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![[Veteran_Traynor Youngs]](https://forums.dust514.com/themes/ccpDust514/dust-avatar-128.png "[Veteran_Traynor Youngs]")
[Veteran_Traynor Youngs]
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Posted - 2012.06.14 03:55:00 -
[1] - Quote
For those of you who don't know, in Eve, when a corporation or Alliance invades another's space, one of the main things that must be done is capturing all of the enemies stations. The mechanic that exists currently is that after the station has been forced to reinforce for about a day two separate times (once for taking down shields, and the second for taking down armor) then the person who strikes the final blow to the station's structure claims the station for their corporation. Stations are not destroyed, and hangers full of ships are never available for looting etc.
I am likely not the only person who thinks this is a pretty weak mechanic.
There have also been a number of people who have suggested that DUST mercs should be able, through some complicated mechanic, to board and capture Eve ships in space. I do not think that that should be allowed, but I have thought of a way to invigorate the station mechanic with a DUST involvement.
The Eve Side:
Once the station has some structure damage, it becomes vulnerable. In order to take the station, a carrier, fitted for delivering DUST mercs must launch assault shuttles at the station. This carrier would have assault shuttles instead of fighters in its bay. The more assault shuttles used, the greater the rate of respawn possible to the Mercs. The Carrier would also need a high slot module that provides mercenary clone relay services. IF this carrier shuts down that module, or is destroyed, then the DUST mercs can no longer respawn.
A single carrier with this module allows one assault at a time against one sector of the station. Multiple carriers could be used to assault multiple sectors simultaneously.
This would require that the Eve corp seizing the station would have to commit at least one carrier to the fight. There would be no orbital bombardment possible, but they would have to stay and take care of the carrier while it assists the assault. If the DUST mercs fail, then the attackers are free to either A: Destroy the station or B: Withdrawal and attack another time after the station has a chance to be reinforced once again.
Using DUST mercs would become the ONLY way of capturing a station and stations would become destructible objects in Eve.
The DUST Side:
Each station should consist of five sectors and each one should represent the map for a max vs max player battle between Dust Mercenaries. The Sectors are:
Core Sector: This is where the main transportation facilities for the station are located and from which all other sectors may be accessed. Failure to control this sector will prevent troops or supplies from having access to any of the other four sectors. This is the first sector that must be assaulted and controlled. Visually this sector should have large open areas where transportation rails similar to trains converge from all (3D) directions and surrounded by administrative and mechanical spaces. This space should be large enough for LAV's and HAV's in limited number, but not Dropships.
Engineering Sector: This is where the fusion core of the station is located as well as the vast array of machinery and equipment that keeps the station running. Once captured, this spaces control systems may be used to alter lighting, atmosphere, and gravity of the other sectors. Visually this sector consists of small cramped corridors filled with pipes and cables. Should be dark and gritty.
Habitat Sector: This is where the station's inhabitants live and work. This station also houses the cloning facilities used by POD pilots and can represent an increase in available clone reserves if taken. Visually this sector is well lit and filled with parks and open air balconies with fake sunlight. Lots of open views good for sniping. Some limited room for use of LAV's.
Hanger: This is where Eve ships are stored. IT is a HUGE open area with large equipment. This area is the only one large enough for HAV's and Dropships to be used. Controlling this section allows for a greater number of supplies to be brought in from outside the station and thus represents an increase in war points, clones, and supplies.
Control: This is the administrative center of the station and also the central location of the stations security forces. This sector represents the greatest challenge, and the greatest reward. Capturing and holding the control areas allows the control of the stations automated defenses as well as the station's supplies. THis sector also has the strongest defenses.
The station itself should be capable of defense through automated turrets and NPC guards. If a DUST corp takes a contract to defend the station, then they may directly control the automated defenses and they begin with control of each sector and receive whatever bonus comes from that sector. |
[Veteran_Traynor Youngs]
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Posted - 2012.06.14 03:56:00 -
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CONTRACTS
For assault contracts there should be options. If coming from an Eve corp, the contract should be able to be either for a corp or for individual mercs. This way, if so desired, the attacking EVE corp could simply offer to pay solo mercs to help take the station. They could come from any group of DUST corps and would be paid a flat fee for their services.
The fee could be either a cost up front regardless of losses, or could be a cost plus contract(they pay whatever the DUST mercs lost in dropsuits and fittings and vehicles plus some amount). Contracts of this type would not allow the DUST players to exercise any control over the station and they would be unable to loot any of the contents.
