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Takahiro Kashuken
Red Star.
4246
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Posted - 2015.03.17 13:55:00 -
[1] - Quote
So we are not getting Prototype hulls just Standard++ and that is the best we can hope for really since CCP cannot decide between tiercide and giving us actual tiers to progress through.
The problem with this is that because HAV have been changed 1st it knocks everything out of whack between vehicles and AV.
AV is currently crying that they don't get a kill for looking at my vehicle and sending me more hate mail even though i dropped 61mil SP into vehicles and my fit costs 1.1mil per fit while i have gunners effectively making it 3 in a vehicle. So more AV pops up which in turn reduces all DS and LAV to ash and makes them and that particular playstyle useless unless you like staying at the flight celing.
If AV gets nerfed to give DS and LAV a chance then they will cry that it takes more shots/people to kill a HAV. I really don't mind this, it gives DS a chance to fight but also if i have 3man HAV then it may take 3 AV to kill it which is fair because AV preach 1:1 ratio all the time. Problem is AV flat out refuses to take a nerf on anything and it should be the end all to vehicles but right now they recieved a few buffs and anymore buffs to deal with the 'new' HAVs effectively kills everything even more which is even worse.
So the proposal is this - All vehicles have the same slot layout for that race.
The Caldari Basic HAV is 5 High and 2 Low, Currently the LAV is 2H/1L and the DS is 4H/2L
With the proposal the DS would become 5H/2L and the LAV 5H/2L
Gallente vehicles would be HAV 3H/4L, DS 3H/4L, LAV 3H/4L
Now the PG/CPU for DS and LAV would also need to be buffed so they can make use of them extra slots, overall because they can fit more tank aswell as other modules it might actually help them regain a place in the battlefied.
It also does counter the problem of having different slot layouts but still being easily taken out by AV because it is at a powerlevel for combating HAVs and nothing else since the HAV are supposed to be the hardest vehicle to take out.
The main problem i can think is that AV wants even more buffs to counter this change which then leads us back to where we are now which would be death to all vehicles which would be no progression at all.
Thoughts?
Disclaimer:
The above post is respectful, contains no ranting, contains no personal attacks, contains no trolling, contains no racism, contains no discrimination, contains no profanity, contains no spamming. This post is an opinion and is related to DUST514
CCP Rattati - "One giant vehicle nerf with more power to AV", you have got to be kidding...''
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DarthJT5
Random Gunz
331
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Posted - 2015.03.17 14:20:00 -
[2] - Quote
I very much agree. I also made a thread about this a while back here. Some of the things I suggested, like LAV HP nerf, has already happened. They still need an increase in slots
Dedicated Shield Tanking vet since Open Beta.
Veteran Python Pilot for 1 year.
The awnser is always XT missiles....
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Takahiro Kashuken
Red Star.
4256
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Posted - 2015.03.17 16:21:00 -
[3] - Quote
DarthJT5 wrote:I very much agree. I also made a thread about this a while back here. Some of the things I suggested, like LAV HP nerf, has already happened. They still need an increase in slots
I can't think of any other way to balance vehicles with each other and AV at the same time, AV will not take a nerf in any shape or form so other vehicles can come back into the game.
Disclaimer:
The above post is respectful, contains no ranting, contains no personal attacks, contains no trolling, contains no racism, contains no discrimination, contains no profanity, contains no spamming. This post is an opinion and is related to DUST514
CCP Rattati - "One giant vehicle nerf with more power to AV", you have got to be kidding...''
|
Takahiro Kashuken
Red Star.
4284
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Posted - 2015.03.19 12:03:00 -
[4] - Quote
Bump.
Need more thoughts on this.
Disclaimer:
The above post is respectful, contains no ranting, contains no personal attacks, contains no trolling, contains no racism, contains no discrimination, contains no profanity, contains no spamming. This post is an opinion and is related to DUST514
CCP Rattati - "One giant vehicle nerf with more power to AV", you have got to be kidding...''
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
7667
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Posted - 2015.03.19 12:09:00 -
[5] - Quote
Assuming I don't get reactionary response I'm aiming for six-seven shots for a maxed IAFG range for killing a maddy with hardeners up assuming same-tier pro vs. Pro. No weakspot shots. Assuming no misses from start to finish.
