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Atom Heart Mother
Nazionali Senza Filtro
147
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Posted - 2015.01.29 08:35:00 -
[1] - Quote
15 % of a 30 meters scout range are 4,5 meters. This value on the minimap is inconsistent and makes the modules quite useless...and you, yes you who think these new stats are good, you are a fool. |
Stupid Blueberry
Pure Evil.
Capital Punishment.
980
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Posted - 2015.01.29 08:38:00 -
[2] - Quote
Switched range amps for Kin cats on all my fittings that had them. The hammer sung too hard.
Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu.
Haajakin Kalen.
Blueberry smokin' that crack y'all
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Atom Heart Mother
Nazionali Senza Filtro
147
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Posted - 2015.01.29 08:51:00 -
[3] - Quote
I did the same bro, this nerf was really unwise  |
pegasis prime
BIG BAD W0LVES
1987
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Posted - 2015.01.29 08:55:00 -
[4] - Quote
With 1 complex range amp my cal scout can see up to 51m but with the nerf as to how the tack net works I can't even pick up an assault withing that rangeb
Proud Caldari purist . Rank 10 colonel omiwarrior.
I fought and bled for the State on Caldari prime.
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Arkena Wyrnspire
Fatal Absolution
21413
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Posted - 2015.01.29 08:59:00 -
[5] - Quote
They're just terrible. They didn't need to be nerfed anywhere near this much, if at all.
Vote 'Keshava' for a new Gallente vehicle name!
Gallente Guide to DUST
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Vicious Minotaur
1896
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Posted - 2015.01.29 09:00:00 -
[6] - Quote
Stupid Blueberry wrote:The hammer sung too hard.
I wish my hammers could sing...
I am a minotaur.
a+üa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa+üa¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça¦ça+üa+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+¦a+üa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa+üa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ëa¦ë
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Oswald Banecroft II
Muteki Armati Virium
61
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Posted - 2015.01.29 09:07:00 -
[7] - Quote
I support this thread and/or movement.
Vicious Minotaur wrote:Stupid Blueberry wrote:The hammer sung too hard. I wish my hammers could sing... Hit metal with them and they will.
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Sgt Kirk
Fatal Absolution
9364
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Posted - 2015.01.29 10:26:00 -
[8] - Quote
They always seem to nerf things that were causing no issue but leave other **** running rampant a lot
Vote 'Keshava' for the new Gallente HAV name!
~Democracy will win!
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Sinboto Simmons
Dead Man's Game
RUST415
7488
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Posted - 2015.01.29 11:17:00 -
[9] - Quote
Had two complex the other day, couldn't tell the difference.
Sinboto - The True Blood Minja
Forum Warrior level 5 Prof 2
Born of the Brutor tribe
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Mregomies
Beer For Evil Mercs
324
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Posted - 2015.01.29 11:23:00 -
[10] - Quote
Atom Heart Mother wrote:15 % of a 30 meters scout range are 4,5 meters. This value on the minimap is inconsistent and makes the modules quite useless...and you, yes you who think these new stats are good, you are a fool.
No... they aren't useless... I have 2 cmplx precis and 1 cmplx range in my ck.0 "TACsr" scout and I can avoid to be killed from behind easily.
Suomi, Finland, PERKELE!
Logibro
Logibro2
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Clone D
1425
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Posted - 2015.01.29 11:48:00 -
[11] - Quote
The close/med/far range implementation had a huge impact on scouts:
1. Everyone can see a scout in close range by default.
An undampened scout can be scanned by any other dropsuit within 3m-5m. This effectively forces a scout to dampen below the 20db threshold so that they won't be detected while hacking cloaked.
2. If scouts are dampened, then that doesn't leave enough/any high slots for range amps.
Scouts are squishy, and if they're going to try to move in a concealed way, then they need information about where potential enemies might be able to spot them, so that they can avoid being blapped in one or two shots. If you're dampening and range amplifying, then you certainly don't have room to armor tank, so you'll be dead before you know it. Scouts need scan range to play their role well.
