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HOLY PERFECTION
G.L.O.R.Y General Tso's Alliance
4
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Posted - 2015.01.13 03:21:00 -
[1] - Quote
Logis are really underpowered due to problems with light suits. Light suits, mostly scouts, have too much armor and too many equipment slots. A scout can run around like "Mario" and kill everything with RE`s and shotguns. Now that is understandable to a point to where you cannot even a hitmarker in him. Going back to the point scouts have too many equipment slots and too much armor. Top three reasons why scouts are taking over a logis job:
1) Too many equipment slots
2) Way too much armor
3) Too small/ fast to even get a hitmarker on them.
Now its not the scouts fault, mainly logistics are really underpowered suit wise. By this I mean they DO NOT have enough armor and shield. A logis job is to help its team out any way necessary. 95% of the time your right by the enemy all the time. So when you get bombarded by shotguns, mass drivers, grenades, heavys, plasma cannons, RE`s ( Remote Explosives), and rail rifles it gets annoying really fast. So logis need more armor and shields because they take most of the hits.
HERE ARE SOME SOLUTIONS BELOW THAT YOU CAN LOOK AT AND AGREE/DISAGREE AND MAKE SUGGESTIONS
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1uXwapEw8FS3snKaSblL-ZOYzd3XpW5kTEzoA-HqnuQw/edit?usp=sharing
I know i posted this in another category, but I posted in the wrong catagory CCP
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Joel II X
Bacon with a bottle of Quafe
5463
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Posted - 2015.01.13 03:26:00 -
[2] - Quote
Logis have more bandwidth, starter health, and range.
On the other hand, scouts have their speed and profiles.
Dazzit really |
One Eyed King
Land of the BIind
7155
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Posted - 2015.01.13 03:30:00 -
[3] - Quote
Sounds more like a "Nerf the Scout" thread.
Those have become passe.
You are a month or two too late.
Thunderbolt. verb and noun.
"James thunderbolted in his pants."
"I lit a bag of thunderbolt on fire on CCP's doorway"
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HOLY PERFECTION
G.L.O.R.Y General Tso's Alliance
4
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Posted - 2015.01.13 03:30:00 -
[4] - Quote
ohh hey joel i think i played with you before in DOPENESS chat channel |
HOLY PERFECTION
G.L.O.R.Y General Tso's Alliance
4
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Posted - 2015.01.13 03:33:00 -
[5] - Quote
One Eyed King wrote:Sounds more like a "Nerf the Scout" thread.
Those have become passe.
You are a month or two too late.
Ya, but really the main point of the paragraph was to try and promote logis. I got anxious to post the graph, it took me a good hour to perfect and think it through. |
7th Son 7
Chatelain Rapid Response Gallente Federation
301
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Posted - 2015.01.13 03:40:00 -
[6] - Quote
HOLY PERFECTION wrote:Logis are really underpowered due to problems with light suits. Light suits, mostly scouts, have too much armor and too many equipment slots. A scout can run around like "Mario" and kill everything with RE`s and shotguns. Now that is understandable to a point to where you cannot even a hitmarker in him. Going back to the point scouts have too many equipment slots and too much armor. Top three reasons why scouts are taking over a logis job: 1) Too many equipment slots 2) Way too much armor 3) Too small/ fast to even get a hitmarker on them. Now its not the scouts fault, mainly logistics are really underpowered suit wise. By this I mean they DO NOT have enough armor and shield. A logis job is to help its team out any way necessary. 95% of the time your right by the enemy all the time. So when you get bombarded by shotguns, mass drivers, grenades, heavys, plasma cannons, RE`s ( Remote Explosives), and rail rifles it gets annoying really fast. So logis need more armor and shields because they take most of the hits. HERE ARE SOME SOLUTIONS BELOW THAT YOU CAN LOOK AT AND AGREE/DISAGREE AND MAKE SUGGESTIONS https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1uXwapEw8FS3snKaSblL-ZOYzd3XpW5kTEzoA-HqnuQw/edit?usp=sharingI know i posted this in another category, but I posted in the wrong catagory CCP
Being serious: What if the Logis recieved another equipment slot? would you like that?
Conduct on the battlefield is the ultimate measure of a man
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Stupid Blueberry
Hyasyoda Terrestrial Acquisitions Firm
880
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Posted - 2015.01.13 03:43:00 -
[7] - Quote
Needs an hp buff. Or something. Feels like their hitbox is too big, at least the Min Logi's is.
Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu.
Haajakin Kalen.
