DUST Search - Ion Pistol should get it's damage AND ROF increased

Cody Sietz wrote:

Ripley Riley wrote:

Cody Sietz wrote:

Or, ya know, it looks bad on paper and we wanna get our concern out there.

Like remember when they were going to change the Amarr assault bonus and everybody got on and said "DONT DO IT!" And they didn't.

And they buffed the Amarr assault further.

These are raw stats from a weapon that no one outside of QA has played with. The Amarr assault suit has been used for months and months; that's how we knew the bonus they were going to give it was shite. We don't have anything to compare the ion pistol to and TTK is being adjusted this patch anyway so we will all need to establish a baseline with our weapons again.

Let 1.8 drop, a few weeks of data roll in, and then we can talk about what is OP and UP.

No, you had no idea if the new bonus would be better or not but didn't wanna lose something that makes the ScR really powerful.

And we have raw stats to compare the Ion pistol to, and it pales in comparison to all other weapons stat wise. Like I said, it looks awful on paper and we are a bit worried about it. Not to mention it will be doing even lower dmg once it gets to armour(the highest ehp type and very common for shield based suits to run a extra plate or 2)

It's the same problem with the AR, shortest range and DPS with no real bonus or reason to be used over other weapons in its same class. We would like a weapon that works, that's all.

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Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries General Tso's Alliance 7546	Posted - 2014.03.19 17:35:00 - [1] - Quote It's really bad. It really is, it falls into the same trap that the Assault Rifle falls into. Lowest range, and yet lowest DPS. It's closest counterpart, the scrambler pistol, has 18m effective range over it. Just for this fact it should have at LEAST matching DPS. Arguments for it: Arg: It has charge! Counter Arg: It instantly locks you up for a full 3.5 seconds, which is deadly for a CQC pistol. A charge shot also doesn't do enough damage to even take down an unfitted medium frame, so you will leave the enemy alive for the most part. Charging mid battle is a bad idea, and you can just do double the DPS with any other rifle in that time. Arg: It has the largest clip! Counter Arg: The scrambler pistol operation skill brings it to just one shot below the Ion Pistol. Not only that, but the Ion Pistol's damage per clip is pathetically low, coming in at 600. That's not enough to bring down most things now days. Scrambler pistol has 880 damage per clip, and a MASSIVE 375% headshot bonus, so scoring even a single hit already brings up that damage per clip to ridiculous amounts. Arg: It has the fastest fire rate! Counter Arg: Doesn't matter when your damage is ****, so you can't actually kill anything with all those bullets flying around. This is the plasma cannon in sidearm form, it really is. Nothing redeems this weapon, it has no use other than humilation of opponents that they got killed by an inferior piece of gear. Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives. DUST514514
Beren Hurin Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 2252	Posted - 2014.03.19 17:38:00 - [2] - Quote I'll wait and see exactly how the charge fire works.
Ripley Riley Incorruptibles 1127	Posted - 2014.03.19 17:40:00 - [3] - Quote The thing isn't even live yet for crissakes!!! He imposes order on the chaos of organic evolution...
Cody Sietz Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 2755	Posted - 2014.03.19 17:42:00 - [4] - Quote I'm inclined to agree with you, and I think it will be outperform by most other sidearms(especially the be Caldari ones) But maybe it will be decent. "I do agree with you there though. shudders" -Arkena Wyrnspire