3. close/med/far scan range nerfed the scout's default scan range too much.
Scan precision between 10m-20m was nerfed, effectively halving the default scan range for the scan precision of scouts.
I would recommend the following adjustments:
Change default scout range from 4/10/20 to 4/15/20.
Change default scan precision so that scouts can afford to dampen + use range amps:
- Light Frames:
Scout: Close/Medium/Far = 20/40/52 --> 27.5/40/52
Basic: Close/Medium/Far = 20/40/52 --> 27.5/40/52
- Medium Frames:
Logistics: Close/Medium/Far = 22.5/45/58.5 --> 30/45/58.5
Assault: Close/Medium/Far = 22.5/45/58.5 --> 30/45/58.5
Basic: Close/Medium/Far = 22.5/45/58.5 --> 30/45/58.5
- Heavy Frames:
Commando: Close/Medium/Far = 27.5/55/71.5 --> 35/55/71.5
Sentinel: Close/Medium/Far = 25/50/65 --> 32.5/50/65
Basic: Close/Medium/Far = 25/50/65 --> 32.5/50/65 |
Baal Omniscient
Qualified Scrub
2143
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Posted - 2015.01.29 12:08:00 -
[12] - Quote
Clone D wrote:The close/med/far range implementation had a huge impact on scouts:
1. Everyone can see a scout in close range by default.
An undampened scout can be scanned by any other dropsuit within 3m-5m. This effectively forces a scout to dampen below the 20db threshold so that they won't be detected while hacking cloaked.
2. If scouts are dampened, then that doesn't leave enough/any high slots for range amps.
Scouts are squishy, and if they're going to try to move in a concealed way, then they need information about where potential enemies might be able to spot them, so that they can avoid being blapped in one or two shots. If you're dampening and range amplifying, then you certainly don't have room to armor tank, so if you're hit then you'll be dead before you know it. Scouts need scan range to play their role well.
3. close/med/far scan range nerfed the scout's default scan range too much.
Scan precision between 10m-20m was nerfed, effectively halving the default scan range for the scan precision of scouts.
I would recommend the following adjustments:
Change default scout range from 4/10/20 to 4/15/20.
Change default scan precision so that scouts can afford to dampen + use range amps:
- Light Frames:
Scout: Close/Medium/Far = 20/40/52 --> 27.5/40/52
Basic: Close/Medium/Far = 20/40/52 --> 27.5/40/52
- Medium Frames:
Logistics: Close/Medium/Far = 22.5/45/58.5 --> 30/45/58.5
Assault: Close/Medium/Far = 22.5/45/58.5 --> 30/45/58.5
Basic: Close/Medium/Far = 22.5/45/58.5 --> 30/45/58.5
- Heavy Frames:
Commando: Close/Medium/Far = 27.5/55/71.5 --> 35/55/71.5
Sentinel: Close/Medium/Far = 25/50/65 --> 32.5/50/65
Basic: Close/Medium/Far = 25/50/65 --> 32.5/50/65
The problem was and is that if a scout has too good base ewar, they are free to tank all of their slots with no drawbacks, or tank ewar either high or low and HP tank the other side, when scouts are SUPPOSED TO BE squishy. Players playing their role aren't an issue, it's the people exploiting the other advantages that come along with those bonuses to play a light assault with all around better non-eHP base stats.
Once you show me a way to balance for that, I have no issue with giving scouts better base ewar or buffing ewar modules.
Winmatar Assault, Proficiency 5 SMG's & Proficiency 5 Swarms Since Uprising 1.0
I GÖú Puppies
(Gê¬n+Ç-´)GèâGöüGÿån+ƒ.*pâ+n+ín+ƒ.
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axis alpha
Namtar Elite
Gallente Federation
524
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Posted - 2015.01.29 13:11:00 -
[13] - Quote
My amarr scout is pissed yo.
