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Scout Hunter II
Inner.Hell
35
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Posted - 2014.07.14 16:43:00 -
[1] - Quote
If Amarr scout receives precision bonus, and only has 2 high slots.......while Caldari has 4 high slots...........kinda of a scrub move.
Like spotting gal scouts isn't hard enough now you are splitting the hunter scout role. If anything i would retain precision for Caldari due to precision enhancers being high slot modules. Therefore you can properly capitalize on the precision effect, and have Amarr receive the range bonus witch they can use to full effect with 4 lows.
Remember that scout profile starts at 35, and scout precision starts at 40. Profile dampeners give 25% efficiency while precision gives only 20%. Hunters always playing catch up with the lolgal & lolcloak. Also Gallente receive a 5% range bonus to their scans per level along with 5% dampening per level. Not to mention the crazy amount of fitting space.
Hope this dosent get overlooked. o7 Last thing we need is a step backwards.
tl;tr
-Switch proposed bonuses between the Amarr & Caldari.
CEO of Inner.Hell
> Those who sacrifice freedom in the name of security, deserve neither.
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Kallas Hallytyr
Skullbreakers
623
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Posted - 2014.07.14 16:50:00 -
[2] - Quote
Reason for changing it: means that both Caldari and Amarr can do good hunting, but will have to sacrifice substantial tank to do both parts well.
We don't know the exact numbers for all three: Gallente damps may be getting reduced mildly to compensate. |
Scout Hunter II
Inner.Hell
35
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Posted - 2014.07.14 16:56:00 -
[3] - Quote
Kallas Hallytyr wrote:Reason for changing it: means that both Caldari and Amarr can do good hunting, but will have to sacrifice substantial tank to do both parts well.
We don't know the exact numbers for all three: Gallente damps may be getting reduced mildly to compensate.
All the information i proposed is assuming there are no further changes to E war.
CEO of Inner.Hell
> Those who sacrifice freedom in the name of security, deserve neither.
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Bojo The Mighty
Spaceman Drug Cartel-Uno
4136
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Posted - 2014.07.14 17:20:00 -
[4] - Quote
What about this theory?
Amarr + 2 Precision Enhancers + 4 Range Amps = Caldari + 4 Precision Enhancers + 2 Range Amps
In that case wouldn't they be on par for scanning but merely different origins?
Smell the burning flesh. Taste the tangy sulfur air. Volcano Season - Moltar's Haiku : SGC2C
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Scout Hunter II
Inner.Hell
35
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Posted - 2014.07.14 17:29:00 -
[5] - Quote
Bojo The Mighty wrote:What about this theory?
Amarr + 2 Precision Enhancers + 4 Range Amps = Caldari + 4 Precision Enhancers + 2 Range Amps
In that case wouldn't they be on par for scanning but merely different origins?
no. Without the 25% bonus the Caldari precision is too weak. We will end up with 2 hunter scouts & none of them will have enough precision power to detect the gal scouts. Trying to buff the Amarr at the cost of Caldari is a bad idea.
CEO of Inner.Hell
> Those who sacrifice freedom in the name of security, deserve neither.
|
Kallas Hallytyr
Skullbreakers
623
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Posted - 2014.07.14 17:30:00 -
[6] - Quote
Scout Hunter II wrote:Kallas Hallytyr wrote:Reason for changing it: means that both Caldari and Amarr can do good hunting, but will have to sacrifice substantial tank to do both parts well.
We don't know the exact numbers for all three: Gallente damps may be getting reduced mildly to compensate. All the information i proposed is assuming there are no further changes to E war.
You know what they say about assumptions?
Rattati has shown excellent ability in just two hotfixes. Why do you assume he will not be as thorough and effective with balancing this? |
Scout Hunter II
Inner.Hell
35
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Posted - 2014.07.14 17:35:00 -
[7] - Quote
Kallas Hallytyr wrote:Scout Hunter II wrote:Kallas Hallytyr wrote:Reason for changing it: means that both Caldari and Amarr can do good hunting, but will have to sacrifice substantial tank to do both parts well.
We don't know the exact numbers for all three: Gallente damps may be getting reduced mildly to compensate. All the information i proposed is assuming there are no further changes to E war. You know what they say about assumptions? Rattati has shown excellent ability in just two hotfixes. Why do you assume he will not be as thorough and effective with balancing this?
Ratatti has done tremendous work. However i dont believe he is a expert in all fields and he relies on feedback to gouge the hotfix.
I am providing feedback and trying to alert to possible problems and offer solutions. Also plz get off his D. ty.
