DUST Search - Is an Inexpensive Collaborative/crowdsourced NPE possible?

Kierkegaard Soren wrote:

I don't think passive trainer is going to work. It never did in EvE; it just has too much meta game going for new players to quickly and easily digest. The same applies for Dust; as OP has already noted, between Core Mechanics, Core Skills, Roles and Specialisations the new player has a vast amount of options to consider and resolve before they've even stepped into a suit and deployed. It is the great strength and the keening weakness of Dust. It's depth of options and the playstyles they afford to the player suffocate before they liberate.

Anyway, waxing lyrical aside, my point is that whatever the NPE is, it's got to be fully interactive. A game mode in of itself, that provides the new player a consequence-free place so that can try anything, anytime, and learn from what works and what does not *whilst playing the game*.

A VR simulator, I suppose. My initial thoughts would be to use a small skirmish map and place an urban-type socket at its center, and have it filled with automated defense turrets such as we have now that have been hacked by...I don't know, drone? Rogue Blaster Turrets, beady-eyed sniper rail positions and such like. However, in being hacked the turrets have been structurally compromised to the point where all weapon types, and not just AV types, can damage and eventually destroy them.

New players must use cover to shelter from incoming fire, use the TACNET to understand where the enemy is positioned and move to the right position to attack accordingly, and then use what they think is the right weapon loadouts to eliminate the turrets. Do they mix damage types for efficient defense stripping? Do they attack with AV and learn of there ammo limitations? Do they try to pull out a forge heavy and go toe-to-toe with rail installations from extreme range?

Of course, all trivial to a vet to accomplish. But for a newbro, intensely valuable information can be learned, and they get to blow sh*t up as they go, which is always a bonus.