I cut you up so bad.... You gonna wish I no cut you up so bad.
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Vulpes Dolosus
Molon Labe.
General Tso's Alliance
2911
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Posted - 2015.01.29 13:19:00 -
[14] - Quote
Change the ranges to 25/75/100%.
Amps to 1.2-1.25 at proto
Scout base range to 25m.
As things are now, a Logi suit can passive scan just as effectively as Cal scout in terms of range and effective precision (both can scan assaults and can't scan scouts).
Dust is there! I was real!
Dear diary, Rattati senpai noticed me today~
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Starlight Burner
ROGUE RELICS
VP Gaming Alliance
97
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Posted - 2015.01.29 14:21:00 -
[15] - Quote
I think scouts are just fine right now.
Besides speed strafing being an issue, scouts are good at the moment.
Thank god for CCP Rattati!!
Rogue Relics is my home away from home.
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Adipem Nothi
Nos Nothi
6161
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Posted - 2015.01.29 15:22:00 -
[16] - Quote
Atom Heart Mother wrote:Range Amps need buff as it was before ...
Nopes. Fixing the range mod would break more than it'd fix.
* Would render useless and ineffective all niche "backstab" classes.
* Would further break an already broken Heavy+Logi blob.
* Would return the "360 wallhack scans" which we'd previously ruled to be bad for the game.
Don't get me wrong. I agree 100% that range amps are presently not worth fitting. But if we do want to fix the module, we must first account for the above, else we'll do more harm than good. If you think PC Heavy Spam is bad now (which you should), just imagine if we augmented them with omniscience.
Shoot scout with yes.
- Ripley Riley
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Boll Spirit
Iberica Racing Team
44
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Posted - 2015.01.29 17:56:00 -
[17] - Quote
We are completely blind , even not using cloak , i think sensors are not working properly from last update , i mean how is possible i cannot detect heavies or assaults that are just behind me or very close to me ? ( full skilled scout ), we are supposed to be scouts , sensors are our strength and a scout has to evaluate previously the enviroment to determinate that if one action is safe or not , we need information to play our role well ... fix it , balance it , do something CCP , why scouts hat to live in a second age of darkness ... |
Clone D
1427
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Posted - 2015.01.29 20:24:00 -
[18] - Quote
Baal Omniscient wrote:The problem was and is that if a scout has too good base ewar, they are free to tank all of their slots with no drawbacks, or tank ewar either high or low and HP tank the other side, when scouts are SUPPOSED TO BE squishy. Players playing their role aren't an issue, it's the people exploiting the other advantages that come along with those bonuses to play a light assault with all around better non-eHP base stats.
Once you show me a way to balance for that, I have no issue with giving scouts better base ewar or buffing ewar modules.
If CCP wanted to limit the kind of modules that a scout could fit, then they could add controls to reject invalid module types.
As it is right now, scouts are uber weak at ewar, which is an area in which they should excel. You can tell when you end up with a bunch of threads saying how weak scout ewar is since 1.10.
As it stands now, if ewar is so weak, then of course scouts will choose the more effective options: eHP and speed. By making scout ewar weak, you're essentially pushing them toward eHP tanking. |
Darken-Sol
BIG BAD W0LVES
1774
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Posted - 2015.01.29 21:03:00 -
[19] - Quote
Sgt Kirk wrote:They always seem to nerf things that were causing no issue but leave other **** running rampant a lot
Because forum warriors usually have no clue what goes on in a real fight.
Crush them
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Joel II X
Bacon with a bottle of Quafe
5849
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Posted - 2015.01.29 21:26:00 -
[20] - Quote
Darken-Sol wrote:Sgt Kirk wrote:They always seem to nerf things that were causing no issue but leave other **** running rampant a lot Because forum warriors usually have no clue what goes on in a real fight.
Haha, it's true! Even when I'm in a match, I have no idea what the hell is going on!  |
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