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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
3268
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Posted - 2014.09.28 19:26:00 -
[1] - Quote
Welp. The first test had an unexpected twist.
MINMANDO:
I lost my first minmando to pubbies who decided they did not appreciate me killing their dropship buddy.
The second engagement was a shocker when I used my Dren swarm launcher (minmando 3, 2 complex light damage mods) to knock ResistanceGTA into a building, which chalked up the first ADS fatality of the morning.
The third engagement ended with me being ren dered into chunky tuna all over the deck by Resistance GTA's proto missile launcher.
The fourth engagement was a stalemate, he would have killed me has the match not ended because I had run out of swarm ammo and was running for a jeep, to hit a supply depot.
CALDARI SENTINEL:
Engagement 1: I hit him once and bounced him off a ravine. Collision damage annihilated him. One of his pubbies proceeded to kill my proto suit.
Engagement 2: Clean engagement, I put three rounds into his python, causing it to crash and burn catastrophically. He avenged himself upon me with a bolt pistol.
Engagement 3: Never, EVER try to crush me with a dropship. I take offense, and I destroy the offenders with extreme prejudice. Scratch another dropship.
I also shot him directly with a forge gun on his dropsuit. twice.
Conclusion: My swarm skills are crap, but I was doing a consistent 999 shield damage with my dren swarms. I managed to land four shot once. I might have taken him down were i using proto swarms.
The CalSent was a mugging, pure and simple. The forge gun turned his dropship into chutney.
I never warned ResistanceGTA of impending attack, and gave him no fair play at any point. He got shots off, and managed to do significant damage to my calsent once. All in all, I think the ADS had it's teeth pulled versus heavy AV. a calm and alert pilot (I was rendering properly for him) has a chance against a minsent and can kill them.
The caldari sentinel (or any other) is a much more brutal prospect for the ADS pilot. They cannot keep up with the damage output of an IAFG, and are unlikely to be able to kill a Heavy AV fit unless said heavy is distracted, shooting someone else (we tend to monofocus) or incompetent.
I think the ADS RoF should come back to 5% per level, honestly. It would allow them to effectively battle AV gunners who actually render properly.
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ResistanceGTA
D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N
D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
1615
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Posted - 2014.09.28 20:19:00 -
[2] - Quote
Reserved
If you find an issue and I stumble upon your thread, I will do my darnedest to get the issue known.
Also, Raptors...
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Dust User
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
719
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Posted - 2014.09.28 20:56:00 -
[3] - Quote
Breakin Stuff wrote:
The caldari sentinel (or any other) is a much more brutal prospect for the ADS pilot. They cannot keep up with the damage output of an IAFG, and are unlikely to be able to kill a Heavy AV fit unless said heavy is distracted, shooting someone else (we tend to monofocus) or incompetent.
I think the ADS RoF should come back to 5% per level, honestly. It would allow them to effectively battle AV gunners who actually render properly.
Do it. |
Halla Murr
Skullbreakers
3dge of D4rkness.
2
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Posted - 2014.09.28 21:16:00 -
[4] - Quote
Breakin Stuff, just to clarify/confirm: this was a L3 MinCom right? So not even close to max damage? Not saying anything abut your tests, they seem to be pretty reasonably indicative of V/AV engagements.
I would agree with your statement that ADSs are pretty humped against heavy AV, and against a medium/high strength light AV they have a chance. How did you find the engagements generally began and how did you feel the fights flowed? Was one side dominant throughout the fight? How did terrain and positioning impact the fights?
As much as Rattati's number bias is laudable, numbers quite simply don't tell the whole story. Would appreciate any additional information you could supply. |
Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
3271
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Posted - 2014.09.29 08:30:00 -
[5] - Quote
I initiated each time. The only time ResistanceGTA had any warning was when I missed trying to adjust for range and momentum or he saw my LAV.
The combat flowed remarkably well with the min commando. Because I was rendering properly he was able to fight. Had I been using proto swarms his rate of fire would have prevented the kill he got on me because I would have been locking firing and loading much faster.
But vs. The mincommando and the ADS is fairly evenly matched, with the edge to the pilot were we to see a 2%/level boost.
The sentinel AV is a more brutal prospect.
The primary threat to sentinel AV is infantry. You may get good resists but unless your target is at extreme range the forge gun, even the assault is more liability than advantage and most sentinels are guilty of making sidearm skills their lowest priority.
So you CAN defend against infantry, but the odds of winning against infantry are about the same as an ADS killing sentinel AV. ADS should make HMGs and commandos their top priority for killing.
So the rock-paper-scissors works.
Commandos are the oddball. Better at AV than assault but worse at killing infantry. Better at killing infantry than sentinel AV but worse at killing vehicles they are pretty overall mediocre.
Sentinel AV is mugging vehicles for their lunch money. It's that simple.
AV vs. V is where it needs to be, but in my opinion the ability for vehicles to effectively retaliate is limited. So V vs. AV is not where it needs to be.
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
3277
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Posted - 2014.09.29 14:55:00 -
[6] - Quote
Any questions, comments or smart remarks?
I'm going to talk to cross and others about my overall findings, most of which were unsurprising, though ResistanceGTA was interesting in his maneuvering. He did not make it easy holding locks with swarms on him. He was full on strafing, and not hovering at all.
But for the record about the damage I was doing. I was only doing 4% less damage than a maxed out suit, or 40 HP for every 1000 HP delivered RAW before resistances from shields applied. The major deficiency is in the base damage difference between my Dren Swarms and a Wyrkomi swarm.
That being said, I treated the swarms like a short range forge and my tactics worked. It was a fight, but a fight in the ADS pilot's favor. Even so I managed to break into his armor twice, forcing him to bug out hard to recover.
There was no engagement that he failed to hit me with the missile launcher at least twice. |
Fox Gaden
Immortal Guides
4399
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Posted - 2014.09.29 15:31:00 -
[7] - Quote
Why arenGÇÖt you cross referencing your test threads? 
Never mind, I will do itGǪ.
@CCP Rattati and ADS drivers.
Test nerds needed.
ADS TTK test Day 1. Ideal conditions to kill Sentinels.
ADS TTK Day 2: Python with small missiles [COMPLETE]
ADS TTK Day 3 Thunderdome Test:
Hand/Eye coordination cannot be taught. For everything else there is the Learning Coalition.
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Halla Murr
Skullbreakers
3dge of D4rkness.
4
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Posted - 2014.09.29 15:42:00 -
[8] - Quote
I think you have some solid conclusions there Breakin Stuff.
It is important to note that you were using STD level swarms: even CBR7's are a big step up in power, and STD -> PRO is even bigger. Still, it's interesting that Resistance didn't have any issues with rendering. |
Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
3279
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Posted - 2014.09.29 15:51:00 -
[9] - Quote
Because I was going to cross-reference them in Rattati's sticky thread and ask if the data might be useful. thanks for conveniently providing me a link farm to copy/paste. |
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