If an eve corp contracts a full dust corp for the attack, then they can either create it as a flat fee, or at a cost plus or as a spoils of war contract. In spoils of war, the mercs gain access to whatever was left in the stationGÇÖs hangers and are able to sell those items on the eve market. This would be the only way to raid the contents of the player hangers.
DUST corps could contract Eve corps for similar operations and with similar contract types. The contract would be considered fulfilled depending on the terms, either when the battle ends, or when the carrier launches the attack (If the DUST mercs are particularly trusting).
Defense contracts can be made for individuals or corps to defend vulnerable stations with payouts similar to those discussed or with payouts for certain objectives.
Similar mechanics could be made for POS's though a different delivery method would be needed for high sec since Carriers can't go there.
Thoughts? |
[Veteran_Cantus]
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Posted - 2012.06.14 04:08:00 -
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I always liked the idea of troops invading the stations. |
[Veteran_Ceerix MKII]
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Posted - 2012.06.14 04:43:00 -
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I like the idea of stations being destructible and that Dust players need to be involved in the taking of them. But I don't think that Dust players should ever be able to take what an EVE player has in their hanger. Dust is already being forced on EVE players weather they like it or not. Then making it so a player that they have very limited interaction with, is able to take stuff they have earned over the 10 years of EVE being around by a new mechanic that's added over night is pretty ****** up. It would be like a Dust player losing everything they own because their ship is blown up en route to a battle by an EVE player. |
[Veteran_Eldorlon Tharn]
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Posted - 2012.06.14 05:53:00 -
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I for one am totaly against stations beeing destroyed.... there is no reason at all for it, + it would mean CCP had to make stations someting a corp can put up... wich would then end up in stations everywhere. and i bet that a station would cost insane amounts of ISK to build.
but on the other hand I'm a big fan of boarding stations for gaining controle of them |
[Veteran_Ceerix MKII]
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Posted - 2012.06.14 06:17:00 -
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Corps/Alliances can put stations up they cost around 15b, so now 0.0 has them everywhere. |
[Veteran_Iceyburnz]
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Posted - 2012.06.14 09:31:00 -
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Cantus wrote:I always liked the idea of troops invading the stations.
Me too. |
[Veteran_Sorry Accident]
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Posted - 2012.06.14 10:50:00 -
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I'm definitely in support of invading stations. However, the boarding party ideals for the BS/MCC/etc doesn't appeal to me.
If boarding parties for ships happens, who gains control over the ship after it's been taken from the enemy? Too many options for that, and it would be extremely hard to determine who deserves it, let alone someone who can fly it. If it would auto-default to the attacking pilot (who landed the boarding party ship of the member who hacks the last objective/kills the last enemy) then I'm just going to set up a pilot who doesn't do anything but sell captured ships on the market (lol)
However, stations are much more managable. Once the station is taken, it's control is given to whichever corporation assigned the contract to attack it. Stations are already managed by EVE players, this would leave the DUST players with just the assault, maybe a bonus or something from taking it for their corp, but still managed by EVE without making DUST any more complicated, and frankly involving a system that EVE players would enjoy/be able to use more easily.
+1 to OP for a wonderful idea, great layout, as well as clearly thought out and defined details. |
[Veteran_Alliria Seedspawns]
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Posted - 2012.06.14 16:01:00 -
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I saw the subject and it was like a light bulb went off in my head - brilliant!!
Then I start reading, and realize you're talking about completely different idea than I thought of. My idea relates to the station games involved in high sec wars. I'm not even going to try to give ideas on how this could potentially work, as people much smarter than I would need to figure it out. This is just a general idea that I acknowledge is a pipe dream.
This would obviously be quite a ways in the future once WiS is implemented. But my overall thought was finding someway to bring Dust mercs to the station where the war target is seeking shelter, and have the dust bunnies try to hunt down the war target. Only thing I could think of would be to have the bunnies locate the ship and plant some C4 or whatever on it to blow it up.
I'm not sure how the hiding war target would be able to defend themselves, but it'd be neat to try to figure out a way for them to get merc's on site to defend them (or betray them). Haha - it'd be even cooler if the dust bunnies could have an all out battle in the station where the eve players are walking around. lmao - that would be awesome! You, as an Eve player, are walking around when all of a sudden gunfire erupts as the two opposing teams duke it out. That'd be epic.