shadow drake35 The Third Day Galactic Skyfleet Empire 77	Posted - 2014.03.19 17:43:00 - [5] - Quote Ripley Riley wrote: The thing isn't even live yet for crissakes!!! very true they just want galentee to be "all powerful" and to dominate MAG Raven, Valor, and S.V.E.R. Veteran
Cody Sietz Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 2755	Posted - 2014.03.19 17:47:00 - [6] - Quote shadow drake35 wrote: Ripley Riley wrote: The thing isn't even live yet for crissakes!!! very true they just want galentee to be "all powerful" and to dominate Or, ya know, it looks bad on paper and we wanna get our concern out there. Like remember when they were going to change the Amarr assault bonus and everybody got on and said "DONT DO IT!" And they didn't. And they buffed the Amarr assault further. "I do agree with you there though. shudders" -Arkena Wyrnspire
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries General Tso's Alliance 7546	Posted - 2014.03.19 17:47:00 - [7] - Quote shadow drake35 wrote: Ripley Riley wrote: The thing isn't even live yet for crissakes!!! very true they just want galentee to be "all powerful" and to dominate Yes, exactly like the plasma cannon. For meows sake you can see in the stats it's a completely broken weapon, everyone looked into the tiniest possible niches it could have, but found none. It's a broken gun, everything other than the flaylock beat it by far. Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives. DUST514514
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries General Tso's Alliance 7546	Posted - 2014.03.19 17:48:00 - [8] - Quote Beren Hurin wrote: I'll wait and see exactly how the charge fire works. We already know, nothing to discover, other than if it can hold a charge. Which either way doesn't matter, the most it can do is make it even worse than we thought it is. Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives. DUST514514
Ripley Riley Incorruptibles 1127	Posted - 2014.03.19 17:50:00 - [9] - Quote Cody Sietz wrote: Or, ya know, it looks bad on paper and we wanna get our concern out there. Like remember when they were going to change the Amarr assault bonus and everybody got on and said "DONT DO IT!" And they didn't. And they buffed the Amarr assault further. These are raw stats from a weapon that no one outside of QA has played with. The Amarr assault suit has been used for months and months; that's how we knew the bonus they were going to give it was shite. We don't have anything to compare the ion pistol to and TTK is being adjusted this patch anyway so we will all need to establish a baseline with our weapons again. Let 1.8 drop, a few weeks of data roll in, and then we can talk about what is OP and UP. He imposes order on the chaos of organic evolution...
BL4CKST4R WarRavens League of Infamy 2131	Posted - 2014.03.19 17:50:00 - [10] - Quote 1)Increase damage to 72 keep RoF and range, and overheat penalty. Makes it the highest DPS gun with nice situstional burst damage but extremely low range. Charge shotting kills your DPS but the high alpha allows for moderate sniping** 2)Increase damage to 60-65 remove charge overheat, keep charge time delay. *Gives it average DPS but makes charge shotting viable, instead of a gimmick, compared to SCP head shots or bolt pistol high alpha, still the lowest range side arm. Charge shot DPS is still lower than the guns DPS by a wide margin. 3)Do not increase damage, reduce charge time to 0.75 and remove overheat time. Makes it the lowest DPS side arm, but charge shooting increase DPS to 466 instead of reducing DPS. Allows for quick follow up shots making it extremely deadly like a mini scrambler rifle. I like Option 3. For the Federation!

