DUST Search - the gunplay and 'input lag' in the game are awful, near unplayable

Buzzwords wrote:

depends on the button, throwing grenades and "quick-swapping" weapons feel laughably slow. to the point where i used to end up hitting the button multiple times and swapping BACK to an empty gun, or swapping right past my sidearm into a nanite injector.

then there's the whole issue with guns not aiming or firing within a small window after a reload. i dunno if you call that input lag, but it's definitely BAD, and at first makes you think the game is just ignoring your commands. same thing with "aim" not over-riding sprint and sprint not over-riding crouch. this is stuff console players are just used to, and without it, the game feels broken or unfinished.

some of it i've acclimated to, and i still have hope that other stuff will get hammered out. but i do agree with mat here, AS IS... dust plays kinda poorly. at least poorly enough to turn OFF a large % of players. if it's a AAA shooter first, then this is stuff that needs to be addressed.

as for people shrugging this stuff off because the game is in beta... if nobody said anything... how would they know to fix it?

i'm sure CCP can figure out that .5 frames per second is bad... but what about: "hey, make the guy go into the grenade throw animation right away when i hit the button. even if the animation is longer, make it readily apparent that the game is executing my commands"

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[Veteran_matsmcfly] 0	Posted - 2012.06.12 18:12:00 - [1] - Quote OK guys I know this is a beta etc. however if the past few years are anything to go by the release version will not be very far removed from the beta we are in just now. Speaking personally here, the game plays terribly. Firstly the game mode skirmish (all I really play) is very unbalanced in favour of the defending side. Something has to be done about the rate at which the MCC takes damage, as it stands just now in order to win you really have to take A and B pretty quickly and then move on and take and then hold all three terminals at the end. Whereas when defending you can loose A and B quickly but as long as your side holds at least one terminal you are almost always guaranteed to win. On a more important note, I think the gun play in the beta is absolutely terrible. Whether it is input lag or plain old regular online lag the characters take an age to respond to your input, aside from that the gunplay itself is just awful with too much emphasis on armour and shielding that regular FPS need for decent aiming and common sense! I love the concept and the ideas behind the game, however the execution of those leave a lot to be desired. The game in its current state feels like a MMORPG with a lack-lustre FPS bolted on for the lulz. Yet another game that promised so much, and so far delivers so little with respect to the FPS element
[Veteran_xAckie] 0	Posted - 2012.06.12 18:31:00 - [2] - Quote matsmcfly wrote: I love the concept and the ideas behind the game, however the execution of those leave a lot to be desired. The game in its current state feels like a MMORPG with a lack-lustre FPS bolted on for the lulz. I figure it really is a working beta and when it finally is released into the playstation store most of the above gameplay balance is sorted. But otherwise I agree about the attacking /defending point - time MCC docks etc. I think the quote above is what I have been thinking, wondering about. First and foremost Dust 514 is an FPS on a console. And I can't / do not believe CCP dont know this - they are betting money and their reputation on this game - so I am thinking/ hoping/ presuming these concerns are unwarranted. After all the SP grind / MMORPG / corp battles / link to EVe etc. is what is built on top of the FPS foundation.
[Veteran_Skytt Syysch] 0	Posted - 2012.06.12 19:09:00 - [3] - Quote "Near unplayable" is just an absurd amount of hyperbole. I haven't run into any input lag issues, are you sure that's what you mean? The hit detection's pretty bad, I'll give you that, and I hear it's getting fixed, but I'm pretty sure the emphasis on armor and shielding is intentional, and we aren't supposed to be insta-killing each other. I used to think the defending team had a largely unfair advantage in that mode as well, but it seems that with the uncoordinated mess that is playing with random people, it's just easier to all randomly end up defending together than it is actually attacking effectively. Everyone can have their own speed and path to attack an objective that they might not show up anywhere near the same time, but everyone defending can see that the objective is being taken, so a few people get over there and help out against the one guy trying to take the objectives by himself. And, publishers have bastardized the concept of a beta over the past few years, and turned it into this pre-release early access, rather than an actual test that is between the stages of finally in a playable state and final product. Release isn't just 2 days away, this is how a beta should feel, bugs and lack of polish everywhere that will get fixed as patches gradually roll out.
