DUST Search - Shield core extender, A NEW MODULE<- GRAB IT WHILE ITS HOT!

Cat Merc wrote:

The dark cloud wrote:

Cat Merc wrote:

You're forgetting how infinitely superior the base regen is on the Cal Sentinel.

That's the whole reason, and only reason, that armor plates give 2x the HP from an extender. (At proto)
Because traditionally, half the slots go to armor repairers.

What you're doing is giving Cal Sentinels the same HP with higher regen and no speed penalty.

You could argue that Armor sentinels get Logi support, but I can argue that this requires 2 players at minimum.
Of course it would be superior in 2v1.

However in 2v2 the scale tips in favor of the Caldari yet again.

With a fitting limitation to 1 per suit and 2 shield extenders you would get a max HP on shields of about 974HP and a recharge of 30hp/s and a delay increase of 24%.

Now lets compare it with the amarr sentinel:
2complex plates =1047HP
2complex reppers= ~19HP/s

So the armor tanked suit has constant regen, more HP and on top of that can be supported with a repair tool. So please explain me how that would be unbalanced? Shield recharge delay gets increased, fitting limitation of 1 per suit and only having a recharge of 30HP/s.

I didn't see a limit of 1 per suit.
Anyway, I'm not sure CCP would want to limit a module like that.

Also, that penalty adds 1.2 seconds of delay, so...

