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Adipem Nothi
Nos Nothi
2012
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Posted - 2014.06.18 16:43:00 -
[1] - Quote
Preface
Spent the morning running Domination to test out my post-fix Proficiency 5 Swarms.
Observations - Efficiency v Dropship
* Efficiency v Incubus reads 55%
* Efficiency v Gorgon reads 55%
* Efficiency v Python reads 80%
* Efficiency v Viper reads 80%
Observations - Efficiency v HAV
* Efficiency v Madrugar reads 80%
* Efficiency v Gunnlogi reads 80%
Observations - Other
* Efficiency v LAVs reads 80%
* Efficiency v Turret Installations reads 80%
Positives
1) Perhaps everyone is still testing, but I felt like Dropship Pilots no longer ignored my swarms. Swarms remain ineffective at killing Dropships but now seem more capable at chasing them away. Unless the observed pilots are just being extra jumpy right now :-)
2) While the HAV remains at extraordinary advantage over Swarmers, bad Tank Pilots appear to be somewhat easier to solo. Responsive Tank pilots remain largely impossible to solo short of serious pilot error.
Negatives
1) Tank Spam is still very much alive and well in Dom. If one side decides to run 3+ tanks and the other side does not respond in kind, the match is more-or-less over. In one such instance, I resisted standard operating procedure (if match broken, leave match) and took the opportunity to single out and "hunt" lone tanks as they farmed our infantry. Other infantry did the same. Even with multiple AV sources on the field -- even after the Proficiency fixes to Swarms and Forge Guns -- there's very little AV Infantry can accomplish apart from "shuffling" around enemy armor.
2) The Incubus remains highly resistant to Swarms. It takes an extraordinarily cocky or bad pilot to remain within Swarm Range through three successive volleys, reload, and three more volleys. I found such a pilot, placed and landed six consecutive PROFICIENCY 5 PROTO SWARMS in rapid succession. The Incubus was wounded as result of my effort, but did not die.
3) It still takes three volleys to destroy an enemy turret installation.
Conclusion
I was hopeful that my max proficiency "anti-vehicle" swarm launcher would be good at "anti-vehicle" duty today. It is perhaps less bad, but it remains far from effective. If it can't do the job, why waste money on it? Before I hang them up again, I would like to point out that I spent 992,000 Isk and 20 minutes of my life hunting King-Hak's Blaster Madrugar; he ended the match 29/0 and sent me a very happy "GG MAN!", which I take to mean he had put down his bag of chips to use both hands.
My Fit: gk.0 "Cheap Ghost - AV" (124k)
DS: Scout Gk.0
PW: Proto Swarms
SW: Toxin SMG
HS: Cmp Damage Amps (x2)
LS: Cmp Damps (x2), Cmp CardReg, Cmp KinCat
EQ: Adv Cloak, Adv Hives
GR: Adv Packed AV Grenade
- 46M SP Scout
Shoot scout with yes...
- Ripley Riley
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Judge Rhadamanthus
Amarr Templar One
2254
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Posted - 2014.06.18 16:44:00 -
[2] - Quote
Just to add to the OP. Did you noice you get 100% against Python Armour?
Judge For CPM 1 youtube
Twitter @Judge_EVELegion
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CCP Logibro
C C P
C C P Alliance
8179
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Posted - 2014.06.18 16:47:00 -
[3] - Quote
All the changes were pulled back (including the bug fixes) as we found some nasty stuff during QA. Still hoping to put it out in Charlie, maybe some bits and pieces sooner.
Armour vehicles will take some more pain now after we reduced armour repairer effectiveness.
CCP Logibro // Patron Saint of Logistics // Distributor of Nanites
(a¦á_a¦á)
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Adipem Nothi
Nos Nothi
2012
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Posted - 2014.06.18 16:47:00 -
[4] - Quote
Judge Rhadamanthus wrote:Just to add to the OP. Did you noice you get 100% against Python Armour?
