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Clone Reanimation Unit
Nova Knife Isk Holdings
7
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Posted - 2012.08.24 21:22:00 -
[1] - Quote
As the topic says... The current starter fits are not really that great. It gives incentives for players to make their own fit, but a brand new player is not going to know any better. This is something that has been a pit of a peeve of mine for a little while. But as I'm seeing more and more people using these fits, I feel that we gotta help them out. Some of the militia suits don't have the PG/CPU to make these fits work, in which case a small increase to those suits PG/CPU might be in order.
First and foremost - The (Militia heavy - Shock) fit. wrote:
This fit needs a serious re-think to its role. A heavy with a swarm launcher is just incredibly ineffective. The creation of a militia forge gun (Something to ponder perhaps) or a militia HMG is in order. (Why are there no militia AV grenades?) At the very least, this fit needs to ditch the swarm launcher. Maybe repurpose it into an anti-infantry heavy fit. Why? A swarm launcher without a nanohive is useless. A swarm launcher that is too slow to keep up with or evade an enemy vehicle is as good as dead. The fact you don't even get an armor repairer on the heavy speaks volumes. This fit is intended to give the heavy an increase to mobility that just simply isn't there.
Proposed replacements (Keeping current assets) :
[Militia Light damage Modifier] [Militia Swarm Launcher] [Militia Locus grenade] [Milita Submachine gun] [Militia armor repairer]
Better AV variant (Adding more logical assets) :
[Militia Forge Gun] [Militia Submachine Gun] [Militia Heavy damage modifier] [Militia armor repairer] [Militia AV grenade]
Better AP variant (Adding logical assets) :
[Militia Heavy Machine Gun] [Militia Scrambler Pistol] [Militia Shield Extender] [Militia Armor Repairer] [Militia Locus grenade]
Second, The assault wrote:
This starter fit isn't neccessarily bad.. It's just not great. For a suit that has more armor than shield, it doesn't have an armor repair unit. This is a red flag in and of itself. A new player probably won't have the benefit of a logistics friend with a repair tool helping him out. A local armor repair will help them out by massive amounts when they are first starting.
Changing the lowslot to an armor repair and putting a nanohive in the equipment slot by default will work wonders for a new player. A second AV oriented assault fit should be added either way, going along with the proposed heavy changes.
New frontline fit :
[Militia Assault Rifle] [Militia Scambler Pistol] [Militia Shield Extender] [Militia Shield Recharger] [Militia Armor Repairer] [Militia Nanohive] [Militia Locus Grenade]
New AV fit: (Requires new assets)
[Militia Swarm Launcher] [Militia Submachine Gun] [Militia Light damage modifier] [Militia Shield extender] [Militia PG upgrade] [Militia AV grenade] [Militia Nanohive]
The scout - Recon wrote:
Same as the assault, this suit is okay, but not great. There is no reason to leave the equipment slot open for a new player. A sniper is lost without his nanohives! Also, the sidearm should be swapped. A good rule of thumb is "One fast, one slow." The pistol is a weapon that fires slow but does good damage at longer ranges. Your sniper rifle already fits that role. The SMG gives you a much better 'up close' option. Tank is nice, but a sniper's worst foe is usually other snipers. A militia shield extender will not save them. They'd be better off with the damage modifier.
New fit;
[Militia Sniper rifle] [Militia Submachine gun] [Militia Light damage modifier] [Militia Kinetic catalyzer] [Militia Locus Grenade] [Militia Nanohive]
Logistics - Triage wrote:
This suit sort of boggles me almost as much as the heavy suit does. Why does a suit that is intended for support have a damage modifier? This suit should be geared towards increased survivability. I'm not a fan of the assault rifle on this fit. One reason being that we already have a starter fit that uses it. If the starter fits are about giving new players variety, this fit should get a shotgun to complement the fact that you're usually going up close and personal to kill someone standing over your teammate you want to revive. This suit also needs a bit more base PG. It's silly that it has less PG than a scout suit which has less slots available overall.
New fit :
[Militia Shotgun] [Militia Shield Extender] [Militia Armor Repairer] [Militia Armor Plate] [Militia Nanohive] [Militia Nanite Injector] [Militia Locus Grenade]
By all means, post alternatives, people. But I think most can agree the starter fits are inadequate as entry-level gear, and the heavy suit is a horrible swarm launcher platform.
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Nova Knife
Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State
789
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Posted - 2012.08.24 21:23:00 -
[2] - Quote
Oops. The above was me. Logging in on the wrong character ftw :) |
Otosan Ookami
Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire
33
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Posted - 2012.08.24 21:28:00 -
[3] - Quote
looks better to me.
Light swarms on a Heavy still annoy me as a starter... But entry level Forge and HMG at least follow logic.
If the Newb heavy wants swarms, they can swap them out and learn proper fitting. |
Ima Leet
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
321
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Posted - 2012.08.24 21:30:00 -
[4] - Quote
i do not see an issue with your starter fits. they're exactly as i would see it. thanks for the post, Nova! |
STB Vermaak Doe
558
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Posted - 2012.08.24 21:32:00 -
[5] - Quote
No starter smg or forge gun is all i have to say militia hmg is ok though |
Garrett Blacknova
Codex Troopers
1849
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Posted - 2012.08.24 21:34:00 -
[6] - Quote
The Heavy should NEVER have been given Swarm Launchers as their ONLY Starter fitting option.
