DUST Search - Forge is Balanced

Zeran Haggai wrote:

Dewie Cheecham wrote:

Carilito wrote:

Tired of Noobs whining about the forge without using it? Show the love of the forge gun the first balanced weapon...

Stop whining about people wanting to create a levelled playing field, where one weapon arent allowed to OHK just about everything in sight.
Man, some Forge Gunners are just the worst noobs, unable to level to real gear.

Base assault forge, no skills, is what like 1230 direct damage and about 210 splash damage? 2.5 second charge time before you can fire with 4 rounds in a clip so you're looking at direct 492 DPS and 84 dps splash . Looking at a minimum of 2 shots, baring the occasional direct hit, to kill most infantry targets so at least 5 seconds to down an infantry in most cases, 2.5 if you manage a direct hit or luck out and fire on a militia scout. If an AR or any other weapon fires on a target for that long they're gonna be dead too. If you nerf FG's against infantry any more then the people carrying them become basically defenseless, then no one is going to carry them, and you're gonna be getting overrun even more by tanks and dropships.

Go ahead and strap on a heavy suit, pick one up, and let me know how well you do. The 1-2 hit kill against infantry is justified given the obscene amount penalties the weapon has.

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Carilito Algintal Core Gallente Federation 345	Posted - 2012.07.29 12:50:00 - [1] - Quote Tired of Noobs whining about the forge without using it? Show the love of the forge gun the first balanced weapon...
Cless Vallein Teknomen 37	Posted - 2012.07.29 12:51:00 - [2] - Quote Amen brother
ICECREAMK1NG WARRIORS 99	Posted - 2012.07.29 12:52:00 - [3] - Quote Agreed +1
Dewie Cheecham Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 677	Posted - 2012.07.29 12:53:00 - [4] - Quote Carilito wrote: Tired of Noobs whining about the forge without using it? Show the love of the forge gun the first balanced weapon... Stop whining about people wanting to create a levelled playing field, where one weapon arent allowed to OHK just about everything in sight. Man, some Forge Gunners are just the worst noobs, unable to level to real gear.
ICECREAMK1NG WARRIORS 99	Posted - 2012.07.29 12:57:00 - [5] - Quote @ dewie. LOL..... I somehow knew you'd show up on this thread. A OHK on just about everything ??? You're an idiot.
Chihiro Itto 66	Posted - 2012.07.29 13:04:00 - [6] - Quote It takes skill (and luck) to get a OSK with a forge, plus the ammo supply is highly limited. If you are planning to use the forge primarily AV (to use it all-AI would be pretty moronic IMO) then any shots you use against infantry are reducing the likelihood that you can take out any vehicles. Plus of course you have to be a heavy to use it which makes you significantly more vulnerable. It takes several seconds to kill a soldier with a forge, about the same amount of time it takes to kill any other soldier in the field with X weapon. Depending on your fitting and your opponent's fitting, that can be pretty much OSK too, regardless of the weaponry involved. Bitching about getting killed by a weapon it takes 2.5 seconds to be targeted with seems pretty weak sauce to me, and I've been on the end of it plenty of times myself.
Zeran Haggai Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 196	Posted - 2012.07.29 13:38:00 - [7] - Quote Dewie Cheecham wrote: Carilito wrote: Tired of Noobs whining about the forge without using it? Show the love of the forge gun the first balanced weapon... Stop whining about people wanting to create a levelled playing field, where one weapon arent allowed to OHK just about everything in sight. Man, some Forge Gunners are just the worst noobs, unable to level to real gear. Base assault forge, no skills, is what like 1230 direct damage and about 210 splash damage? 2.5 second charge time before you can fire with 4 rounds in a clip so you're looking at direct 492 DPS and 84 dps splash . Looking at a minimum of 2 shots, baring the occasional direct hit, to kill most infantry targets so at least 5 seconds to down an infantry in most cases, 2.5 if you manage a direct hit or luck out and fire on a militia scout. If an AR or any other weapon fires on a target for that long they're gonna be dead too. If you nerf FG's against infantry any more then the people carrying them become basically defenseless, then no one is going to carry them, and you're gonna be getting overrun even more by tanks and dropships. Go ahead and strap on a heavy suit, pick one up, and let me know how well you do. The 1-2 hit kill against infantry is justified given the obscene amount penalties the weapon has.
Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 1849	Posted - 2012.07.29 13:45:00 - [8] - Quote My Dragonfly suit can survive a Standard Forge Gun's splash. By the time they've charged for a second shot, I'm probably not in line of sight any more. Base Shield/Armour for a Militia Scout, Standard Scout or Dragonfly is less than the splash on the un-upgraded Standard Forge Gun. But with a few of the right skills (MUCH cheaper than upgrading the FG), and with a couple of Militia Shield and Armour Mods (ALSO cheaper than the Forge Gun), you can survive the first shot. If I'm actually moving, and a Forge Gunner manages to land a direct shot on me, I'm both surprised and impressed. If they manage to hit me with splash damage and kill me, I was either already hurt or I was using free gear anyway. Against vehicles, it's easier to hit, but that means the weapon is better at hitting the targets it was designed to hit than something smaller which moves in less predictable paths. And it's still only a one-shot against those "easy" targets when they're badly fitted. I have two all-Militia HAV fittings, neither of which can be one-shotted with a max-upgraded and damage modded Prototype Forge Gun. They'll both die on a second hit if I stick around, but neither one will go down against a single shot.
Gelan Corbaine BetaMax. 103	Posted - 2012.07.29 13:54:00 - [9] - Quote preach brother preach !
Iceyburnz 316	Posted - 2012.07.29 15:28:00 - [10] - Quote I agree, never felt like the forge gun was "too powerful". Feels about right to me.

