion, thank you for your high quality of sniper know how it's been a help in finding some direction as a sniper new to Dust (and a player who's not a "FPS guy"), but you are not the average and shouldn't be the balance point.

My 0.00 ISK
Cross

I like to snipe more than using the others (hence my name) but I am absolutely terrible at it and need some advice and I would like to thank you for providing the advice I've been looking for. And if there is anything you can tell me more about sniping I am really happy to hear well read what you have to say.

wow And i thought i was a ok sniper in this game, now i realize am horrible XD. I usualy play the recon/ sniper in FPS games so i know my way around snipers, tho in this game it feels different some how and i still cant figure out what is it.... If i could be in a squad with some off you guys that would help me out a lot.

First off, I am not a Sniper. I tried the role, found it ill suited my playstyle. That being said, I'm not exactly a Sniper Hunter either, but I have my own methods of dealing with them.

First... ID their location. IMPORTANT! If you know where the sniper is, you can hide from him behind cover.

Second... get behind cover... anyone sitting in the open when there is cover available deserves to be sniped.

Third... when in doubt, suppress... Scout suits used as Snipers are flimsy... they generally stack Damage mods to increase the chances of that OHK, (some exceptions occur), if you start firing and land even one bullet that Scout WILL duck... whether it be to preserve their KDR, or their suit, or simply retain their hard to reach position, they don't want to die.

One your team, in games such as Battlefield 3, and some others, Snipers are supposed to 'spot' targets for you. In BF3 particularly, this has to be done manually, and alot of snipers do not do it. Possibly a cause of some sniper hate. However, a Sniper, watching from his perch, 'Spotting' Incoming hostiles in an area, and calling out enemy movements is a honest to god boon to any team.

Myself, I love having a sniper on 'Overwatch' and it has allowed me to retain situational awareness in some hell-like situations under fire.

Stop bashing the snipers, learn to work with, or deal with, them.

Oh, and I saw mention that Snipers require 'special' skills to take care of... What character, suit, or other doesn't? Do you stand in front of a Heavy with a HMG and have a shoot-out in an Assault Suit? Do you use cover to protect against incoming fire? All these are 'special' skills required for FPS, or real-life combat (yes I said real-life).

That's my rant. Snipers, you have my support!

The Black Jackal

Actually I've got ideas about snipers working in pairs that I think could work, kind of like real life sniper/spotter duos except both will be shooting. The few times I've had to defend a spot with other snipers we ended up turning things into a meat grinder for the other side. It worked especially well because even if the ideal of "one shot one kill" isn't possible for most targets then a second shooter would at least finish off your target and get you assist points.

Now that I think about it, I know that logis and pilots have their own channels but do snipers? Someone get on that if not, we could use a sniper union hall.

You know wut I hate snipers they **** me off and dont (in my eyes) help with anything...

However in the next build...

If a sniper makes any crusader dropsuit class head explode I will dry hump you 4 ever, be your bt1ch, clean you merc quarters and will even fluff ...your pillows.

This build tho your just air stealers.

Why is there an actual need for a defense of sniping? I actually don't mind sniping on the battlefield.

1) And you snipers aren't going to like this, I don't see it really swinging the game either way during a battle. Sure during an ambush map a sniper might get some good kills but it is really nothing compared to vehicle users and more aggressive AP dropsuit builds.

During skirmish maps I never have seen a sniper on my team assisting with taking/holding objectives in a meaningful way. Perhaps I have just been unlucky and completely missed the opportunity to see someone who is on the ball at work, or perhaps I just haven't actually seen a good sniper in game. Given these two options I think the former is more likely and that most people who snipe just don't really pay attention to skirmish maps' objectives and instead just try to farm kills during these matches.

Please prove me wrong in my next game though. Shoot the guy who is about to pop me while I'm taking an objective. Or shoot him/her while he/she is trying to rehack what I just took. I'd love to thank the snipers I just have no reason to as of yet.

2) Snipers are a great way for me to get points. I love how you all are so focused on your target that you completely miss seeing me sneak up on you. Perhaps some people need to spend more time looking at their radar, though it could be that all that sp I spend on dropsuit command is finally paying dividends.

That being said I do believe that a sniper could be a relevant player in any game and as you have already said Van simply having the whole team on coms would go a long way towards making that a possibility.

They could make 100 builds and the job of a sniper will never change. Cover hack point. Win.
(Sha, I hate the sound of these new modules, but tbh they'll be fine. Just slow everything down more... Mass drivers/SMG will be a big pile of win. Split em up, knock em down.)