I had really time collecting Efficiency readouts on Dropships once they started to move, and every Python I encountered was quick to move.
Shoot scout with yes...
- Ripley Riley
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Velociraptor antirrhopus
Kang Lo Directorate
Gallente Federation
275
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Posted - 2014.06.18 16:50:00 -
[5] - Quote
CCP Logibro wrote:All the changes were pulled back (including the bug fixes) as we found some nasty stuff during QA. Still hoping to put it out in Charlie, maybe some bits and pieces sooner.
Armour vehicles will take some more pain now after we reduced armour repairer effectiveness.
I really hope you decrease the maximum tanks in pubs and even PC.
We really don't see much tank spam anymore but it occasionally does pop up. You just can't counter that many tanks, even with my Proficiency 5 Forge because all the infantry can see the AVers and kill them or attempt to stop them.
Heavy turning speed should NOT be changed, we already get slaughtered by basic/adv scouts in our proto, dancing round us
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Repe Susi
Rautaleijona
1316
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Posted - 2014.06.18 17:03:00 -
[6] - Quote
Velociraptor antirrhopus wrote:CCP Logibro wrote:All the changes were pulled back (including the bug fixes) as we found some nasty stuff during QA. Still hoping to put it out in Charlie, maybe some bits and pieces sooner.
Armour vehicles will take some more pain now after we reduced armour repairer effectiveness. I really hope you decrease the maximum tanks in pubs and even PC. We really don't see much tank spam anymore but it occasionally does pop up. You just can't counter that many tanks, even with my Proficiency 5 Forge because all the infantry can see the AVers and kill them or attempt to stop them.
Mhm. That is too bad that you _need_ tanks to counter tanks. There should be some middle-way or something. And here we are yet again with Minmatar Commandos. You just CAN NOT kill a good tanker. Keep him away, yes. But whats good the bonus is for then? I want to kill havs and dropships. That's why I specced in to Minmando damn it.
Life is pleasant. Death is peaceful. It's the transition that's troublesome. ~ Isaac Asimov
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lee corwood
Knights Of Ender
Proficiency V.
854
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Posted - 2014.06.18 17:39:00 -
[7] - Quote
I haven't logged in until very recently. I loaded up a game to see where things were at. I think this was definitely after Alpha hit. I jumped into one domination with 4 tanks on the opposing team. I took out my proto swarmers and while I only killed 2 of them, they replenished and spent the rest of the game hunting me down. I didn't kill any others but I kept every single one of them focused on me. They even orbitalled me once on my lonely hill.
However, it was obvious these tankers were not used to opposition. The first two I killed simply stood there. I think they thought I was a newberry with a basic and didn't realize my first two volleys had them down to only half armor. After that, the rest were too afraid to get close as there was no cover from my swarms and their distance made it hard for them to hit me. I've been killed quite efficiently by tanks before so I can only assume they were not very experienced and were trolling my team.
The other game, good tankers. Killed both my suits very quickly. I resorted to proxies and dealt with them very efficiently.
DS on the other hand was difficult. Usually I can distract one so they can never get their job done. I've gotten plenty of damage points but otherwise they always escape. I even had a python with rotating hardeners that gave me a run for my money. Then 3 of them came at me. I couldn't dodge all their firepower and my swarmers couldn't damage it fast enough to at least take one with me. But 3 against my lonely AV, yeah I'm ok with that.
That being said, I think a little tweak would be nice. I actually enjoy where AV is now than I have most in any other time (even more than when AV was jokingly OP), but as a beta player who's rather non-commital to the future of this game, I'm practically wasting every cent of my isk taking down vehicles so my blueberries can enjoy the game. I don't think as a serious player logging on daily I'd be satisfied just yet at the balance between AV and Vehicles.
Minmatar Logisis | Heavy lover. Ping for video services.