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The dark cloud The Rainbow Effect 3699	Posted - 2014.07.25 21:42:00 - [1] - Quote Ive beeing thinking about what shield modules could we need that improves the game? I was thinking about a module called "shield core extender". What it does? Quite simple it increases your shields by a % instead of a fixed number like regular shield extenders. So ive thought somewhat like this: -Basic shield core extender +15% maximum shields +7% shield recharge delay -Enhanced shield core extender +20% maximum shields +8% shield recharge delay -complex shield core extender +25% maximum shields +10% shield recharge delay The module itself is designed to work primary with caldari heavy frames and are aswell highslot modules. It would give a bigger shield HP bonus on a heavy frame while on medium frames the effect would only mimic a normal shield extender and on light frames the benefit would be worse then normal shield extender. So lets see how it would work on a assault suit: -Caldari assault with lvl5 skills has 262HP on shields. Adding a complex shield core extender gives +25% shields which would be 327HP (that would be 65HP). So the effect would be very close to that of a complex shield extender (66HP) -A Caldari sentinel got 656HP on shields, we add a complex core shield extender (+25%) and we get 820HP on the suit. That is a increase of 164HP on shields. That is 98HP more then a complex shield extender. Before the armor tankers are going to jump up and down on their chairs im gonna talk about balancing: The module increases the recharge delay more then a normal extender and the fitting cost should aswell be higher (same like if you compare rechargers and energizers). Additionally we could aswell apply stacking penalty on the module to make the overuse of it less appealing. I think this is possible without a client update. CCP allready has the coding in the game just look at shield energizers they give negative % on dropsuits. All you need to do is Take the shield extender icon, add the +% on shields and the recharge delay values. Skillwise it would be tied to the shield extension skillbook that unlocks shield extenders.
Abraham Baby Fish LATINOS KILLERS CORP Dark Taboo 24	Posted - 2014.07.25 21:58:00 - [2] - Quote Finnaly a good idea +1 Proudly a baby fish and a caldari loyalist. Sentinel ck.0, Scout ck.0. Either my sentinel is dead. i like burritos.
PLAYSTTION GamersForChrist 196	Posted - 2014.07.25 22:12:00 - [3] - Quote Very good, but bait too much on a cal sentinel if its stacked, if it were a thing there would have to be tweaked but i love the idea. 44/4 in a BPO Scout (1.8) 40/5 in a Proto Assault (1.7) Open Beta Vet 26mil sp R.I.P Dust 514
The dark cloud The Rainbow Effect 3701	Posted - 2014.07.25 22:17:00 - [4] - Quote PLAYSTTION wrote: Very good, but bait too much on a cal sentinel if its stacked, if it were a thing there would have to be tweaked but i love the idea. The caldari sentinel has 3 highslots (on all variants). And to counter for high stacking the fitting cost should be higher and there should be a stacking penalty. Like all other % based modules have. 1st module= 100% 2nd= ~80% 3rd= ~50% New shield module!
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 2523	Posted - 2014.07.25 22:30:00 - [5] - Quote Hmmm sorta like a Damage Resistance Amplifier, which is something I've wanted for quite some time. Idea is solid, needs polishing, but overall +1 from me.
Benjamin Ciscko Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 2636	Posted - 2014.07.26 00:04:00 - [6] - Quote What about Scaling shield extenders per suit I'll just throw some random numbers at you for demonstration purposes Complex shield extender on a scout 33 Complex shield extender on an assault 66 Complex shield extender on a Sentinel 99 Tanker/Logi
The dark cloud The Rainbow Effect 3704	Posted - 2014.07.26 00:35:00 - [7] - Quote Benjamin Ciscko wrote: What about Scaling shield extenders per suit I'll just throw some random numbers at you for demonstration purposes Complex shield extender on a scout 33 Complex shield extender on an assault 66 Complex shield extender on a Sentinel 99 The problem is that it would buff the HP of every suit in the game and makes bricktanking even worse. The module i want only benefits you if the suit allready has high HP on shields. New shield module!
Peregrinuus 9	Posted - 2014.07.26 00:41:00 - [8] - Quote Benjamin Ciscko wrote: What about Scaling shield extenders per suit I'll just throw some random numbers at you for demonstration purposes Complex shield extender on a scout 33 Complex shield extender on an assault 66 Complex shield extender on a Sentinel 99 To be honest, as much as I hate scouts, I don't like that idea of deliberately nerfing some modules. Honestly, a scout should be able to put tanking modules on, but it should come at an obvious cost, and I think the cost is just not there because scouts have base attributes that are just all around too good. I like cloud's suggestion. I'm sure that it can be balanced some way Hi.
Alena Ventrallis S0VER31GN 1496	Posted - 2014.07.26 00:54:00 - [9] - Quote The dark cloud wrote: Benjamin Ciscko wrote: What about Scaling shield extenders per suit I'll just throw some random numbers at you for demonstration purposes Complex shield extender on a scout 33 Complex shield extender on an assault 66 Complex shield extender on a Sentinel 99 The problem is that it would buff the HP of every suit in the game and makes bricktanking even worse. The module i want only benefits you if the suit allready has high HP on shields. lower pg/cpu on scouts, raise pg/cpu on heavies. Introduce the light/medium/heavy tank mods with pg/cpu for their class. so scouts can't fit heavy extenders, mediums can if they use fitting mods, and heavies fit them no problem. Rattati has spoken. CalScout hitbox is fine. You're gun game is broken.
KEROSIINI-TERO The Rainbow Effect 1179	Posted - 2014.07.26 02:28:00 - [10] - Quote I like hard +x HP modules better. Avoids the need of stacking penalties and even with them being op as fudge. People would enjoy Dust a lot more if they accepted the fact that EVERYTHING is subject to change