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One Eyed King
Land of the BIind
7156
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Posted - 2015.01.13 03:49:00 -
[8] - Quote
HOLY PERFECTION wrote:One Eyed King wrote:Sounds more like a "Nerf the Scout" thread.
Those have become passe.
You are a month or two too late. Ya, but really the main point of the paragraph was to try and promote logis. I got anxious to post the graph, it took me a good hour to perfect and think it through. I think it is reasonable that they need a speed/HP alignment.
They are too slow for having too low of an HP.
Thunderbolt. verb and noun.
"James thunderbolted in his pants."
"I lit a bag of thunderbolt on fire on CCP's doorway"
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Vitantur Nothus
Nos Nothi
1673
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Posted - 2015.01.13 03:52:00 -
[9] - Quote
One Eyed King wrote: I think it is reasonable that they need a speed/HP alignment.
They are too slow for having too low of an HP.
And Assaults are too fast for having high HP. Switcheroo? |
Mejt0
Dead Man's Game RUST415
689
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Posted - 2015.01.13 06:41:00 -
[10] - Quote
Logi = support support /= hp/defense monster
Loyal to State. Led by Tibus Heth.
Not scared of death [like Admiral Yakiya Tobil-Toba].
Honour and Mission over money
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Jathniel
G I A N T
1409
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Posted - 2015.01.13 06:50:00 -
[11] - Quote
Lets not forget. Logis were better than Assaults. All a Logi had to do was give up a sidearm, and it was allowed to have equipment, comparable HP, and more overall versatility.
If we buff Logis HP, they will simply overshadow Assaults again.
Instead of HP values, I would instead argue for giving Logis more tactical equipment options. Instead of just being an uplink, ammo, rez and rep provider, consider creating more equipment that Logis can specifically fit.
I proposed a deployable stationary cloak field. Throw it down like a nanohive, and any friendly within radius is hidden. Or deployable barrier fields, that Logis can croch behind to cover their flanks while they rez and/or rep someone; or that can be used to reinforce a position. Or give Logis deployable drones, or tactical turrets that they can set up.
Basically, give Logis equipment that THEY can use. Generate equipment content for Logis.
Retired
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tal mrak-thanl
Aethan Dor
25
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Posted - 2015.01.13 07:12:00 -
[12] - Quote
Stupid Blueberry wrote: Feels like their hitbox is too big, at least the Min Logi's is.
This is true, the min logi's hitbox is approximately 3X the size of the actual dropsuit. Also, logi suits are magnetized, and attract bullets and grenades, even around corners. Furthermore, I'm fairly certain that logis show up on the HUD as a flashing red target with three arrows pointing at it, I can't be sure though, as I'm usually too busy dying in a RE hailstorm and respawning under HMG fire to actually look at the HUD.
At the end of the day, I don't really mind the logi's soft spots, especially when I'm spending my countless millions of triage SP. |
Jack McReady
DUST University Ivy League
1773
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Posted - 2015.01.13 08:28:00 -
[13] - Quote
the only logi that worked for me was the minmatar logi because I could fit EHP which was about the base hp of a commando and still run proto equip. I used a sidearm to save fittings though!
as always I can only repeat the following in this regard: 1. logis need hp 2. what logis do not need is fitting flexibility comperable to a scout in terms of hi or low slots
their base stats and slot layout should be commando like except with 4 equipment slots at proto, medium ewar and current logi mobility.
fixed. |
Assert Dominance
Ahrendee Mercenaries
749
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Posted - 2015.01.13 08:47:00 -
[14] - Quote
youre probably just a bad logi...
LogicGäó
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Meee One
Amakakeru-Ryu-no-Hirameki
1471
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Posted - 2015.01.13 08:50:00 -
[15] - Quote
Jack McReady wrote:the only logi that worked for me was the minmatar logi because I could fit EHP which was about the base hp of a commando and still run proto equip. I used a sidearm to save fittings though!
as always I can only repeat the following in this regard: 1. logis need hp 2. what logis do not need is fitting flexibility comperable to a scout in terms of hi or low slots
their base stats and slot layout should be commando like except with 4 equipment slots at proto, medium ewar and current logi mobility.
fixed. "I don't run logistics,but imma comment anyway"
Mmm hmm,i can tell with how excited you are about taking logistics slots away.
Have you forgotten that assaults have 8-9 slots, 100 more eHP yet are the same speedas basics ?
I can tell you don't run logistics,because your suggestion would serve to make logistics even easier to be killed,and your omitting the fact that there are supposed to be equipment modules in the works.
And those modules will require the slots you are so eager to get removed.