The Scout should NEVER have been limited to only a Sniper Rifle starter fitting.
The Logi should DEFINITELY have at least 3 different loadouts.
ALL the starter fittings need variants with different purposes. Even if they keep the current fittings, but add extras - badly-fitted, but with different combinations of gear. Militia HMG heavy fit to go with the Swarm variant, a new Assault fitting with a Swarm Launcher instead of the AR, a Scout with a Shotgun as an alternative to running Sniper duty.
Also, some of the starter fits should use SMGs instead of Scrambler Pistols. In particular, a Sniper should have SMG as a backup. Scrambler Pistols are a (bad) attempt at doubling up on long-range weapons when any sane sniper would want a good CQC weapon to keep enemies at bay. |
Stile451
Red Star.
76
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Posted - 2012.08.24 22:12:00 -
[7] - Quote
On the Logistics - Triage I would swap the Militia Nanite Injector with the Militia Repair Tool(at least until the Nanite Injector targeting gets fixed).
I think that the initial fittings are bad on purpose to get the player to experiment with other options. |
STB Vermaak Doe
558
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Posted - 2012.08.24 22:32:00 -
[8] - Quote
Garrett Blacknova wrote:The Heavy should NEVER have been given Swarm Launchers as their ONLY Starter fitting option.
The Scout should NEVER have been limited to only a Sniper Rifle starter fitting.
The Logi should DEFINITELY have at least 3 different loadouts.
ALL the starter fittings need variants with different purposes. Even if they keep the current fittings, but add extras - badly-fitted, but with different combinations of gear. Militia HMG heavy fit to go with the Swarm variant, a new Assault fitting with a Swarm Launcher instead of the AR, a Scout with a Shotgun as an alternative to running Sniper duty.
Also, some of the starter fits should use SMGs instead of Scrambler Pistols. In particular, a Sniper should have SMG as a backup. Scrambler Pistols are a (bad) attempt at doubling up on long-range weapons when any sane sniper would want a good CQC weapon to keep enemies at bay.
I gotta say no to the sniper smg, the only class that needs the smg is the av because it can't kill infantry with it's primary |
Otosan Ookami
Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire
33
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Posted - 2012.08.30 03:10:00 -
[9] - Quote
As a "slightly" prolific sniper with decent skills, I really REALLY feel bad.
I'll admit to taking a "Perverse" joy in my playstyle... with one hand crushed ( old injury) and poor mobility, I may not move well, but I can shoot.
I had a 23/0 round... and it was WRONG.
This round... Multiple heavies and a logi streaming away from an installation. I kept sniping the heavies... the logi kept resurrecting the Heavies... till the Heavies eventually said "forget this" and I shot the Logi as he had then outlived his usefulness.
Feel bad????? Otosan??!?! The guy who shoots speeding Onikuma drivers at 500m and waits for someone else to say "ALRIGHT!!! FREE CAR!!!" for the laughs? Confused?
Heavies with Swarms., Streams of them flying out at other targets, exploding harmlessly, nowhere NEAR their intended prey.
Give them a chance, Militia 2 shot Forge gun, Please.
As an '06 eve player, it's not entirely intuitive to have a "Starter Heavy fit" start with Light class weapons, that were specifically nerfed in the previous build to not work well on Bipedal targets.
It was an eye opener the first time I saw a scoutsuit with swarms. "Those aren't Heavy weapons? why the hell are they on the heavy suit then?" "
Hell, I thought "Scrambler" pistols were E-war for Countering vehicles when I started 2 builds ago!
My two cents, It's more fun hunting prey with teeth. Not Nerf. |
Nova Knife
Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State
789
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Posted - 2012.09.06 22:15:00 -
[10] - Quote
Also pointing out that other starter fits would be nice. There's no reason to limit them to just four. If clutter is a concern, maybe give us a 'starter fit' subfolder in the fittings selection screen at spawn.
Open to suggestions for alternate starter fits. I'm sure I am not the only one with ideas on this. |
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Soleire
90
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Posted - 2012.09.06 23:21:00 -
[11] - Quote
How about having the Starting fits start out "empty"?
Heavy with Militia HMG
Assault with Militia Assault and Pistol
Scout with Sniper and SMG
Logi with Militia
and if absolutely necessary
Assault with Millitia Swarm and SMG
I would make these fits locked meaning that if players want to use the high/low slots, they would have to buy disposable versions of all items. It would make for a good incentive to skill up too. |
Ten-Sidhe
Osmon Surveillance Caldari State
414
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Posted - 2012.09.07 01:14:00 -
[12] - Quote
militia forge sounds okay, people will want to use assault forge as soon as they learn difference anyway.
smg vs scram pistol: amarr should have pistol in all starter and minmatar/caldari the smg, not sure about gallente future hybrid pistol? They take same fitting and both are good weapons.(pistol is longer range, higher damage per hit, and more accurate)
Scout and assault shouldn't have equipment in starter, players can edit fit to add it as stepping stone to proper fits. All militia fits take more pg/cpu then standard gear, so upping pg/cpu to fit in starter could make the militia suits fit more then standard, soon all suits need re-balanced as adjustment ripple up skill tree. Once they have few levels of electronics, enginnering, ??? upgrades, ect.. they can add the nanohive or what ever to fit themselves. Maybe have this pointed out in a tutorial for them. |
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