MINA Longstrike 2Shitz 1Giggle United Brotherhood Alliance 345	Posted - 2014.03.19 17:52:00 - [11] - Quote If it only locks on full charge and incremental charges do appropriate damage you could probably fire a round every 1s for 250ish dmg without ever seizing, which would make it pretty decent as a close quarters sidearm.
Onesimus Tarsus The Exemplars Top Men. 1663	Posted - 2014.03.19 17:52:00 - [12] - Quote Ripley Riley wrote: The thing isn't even live yet for crissakes!!! Yeah, it won't really bring on the suck until it hits the street! Don't waste perfectly good complaints on shredded glass in your oatmeal until you've tried it first. Unless you're just *addicted* to wetsuit paperdolls...
Banjo Robertson Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 99	Posted - 2014.03.19 17:53:00 - [13] - Quote I think it would be nice if you charged the Ion pistol up, and it stayed at that charge level for all the shots you fired for the rest of the clip. Or maybe it has a secret damage bonus of %300 against everything but headshots :D
BL4CKST4R WarRavens League of Infamy 2131	Posted - 2014.03.19 17:54:00 - [14] - Quote Onesimus Tarsus wrote: Ripley Riley wrote: The thing isn't even live yet for crissakes!!! Yeah, it won't really bring on the suck until it hits the street! Don't waste perfectly good complaints on shredded glass in your oatmeal until you've tried it first. So I guess it's safe to say the magsec won't be OP whatsoever For the Federation!
Ripley Riley Incorruptibles 1127	Posted - 2014.03.19 17:57:00 - [15] - Quote Onesimus Tarsus wrote: Yeah, it won't really bring on the suck until it hits the street! Don't waste perfectly good complaints on shredded glass in your oatmeal until you've tried it first. Data on damage done to shields, damage done to armor, damage done total, kills with weapon, assists with weapon, kills at optimal range or less, kills at optimal range or more, damage at optimal range or less, damage at optimal range or more, time spent reloading per kill, number of kills with charge shots, number of headshots, number of headshot kills... You know, actually data... Is infinity more valuable that a few dozen twats in General Disucssion shitting themselves because DAMG X IS HIHER DAN DAMG Y! IZ BROK! FIX ET! He imposes order on the chaos of organic evolution...
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries General Tso's Alliance 7552	Posted - 2014.03.19 17:57:00 - [16] - Quote BL4CKST4R wrote: Onesimus Tarsus wrote: Ripley Riley wrote: The thing isn't even live yet for crissakes!!! Yeah, it won't really bring on the suck until it hits the street! Don't waste perfectly good complaints on shredded glass in your oatmeal until you've tried it first. So I guess it's safe to say the magsec won't be OP whatsoever Uhh Black, I'm pretty sure he's arguing FOR the Ion Pistol, not against. Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives. DUST514514
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries General Tso's Alliance 7552	Posted - 2014.03.19 17:58:00 - [17] - Quote Ripley Riley wrote: Onesimus Tarsus wrote: Yeah, it won't really bring on the suck until it hits the street! Don't waste perfectly good complaints on shredded glass in your oatmeal until you've tried it first. Data on damage done to shields, damage done to armor, damage done total, kills with weapon, assists with weapon, kills at optimal range or less, kills at optimal range or more, damage at optimal range or less, damage at optimal range or more, time spent reloading per kill, number of kills with charge shots, number of headshots, number of headshot kills... You know, actually data... Is infinity more valuable that a few dozen twats in General Disucssion shitting themselves because DAMG X IS HIHER DAN DAMG Y! IZ BROK! FIX ET! These twats predicted every single thing that was OP, to be OP the moment they saw the stats. It's not hard if you have a single brain cell. Especially with a lot of people looking at it, they can spot problems together very quickly. Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives. DUST514514
Onesimus Tarsus The Exemplars Top Men. 1665	Posted - 2014.03.19 17:59:00 - [18] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: BL4CKST4R wrote: Onesimus Tarsus wrote: Ripley Riley wrote: The thing isn't even live yet for crissakes!!! Yeah, it won't really bring on the suck until it hits the street! Don't waste perfectly good complaints on shredded glass in your oatmeal until you've tried it first. So I guess it's safe to say the magsec won't be OP whatsoever Uhh Black, I'm pretty sure he's arguing FOR the Ion Pistol, not against. I'm too nuanced for my own good. Unless you're just *addicted* to wetsuit paperdolls...
Cody Sietz Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 2757	Posted - 2014.03.19 17:59:00 - [19] - Quote Ripley Riley wrote: Cody Sietz wrote: Or, ya know, it looks bad on paper and we wanna get our concern out there. Like remember when they were going to change the Amarr assault bonus and everybody got on and said "DONT DO IT!" And they didn't. And they buffed the Amarr assault further. These are raw stats from a weapon that no one outside of QA has played with. The Amarr assault suit has been used for months and months; that's how we knew the bonus they were going to give it was shite. We don't have anything to compare the ion pistol to and TTK is being adjusted this patch anyway so we will all need to establish a baseline with our weapons again. Let 1.8 drop, a few weeks of data roll in, and then we can talk about what is OP and UP. No, you had no idea if the new bonus would be better or not but didn't wanna lose something that makes the ScR really powerful. And we have raw stats to compare the Ion pistol to, and it pales in comparison to all other weapons stat wise. Like I said, it looks awful on paper and we are a bit worried about it. Not to mention it will be doing even lower dmg once it gets to armour(the highest ehp type and very common for shield based suits to run a extra plate or 2) It's the same problem with the AR, shortest range and DPS with no real bonus or reason to be used over other weapons in its same class. We would like a weapon that works, that's all. "I do agree with you there though. shudders" -Arkena Wyrnspire
Aikuchi Tomaru Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 2050	Posted - 2014.03.19 18:02:00 - [20] - Quote Tell me more about how you were already able to try out the Ion Pistol. I think we shouldn't flame so much about these small numbers before actually being able to try out the weapon for ourselves. Maybe the handling of it is pretty well, making up for the slightly worse stats? Maybe you consider it too much with the current gameplay of 1.7 which will extremely change with 1.8? I'm just saying TTK. Sign up for Caldari FW and defeat the evil Gallente Overlords!