CEO of Inner.Hell
> Those who sacrifice freedom in the name of security, deserve neither.
|
Bojo The Mighty
Spaceman Drug Cartel-Uno
4140
|
Posted - 2014.07.14 17:42:00 -
[8] - Quote
Scout Hunter II wrote:Bojo The Mighty wrote:What about this theory?
Amarr + 2 Precision Enhancers + 4 Range Amps = Caldari + 4 Precision Enhancers + 2 Range Amps
In that case wouldn't they be on par for scanning but merely different origins?
no. Without the 25% bonus the Caldari precision is too weak. We will end up with 2 hunter scouts & none of them will have enough precision power to detect the gal scouts. Trying to buff the Amarr at the cost of Caldari is a bad idea. You're numbers are based off of current scenario not future scenario.
Smell the burning flesh. Taste the tangy sulfur air. Volcano Season - Moltar's Haiku : SGC2C
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Scout Hunter II
Inner.Hell
35
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Posted - 2014.07.14 17:49:00 -
[9] - Quote
Bojo The Mighty wrote:Scout Hunter II wrote:Bojo The Mighty wrote:What about this theory?
Amarr + 2 Precision Enhancers + 4 Range Amps = Caldari + 4 Precision Enhancers + 2 Range Amps
In that case wouldn't they be on par for scanning but merely different origins?
no. Without the 25% bonus the Caldari precision is too weak. We will end up with 2 hunter scouts & none of them will have enough precision power to detect the gal scouts. Trying to buff the Amarr at the cost of Caldari is a bad idea. You're numbers are based off of current scenario not future scenario.
Do you know something i dont? Because im solely working with the numbers Rattati & CCP provided. They have shown no intention in changing values for profile dampeners or gal bonus.
CEO of Inner.Hell
> Those who sacrifice freedom in the name of security, deserve neither.
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Tebu Gan
Dem Durrty Boyz General Tso's Alliance
1071
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Posted - 2014.07.14 20:29:00 -
[10] - Quote
Scout Hunter II wrote:Bojo The Mighty wrote:What about this theory?
Amarr + 2 Precision Enhancers + 4 Range Amps = Caldari + 4 Precision Enhancers + 2 Range Amps
In that case wouldn't they be on par for scanning but merely different origins?
no. Without the 25% bonus the Caldari precision is too weak. We will end up with 2 hunter scouts & none of them will have enough precision power to detect the gal scouts. Trying to buff the Amarr at the cost of Caldari is a bad idea.
All the talk I ever hear of concerning scouts, is the Gal, and Cal, and now considering the changes, Amar.
My minnie scout is feeling lonely. What exactly is their role in all this scoutness?
Tanks - Balancing Turrets
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hfderrtgvcd
Resheph Interstellar Strategy Gallente Federation
141
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Posted - 2014.07.14 20:30:00 -
[11] - Quote
Scout Hunter II wrote:Bojo The Mighty wrote:Scout Hunter II wrote:Bojo The Mighty wrote:What about this theory?
Amarr + 2 Precision Enhancers + 4 Range Amps = Caldari + 4 Precision Enhancers + 2 Range Amps
In that case wouldn't they be on par for scanning but merely different origins?
no. Without the 25% bonus the Caldari precision is too weak. We will end up with 2 hunter scouts & none of them will have enough precision power to detect the gal scouts. Trying to buff the Amarr at the cost of Caldari is a bad idea. You're numbers are based off of current scenario not future scenario. Do you know something i dont? Because im solely working with the numbers Rattati & CCP provided. They have shown no intention in changing values for profile dampeners or gal bonus. No you aren't. Did you even look at his spreadsheet? Here it is https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1i0LbL4DJt6LGioHeUVfuCyJlDK1CHf_n9plFNUtrHOs/edit?pli=1#gid=0. Note that these are not finalized. |
Kallas Hallytyr
Skullbreakers
623
|
Posted - 2014.07.14 20:32:00 -
[12] - Quote
Scout Hunter II wrote:Do you know something i dont? Because im solely working with the numbers Rattati & CCP provided. They have shown no intention in changing values for profile dampeners or gal bonus.
Yet again, you don't know that they aren't going to change the values. Not changing the values seems very slim: all we have seen in the Charlie thread is an outline, nothing numerical, so quit your pre-bitching about nothing.
Current numbers has GalScouts needing 3x Complex Dampeners to dodge GalLogi/CalScout scans. That's some substantial tank sacrifice. Caldari should sacrifice tank, to go along with the base range: Amarr should sacrifice tank to get range, to go along with their base precision: Gallente should sacrifice tank to avoid scans.
Your issue is based on incomplete data. Wait until we see some numbers, then provide actual feedback instead of whining like a child over nothing.