Ah...to dream... |
[Veteran_Traynor Youngs]
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Posted - 2012.06.14 19:12:00 -
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Eldorlon Tharn wrote:I for one am totaly against stations beeing destroyed.... there is no reason at all for it, + it would mean CCP had to make stations someting a corp can put up... wich would then end up in stations everywhere. and i bet that a station would cost insane amounts of ISK to build.
but on the other hand I'm a big fan of boarding stations for gaining controle of them
The reason was stated in the OP, and that is because the way stations transfer now is dumb, and they cannot be destroyed now.
With this idea, Null Sec player owned stations can either be destroyed, OR captured in a way that makes sense and gives a VITAL role to the DUST mercs.
If DUST has no more interaction than allowing or preventing PI, then Eve players won't care.
If you need DUST mercs in order to not have to pay the 15billion isk price tag for a new station, then the biggest alliances with the deepest pockets will be clambering to pay top dollar for the best Mercs. I think that is a good idea. |
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[Veteran_Traynor Youngs]
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Posted - 2012.06.14 19:14:00 -
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Ceerix MKII wrote:I like the idea of stations being destructible and that Dust players need to be involved in the taking of them. But I don't think that Dust players should ever be able to take what an EVE player has in their hanger. Dust is already being forced on EVE players weather they like it or not. Then making it so a player that they have very limited interaction with, is able to take stuff they have earned over the 10 years of EVE being around by a new mechanic that's added over night is pretty ****** up. It would be like a Dust player losing everything they own because their ship is blown up en route to a battle by an EVE player.
They way it works now, the invaders shut down your docking rights and then you have to either sell it, contract to have it moved, or consider it lost until your alliance can retake the station.
I think that mechanic is pretty stupid.
If you don't want to lose your stuff when the enemy sieges your system (and there are two separate reinforcement timers where you can get your stuff out of dodge) then you should move out. IF you are too AFK, or too lazy, then you should lose your stuff. Eve is hard, it can afford to be a bit harder.
Remember that this is only for Null Sec stations. No body is gonna invade your Jita 4-4 station and steal your 40billion trit. |
[Veteran_Ceerix MKII]
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Posted - 2012.06.14 22:44:00 -
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EVE is harder just because you added Dust to the universe. It sounds great to a Dust player being able to raid some hanger in a station of all the items that EVE players have. It would be the same as logging in to Dust to a message your stuff is gone because some pilot blew your ship en route. But sorry the EVE universe is hard, and as a Dust player you are within it. The open nature of EVE is one of the things that do make it fun but no matter what there have to be limits to keep game play fun. Dust already is relying heavily on EVE players embracing the game. If they don't a lot of what will make Dust fun is gone. |
[Veteran_handegekke]
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Posted - 2012.06.15 07:16:00 -
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Iceyburnz wrote:Cantus wrote:I always liked the idea of troops invading the stations. Me too.
Same :D |
[Veteran_Traynor Youngs]
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Posted - 2012.06.15 14:39:00 -
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Ceerix MKII wrote:EVE is harder just because you added Dust to the universe. It sounds great to a Dust player being able to raid some hanger in a station of all the items that EVE players have. It would be the same as logging in to Dust to a message your stuff is gone because some pilot blew your ship en route. But sorry the EVE universe is hard, and as a Dust player you are within it. The open nature of EVE is one of the things that do make it fun but no matter what there have to be limits to keep game play fun. Dust already is relying heavily on EVE players embracing the game. If they don't a lot of what will make Dust fun is gone.
More like you log on after being gone for a week and see the 2-3 DOZEN notifications from your corp that your system had SBU's up, and that your TCU was under attack and then that your TCU was reinforced, then attacked, then that your station was being attacked, and that it reinforced, and that it was attacked, and reinforced, and the "OMG, GET YOUR STUFF OUT!" mails from the CEO and directors, and the mails from corpies saying "contract to me and Ill jump freighter your stuff to JITA" and the mail about Sov changes in the surrounding systems.
If you don't see or respond to any of that....then IMHO, you deserve to have a dust bunny going through your stuff and selling what ever they want.
But that is a sidetrack and the purpose was to give DUST mercs something more than just what they are being paid. THis way, some DUST corps would contract Eve Corps to do the sieging so that they could loot the station. Without some inherent incentive, DUST mercs are just another tool of eve and not their own entities.
The mechanic to facilitate that could be discussed. I think hangers should be fair game, but that I just me (and I have lots of ships in unavailable hangers out there in null) and not the focus of the thread.
So lets keep up the discussion about station assaults.
Do people like the way each sector has some benefit to controlling it? Or does that make it too campy?
Also, any feedback on layout, esthetics, mechanics, etc? |
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