Onesimus Tarsus The Exemplars Top Men. 1665	Posted - 2014.03.19 18:05:00 - [21] - Quote Cody Sietz wrote: Ripley Riley wrote: Cody Sietz wrote: Or, ya know, it looks bad on paper and we wanna get our concern out there. Like remember when they were going to change the Amarr assault bonus and everybody got on and said "DONT DO IT!" And they didn't. And they buffed the Amarr assault further. These are raw stats from a weapon that no one outside of QA has played with. The Amarr assault suit has been used for months and months; that's how we knew the bonus they were going to give it was shite. We don't have anything to compare the ion pistol to and TTK is being adjusted this patch anyway so we will all need to establish a baseline with our weapons again. Let 1.8 drop, a few weeks of data roll in, and then we can talk about what is OP and UP. No, you had no idea if the new bonus would be better or not but didn't wanna lose something that makes the ScR really powerful. And we have raw stats to compare the Ion pistol to, and it pales in comparison to all other weapons stat wise. Like I said, it looks awful on paper and we are a bit worried about it. Not to mention it will be doing even lower dmg once it gets to armour(the highest ehp type and very common for shield based suits to run a extra plate or 2) It's the same problem with the AR, shortest range and DPS with no real bonus or reason to be used over other weapons in its same class. We would like a weapon that works, that's all. Now you're just being silly. Go get a RR if you want work-type-thing. Unless you're just *addicted* to wetsuit paperdolls...
BL4CKST4R WarRavens League of Infamy 2131	Posted - 2014.03.19 18:07:00 - [22] - Quote Ripley Riley wrote: Onesimus Tarsus wrote: Yeah, it won't really bring on the suck until it hits the street! Don't waste perfectly good complaints on shredded glass in your oatmeal until you've tried it first. Data on damage done to shields, damage done to armor, damage done total, kills with weapon, assists with weapon, kills at optimal range or less, kills at optimal range or more, damage at optimal range or less, damage at optimal range or more, time spent reloading per kill, number of kills with charge shots, number of headshots, number of headshot kills... You know, actually data... Is infinity more valuable that a few dozen twats in General Disucssion shitting themselves because DAMG X IS HIHER DAN DAMG Y! IZ BROK! FIX ET! Launch weapon Gather data Get player feedback Make adjustments to weapon as needed Gather data Get player feedback on adjustments You are skipping step 1 and 2 because it's inconvenient. I will break it down in a simple manner. Launch weapon Gather data Get player feedback Make adjustments to weapon as needed Gather data Get player feedback on adjustments [ ] Launch weapon, read below [X] Gather data, it has been provided by CCP by comparing the weapon type which other similar weapons this step can be done mathematically. AR, SCR, and SCP are the best to compare this with. [X] This is player feedback last three steps won't be needed if CCP listended. [ ] [ ] [ ] For the Federation!
Kasote Denzara A Vulture 1967	Posted - 2014.03.19 18:10:00 - [23] - Quote It's a secondary, so it isn't supposed to be expectant to be a replacement primary. It'll be like the Flaylock- a finisher or a surprise weapon. That's about all I can see it as. We also don't know exactly how this weapon actually operates on the field, so it's really just looking at numbers and ill-wishing. "Go ahead and dual tank. My Commando dual ganks." -Kasote Denzara I'm waiting for my G-I suit. It's what I want.
Medic 1879 Forsaken Immortals Top Men. 1888	Posted - 2014.03.19 18:11:00 - [24] - Quote Ripley Riley wrote: The thing isn't even live yet for crissakes!!! Sadly I once said the same thing for the plasma cannon. Ignored how bad it looked and thought yeah I can take tanks with that! Rampant optimism leads to disappointment being a negative nancy however means any surprise is a good one or your proved right either way you feel better about it. Lead Diplomat for Forsaken Immortals.
Ripley Riley Incorruptibles 1127	Posted - 2014.03.19 19:04:00 - [25] - Quote Medic 1879 wrote: Rampant optimism leads to disappointment being a negative nancy however means any surprise is a good one or your proved right either way you feel better about it. I'm not being optimistic. In fact, Cat Merc might be right. I'm just saying to reserve final judgement. I forget who said it, but some enlightened forum-goer said something to the effect of, "We can't look at any one specific weapon or dropsuit in the context of a single player using it. We have to remember Dust is a squadbased FPS." I want to see my squadmates and I use the ion pistol in combination with other weapons before I go screaming it is UP. Medic 1879 wrote: Sadly I once said the same thing for the plasma cannon. Seriously though, sorry about that plasma cannon... He imposes order on the chaos of organic evolution...


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