DUST Search - My officer forge felt limp

DUST Fiend wrote:

Breakin Stuff wrote:

Lightning35 Delta514 wrote:

All forge guns need less charge time. Reduce assault to 2 seconds, standard to 3 seconds, and breach to 4.

2 seconds is too low. Trust me. I know things about AV.

2.5 assault, 3+ alpha increase for STD. And I'm thinking 5 seconds On the breach if I recall my math correctly.

The real neutering of the forge came when the 1 sec refire/reload penalty came into play. That was introduced right around the time the PLC was brought in.

True base charge times are 4/5/7 for assault/std/breach. This refire delay is not affected by skills at all.

Currently the biggest hindrance to the balancing process is only having ADV / PRO HAVs, instead of also having them for LAVs and Dropships. Once those are out, then AV can start being buffed accordingly. Prices for AV may need to be raised slightly or prices for vehicles cut, depending on how it starts to pan out. I will say though that if I got my idea of a proto Incubus tomorrow (2/3 layout, PG / CPU boost), so long as I stayed moving I wouldn't have to worry about AV very much.

So, I think we need to get those vehicles out ASAP, then AV can start being ratcheted up. This would be a great time for them to release the reskinned Amarr and Minmatar place holders as well (don't forget LAVs and dropships GAISSS). The issue with this game has always been that it tries to balance around not having all of its base materials in the game. I say get all the pieces together before you start building the puzzle.

There's never enough sh**posting going on, so let's add a few more teaspoons of the guy posting after me to the recipie!

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Bright Steel Horizons' Edge 1244	Posted - 2015.05.04 10:50:00 - [1] - Quote Getting tired of these tanks driving around with immunity so I decided to throw on my gastons forge and show them something... Had three complex heavy damage mods on my proto min sentinel and given I got his attention, he shrugged it off and drove away.... Multiple times. And the only time we almost poped him was when two other swarms were helping. I just don't like the idea of officer forge only driving away a tank.. I could bust through his reps but slowly... After about five minutes of peek-a-boo the other guy with swarms got snipped by a Thales so I put my officer suit away... Do you guys think this a good balance? I agree that one AV of the same their shouldn't take down a tank this was frustrating. Dust 514, the BEST WORST game you can't stop playing.
shaman oga Dead Man's Game 4560	Posted - 2015.05.04 10:55:00 - [2] - Quote Gatsun could use some love, it has less alpha than a an AFG, but charge time and 6 bullets are ok. Shaman's Shack - A place to trade
Mregomies Beer For Evil Mercs 446	Posted - 2015.05.04 10:57:00 - [3] - Quote I want to buy more of those gastun's and alldin's... senti ck.0 + dmg mods = Zeus Suomi, Finland, PERKELE! Logibro Logibro2
Lightning35 Delta514 48TH SPECIAL OPERATIONS FORCE 353	Posted - 2015.05.04 11:00:00 - [4] - Quote All forge guns need less charge time. Reduce assault to 2 seconds, standard to 3 seconds, and breach to 4. 48th Special Operations Force. Twitter- @48SOF
Jack Boost Zarena Family 762	Posted - 2015.05.04 11:14:00 - [5] - Quote As forge user I share pain with you, but there is not so bad. Often using afg I manage to take out vehicles with or without help. But taking this road you get single shooted by rails, snipers and instalations. Not good possition for 4+ shoots vs rest Dust mechanics. For succes IMHO keeping vehicles at red zone is good position for your team.... but this is very low paided... Try Aldins afg .. more honey and sweet teras... Not much time left...
Megaman Trigger Ready to Play 310	Posted - 2015.05.04 11:33:00 - [6] - Quote The base class of Forge Guns should really be somewhere between the AFG and BFG in terms of power, so it fits with the conventions of other weapons. Purifier. First Class.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 8363	Posted - 2015.05.04 11:40:00 - [7] - Quote Lightning35 Delta514 wrote: All forge guns need less charge time. Reduce assault to 2 seconds, standard to 3 seconds, and breach to 4. 2 seconds is too low. Trust me. I know things about AV. 2.5 assault, 3+ alpha increase for STD. And I'm thinking 5 seconds On the breach if I recall my math correctly. The real neutering of the forge came when the 1 sec refire/reload penalty came into play. That was introduced right around the time the PLC was brought in. True base charge times are 4/5/7 for assault/std/breach. This refire delay is not affected by skills at all. There's never enough sh**posting going on, so let's add a few more teaspoons of the guy posting after me to the recipie!
Macchi00 LORD-BRITISH 136	Posted - 2015.05.04 12:10:00 - [8] - Quote In fact, FG can not be said to be the strongest of the AV weapons. All of the equipment is broken if I change to heavy suit. Not nearly there are benefits of using FG. I suffice with M-Commando swarm launcher. I think FG need to buff damage. I love ForgeGun. I made ForgeGun montage in YouTube. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SIhuGxfbjSQ
Ghosts Chance Intara Direct Action Caldari State 3338	Posted - 2015.05.04 12:56:00 - [9] - Quote use a sica with 4 damage mods instead, makes maddies go BOOM... you may have to put a better rail on it if you want to take on well fit GV.0's though Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind" I am Chances Ghost
NextDark Knight Molon Labe. RUST415 792	Posted - 2015.05.04 13:43:00 - [10] - Quote Forge guns has a lower charge time. It was changed to shoe horn the weapon into a av weapon. Hopefully the plasma cannon will get similar treatment to stop people from abusing it. I would love the forge gun to return to the fast charge time. Over 60+ Million SP and full proto in all Caldari Suits. Dust just won't die on PS3/Xbox. Dustin since 6/29/2012