Gyrnius ZionTCD Legacy Rising 65	Posted - 2012.07.29 19:28:00 - [11] - Quote Zeran Haggai wrote: Dewie Cheecham wrote: Carilito wrote: Tired of Noobs whining about the forge without using it? Show the love of the forge gun the first balanced weapon... Stop whining about people wanting to create a levelled playing field, where one weapon arent allowed to OHK just about everything in sight. Man, some Forge Gunners are just the worst noobs, unable to level to real gear. Base assault forge, no skills, is what like 1230 direct damage and about 210 splash damage? 2.5 second charge time before you can fire with 4 rounds in a clip so you're looking at direct 492 DPS and 84 dps splash . Looking at a minimum of 2 shots, baring the occasional direct hit, to kill most infantry targets so at least 5 seconds to down an infantry in most cases, 2.5 if you manage a direct hit or luck out and fire on a militia scout. If an AR or any other weapon fires on a target for that long they're gonna be dead too. If you nerf FG's against infantry any more then the people carrying them become basically defenseless, then no one is going to carry them, and you're gonna be getting overrun even more by tanks and dropships. Go ahead and strap on a heavy suit, pick one up, and let me know how well you do. The 1-2 hit kill against infantry is justified given the obscene amount penalties the weapon has. Base assault forge guns charge is 5 seconds iirc, not 2.5. 2.5 is when you have the forge gun skill trained to 5.
Cless Vallein Teknomen 37	Posted - 2012.07.29 19:30:00 - [12] - Quote assalut forge gun is 2.5 from the get go
Gyrnius ZionTCD Legacy Rising 65	Posted - 2012.07.29 19:32:00 - [13] - Quote Cless Vallein wrote: assalut forge gun is 2.5 from the get go No its not - I've used assault forge guns from Forge Gun 1 - take a look at what that skill does =) EDIT: The point is the DPS is even lower due to the horrible ROF, EVEN with maxed skills.
Zeran Haggai Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 196	Posted - 2012.07.29 19:47:00 - [14] - Quote Gyrnius wrote: Base assault forge guns charge is 5 seconds iirc, not 2.5. 2.5 is when you have the forge gun skill trained to 5. No normal forge is 3 seconds, assault variant is 2.5.
Iron Wolf Saber BetaMax. 2867	Posted - 2012.07.29 19:51:00 - [15] - Quote I say nerf range a down from infinit to long range standoff which would give sharpshooter some purpose. Maybe make the off dead center shots a bit more consistent in happening. Also we need like a seige variant, much lower damage higher ROF. and the vanillia needs to have a higher damage pershot when its overcharged.
Gyrnius ZionTCD Legacy Rising 65	Posted - 2012.07.29 19:58:00 - [16] - Quote Zeran Haggai wrote: Gyrnius wrote: Base assault forge guns charge is 5 seconds iirc, not 2.5. 2.5 is when you have the forge gun skill trained to 5. No normal forge is 3 seconds, assault variant is 2.5. That is a display bug. Take a look at the Max Ammo - you don't actually GET 16 rounds stored until you get the ammo capacity skill trained up to level 5. Likewise, you don't get 2.5 second charge up time on the assault forge gun until you have Forge Gun trained to 5. The Forge Gun Operation skill is the one that allows you to use the forge guns in the first place. The bonus to the skill is: "-5% to forge gun charge time per level" - at level 5 this means 2.5 seconds for the assault and 3.5 seconds for the standard version.
Zeran Haggai Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 196	Posted - 2012.07.29 20:29:00 - [17] - Quote Gyrnius wrote: Zeran Haggai wrote: Gyrnius wrote: Base assault forge guns charge is 5 seconds iirc, not 2.5. 2.5 is when you have the forge gun skill trained to 5. No normal forge is 3 seconds, assault variant is 2.5. That is a display bug. Take a look at the Max Ammo - you don't actually GET 16 rounds stored until you get the ammo capacity skill trained up to level 5. Likewise, you don't get 2.5 second charge up time on the assault forge gun until you have Forge Gun trained to 5. The Forge Gun Operation skill is the one that allows you to use the forge guns in the first place. The bonus to the skill is: "-5% to forge gun charge time per level" - at level 5 this means 2.5 seconds for the assault and 3.5 seconds for the standard version. Are you high? The ammo capacity is 16. You start with 4 loaded and 12 for reloads. 12+4=16
