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Loyalty Rank, how it should work.

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jhon hartigan Mannar Focused Warfare Gallente Federation 326	Posted - 2014.10.29 12:16:00 - [1] - Quote First of all some questions: How will Loyalty Rank work, CCP? I mean: how are you going to calculate it? Which are the stats you are going to use in the formula? Is your attempt to reward dedication or personal skills? Why am I asking? Because I want to discuss with CCP and forumers how Loyalty Ranks should work before they release it, to let them know how we would like it to work so they could eventually Fix it before the 4th of November. Lets take a look at the stats they send you if you ask for your account stats in a ticket. Assisted Kill, Assisted Kills in a Vehicle, Deaths, Kills, Losses, Objects hacked, Suicides, Wins, Player logon count, Total logon time (hours) We can add to this the total WP stat that we can find in game. All these stats are about how much you have played, your dedication to the game, the hours spent playing. There isnt a single stat that show players skill and his effectivness on the battlefield. Lets make an example: ......................................... Player A................... Player B Assisted Kills:................... 2.000......................... 1.000 Assisted Kills in a Vehicle:500..............................100 Deaths:................................20.000.........................5000 Kills:....................................40.000..........................30.000 WP:....................................4.000.000..................... 2.500.000 Losses:.................................2.000...........................750 Objects hacked:...................5.000..........................2.000 Wins:................................... 2.500.............................2.000 Tital logon time:.............. 4.000 hours......................1.000 Player A has spent 4x the time on the game than player B, so ha also has more Kills, Wins, WP, hacks... He looks better. But locking at the numbers we can clearly see how B is way more effective on the battlefield. If we math kills/WP/hacks per hour/match we can clearly see that B has higher numbers than A. Using Basic stat we reward pA with a higher rank, using stats per hour/match or kdr we reward B with a higher rank. Now: who should we reward? The skilled and effective player or the dedicated one? I'd say both should be rewarded. Be dedicated is important cause this is a Loyalty Rank and it should show Loyalty(really?) But this is a RANK, we will be able to see the Rank of other players, so it is more important if he is skilled, not if he has spent a lot of hours on the game. That's why I think player's skills and effectivness on the battlefield should be rewarded more than time spent on the game and Basic stats. Let me know what you think.
Horizon Limit Nexus Balusa Horizon 118	Posted - 2014.10.29 12:21:00 - [2] - Quote I guess it's more a time/objective based thing, hi-fi = better rank. Of course better stats will you help you rank up faster. Cal scout vs Cal scout
Jack Boost Zarena Family 480	Posted - 2014.10.29 12:58:00 - [3] - Quote From dev-blog: "Character will gain a Loyalty Rank based on your Lifetime Battles, Wins, War Points and Aurum spen t. " It will be probably: 1000 wp = 1 point in LR ( :) lets call this like here ) 1 AUR = 1 point in LR 1 battle = 1 point in LR 1 win = maybe 5 point in LR So.... beter buy a lot of AUR Not much time left...
jhon hartigan Mannar Focused Warfare Gallente Federation 327	Posted - 2014.10.29 20:09:00 - [4] - Quote Jack Boost wrote: From dev-blog: "Character will gain a Loyalty Rank based on your Lifetime Battles, Wins, War Points and Aurum spen t. " It will be probably: 1000 wp = 1 point in LR ( :) lets call this like here ) 1 AUR = 1 point in LR 1 battle = 1 point in LR 1 win = maybe 5 point in LR So.... beter buy a lot of AUR Calculating the Rank only with Wins, WP aur and Battles (even with different numbers than yours) would reward more players that have played more and and not players that are more skilled, that quote is what make me afraid, it doesn't speak about kills/match, wp/match and stuff like that.
Joseph Ridgeson WarRavens Capital Punishment. 2241	Posted - 2014.10.29 20:28:00 - [5] - Quote jhon hartigan wrote: Jack Boost wrote: From dev-blog: "Character will gain a Loyalty Rank based on your Lifetime Battles, Wins, War Points and Aurum spen t. " It will be probably: 1000 wp = 1 point in LR ( :) lets call this like here ) 1 AUR = 1 point in LR 1 battle = 1 point in LR 1 win = maybe 5 point in LR So.... beter buy a lot of AUR Calculating the Rank only with Wins, WP aur and Battles (even with different numbers than yours) would reward more players that have played more and and not players that are more skilled, that quote is what make me afraid, it doesn't speak about kills/match, wp/match and stuff like that. Loyalty =/= Skill. If someone is totally terrible at the game but keeps at it and tries their damnedest, I don't see why they should not be as well rewarded as an expert player. And, nooooo, this totally doesn't have any reason to do with my low KD/R, skill, and win rate and my terribly high Aurum spent. Nope, not at all. runs and hides "This is B.S! This is B.S! I paid money! Cash money, dollars money, cash money!"