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Mahal Daj
Mahal Tactical Enterprises
66
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Posted - 2014.06.18 18:19:00 -
[8] - Quote
OP,
As a dropship pilot, I'd like to point out that I am incredibly wary of swarms, but that forge guns/80GJ Rails are the weapons that kill me. However I'm 75% likely to stow my DS if there is an aggressive swarmer on the field.
As an infantry, your presence is felt and appreciated because the vehicles are often effectively nullifed as combatants if they are actively engaged with a swarmer such as yourself.
So... much like DS pilots themselves, your contributions matter, but are not scored in WP. For reference, I (squad leader) had a constant gunner (with defend order), Mobile CRU, and a standard dropship with adv turrets. My gunner put up 1835 WP for the game, I only got 800 WP for the same game. It is very strange that these two juggernaut professions on the battlefield are not often scored.
And, OP, if you really want a heck of a time, I'll hit you with the defend order, grab a constant gunner, and be your DS taxi while we show the tankers terror on black wings. You can catch me in Scouts United to squad.
Boost your squad's points by 40%, learn to use the Squad Wheel!
I provide training: 1M isk: 90 Minutes of Basic Command
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Adipem Nothi
Nos Nothi
2023
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Posted - 2014.06.18 18:26:00 -
[9] - Quote
Mahal Daj wrote:
And, OP, if you really want a heck of a time, I'll hit you with the defend order, grab a constant gunner, and be your DS taxi while we show the tankers terror on black wings. You can catch me in Scouts United to squad.
o/ Daj
If you catch me in a squad with a Dropship pilot, I'll be running recon on the ground lighting up redberries for him to farm. Up until he starts to brag about his "skill" or until I get bored and leave.
Shoot scout with yes...
- Ripley Riley
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NIETZCHES OVERMAN
Mannar Focused Warfare
Gallente Federation
68
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Posted - 2014.06.18 18:27:00 -
[10] - Quote
Adipem Nothi wrote:Judge Rhadamanthus wrote:Just to add to the OP. Did you noice you get 100% against Python Armour? I had a tough time collecting Efficiency readouts on Dropships once they started to move away from me, and every Python I engaged was very quick to move. In all cases above, I made note of Efficiency readouts at start-of-engagement (i.e. target had shields).
I find ds very easy to counter, but the fact is it takes me and another merc, usually myself and Roeg, we dont use swarms we use forges, 2 synced breach forge shots will do it...... If im alome though I dont even bother. |
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Mahal Daj
Mahal Tactical Enterprises
67
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Posted - 2014.06.18 18:31:00 -
[11] - Quote
Adipem Nothi wrote:Mahal Daj wrote:
And, OP, if you really want a heck of a time, I'll hit you with the defend order, grab a constant gunner, and be your DS taxi while we show the tankers terror on black wings. You can catch me in Scouts United to squad.
o/ Daj If you catch me in a squad with a Dropship pilot, I'll be running recon on the ground and lighting up redberries for him to farm ... up until I get bored or he starts to brag about his "skill".
It's hard to farm without a pilot's turret... I can't hit anything with it anyway.
Boost your squad's points by 40%, learn to use the Squad Wheel!
I provide training: 1M isk: 90 Minutes of Basic Command
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Adipem Nothi
Nos Nothi
2027
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Posted - 2014.06.18 18:38:00 -
[12] - Quote
Mahal Daj wrote:
It's hard to farm without a pilot's turret... I can't hit anything with it anyway.
There are pilots out there who are really good at it. I ran recon for one a few weeks back who topped our leaderboards (both WP and Killcount) roughly 5 ambush matches in a row. I forget his name ... he was with AE (but it wasn't Nine) ... I'll remember it later.
Shoot scout with yes...
- Ripley Riley
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Mahal Daj
Mahal Tactical Enterprises
68
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Posted - 2014.06.18 18:40:00 -
[13] - Quote
I prefer to play transport DS instead of ADS. It's highly under-represented. I'd fly the logistics DS if they would bring it back!
Boost your squad's points by 40%, learn to use the Squad Wheel!
I provide training: 1M isk: 90 Minutes of Basic Command
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