Arcturis Vanguard Escrow Removal and Acquisition Dark Taboo 218	Posted - 2014.07.26 04:58:00 - [11] - Quote What if you designed it so only one (1) could be applied to a suit? You wouldn't need to have drastic cpu/pg inflation for the boost, no need for stacking penalties and cannot make a suit to high in ehp without adding basic extenders, though with the three highs it's not like you can get crazy anyways. I do like this idea for the caldari heavy or any heavy in general who is looking for a shield boost. Keep this discussion going! Amarr Heavy V Amarr Assault V Caldari Scout V Caldari logistic IV Prof V HMG & FORGE Prof IV CR, SMG Prof III ScR
Lynn Beck Fooly Cooly. Anime Empire. 2093	Posted - 2014.07.26 07:31:00 - [12] - Quote What if... We buffed HP mods such that it wasn't almost necessary to STACK 5/6 of your slots with enough tank to survive barely over a second of Mlt AR fire? Example stats: Shield extender: 70 CPU, 14 PG 90 HP +15% depleted shield delay Armor Plate: 40 CPU, 20 PG 200 HP -10% speed penalty Now, scouts sacrifice not only their speed for armor stacking, but also A LOT of PG. Minjas would only 'need' 1 extender, and fitting 2(encroaching assault scout territory) is suicide as 28 PG is a lot. This solves 1 problem, but makes 2 more, mainly, that we are missing modules to fill in the emptiness, and that this allows for a Galassault to run 2 plate, 1 PG mod, 1 repper And i say, GOOD. Let them sacrifice their slot for 200 more HP, they can't rep super effectively now. Also, they're 18.7% slower. Ferros could(?) be buffed to 90 HP, and cost slightly less than current plates. Reactives would grant: 1/3/5 reps 60/80/90 HP 0/3/5% speed penalty Damage mods could give: 3/6/8%, or 3/5/7% Cost 75 CPU(+7 CPU) and 11 PG(+2 Pg) Meanwhile, we could add cheaper mods that grant non HP/DPS advantage: Effective range mod: +5/7/10% effective range 50 CPU, 6 PG (proto) Backup mags: +25/40/50% ammo capacity -3/5/7% speed 2/4/5 PG cost However, these are merely thrown here as offtopic as o how this might work. Along with these, Precision/damp/range/codebreakers would need % effect buffs, along with keeping their costs more or less the same. With this we would raise Scout profile back up to 40(with a CPU buff, coupled with a PG reduction in Codebreakers and Kincats) and a scout would need AT LEAST 1 Pg mod per Extender/plate they want. General John Ripper -BAM! I'm Emeril Lagasse. This message was approved by the 'Nobody Loved You' Foundation
Echo 1991 WarRavens Final Resolution. 362	Posted - 2014.07.26 13:25:00 - [13] - Quote Shield modules that increase HP should not give more than an armour mod of the same tier. shields repair on their own which is the reason why the have less HP. you also forget that the gallente heavy has 450 shields so would benefit from this also as well as the amarr suit i think.
The dark cloud The Rainbow Effect 3714	Posted - 2014.07.26 13:44:00 - [14] - Quote Echo 1991 wrote: Shield modules that increase HP should not give more than an armour mod of the same tier. shields repair on their own which is the reason why the have less HP. you also forget that the gallente heavy has 450 shields so would benefit from this also as well as the amarr suit i think. When we would pick up the idea of limiting the module down to 1 per fit then armor tankers would still get much more HP then a caldari sentinel. And even if you would stack 3 of them on a suit your recharge would still only be 30HP/s while on the other hand a amarr sentinel that gets logi support heals over 70hp/s and that aswell under fire. And stacking 3 modules would mean +30% recharge delay and with stacking penalty you get less HP boost with each module. New shield module!
Cat Merc Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 11306	Posted - 2014.07.26 14:19:00 - [15] - Quote You're forgetting how infinitely superior the base regen is on the Cal Sentinel. That's the whole reason, and only reason, that armor plates give 2x the HP from an extender. (At proto) Because traditionally, half the slots go to armor repairers. What you're doing is giving Cal Sentinels the same HP with higher regen and no speed penalty. You could argue that Armor sentinels get Logi support, but I can argue that this requires 2 players at minimum. Of course it would be superior in 2v1. However in 2v2 the scale tips in favor of the Caldari yet again. Feline overlord of all humans - CAT MERC