Joel II X Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 4126	Posted - 2014.10.29 20:34:00 - [6] - Quote jhon hartigan wrote: Jack Boost wrote: From dev-blog: "Character will gain a Loyalty Rank based on your Lifetime Battles, Wins, War Points and Aurum spen t. " It will be probably: 1000 wp = 1 point in LR ( :) lets call this like here ) 1 AUR = 1 point in LR 1 battle = 1 point in LR 1 win = maybe 5 point in LR So.... beter buy a lot of AUR Calculating the Rank only with Wins, WP aur and Battles (even with different numbers than yours) would reward more players that have played more and and not players that are more skilled, that quote is what make me afraid, it doesn't speak about kills/match, wp/match and stuff like that. You mean to say loyalty ranks SHOULDN'T be based on loyalty?
jhon hartigan Mannar Focused Warfare Gallente Federation 327	Posted - 2014.10.29 20:55:00 - [7] - Quote Joel II X wrote: jhon hartigan wrote: Jack Boost wrote: From dev-blog: "Character will gain a Loyalty Rank based on your Lifetime Battles, Wins, War Points and Aurum spen t. " It will be probably: 1000 wp = 1 point in LR ( :) lets call this like here ) 1 AUR = 1 point in LR 1 battle = 1 point in LR 1 win = maybe 5 point in LR So.... beter buy a lot of AUR Calculating the Rank only with Wins, WP aur and Battles (even with different numbers than yours) would reward more players that have played more and and not players that are more skilled, that quote is what make me afraid, it doesn't speak about kills/match, wp/match and stuff like that. You mean to say loyalty ranks SHOULDN'T be based on loyalty? No, I created the thread to discuss it. My question is: should we only reward loyalty or skill too? I d say we should consider both these things, loyalty (means time spent in game) and skill/ effectivness too. That s just my opinion. Do you think we should only reward loyalty and not skill?
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 13929	Posted - 2014.10.29 20:57:00 - [8] - Quote Don't give a **** how it works. Only titles I'm interested in are ones that reflect loyalty to the Amarr or that I am primarily an HAV pilot. GÇ£How does this all work then?GÇ¥ GÇ£Like so Choirboy.GÇ¥ Mila to Kador, Sub Zero Club, Shoashu Sasaanko
Flint Beastgood III Carbon 7 Iron Oxide. 626	Posted - 2014.10.29 21:32:00 - [9] - Quote It's a loyalty rank, so it should reward loyalty. Being skilled provides it's own rewards - wins/SP/ISK/LP. EDIT: I believe total playtime should be factored into the equation too, because nothing says loyalty like playing through constant bugs and problems to support a product you have faith in. Yep
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution 8163	Posted - 2014.10.29 22:32:00 - [10] - Quote Flint Beastgood III wrote: It's a loyalty rank, so it should reward loyalty. Being skilled provides it's own rewards - wins/SP/ISK/LP. EDIT: I believe total playtime should be factored into the equation too, because nothing says loyalty like playing through constant bugs and problems to support a product you have faith in. it should be time deployed in a match and not just logged on. Because a lot of people just leave DUST 514 logged on on their between match time. CCP holds the Caldari's hand so this doesn't happen again.