I'm against buffing alpha because that'd slam the nail on yhe dropship coffin. Period.
I actually agree with your active mod proposal. It would justify tweaking RoF stats (except swarms, I cannot see a way to balance the damn things as-is).
I think I figured out how to make swarms dumbfire without repeating the four-missile anti infantry shotgun of beta.We'll see if I can refine the idea into something that doesn't result in abomination.
AV
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Derpty Derp
Dead Man's Game
930
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Posted - 2015.03.19 12:21:00 -
[6] - Quote
My thoughts are vehicle vs AV are pretty close to fine...
My best fit LAV dies in 2 hits if the hardener is down (3 or 4 with.)
I solo'd a few Gunnlogi's earlier with a forge gun (didn't even use grenades.)
I downed a few tanks with my LAV (Small turret.)
My balanced ads (Bus) build can finally survive 3 of protato's finest swarms (as long as the hardener is up.)
,,, I could go on with how a lot of things are quite nice.
But instead I'd like people to stop bitching about how AV needs a buff to take out the OP builds available for the Madruga (possibly for dual hardened Gunni's as well.)
Lets just focus on ironing out those issues (hopefully quickly, because I would like to do something other than suicide jeep the whole match.) Then we can see if thar be balance with the AV.
Also, AV grenades people... Use them. |
Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
7667
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Posted - 2015.03.19 13:54:00 -
[7] - Quote
The gunnlogi and madrugar stated as op is subjective.
You soloed a gunnlogi. Congratulations. Soloing a tank requires the driver to be a complete dumbass, despite all wiseass commentary I give. Gunner skill is really not a factor.
Nerfung the crap out of HAVs is not the damn answer, especially not after they were just altered the developmental equivalent of five minutes ago.
Especially not when the removal of the shield fitting nerfs would set the damn HAVs perfectly for introducing and iteratively balancing AV parity.
Blanket calling the HAV builds OP is not a constructive idea.
AV needs to be tweaked. Dropships need to have some of their glaring mechanical issues looked at in turn.
This is a process, there's not going to be any instant fixes.
AV
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Spkr4theDead
Red Star.
3083
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Posted - 2015.03.19 15:19:00 -
[8] - Quote
Breakin Stuff wrote:Assuming I don't get reactionary response I'm aiming for six-seven shots for a maxed IAFG range for killing a maddy with hardeners up assuming same-tier pro vs. Pro. No weakspot shots. Assuming no misses from start to finish.
I'm against buffing alpha because that'd slam the nail on yhe dropship coffin. Period.
I actually agree with your active mod proposal. It would justify tweaking RoF stats (except swarms, I cannot see a way to balance the damn things as-is).
I think I figured out how to make swarms dumbfire without repeating the four-missile anti infantry shotgun of beta.We'll see if I can refine the idea into something that doesn't result in abomination.
I'm aiming for tanks to counter tanks.
I'd love to see you explain your problems with that.
Nope. Confirming that pilot input is not, and never was, valued. - Breakin Stuff
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
7669
|
Posted - 2015.03.19 15:33:00 -
[9] - Quote
Spkr4theDead wrote:Breakin Stuff wrote:Assuming I don't get reactionary response I'm aiming for six-seven shots for a maxed IAFG range for killing a maddy with hardeners up assuming same-tier pro vs. Pro. No weakspot shots. Assuming no misses from start to finish.
I'm against buffing alpha because that'd slam the nail on yhe dropship coffin. Period.
I actually agree with your active mod proposal. It would justify tweaking RoF stats (except swarms, I cannot see a way to balance the damn things as-is).
I think I figured out how to make swarms dumbfire without repeating the four-missile anti infantry shotgun of beta.We'll see if I can refine the idea into something that doesn't result in abomination. I'm aiming for tanks to counter tanks. I'd love to see you explain your problems with that.
I have no problem with that. I have a problem with your assertion that nothing else should counter tanks.
Care to explain why HAVs should automatically be immune to dedicated attack by people who aren't lazy about SP or fittings to counter vehicles?
You know, with logic And provable evidence?