DUST Fiend 16838	Posted - 2015.05.04 13:53:00 - [11] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: Lightning35 Delta514 wrote: All forge guns need less charge time. Reduce assault to 2 seconds, standard to 3 seconds, and breach to 4. 2 seconds is too low. Trust me. I know things about AV. 2.5 assault, 3+ alpha increase for STD. And I'm thinking 5 seconds On the breach if I recall my math correctly. The real neutering of the forge came when the 1 sec refire/reload penalty came into play. That was introduced right around the time the PLC was brought in. True base charge times are 4/5/7 for assault/std/breach. This refire delay is not affected by skills at all. Currently the biggest hindrance to the balancing process is only having ADV / PRO HAVs, instead of also having them for LAVs and Dropships. Once those are out, then AV can start being buffed accordingly. Prices for AV may need to be raised slightly or prices for vehicles cut, depending on how it starts to pan out. I will say though that if I got my idea of a proto Incubus tomorrow (2/3 layout, PG / CPU boost), so long as I stayed moving I wouldn't have to worry about AV very much. So, I think we need to get those vehicles out ASAP, then AV can start being ratcheted up. This would be a great time for them to release the reskinned Amarr and Minmatar place holders as well (don't forget LAVs and dropships GAISSS). The issue with this game has always been that it tries to balance around not having all of its base materials in the game. I say get all the pieces together before you start building the puzzle. "When in doubt, dropship out" If you see me, bring AV to collect ISK DUST STUFF
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 8365	Posted - 2015.05.04 14:23:00 - [12] - Quote DUST Fiend wrote: Breakin Stuff wrote: Lightning35 Delta514 wrote: All forge guns need less charge time. Reduce assault to 2 seconds, standard to 3 seconds, and breach to 4. 2 seconds is too low. Trust me. I know things about AV. 2.5 assault, 3+ alpha increase for STD. And I'm thinking 5 seconds On the breach if I recall my math correctly. The real neutering of the forge came when the 1 sec refire/reload penalty came into play. That was introduced right around the time the PLC was brought in. True base charge times are 4/5/7 for assault/std/breach. This refire delay is not affected by skills at all. Currently the biggest hindrance to the balancing process is only having ADV / PRO HAVs, instead of also having them for LAVs and Dropships. Once those are out, then AV can start being buffed accordingly. Prices for AV may need to be raised slightly or prices for vehicles cut, depending on how it starts to pan out. I will say though that if I got my idea of a proto Incubus tomorrow (2/3 layout, PG / CPU boost), so long as I stayed moving I wouldn't have to worry about AV very much. So, I think we need to get those vehicles out ASAP, then AV can start being ratcheted up. This would be a great time for them to release the reskinned Amarr and Minmatar place holders as well (don't forget LAVs and dropships GAISSS). The issue with this game has always been that it tries to balance around not having all of its base materials in the game. I say get all the pieces together before you start building the puzzle. Unfortunately HAVs being overpowered are more likely to cause permanent rage quits than dropships and LAVs not having ADV/PRO tiers. And after the last sht flinging session directed at rattati by vehicle users when he introduced the HAVs and the ADS rebalance I wouldn't hold my breath at the prospect of him making doing that with dropships and LAVs a priority. Or... you know... other vehicle users could actually submit numbers and reasons for rattatI to use as a reference when it's time, and the sooner constructive feedback starts, the sooner you're likely to get your wish. But no, I disagree that the infantry, who comprise the majority of the playerbase should have to suck up the HAV issue until a few players get their particular toy fixed.I hate to say this, but dropship pilots provided no-feedback for months, defended a imbalanced vehicle and then screamed that rattati was a sht like a bunch of feet-stamping children when he brought it to heel. Sympathy for your plight is in rather short supply. There's never enough sh**posting going on, so let's add a few more teaspoons of the guy posting after me to the recipie!