Official Blueberry of the Forums.
Title given by my #1 fan Sgt Kirk.
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LAVALLOIS Nash
426
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Posted - 2015.01.13 09:23:00 -
[16] - Quote
You can frankenstein the ADV Amarr logi into alot of roles. PLC+AV nades+SMG/Magsec+mines makes a alright AV fit. Take that same suit, stack reps, damage mods and nice weapons....you got an assault fit that engage a maximum of 2 ADV fits at a time. Stack some plates and a triage hive and now you got a sniper fit.
Having Armor and Shield core skills maxed out helps too. |
Jack McReady
DUST University Ivy League
1774
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Posted - 2015.01.13 09:36:00 -
[17] - Quote
Meee One wrote:Jack McReady wrote:the only logi that worked for me was the minmatar logi because I could fit EHP which was about the base hp of a commando and still run proto equip. I used a sidearm to save fittings though!
as always I can only repeat the following in this regard: 1. logis need hp 2. what logis do not need is fitting flexibility comperable to a scout in terms of hi or low slots
their base stats and slot layout should be commando like except with 4 equipment slots at proto, medium ewar and current logi mobility.
fixed. "I don't run logistics,but imma comment anyway" Mmm hmm,i can tell with how excited you are about taking logistics slots away. Have you forgotten that assaults have 8-9 slots, 100 more eHP yet are the same speedas basics ? I can tell you don't run logistics,because your suggestion would serve to make logistics even easier to be killed, and your omitting the fact that there are supposed to be equipment modules in the works. And those modules will require the slots you are so eager to get removed. who would guess, another "forum wisdom" answer by yet another random scrubberry. you not only fail at reading but also at logic. what do you not comprehend about base stats compared to commandos interms of HP and hi/low slots? *looks at commandos BASE hp* *sees 800 hp on average* *looks at full proto equipment logi FULLY FITTED and barely hits 700 hp*
yes, on average 700 hp is the most you get out of a logistic suit if you do your job aka fit proto equipment and support your team. this is one shotgun blast to head away from going back to the clone factory.
and btw the things I have forgotten about logistic suits you have yet to learn |
MightyMedic
Forty-Nine Fedayeen Minmatar Republic
0
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Posted - 2015.01.13 09:40:00 -
[18] - Quote
I'd propose the same as someone else already posted, give logis more and varying types of equipment to carry. While increasing the PG/CPU of existing gear but giving logi's more bonus to decrease the cost, making it where other suits can still fit it but a more severe cost of other modules.
I'd also suggest racial parity to rep tools, nanite injectors, and remotes.
Caldari: Rep Tool: Decreases shield regen times when it's on the target while increase shield regen amount, nothing to armor. Nanite Injector: Increased shield upon recovery with a decrease in armor. Remote: Most Effective against armor
Gallente: Rep Tool: Increases armor rep amount nothing to shield. Nanite Injector: Increased armor amount upon recovery with little to no shield. Remote: Most Effective against shield, larger blast radius
Amarr: Rep Tool: Moderately better armor repair than shield but does both. Nanite Injector: Moderately better armor than shield on recovery. Remote: Effective against shield, larger blast radius.
Minmatar: Rep Tool: Moderately better shield regen than armor but does both. Nanite Injector: Moderately more shield than armor on recovery. Remote: Effective against armor, larger blast radius.
Neither Amarr or Minmatar effects shield regen timer.
Propose adding a deploy animation for remotes and do away with a throw capability.
Deployables:
Gallente: 360 degree scanner with a 5 degree rotating cone of detection.
Caldari: AOE Active profile dampener
Amarr: A pad to increase/decrease the spawn timers on a mobile CRU depending on it's control.
Minmatar: A pad to increase/decrease the hack speed of installations near by.
I'd also propose a few deployables that aren't racial, such as turrets, but would be a HUGE bandwidth hog, someone else mentioned. I'd also suggest a stationary profile dampener, stationary armor and shield regen points.
I'd also do away with all the logi bonuses, and change them to the racial rep tool and deployable.
I'd propose give the scanner and uplink bonuses to the scouts, but do away with the bonuses such as the nova knives and whatever the amarr scout. I'd decrease the passive scan bonuses of the scouts. I'd propose give the gallente and caldari scouts bonuses to active scanners while changing the Intel Kill assists WP to cover the entire team rather than just the squad. I'd give the amarr scouts the bonus to the uplinks and give Minmatar scouts more hacking bonuses, such as increasing the range of hack capability, removing the hack speed bonus and give a increased efficacy to code breakers, and increase profile dampening.