People hate on snipers because of those matches where the whole enemy team decides to snipe. (Or your team does and you can't get any backup while capping.)

I like to pull the rifle out for counter sniping and thinning out teams that crowd around supply depots in ambush. I've barely put any points into it, but can still take out 90% of suits in two shots or less with a damage mod.

What I want to know is why the vast majority of snipers stay perfectly still and aim down their scopes constantly. You guys are ridiculously easy to sneak up on. I usually get too impatient and move to a new position long before anyone can climb up behind me.

I can't agree with this infinity. Yesterday Edrot Or'vana and Frank A and myself were on the same team. I joined half way in and I suspect that could have been why Ed'rot was sniping as when we are on the same team he will usually run assault. Frank A is fairly newish to me as a sniper so I can't say I know much about him except he is a damn good counter sniper. The end of that game Edrot 25-0,Frank A was 21-0 and myself at 17-0. All 3 of us on top. Kills were flowing only because they had noob snipers on that team. I'm surprised there were no 'snipers are op' after that game.

Whenever we are faced against each other ALL of our kills drop significantly. This happens 10 times a day. Don't only take my word for it. Ask them yourself. We get better everyday because we hunt each other and no one else. The only reason those 2 guys aren't above me for kd is because they play with all the classes much more than me. A game I came out of right now had someone called hat tata in it. I killed him as an assault,he returned with a ishukone and killed me twice and spent the rest of the game hunting me. I ended up going 8-2. First time I have died twice in a game since Edrot made me go 3-4. The only negative game I have had this build.


The other 2 people to double gank me in game are here with us Sha and Tony and the one missing from this thread is Tyas. I like the fact that my major failures have been against them. It makes my head big. Can't forget a shoutout to x-darktemplar-x Heavy. The man that will cross a map take 3 bullets to the face and laugh while gunning you down with his gastun mini gun. I dare you to twitch straff him. He is my death dealer. Damn I nearly forgot shakaaal6666. Another heavy that doesn't give a crap about snipers.

Those people I have mentioned make me and any other sniper look far from overpowered. I wish they would come and speak on this topic. I play against them constantly and they all have my respect. Especially edrot and frank. If they agreed with you,I would be willing to re look my stance with you infinity and sniper being overpowered. Not that it means anything to you I am sure.

So why didn't you reposition yourself so that you were safe from the enemy snipers and help your team take objectives instead of dueling? The thing countering you in that game was yourself. You decided to go hunting the other snipers rather than shooting enemy infantry. In my own experience, if an enemy sniper seems to get a few kills I'll pop up now-and-then to see if he's exposed and I can kill them, but otherwise I'll simply position myself somewhere safe and wipe out the enemy team's infantry like normal. I've never felt myself constrained in any significant way by another sniper.

It's called cover.

All those flakes sitting around in the infamous volcanic basin map are there for a reason, and that reason is not to climb up and snipe from them. (Unless you enjoy being effortlessly picked off by Tactical ARs.) If you are running in a straight line out in the open, you might as well paint a bullseye on your helmet.

I have over 1700 kills as a sniper with a KDR (please don't hate me for bringing that up) of 5.83. Generally speaking, per match, I walk away with 6 kills for each death. I'm around 115 on the Leaderboards if you'd like to fact check my assertion.

Lol no bridges burnt here. The more I hear contrabanjoe on the planetary response channel,the more I am inclined to believe I'm going to let my clan be absorbed by his corporation or whatever he starts. His tactics over this last weeks corp battles were amazing. Even if we actually faced a descent team they would have been spanked.

Lol my main reason though is he didn't even ask if he could lead us. He just took control of our team of killers and was shouting orders. Without a doubt the most fun I have had in this beta. Can't wait for full team grouping. Then true op things can start showing themselves and fun time will be here.

I would invite you and give you the password to that uvt channel but its not mine to give. Will ask him if he minds more people coming in. Its not a corp right now just people grouping and talking to each other about the game. Will get back to you in game.

I agree and I play a Logi with a shotgun. If i get killed by a sniper it's my own damn fault. By sticking to cover 95% of the time I never face the danger of a sniper. The thing that makes me laugh are the guys who KNOW there is a sniper who can see them but they insist popping their heads out to see where the sniper is sitting....BAMMMMMM DEAD! I dont mind I get points for reviving your dumbass.
I find having an ally sniper overlooking my area a must. I actually prefer it. I will put my drop uplink and nano hive somewhere near his firing lane just for the added security. Enemies who notice the drop uplink come wondering in like ******* sheep. Between the sniper and I, we will clean house.