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Arkena Wyrnspire
Fatal Absolution
15168
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Posted - 2014.07.04 22:43:00 -
[1] - Quote
Presently, I feel the system is poorly done.
The modular system we have at the moment leads to hugely open maps and some of the map templates have some horrible problems. For example, Manus Peak has one team on an elevated hill position below their spawn with overlook of the point in Domination, and overlook of at least one point in Skirmish, while the other team has no such advantage.
The system leads to generally having two extremes of engagement styles - either long range, or short range. Either you tend to be forced into compact spaces which are mostly closed off from long range intervention, or you're in open ground with very little cover.
There are also problems with the redline. The ability to stay in the redline with, say, a railgun equipped HAV gives you a very powerful protective tool reducing the risk to you greatly. However, on a lot of maps you can still have line of sight on important locations. From the redline, you can still hit things. In some cases you can actually see directly onto hack consoles from the redline (as in Manus Peak). That's not great.
I believe character movement is being covered in another thread but climbing hills is a chore at the moment as well.
High ground is also not great at the moment. A lot of places are only accessible by dropship. That's not exactly a bad thing, as it gives dropships a role, but sometimes matches (especially Domination) can become completely dependent on the control of the high ground. For example, on the pipeline map with the control point below the large tower, the elevated square area around the base of the tower has direct line of sight on the hack console whilst being very protective from those below.
There are things you can do to counter this, but they're not easy or reliable and it still confers a huge advantage.
To summarise:
- Modular maps too open
- Facilities go to the other extreme
- Redline design is poor
- High ground is too strong
I feel that more mid-ranged maps with a better balance between long range and short range zones and more intelligent high ground design would allow for a more diverse range of roles to thrive and reduce map imbalances.
Also, I'd like to know who's in charge of doing map design in Legion. The previous person, CCP Logicloop, was great and communicated. I might not have put this adequately, but I'd be happy to explain further what I see as the problems with each map. I'm particularly interested here because there ought to be some exciting stuff that can be done with maps after the PS3 restrictions are removed.
You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake.
Polka will never die.
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Cat Merc
Onslaught Inc
RISE of LEGION
10645
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Posted - 2014.07.04 22:53:00 -
[2] - Quote
I want procedural generation for maps on planets.
Sometimes you will have the advantage, sometimes you will have a disadvantage, but it's never going to be the same between two different planets.
Feline overlord of all humans - CAT MERC
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Sgt Kirk
Fatal Absolution
6348
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Posted - 2014.07.04 22:54:00 -
[3] - Quote
This message is approved by Sgt Kirk
see you space cowboy...
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Appia Vibbia
Molon Labe.
General Tso's Alliance
3097
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Posted - 2014.07.04 22:59:00 -
[4] - Quote
I'd prefer to just have them work on a map editor and let the community make the maps. Outsourcing it to us will both give us better quantity and qaulity maps than we've experienced through DUST. CCP could then take some of the maps and "make them official" by giving custom graphics and smoothing out textures, rather than only see 3 maps added every once in a while.
Appia Vibbia for CPM1
Empress of Alts
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Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
15732
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Posted - 2014.07.05 01:05:00 -
[5] - Quote
I believe lessons learned was most appropriate but we will have to wait and see the results.
Edit
A map editor would be cool if feasible.
CPM 0 Secretary
Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior, Annoying Artist
\\= Advanced Gallente Logistics =// Unlocked
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DAMIOS82
WarRavens
Final Resolution.
130
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Posted - 2014.07.05 06:11:00 -
[6] - Quote
personally i woud like to see facility's based on what other corporations build in that sector, including ruins for destroyed sectors/not repaired yet and defensive buildings. |
Arkena Wyrnspire
Fatal Absolution
15195
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Posted - 2014.07.05 21:59:00 -
[7] - Quote
DAMIOS82 wrote:personally i woud like to see facility's based on what other corporations build in that sector, including ruins for destroyed sectors/not repaired yet and defensive buildings.
I don't think it's a case of wanting cool stuff as much as it's a case of wanting balanced maps that more people can actually have fun on.
You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake.
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Dnaizohd Orlenaard
Crux Special Tasks Group
Gallente Federation
6
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Posted - 2014.07.07 18:59:00 -
[8] - Quote
Locations with big attention to detail aswell, like offices where for example R&D is done, not just corridors that lead to stairs that lead to open areas etc  I know this has to do with the ps3 "limitations" but still, just restating 
Try EVE: Online with this link and get rewards!: https://secure.eveonline.com/trial/?invc=1a9dbe71-b180-4b3b-a590-0a0517
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Hawkings Greenback
Red Star.
EoN.
154
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Posted - 2014.07.08 08:01:00 -
[9] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:DAMIOS82 wrote:personally i woud like to see facility's based on what other corporations build in that sector, including ruins for destroyed sectors/not repaired yet and defensive buildings. I don't think it's a case of wanting cool stuff as much as it's a case of wanting balanced maps that more people can actually have fun on.
This ^^
Because currently when the map comes up, generally, you know what type of tactics you will need to use & what tactics the red berries will be using. In some games I die a little on the inside because you know whats coming 
I would like to see more balanced maps, not a case of who gets there first & sets up wins ( which I know is not always true ).
GÇ£Without deviation from the norm, progress is not possible.GÇ¥
GÇò Frank Zappa
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Hawk-eye Occultus
ARKOMBlNE
259
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Posted - 2014.07.08 11:46:00 -
[10] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:[...] High ground is too strong
[...]
It's over! I have the high ground!
Shofixti beats an Ur-Quan Dreadnought and a Kor-Ah Marauder.
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hfderrtgvcd
Resheph Interstellar Strategy
Gallente Federation
9
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Posted - 2014.07.08 14:53:00 -
[11] - Quote
Domination has become almost unplayable because of the high ground. A team will take a dropship to the over look point, spam uplinks and nanohives and then switch to rail rifles and mass drivers. The only reliable counter is an orbital or your own dropship ( and hope they dont have any forge gunners). |
Regis Blackbird
DUST University
Ivy League
321
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Posted - 2014.07.08 21:23:00 -
[12] - Quote
I don't really have a problem with the current socket map design, and think it can (and will) be used more effectively in Legion.
You complain about the spawn points (I.e one team have an advantage), but the spawn points are not the maps. Sure, they are in fixed locations in Dust, but there is nothing that states this will be true for Legion as well.
The sockets can be filled with whatever, it does not have to be cramped spaces. Technically it does not need to be buildings at all, but variation of environments which makes the map unique (small lakes, hills etc.)
If they add things like speedtree to Legion, or any other technology that would give us dynamic foliage (higher than grass which obscures the view and can be used as cover), you probably won't recognize the maps.
The problem I have with procedural generated maps is that, (while nice in theory) they risk being massively unfair to one party, since a computer will decide where to place everything (or worse, CCP let Scotty handle it  ) |
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