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hold that
Krusual Covert Operators Minmatar Republic
547
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Posted - 2015.01.13 11:31:00 -
[19] - Quote
logis are NEAR PERFECT wtf you talking about. man i need to stop coming on these forums. |
J0LLY R0G3R
And the ButtPirates
1765
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Posted - 2015.01.13 12:52:00 -
[20] - Quote
Support your team correct? Stay near your team. Support them. Just don't think because a scout jumped out you, you should look at him and he should die. That assault you should be around probably has 3 times the hp of the scout pestering you, the heavy.. more like 4.
At this point asking for more hp is just a cop out for bad situational awareness, bad squadplay, bad tactics.
I wish I could help ya but typing on this phone is jus annoying.
Stray from the pack at your own risk.
TLDR : Last Dust Montage
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Everything Dies
Same Dung Different Year
1171
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Posted - 2015.01.13 13:24:00 -
[21] - Quote
7th Son 7 wrote:
Being serious: What if the Logis recieved another equipment slot? would you like that?
Another equipment slot would be a total waste. You can't even fit a proto uplink and nanohive with a logi currently! Right now, my logi's main purpose is packing scanners--if I want to rep/revive someone, I can use a scout suit and at least enjoy the speed/sidearm/lower profile. Hell, a simple assault + repper combo is usually enough for most fights.
Mike Patton is the greatest singer in music. Proof
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One Eyed King
Land of the BIind
7168
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Posted - 2015.01.13 20:11:00 -
[22] - Quote
Vitantur Nothus wrote:One Eyed King wrote: I think it is reasonable that they need a speed/HP alignment.
They are too slow for having too low of an HP.
And Assaults are too fast for having high HP. Switcheroo? If not a direct switch, something like it.
I think in general there should be a correlation with HP and speed.
I think its unfair to both Commandos and Logis to be slower than other suits who have higher HP.
Thunderbolt. verb and noun.
"James thunderbolted in his pants."
"I lit a bag of thunderbolt on fire on CCP's doorway"
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Nonoriri ko
Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State
36
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Posted - 2015.01.13 20:23:00 -
[23] - Quote
My proto logi sits at 300 shields 800 armor. Another 500 shields would be nice.
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Leadfoot10
Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance
2865
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Posted - 2015.01.13 20:24:00 -
[24] - Quote
Hit detection on fast moving suits in low framerate situations has been problematic for a while now, and IMO it's one of the most game-breaking problems with Dust.
That said, I don't agree -- at all -- that logistics are UP. Why? Because even an average one can top the leaderboards with ease, and that has a tradeoff in that they are easier to kill -- as it should be, IMO. |
TEBOW BAGGINS
GREATNESS ACHIEVED THRU TROLLING
1550
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Posted - 2015.01.13 21:49:00 -
[25] - Quote
Jathniel wrote:Lets not forget. Logis were better than Assaults. All a Logi had to do was give up a sidearm, and it was allowed to have equipment, comparable HP, and more overall versatility.
If we buff Logis HP, they will simply overshadow Assaults again.
Instead of HP values, I would instead argue for giving Logis more tactical equipment options. Instead of just being an uplink, ammo, rez and rep provider, consider creating more equipment that Logis can specifically fit.
I proposed a deployable stationary cloak field. Throw it down like a nanohive, and any friendly within radius is hidden. Or deployable barrier fields, that Logis can croch behind to cover their flanks while they rez and/or rep someone; or that can be used to reinforce a position. Or give Logis deployable drones, or tactical turrets that they can set up.
Basically, give Logis equipment that THEY can use. Generate equipment content for Logis. there was serious talk once of adding a deployable bubble shield.. it should be reconsidered now with BW.. it could work if it had a super high PG/CPU BW.. the BW possibly so high that only a logi could fit one. i guess it could be destroyed after a tanking a certain threshold of damage, with proto taking the most damage to destroy.. but does it recharge.. i guess they abandoned the idea over all the complaints it could have caused..
AKA Zirzo Valcyn
AFKing since 2012
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cris bleu
Carbon 7 Iron Oxide.
58
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Posted - 2015.01.13 21:56:00 -
[26] - Quote
We have posts saying it's not fair that logisearn WP too fast comparedto other classes and posts saying that logis are too weak compared to other classes. My view is that the situation is a sensible trade off. I want the WP and I can accept that the suit should not be strong enough to start to drift into assault territory. Any buff to Louis should be small. Definitely not to ehp, but I agree that we could use a little more speed. |
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