[Veteran_Sintel Jenner] 0	Posted - 2012.06.12 19:18:00 - [4] - Quote Skytt Syysch wrote: I haven't run into any input lag issues I'm not sure if this is his problem, but my PS3 connects over wifi, and using the bluetooth headset caused the controller to be almost unusable. Switching to a wired headset cleared that up completely. There are some issues, but nothing as severe as he's making it sound.
[Veteran_SILENTSAM 69] 0	Posted - 2012.06.12 19:29:00 - [5] - Quote This is an actual beta. This is not something like what BF3 did or any of the other FPS games in the last several years where they put out a 'beta' and use it to promote the game rather than really use it as a beta. CCP is a great company and I have high hopes. They are great at dealing with lag on EVE, so I can't wait to see what the most powerful super computer in the gaming industry does for an FPS game. Oh, and we are not running on that super computer right now
[Veteran_Ignatius Crumwald] 0	Posted - 2012.06.12 19:30:00 - [6] - Quote matsmcfly wrote: Yet another game that promised so much, and so far delivers so little with respect to the FPS element You should have seen the last build. Now go stress the server and learn the basics of the skilling system like a good little beta tester. The next build will be sometime between now and the first week of July, you can come and help us beat a live horse to death.
[Veteran_Skytt Syysch] 0	Posted - 2012.06.12 19:30:00 - [7] - Quote Sintel Jenner wrote: Skytt Syysch wrote: I haven't run into any input lag issues I'm not sure if this is his problem, but my PS3 connects over wifi, and using the bluetooth headset caused the controller to be almost unusable. Switching to a wired headset cleared that up completely. There are some issues, but nothing as severe as he's making it sound. Weird. It may not be the best to try to play it over wireless if you have the option to connect the PS3 via a wired connection (not everyone has the choice, so that's understandable). I can't imagine why the headset would cause issues like that, I'll have to see if mine does anything similar when the servers are back up. That's definitely the first time I've heard of that happening, though, in any game.
[Veteran_Rhapsodyy] 0	Posted - 2012.06.12 19:34:00 - [8] - Quote matsmcfly wrote: OK guys I know this is a beta etc. however if the past few years are anything to go by the release version will not be very far removed from the beta we are in just now. How wrong you are. Next build will be as differant as the previous one was to this one.
[Veteran_matsmcfly] 0	Posted - 2012.06.12 20:00:00 - [9] - Quote lol by the phrase near unplayable I was referring to the fact that the terrible 'feel' of the game leads to the loss of interest rather rapidly. Honestly, I cant believe that I am the only person that feels/experiences a notable delay between hitting a button and observing a response on screen. I play with a wired connection and have used two different TV setups including messing with the video output settings from the PS3 (i.e. those that helped with the BF3 input issues for some). Guys, you dont have to tell me about a proper beta, I am more than aware and have been in testing betas many moons ago! Dont get me wrong, I will be delighted if this testing continues to run as a proper beta, however as Skytt seems to agree with, 'beta' tests over at least the past 3-5 years have been a joke and what has led me to be sceptical with the testing phase of modern day games. I am of the mind-set, "I will believe it when I see it", so lets see what is put out there come release build day! I was talking to my clan mates a few days ago voicing some concerns I have from this build, and said that this game will play completely different when we can coordinate and join a game together. I am sure CCP and gearing up to get this in to testing, so fingers crossed that this is a feature that will be added to the forthcoming build/phase. One more thing guys, have any of you played with keyboard/mouse yet and would be able to compare against using the controller?
[Veteran_Darkz azurr] 0	Posted - 2012.06.12 20:10:00 - [10] - Quote i find the controls feel a little weird to me. i can move the right stick about 5 % and get nothing move on screen ..aiming feels a lil weird to me..cant put my finger on it tho ...i have no problem aiming on cod/battlefield ...normally in the top 3 every game..but in dust ..well im normally top 5 but still feels off ..anyone else find the controlls a tiny bit off somehow...im just waiting for the next build before i comment on this tho.