Cat Merc Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 11306	Posted - 2014.07.26 14:23:00 - [16] - Quote If the delay penalty increased, then maybe. But on a Caldari sentinel with a delay of 5/1, 10% isn't much, turning into 5.5/1.1. Feline overlord of all humans - CAT MERC
The dark cloud The Rainbow Effect 3714	Posted - 2014.07.26 14:37:00 - [17] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: You're forgetting how infinitely superior the base regen is on the Cal Sentinel. That's the whole reason, and only reason, that armor plates give 2x the HP from an extender. (At proto) Because traditionally, half the slots go to armor repairers. What you're doing is giving Cal Sentinels the same HP with higher regen and no speed penalty. You could argue that Armor sentinels get Logi support, but I can argue that this requires 2 players at minimum. Of course it would be superior in 2v1. However in 2v2 the scale tips in favor of the Caldari yet again. With a fitting limitation to 1 per suit and 2 shield extenders you would get a max HP on shields of about 974HP and a recharge of 30hp/s and a delay increase of 24%. Now lets compare it with the amarr sentinel: 2complex plates =1047HP 2complex reppers= ~19HP/s So the armor tanked suit has constant regen, more HP and on top of that can be supported with a repair tool. So please explain me how that would be unbalanced? Shield recharge delay gets increased, fitting limitation of 1 per suit and only having a recharge of 30HP/s. New shield module!
Cat Merc Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 11307	Posted - 2014.07.26 15:27:00 - [18] - Quote The dark cloud wrote: Cat Merc wrote: You're forgetting how infinitely superior the base regen is on the Cal Sentinel. That's the whole reason, and only reason, that armor plates give 2x the HP from an extender. (At proto) Because traditionally, half the slots go to armor repairers. What you're doing is giving Cal Sentinels the same HP with higher regen and no speed penalty. You could argue that Armor sentinels get Logi support, but I can argue that this requires 2 players at minimum. Of course it would be superior in 2v1. However in 2v2 the scale tips in favor of the Caldari yet again. With a fitting limitation to 1 per suit and 2 shield extenders you would get a max HP on shields of about 974HP and a recharge of 30hp/s and a delay increase of 24%. Now lets compare it with the amarr sentinel: 2complex plates =1047HP 2complex reppers= ~19HP/s So the armor tanked suit has constant regen, more HP and on top of that can be supported with a repair tool. So please explain me how that would be unbalanced? Shield recharge delay gets increased, fitting limitation of 1 per suit and only having a recharge of 30HP/s. I didn't see a limit of 1 per suit. Anyway, I'm not sure CCP would want to limit a module like that. Also, that penalty adds 1.2 seconds of delay, so... Feline overlord of all humans - CAT MERC
The dark cloud The Rainbow Effect 3714	Posted - 2014.07.26 16:03:00 - [19] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: The dark cloud wrote: Cat Merc wrote: You're forgetting how infinitely superior the base regen is on the Cal Sentinel. That's the whole reason, and only reason, that armor plates give 2x the HP from an extender. (At proto) Because traditionally, half the slots go to armor repairers. What you're doing is giving Cal Sentinels the same HP with higher regen and no speed penalty. You could argue that Armor sentinels get Logi support, but I can argue that this requires 2 players at minimum. Of course it would be superior in 2v1. However in 2v2 the scale tips in favor of the Caldari yet again. With a fitting limitation to 1 per suit and 2 shield extenders you would get a max HP on shields of about 974HP and a recharge of 30hp/s and a delay increase of 24%. Now lets compare it with the amarr sentinel: 2complex plates =1047HP 2complex reppers= ~19HP/s So the armor tanked suit has constant regen, more HP and on top of that can be supported with a repair tool. So please explain me how that would be unbalanced? Shield recharge delay gets increased, fitting limitation of 1 per suit and only having a recharge of 30HP/s. I didn't see a limit of 1 per suit. Anyway, I'm not sure CCP would want to limit a module like that. Also, that penalty adds 1.2 seconds of delay, so... Just edited it in cause having more then 1000HP on shields might upset some people. New shield module!


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