Bright Steel Horizons' Edge 1247	Posted - 2015.05.05 11:44:00 - [13] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: use a sica with 4 damage mods instead, makes maddies go BOOM... you may have to put a better rail on it if you want to take on well fit GV.0's though I don't run vehicles so I don't even try at the moment. And the idea of needing a vehicle to counter a vehicle is ok except for when you have a match with two or three tanks on the other side and nobody with tanks on your own side. Unless half the tea goes AV the tanks can pretty much do what they want... I didn't mind the gun logis of last build, but the madrugers this time around just laugh at me.... Dust 514, the BEST WORST game you can't stop playing.
Kallas Hallytyr Skullbreakers 1510	Posted - 2015.05.05 12:52:00 - [14] - Quote Bright Steel wrote: Do you guys think this a good balance? I agree that one AV of the same their shouldn't take down a tank this was frustrating. I really hope you're not just wanting an out and out buff of FGs, since the only real issue with V/AV balance is Armour HAVs currently. Straight up buffs because of one element seriously hurts other areas: FGs and DSs have been pretty balanced for a long time, while Swarms have been insanely effective for ages and FGs vs HAVs have been up and down in balance. The issue stems from the great speed of HAVs and the periods of resilience. Reducing their speed and/or reducing their periods of resilience would do a world more good than just buffing FGs. Alt of Halla Murr. Sentinel.
Kallas Hallytyr Skullbreakers 1511	Posted - 2015.05.05 12:59:00 - [15] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: But no, I disagree that the infantry, who comprise the majority of the playerbase should have to suck up the HAV issue until a few players get their particular toy fixed.I hate to say this, but dropship pilots provided no-feedback for months, defended a imbalanced vehicle and then screamed that rattati was a sh*t like a bunch of feet-stamping children when he brought it to heel. Sympathy for your plight is in rather short supply. Pilots have given feedback plenty, there was even a thread about being ignored where we actually got acknowledged by Rattati mentioning that he'd read the feedback (because without him saying, we have no indication.) As for foot stomping, that is a minority, as with HAV operators and AV users and any other subset of the community, not the majority of pilots. That said, Dropships - the overall class, not just ADSs - have tended to be neglected when people balance/rebalance V/AV. Often people will complain about HAVs being too tough to kill and ask for a buff without thinking about how that affects the already relatively fragile DS or LAV. And if you want to talk about sympathy, everyone has had periods of ridiculous OPness or droughts of UPness. There is absolutely zero benefit from truing to act superior about who's acted more childish, or who's most recently wielding the OP Stick. Alt of Halla Murr. Sentinel.
Alldin Kan Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1237	Posted - 2015.05.05 14:48:00 - [16] - Quote Bright Steel wrote: so I decided to throw on my *gastons* forge... I think I found your problem. Alldin Kan has joined the battle!
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 8393	Posted - 2015.05.05 14:55:00 - [17] - Quote Kallas Hallytyr wrote: Bright Steel wrote: Do you guys think this a good balance? I agree that one AV of the same their shouldn't take down a tank this was frustrating. I really hope you're not just wanting an out and out buff of FGs, since the only real issue with V/AV balance is Armour HAVs currently. Straight up buffs because of one element seriously hurts other areas: FGs and DSs have been pretty balanced for a long time, while Swarms have been insanely effective for ages and FGs vs HAVs have been up and down in balance. The issue stems