Gyrnius ZionTCD Legacy Rising 65	Posted - 2012.07.29 20:44:00 - [18] - Quote Zeran Haggai wrote: Gyrnius wrote: Zeran Haggai wrote: Gyrnius wrote: Base assault forge guns charge is 5 seconds iirc, not 2.5. 2.5 is when you have the forge gun skill trained to 5. No normal forge is 3 seconds, assault variant is 2.5. That is a display bug. Take a look at the Max Ammo - you don't actually GET 16 rounds stored until you get the ammo capacity skill trained up to level 5. Likewise, you don't get 2.5 second charge up time on the assault forge gun until you have Forge Gun trained to 5. The Forge Gun Operation skill is the one that allows you to use the forge guns in the first place. The bonus to the skill is: "-5% to forge gun charge time per level" - at level 5 this means 2.5 seconds for the assault and 3.5 seconds for the standard version. Are you high? The ammo capacity is 16. You start with 4 loaded and 12 for reloads. 12+4=16 At level 5, Ammo Capacity gives you 16 rounds stored and 4 in the clip. I guess this means there could be a display bug on the other end - showing the default stats even with skills trained up. My understanding was the stats displayed were max skilled values, but it could be the opposite, in which case the numbers I'm putting out are higher than displayed.
Zeran Haggai Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 196	Posted - 2012.07.29 20:48:00 - [19] - Quote Gyrnius wrote: Zeran Haggai wrote: Gyrnius wrote: Zeran Haggai wrote: Gyrnius wrote: Base assault forge guns charge is 5 seconds iirc, not 2.5. 2.5 is when you have the forge gun skill trained to 5. No normal forge is 3 seconds, assault variant is 2.5. That is a display bug. Take a look at the Max Ammo - you don't actually GET 16 rounds stored until you get the ammo capacity skill trained up to level 5. Likewise, you don't get 2.5 second charge up time on the assault forge gun until you have Forge Gun trained to 5. The Forge Gun Operation skill is the one that allows you to use the forge guns in the first place. The bonus to the skill is: "-5% to forge gun charge time per level" - at level 5 this means 2.5 seconds for the assault and 3.5 seconds for the standard version. Are you high? The ammo capacity is 16. You start with 4 loaded and 12 for reloads. 12+4=16 At level 5, Ammo Capacity gives you 16 rounds stored and 4 in the clip. I guess this means there could be a display bug on the other end - showing the default stats even with skills trained up. My understanding was the stats displayed were max skilled values, but it could be the opposite, in which case the numbers I'm putting out are higher than displayed. Dude, there's no freaking bug. The starting capacity is 16 shots. You have 16 total shots. Upgraded capacity gives you a total of 20.
Gyrnius ZionTCD Legacy Rising 65	Posted - 2012.07.29 20:54:00 - [20] - Quote Well, I have my forge gun operation at level 5 and proficiency at 5, yet the stats reported on the gun fitted on the suits are still as the default. There's either a display bug showing the max stats or a bug NOT showing the current stats based upon skills. Which is it? Is there some other place to read the current stats?

Zeran Haggai Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 196	Posted - 2012.07.29 21:15:00 - [21] - Quote Gyrnius wrote: Well, I have my forge gun operation at level 5 and proficiency at 5, yet the stats reported on the gun fitted on the suits are still as the default. There's either a display bug showing the max stats or a bug NOT showing the current stats based upon skills. Which is it? Is there some other place to read the current stats? If you're talking about the fitting/market info screen, it always shows the base unmodified stats of the weapon/armor/module ect.
Gyrnius ZionTCD Legacy Rising 65	Posted - 2012.07.29 21:19:00 - [22] - Quote Is there a place to read the current stats with skills and fitted damage mods included?
Zeran Haggai Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 196	Posted - 2012.07.29 21:26:00 - [23] - Quote not that i'm aware of, just gotta do the math. Only stat i know of currently that shows a visual change as you skill up is PG/CPU in the fitting screen.


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