True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 13936	Posted - 2014.10.29 23:53:00 - [11] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: Flint Beastgood III wrote: It's a loyalty rank, so it should reward loyalty. Being skilled provides it's own rewards - wins/SP/ISK/LP. EDIT: I believe total playtime should be factored into the equation too, because nothing says loyalty like playing through constant bugs and problems to support a product you have faith in. it should be time deployed in a match and not just logged on. Because a lot of people just leave DUST 514 logged on on their between match time. That screws us over since combined out wait times for FW must be in the hundreds high dozens of hours............ GÇ£How does this all work then?GÇ¥ GÇ£Like so Choirboy.GÇ¥ Mila to Kador, Sub Zero Club, Shoashu Sasaanko
Aero Yassavi Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 9040	Posted - 2014.10.30 00:02:00 - [12] - Quote This is a system to reward loyalty to Dust as a product, so really skill shouldn't even factor into it at all. Someone who is bad at the game can still be just as loyal as someone who is awesome at the game (like me :p). Hours played and aurum spent are huge reflections of your loyalty and faith in this product. However, what's to say if you were actually playing while logged in or AFK when that was a huge issue? That's the only reason the included other stats like kills and hacks into the equation I believe. Amarr are the good guys Join "PIE Ground Control" for secure Amarr FW syncing and orbital support
Aero Yassavi Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 9040	Posted - 2014.10.30 00:04:00 - [13] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: Flint Beastgood III wrote: It's a loyalty rank, so it should reward loyalty. Being skilled provides it's own rewards - wins/SP/ISK/LP. EDIT: I believe total playtime should be factored into the equation too, because nothing says loyalty like playing through constant bugs and problems to support a product you have faith in. it should be time deployed in a match and not just logged on. Because a lot of people just leave DUST 514 logged on on their between match time. That screws us over since combined out wait times for FW must be in the hundreds high dozens of hours............ Not only that, but all the organization and events that are ran through the game channels. Dust doesn't just happen while deployed. Amarr are the good guys Join "PIE Ground Control" for secure Amarr FW syncing and orbital support
wayrow1 Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 23	Posted - 2014.10.30 00:47:00 - [14] - Quote I should be a lord at least hehe lol
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution 8163	Posted - 2014.10.30 02:08:00 - [15] - Quote Aero Yassavi wrote: True Adamance wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: Flint Beastgood III wrote: It's a loyalty rank, so it should reward loyalty. Being skilled provides it's own rewards - wins/SP/ISK/LP. EDIT: I believe total playtime should be factored into the equation too, because nothing says loyalty like playing through constant bugs and problems to support a product you have faith in. it should be time deployed in a match and not just logged on. Because a lot of people just leave DUST 514 logged on on their between match time. That screws us over since combined out wait times for FW must be in the hundreds high dozens of hours............ Not only that, but all the organization and events that are ran through the game channels. Dust doesn't just happen while deployed. Good points. CCP holds the Caldari's hand so this doesn't happen again.
jhon hartigan Mannar Focused Warfare Gallente Federation 334	Posted - 2014.10.30 10:03:00 - [16] - Quote Aero Yassavi wrote: This is a system to reward loyalty to Dust as a product, so really skill shouldn't even factor into it at all. Someone who is bad at the game can still be just as loyal as someone who is awesome at the game (like me :p). Hours played and aurum spent are huge reflections of your loyalty and faith in this product. However, what's to say if you were actually playing while logged in or AFK when that was a huge issue? That's the only reason the included other stats like kills and hacks into the equation I believe. I see that a lot of you want this rank to ony reward loyalty and time spent on game....and actually it is called "loyalty rank" ...so how could I disagree? BUT we can consider the effort a player puts in a battle a sign of his loyalty to the game, if he really tries to win and do good in any match he is actually playing the game as it is supposed to be played, he is being loyal to the game. I m not talking only about killing, there are a lot of things you can do on the battlefield, but if you are just staying back/afk/ or you do not really try to do good for your team you re not being loyal to the game in my opinion ( you is impersonal obviously) Also I think both should be rewarded, players that spent a lot of time on game and on the forum but also players that always try to do good things on the battlefield. Aero Yassavi wrote: True Adamance wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: Flint Beastgood III wrote: It's a loyalty rank, so it should reward loyalty. Being skilled provides it's own rewards - wins/SP/ISK/LP. EDIT: I believe total playtime should be factored into the equation too, because nothing says loyalty like playing through constant bugs and problems to support a product you have faith in. it should be time deployed in a match and not just logged on. Because a lot of people just leave DUST 514 logged on on their between match time. That screws us over since combined out wait times for FW must be in the hundreds high dozens of hours............ Not only that, but all the organization and events that are ran through the game channels. Dust doesn't just happen while deployed. Good point, kills or wp per hour was a bad idea. But kills or wp or hacks per match is still a good stat. it show how good you do, your effort, everytime you play. I repeat it, using chats, talking, using the forum is as important as being effective on the battlefield, they both should be rewarded, they are both sign of loyalty to the game.


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