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Vrain Matari Mikramurka Shock Troop Minmatar Republic 2	Posted - 2015.08.08 23:11:00 - [1] - Quote Many agree that Dust is in dire need of a better NPE. Many also agree that the purpose of an NPE tutorial/walkthrough is not to teach noobs 'how to shoot a gun', but rather to give New Eden immigrants a handle on the several non-trivial and interconnected systems that comprise a viable merc's working knowledge in Dust. This point is not in dispute - veteran players have repeatedly demonstrated, for the benefit of CCP and the playerbase, that a new toon in low-end gear can be viable against almost all pub-level opposition and easily capable of slaughtering noobs by the dozen in the academy. There is far more going on here than simple map knowledge - core skills, racial characteristics, suit classes, vehicle classes, richly varied weapons classes, shield characteristics, armor characteristics, active ewar, passive ewar, squad mechanics, off-map assets, equipment(big topic!), spawn mechanics, cloak mechanics, integrated warfare, installations, game glitches/bugs. That's on the battlefield. Also WP mechanics, sp mechanics, ISK, AUR, boosters, trading, BPOs, APEX off the battlefield. Any dev or player insisting that the broad demand for a tutorial/walkthrough is about 'shooting a gun' has their head so far up their exhaust port that they most likely suffer from a tongue scalded by a regrettable too-oft licking of their reactor core. Imo 'how to shoot a gun' can be translated to merc-speak as 'too expensive'. There is nothing wrong with 'too expensive' as an answer, it's a reality of development for Dust at this time...but....this is an issue that will not go away: whatever the future incarnation of Dust, it will also suffer from this same issue. We face a classic dilemma: we need a quality NPE but it's too expensive/time consuming. I believe it's worth considering a collaboration/crowdsource solution to the NPE: a set of narrated first-person training 'matches' where noobs never fire a gun, but are there to look, listen and learn. The basic idea: Record a match from the point of view of several players on both sides, say 3 per side. Call them Red(R1, R2, R3) and Blue/Green(1, 2, 3). Maybe also devote a player on each side to keeping the overhead map up. Publish this set of 6 or 8 videos to the playerbase. In some kind of open-source collaborative venue, players post time-stamped text of what they want 'Sarge' to communicate to the player at that particular point in time, for some or all points-of-view. Sarge can start and stop time, rewind, speed up/slow down playback and also switch the player's PoV at will. Sarge is just a voice in the player's head, but he also has control of a '~~magic pointer~~holographic projector' that can produce on-screen effects. Community/devs argue, plead, vote, mud-wrestle to decide how to order the PoV-switching and narration to best educate noobs. With a final training mission in hand, CCP adds effects from Sarge's magic pointer to the video to highlight and make explicit what we're trying to teach the player. CCP publishes the PoV observer missions in the battle finder. Players can run through these at any time for as many times as they desire. On the first few run-throughs they get sweet loot just for watching. That's it, but on a final point of immersion 'Sarge' should prolly be working for the merc recruiters that issue public contracts. His/her mission is to try and make a recruit 'worth their ISK'. PSN: RationalSpark
Sicerly Yaw Corrosive Synergy No Context 773	Posted - 2015.08.08 23:30:00 - [2] - Quote they should just add a subscription option with benefits to said players and use that money to hire interns and whatever other resources they can to make further progress in my opinion I am not sure who is in charge of accounting or for that matter who decides how the budget as big or small as it may be gets spent, but I do know that there are plenty of players willing to spend lots of money on this game to see it become something more then it already is I for one would be willing to pay more on a monthly basis depending on what benefits I receive giving that I could afford it so simple fix to that would be to implement tired subscription system starting out cheap giving minimal benefits (daily keys, aur gear, aur, warbarge components, officer gear, ect) and getting more expensive while giving more benefits I am sure people would be willing to pay up to perhaps 25$ USD or more for some of these benefits some already spend close to this amount if not more but allowing players to pay on a monthly basis would make it easier to manage the funds and make it so there's a steady income perhaps these players that choose to subscribe can get unique discounts to aur items and such making trading better would also encourage even more spending while making the game better for F2P players as well do to the increase in goods available and casual players that cant afford to grind out isk could simply subscribe buy a few items here and there and sell those items to fund their fun click here if you are making a new account and want some free BPO's
Kierkegaard Soren Eridani Light Horse Battalion 903	Posted - 2015.08.08 23:52:00 - [3] - Quote I don't think passive trainer is going to work. It never did in EvE; it just has too much meta game going for new players to quickly and easily digest. The same applies for Dust; as OP has already noted, between Core Mechanics, Core Skills, Roles and Specialisations the new player has a vast amount of options to consider and resolve before they've even stepped into a suit and deployed. It is the great strength and the keening weakness of Dust. It's depth of options and the playstyles they afford to the player suffocate before they liberate. Anyway, waxing lyrical aside, my point is that whatever the NPE is, it's got to be fully interactive. A game mode in of itself, that provides the new player a consequence-free place so that can try anything, anytime, and learn from what works and what does not whilst playing the game. A VR simulator, I suppose. My initial thoughts would be to use a small skirmish map and place an urban-type socket at its center, and have it filled with automated defense turrets such as we have now that have been hacked by...I don't know, drone? Rogue Blaster Turrets, beady-eyed sniper rail positions and such like. However, in being hacked the turrets have been structurally compromised to the point where all weapon types, and not just AV types, can damage and eventually destroy them. New players must use cover to shelter from incoming fire, use the TACNET to understand where the enemy is positioned and move to the right position to attack accordingly, and then use what they think is the right weapon loadouts to eliminate the turrets. Do they mix damage types for efficient defense stripping? Do they attack with AV and learn of there ammo limitations? Do they try to pull out a forge heavy and go toe-to-toe with rail installations from extreme range? Of course, all trivial to a vet to accomplish. But for a newbro, intensely valuable information can be learned, and they get to blow sh*t up as they go, which is always a bonus. Dedicated Commando. "He who can destroy a thing, controls a thing."
Vrain Matari Mikramurka Shock Troop Minmatar Republic 2	Posted - 2015.08.09 00:12:00 - [4] - Quote Kierkegaard Soren wrote: I don't think passive trainer is going to work. It never did in EvE; it just has too much meta game going for new players to quickly and easily digest. The same applies for Dust; as OP has already noted, between Core Mechanics, Core Skills, Roles and Specialisations the new player has a vast amount of options to consider and resolve before they've even stepped into a suit and deployed. It is the great strength and the keening weakness of Dust. It's depth of options and the playstyles they afford to the player suffocate before they liberate. Anyway, waxing lyrical aside, my point is that whatever the NPE is, it's got to be fully interactive. A game mode in of itself, that provides the new player a consequence-free place so that can try anything, anytime, and learn from what works and what does not whilst playing the game. A VR simulator, I suppose. My initial thoughts would be to use a small skirmish map and place an urban-type socket at its center, and have it filled with automated defense turrets such as we have now that have been hacked by...I don't know, drone? Rogue Blaster Turrets, beady-eyed sniper rail positions and such like. However, in being hacked the turrets have been structurally compromised to the point where all weapon types, and not just AV types, can damage and eventually destroy them. New players must use cover to shelter from incoming fire, use the TACNET to understand where the enemy is positioned and move to the right position to attack accordingly, and then use what they think is the right weapon loadouts to eliminate the turrets. Do they mix damage types for efficient defense stripping? Do they attack with AV and learn of there ammo limitations? Do they try to pull out a forge heavy and go toe-to-toe with rail installations from extreme range? Of course, all trivial to a vet to accomplish. But for a newbro, intensely valuable information can be learned, and they get to blow sh*t up as they go, which is always a bonus. Love it. Lots of bang for the buck in this proposal. PSN: RationalSpark
Thor Odinson42 Negative-Feedback 6	Posted - 2015.08.09 10:46:00 - [5] - Quote In the meantime I'd like to see a mass effort to get noobs into a rookie channel. Have the channel moderated to keep trolls at bay. A weird concept, but veterans would post in the channel, squad with players, help new players find corps that are somewhat organized and helpful of new players. Send invites to the channel from the EOM screen when you see people getting wrecked.
CommanderBolt KILL-EM-QUICK Rise Of Legion. 3	Posted - 2015.08.09 10:53:00 - [6] - Quote Thor Odinson42 wrote: In the meantime I'd like to see a mass effort to get noobs into a rookie channel. Have the channel moderated to keep trolls at bay. A weird concept, but veterans would post in the channel, squad with players, help new players find corps that are somewhat organized and helpful of new players. Send invites to the channel from the EOM screen when you see people getting wrecked. This. If I knew there was a dedicated channel that new players filtered into, (Just like rookie help chat in eve for the first 30 days) I would sit in there to answer questions, give pointers and even get squads going so I can show new players the nice things in life like a logi with reps, good hives, good uplinks and the like... "Madness how we turned our common-ground into a battle-ground.." - Essa


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