AV
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Derpty Derp
Dead Man's Game
935
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Posted - 2015.03.19 15:53:00 -
[10] - Quote
Breakin Stuff wrote:Blanket calling the HAV builds OP is not a constructive idea.
Well I'd call them 'immortal' if not for the fact I know they die when you maul a jihaad up their arse.
I've pointed out the obvious problems with hardeners in many a thread, I don't see the need to post it everywhere. |
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Maiden selena MORTIMOR
Amarr Templars
Amarr Empire
337
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Posted - 2015.03.19 15:57:00 -
[11] - Quote
Very much agree
no im not a mortedeamor alt..im her slave
When my master is banned I represent her wishes and that of the Mortimor famil
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Maiden selena MORTIMOR
Amarr Templars
Amarr Empire
338
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Posted - 2015.03.19 16:00:00 -
[12] - Quote
Derpty Derp wrote:My thoughts are vehicle vs AV are pretty close to fine...
My best fit LAV dies in 2 hits if the hardener is down (3 or 4 with.)
I solo'd a few Gunnlogi's earlier with a forge gun (didn't even use grenades.)
I downed a few tanks with my LAV (Small turret.)
My balanced ads (Bus) build can finally survive 3 of protato's finest swarms (as long as the hardener is up.)
,,, I could go on with how a lot of things are quite nice.
But instead I'd like people to stop bitching about how AV needs a buff to take out the OP builds available for the Madruga (possibly for dual hardened Gunni's as well.)
Lets just focus on ironing out those issues (hopefully quickly, because I would like to do something other than suicide jeep the whole match.) Then we can see if thar be balance with the AV.
Also, AV grenades people... Use them.
I agree people in dust always whine whenever tanks are balanced because they don't wanna put forth real av effort
no im not a mortedeamor alt..im her slave
When my master is banned I represent her wishes and that of the Mortimor famil
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Takahiro Kashuken
Red Star.
4331
|
Posted - 2015.03.20 01:15:00 -
[13] - Quote
Breakin Stuff wrote:Assuming I don't get reactionary response I'm aiming for six-seven shots for a maxed IAFG range for killing a maddy with hardeners up assuming same-tier pro vs. Pro. No weakspot shots. Assuming no misses from start to finish.
I'm against buffing alpha because that'd slam the nail on yhe dropship coffin. Period.
I actually agree with your active mod proposal. It would justify tweaking RoF stats (except swarms, I cannot see a way to balance the damn things as-is).
I think I figured out how to make swarms dumbfire without repeating the four-missile anti infantry shotgun of beta.We'll see if I can refine the idea into something that doesn't result in abomination.
10+ Shots, but base HP and skills got nerfed/taken away so i wont see that again.
I miss the days where i could actually fight a HAV battle without AV claiming which side would win after firing a clip.
AV still decides far too much in the way of vehicle battles.
Disclaimer:
The above post is respectful, contains no ranting, contains no personal attacks, contains no trolling, contains no racism, contains no discrimination, contains no profanity, contains no spamming. This post is an opinion and is related to DUST514
CCP Rattati - "One giant vehicle nerf with more power to AV", you have got to be kidding...''
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Thaddeus Reynolds
Facepunch Security
225
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Posted - 2015.03.20 01:45:00 -
[14] - Quote
I agree with the idea of DSs and LAVs getting expanded slot layouts (and just standardizing them on racial lines)...
I'm not sure where balance lines need to be drawn right now though, there are so many variables that modify possible balance equations, shields probably will need a buff (or at least the nerfs to them undone), and the 80GJ railguns need to be just as viable without a heat-sink as the 80GJ blasters are without one.
There are a lot of issues with vehicles right now, but we're still in the middle of the changes over all
Khanid Logi and Tanker, sometimes AV Heavy or Sniper.
Vehicle Re-vamp Proposal
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Takahiro Kashuken
Red Star.
4370
|
Posted - 2015.03.21 13:16:00 -
[15] - Quote
Back to the top
Disclaimer:
The above post is respectful, contains no ranting, contains no personal attacks, contains no trolling, contains no racism, contains no discrimination, contains no profanity, contains no spamming. This post is an opinion and is related to DUST514
CCP Rattati - "One giant vehicle nerf with more power to AV", you have got to be kidding...''
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