For example, assuming number changes are on the table, how about doing the maths to find a balanced outcome for all three? |
One Eyed King
Land of the BIind
2557
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Posted - 2014.07.14 20:39:00 -
[13] - Quote
Tebu Gan wrote:Scout Hunter II wrote:Bojo The Mighty wrote:What about this theory?
Amarr + 2 Precision Enhancers + 4 Range Amps = Caldari + 4 Precision Enhancers + 2 Range Amps
In that case wouldn't they be on par for scanning but merely different origins?
no. Without the 25% bonus the Caldari precision is too weak. We will end up with 2 hunter scouts & none of them will have enough precision power to detect the gal scouts. Trying to buff the Amarr at the cost of Caldari is a bad idea. All the talk I ever hear of concerning scouts, is the Gal, and Cal, and now considering the changes, Amar. My minnie scout is feeling lonely. What exactly is their role in all this scoutness?
Some of the changes and talk I have seen would mean that we would not be unable to defeat all scans. If I remember correctly (and there has been so much talk it would take forever to find the post), we would be able to beat passive scans with 2 damps and a cloak and active gal logi precision scans with 3 damps and a cloak?
Regardless of the specifics and my accuracy remember them, we will be more viable even without direct buffs because of the re arrangement of EWAR. In this way, we will be able to use our bonuses as they are, even in PC settings.
This is how a minja feels
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Scout Hunter II
Inner.Hell
35
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Posted - 2014.07.14 20:54:00 -
[14] - Quote
Kallas Hallytyr wrote:Scout Hunter II wrote:Do you know something i dont? Because im solely working with the numbers Rattati & CCP provided. They have shown no intention in changing values for profile dampeners or gal bonus. Yet again, you don't know that they aren't going to change the values. Not changing the values seems very slim: all we have seen in the Charlie thread is an outline, nothing numerical, so quit your pre-bitching about nothing. Current numbers has GalScouts needing 3x Complex Dampeners to dodge GalLogi/CalScout scans. That's some substantial tank sacrifice. Caldari should sacrifice tank, to go along with the base range: Amarr should sacrifice tank to get range, to go along with their base precision: Gallente should sacrifice tank to avoid scans. Your issue is based on incomplete data. Wait until we see some numbers, then provide actual feedback instead of whining like a child over nothing. For example, assuming number changes are on the table, how about doing the maths to find a balanced outcome for all three?
Not sure if separating range and precision would be a good idea. However i guess we can wait and see how it plays out.
CEO of Inner.Hell
> Those who sacrifice freedom in the name of security, deserve neither.
|
Boot Booter
Escrow Removal and Acquisition Dark Taboo
671
|
Posted - 2014.07.14 21:19:00 -
[15] - Quote
Based on his spreadsheet it seems pretty balanced to me. The problem with giving Caldari precision is it gets a bonus to its base without sacrificing tank. This is compounded by shared squad vision. Now both amarr and Caldari will need to sacrifice their respective major tank in order to augment their scanning weakness. Scanning is much much better than damping, so you should not worry about gallente. Minmatar, as always, will be doing its own thing in style.
What happened to the repair tool glow?
Why won't CCP answer?
Conspiracy?
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Ghost Kaisar
Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance
5953
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Posted - 2014.07.15 01:42:00 -
[16] - Quote
Scout Hunter II wrote:If Amarr scout receives precision bonus, and only has 2 high slots.......while Caldari has 4 high slots...........kinda of a scrub move.
Like spotting gal scouts isn't hard enough now you are splitting the hunter scout role. If anything i would retain precision for Caldari due to precision enhancers being high slot modules. Therefore you can properly capitalize on the precision effect, and have Amarr receive the range bonus witch they can use to full effect with 4 lows.
Remember that scout profile starts at 35, and scout precision starts at 40. Profile dampeners give 25% efficiency while precision gives only 20%. Hunters always playing catch up with the lolgal & lolcloak. Also Gallente receive a 5% range bonus to their scans per level along with 5% dampening per level. Not to mention the crazy amount of fitting space.
Hope this dosent get overlooked. o7 Last thing we need is a step backwards.
tl;tr
-Switch proposed bonuses between the Amarr & Caldari.
You used an alt for this?
Also: All scouts can now dodge each others scans and other scans (Provided they use enough damps). This means that all scouts are now viable in PC, not just Cal and Gal.
Boo hoo, you don't have an uber wall-hack anymore. Try actually HUNTING scouts instead of following the little red chevron.
We had to do that the old fashioned way pre-gal scout. Back when being a PC Scout was a Badge of F*cking Honor.
How I Imagine I look when running Minmatar Scout
PSN: EVL_Elgost105
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