[Veteran_matsmcfly] 0	Posted - 2012.06.12 20:15:00 - [11] - Quote Darkz azurr wrote: i find the controls feel a little weird to me. i can move the right stick about 5 % and get nothing move on screen ..aiming feels a lil weird to me..cant put my finger on it tho ...i have no problem aiming on cod/battlefield ...normally in the top 3 every game..but in dust ..well im normally top 5 but still feels off ..anyone else find the controlls a tiny bit off somehow...im just waiting for the next build before i comment on this tho. The best I can come up with as a descriptor would be to say the controls feel a bit 'loose', I cant really put my finger on it exactly either. The delay I am experiencing is the biggest problem currently though.
[Veteran_Buzzwords] 0	Posted - 2012.06.12 20:23:00 - [12] - Quote depends on the button, throwing grenades and "quick-swapping" weapons feel laughably slow. to the point where i used to end up hitting the button multiple times and swapping BACK to an empty gun, or swapping right past my sidearm into a nanite injector. then there's the whole issue with guns not aiming or firing within a small window after a reload. i dunno if you call that input lag, but it's definitely BAD, and at first makes you think the game is just ignoring your commands. same thing with "aim" not over-riding sprint and sprint not over-riding crouch. this is stuff console players are just used to, and without it, the game feels broken or unfinished. some of it i've acclimated to, and i still have hope that other stuff will get hammered out. but i do agree with mat here, AS IS... dust plays kinda poorly. at least poorly enough to turn OFF a large % of players. if it's a AAA shooter first, then this is stuff that needs to be addressed. as for people shrugging this stuff off because the game is in beta... if nobody said anything... how would they know to fix it? i'm sure CCP can figure out that .5 frames per second is bad... but what about: "hey, make the guy go into the grenade throw animation right away when i hit the button. even if the animation is longer, make it readily apparent that the game is executing my commands"
[Veteran_Darkz azurr] 0	Posted - 2012.06.12 20:31:00 - [13] - Quote Buzzwords wrote: depends on the button, throwing grenades and "quick-swapping" weapons feel laughably slow. to the point where i used to end up hitting the button multiple times and swapping BACK to an empty gun, or swapping right past my sidearm into a nanite injector. then there's the whole issue with guns not aiming or firing within a small window after a reload. i dunno if you call that input lag, but it's definitely BAD, and at first makes you think the game is just ignoring your commands. same thing with "aim" not over-riding sprint and sprint not over-riding crouch. this is stuff console players are just used to, and without it, the game feels broken or unfinished. some of it i've acclimated to, and i still have hope that other stuff will get hammered out. but i do agree with mat here, AS IS... dust plays kinda poorly. at least poorly enough to turn OFF a large % of players. if it's a AAA shooter first, then this is stuff that needs to be addressed. as for people shrugging this stuff off because the game is in beta... if nobody said anything... how would they know to fix it? i'm sure CCP can figure out that .5 frames per second is bad... but what about: "hey, make the guy go into the grenade throw animation right away when i hit the button. even if the animation is longer, make it readily apparent that the game is executing my commands" completely agree ..game apears to be moving in the right direction, there doing a great job..so hope all this is looked into into more depth as its the core mechanics of a fps game..
[Veteran_matsmcfly] 0	Posted - 2012.06.12 20:32:00 - [14] - Quote Buzzwords wrote: some of it i've acclimated to, and i still have hope that other stuff will get hammered out. but i do agree with mat here, AS IS... dust plays kinda poorly. at least poorly enough to turn OFF a large % of players. if it's a AAA shooter first, then this is stuff that needs to be addressed. Nicely put Buzz, the other side of the coin in that regard though is that the game is free to play there will be a significant portion that will hang around regardless of the nature of the final build just to see how it goes. I just always had it in my head that Dust was going to be a FPS first and foremost, with a massive capacity for customization RE: your skills and 'loadouts' all set in the EVE universe. In order to achieve this, then the FPS side of things need ALOT of work IMO. Fingers crossed though
[Veteran_Skytt Syysch] 0	Posted - 2012.06.12 20:48:00 - [15] - Quote Buzzwords wrote: then there's the whole issue with guns not aiming or firing within a small window after a reload. i dunno if you call that input lag, but it's definitely BAD, and at first makes you think the game is just ignoring your commands. Yeah, that one is that certain commands just don't go through if activated during certain animations. It's not input lag, because there's no delay, it fully prevents the command from ever going through until you press the button again. I actually spent a little while testing it and created a thread about it. I think there's a lot of "shrugging off" of some of the issues because there's been at least talk of some of this stuff being addressed by the devs that fixes are in the works or included in the next update. I haven't personally seen many reports straight from the devs, but there's a lot of secondhand reporting floating around on the forums saying that they have touched on those subjects (such as the freezing and hit detection, which are the big ones in my opinion). I have no reason not to believe the people saying the devs have commented on various things, after all I have a feeling every developer would want to work out the big issues. And you're right that we should report things. It's just hard to ever be the first one to report a specific issue. ;)
[Veteran_Drizztana Gradul] 0	Posted - 2012.06.13 03:11:00 - [16] - Quote ONe thing to add. Switching weapons is painfully slow and unresponsive. I understand how its supposed to work but its so hard to get right on the gun youre trying to switch to that sometimes you let go of R2 early. Its got to be a little tighter. The controls are pretty sloppy. Out of game its bad too. The menus take forever to get in and out of.
[Veteran_Darkz azurr] 0	Posted - 2012.06.13 13:29:00 - [17] - Quote cant wait to test the new build...i hope some of these problems are fixed in it already ..


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