from the great speed of HAVs and the periods of resilience. Reducing their speed and/or reducing their periods of resilience would do a world more good than just buffing FGs. If it was "Just" a push to buff FGs it would be dishonest and not inclusive of actual problems besides the interaction of ONE weapon versus one vehicle while ignoring the others. I think my problem is the blanket statement by certain parties of "that imbalance is perfectly ok and you should have to suck it up until I get what I want." There's never enough sh**posting going on, so let's add a few more teaspoons of the guy posting after me to the recipie!
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 8393	Posted - 2015.05.05 14:57:00 - [18] - Quote Kallas Hallytyr wrote: Breakin Stuff wrote: But no, I disagree that the infantry, who comprise the majority of the playerbase should have to suck up the HAV issue until a few players get their particular toy fixed.I hate to say this, but dropship pilots provided no-feedback for months, defended a imbalanced vehicle and then screamed that rattati was a sht like a bunch of feet-stamping children when he brought it to heel. Sympathy for your plight is in rather short supply. Pilots have given feedback plenty, there was even a thread about being ignored where we actually got acknowledged by Rattati mentioning that he'd read the feedback (because without him saying, we have no indication.) As for foot stomping, that is a minority, as with HAV operators and AV users and any other subset of the community, not the majority of pilots. That said, Dropships - the overall class, not just ADSs - have tended to be neglected when people balance/rebalance V/AV. Often people will complain about HAVs being too tough to kill and ask for a buff without thinking about how that affects the already relatively fragile DS or LAV. And if you want to talk about sympathy, everyone has had periods of ridiculous OPness or droughts of UPness. There is absolutely zero benefit from truing to act superior about who's acted more childish, or who's most recently wielding the OP Stick. considering the Av infantry have held that stick the least historically this post is a lot of high horse without realizing it's actually "riding" a Saw Horse. There's never enough sh*posting going on, so let's add a few more teaspoons of the guy posting after me to the recipie!
Bright Steel Horizons' Edge 1249	Posted - 2015.05.05 15:10:00 - [19] - Quote I think we were in a good spot before. The double hardened repping tanks is what has thrown us off... But I'm not an expert by no means Dust 514, the BEST WORST game you can't stop playing.
CeeJ Mantis Mantodea MC 181	Posted - 2015.05.05 17:09:00 - [20] - Quote Bright Steel wrote: Getting tired of these tanks driving around with immunity so I decided to throw on my gastons forge and show them something... Had three complex heavy damage mods on my proto min sentinel and given I got his attention, he shrugged it off and drove away.... Multiple times. And the only time we almost poped him was when two other swarms were helping. I just don't like the idea of officer forge only driving away a tank.. I could bust through his reps but slowly... After about five minutes of peek-a-boo the other guy with swarms got snipped by a Thales so I put my officer suit away... Do you guys think this a good balance? I agree that one AV of the same their shouldn't take down a tank this was frustrating. Had a match where my squad decided to stop the enemy's proto tanks, and my gastons, 1 aldin, and a wirikomi breach was often insufficient to crack a tank. They can easily cover 200+ meters tonget out of range, and 1 tank took over 10 shots while doing so and escaped. My corp merchant says he can't sell his officer forges. Hell, against a proto armor tank, even my Kubo's are just a cute toy. Laser strikes aren't too effective either. Tankers are happy that they got their wish, and but teamwork, or av nade traps are they only way to kill them. Takes the fun out of maxing the FG tree, and the use of shiny things. Longest plasma cannon kill: 236.45m



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