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BL4CKST4R
WarRavens League of Infamy
2005
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Posted - 2014.03.09 13:44:00 -
[1] - Quote
For a suit that can be used instantly after death plus the highest HP, the highest and only suit with damage resistance, and the highest DPS weapon maybe the heavy suit is a little to much.
Some people complain about the HMGs range but at 47 meters it's still doing around 300 dps. Of course it doesn't even have to opt to using the HMG I can always use a Light weapon.
There is also the speed but that's only if the suit is playing it's role at point defense, but the suit like any other suit can just drop an LAV and mitigate it's speed disadvantage.
In 1.8 the heavy suit gets plenty of love but it has no disadvantages to its use and it can easily be spammed? Similarly to a tank, to just destroy other players.
Everything I said above is not saying the heavy is OP, if the heavy suit was used in the role it is meant for then it would be perfect and if people didn't have the tendency to just use the item that will farm them the most kills without putting themselves in danger. ..
My suggestion is disallow heavy suits from driving vehicles but they can get in vehicles driven by other players. This allows for proper deployment without removing the heavies speed penalty.
Add a small 1.5 second timer before you can get in a vehicle, when approach your vehicle you have to wait 1.5 seconds before the button to enter activates.
Place a 5 minute timer after the loss of a heavy suit before it can be spawned, this would for more tactical use of the heavy rather than using it as a wrecking ball of flaming ****. Similarly this should apply to tanks but slightly longer....
For the Federation!
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Arkena Wyrnspire
Fatal Absolution
10802
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Posted - 2014.03.09 13:46:00 -
[2] - Quote
I dislike these limits you're suggesting.
You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake.
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bamboo x
Eternal Beings Proficiency V.
175
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Posted - 2014.03.09 13:49:00 -
[3] - Quote
**** it, let's get rid of vehicles and ride scouts like horses.
Sign my petition for mortal tanks
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BL4CKST4R
WarRavens League of Infamy
2005
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Posted - 2014.03.09 13:49:00 -
[4] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:I dislike these limits you're suggesting.
Any suggestions? Maybe it goes a little to far but whenever a heavy suit is not use as intended it just becomes a steam roller. With the TTK changes and the massive buff to their HP they will literally be walking tanks. Which of course is their intended role and that is fine, but like I said when they are not playing to their role is just breaks them.
For the Federation!
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Delta90212
Dust2Dust. Top Men.
340
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Posted - 2014.03.09 13:51:00 -
[5] - Quote
If you let logis piggyback on heavys then yes
Fear The Tribes // In Rust We Trust // Standings Minmatar 6 // Minmatar Logibro //
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The Terminator T-1000
Skynet Incorporated
187
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Posted - 2014.03.09 13:53:00 -
[6] - Quote
Dumb |
Himiko Kuronaga
Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance
3200
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Posted - 2014.03.09 13:54:00 -
[7] - Quote
BL4CKST4R wrote:For a suit that can be used instantly after death plus the highest HP, the highest and only suit with damage resistance, and the highest DPS weapon maybe the heavy suit is a little to much.
It can't strafe.
Quote:Some people complain about the HMGs range but at 47 meters it's still doing around 300 dps. Of course it doesn't even have to opt to using the HMG I can always use a Light weapon.
At 47 meters the vast majority of shots are missing on a stationary target, let alone a moving one. Applied dps at 47 meters is not anywhere close to 300 dps.
Quote:There is also the speed but that's only if the suit is playing it's role at point defense, but the suit like any other suit can just drop an LAV and mitigate it's speed disadvantage.
Do that in a serious PC match and you will get railed tanked before you make it halfway across the map. Do that in a city and you'll be banned from your corporation for stupidity and worthlessness.
Quote:In 1.8 the heavy suit gets plenty of love but it has no disadvantages to its use and it can easily be spammed? Similarly to a tank, to just destroy other players.
It can't strafe. At all. In low frame rate environments, which are basically any competitive match, movement based tanking has a large advantage over stationary brick tanking. This is because lower frame rates make it impossible to visually track your opponent via reflex and instead force you to guess. This results in a LOT of lost DPS. The person moving does not have to do this however, because the heavy is so slow that movement is basically irrelevant.
Quote:Everything I said above is not saying the heavy is OP, if the heavy suit was used in the role it is meant for then it would be perfect and if people didn't have the tendency to just use the item that will farm them the most kills without putting themselves in danger. ..
It will be used in whatever role its useful in. If you decide to be speed racer in a pub, you're only getting away with it because pubs are full of garbage players who deserve to lose to such tactics.
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Jacques Cayton II
Providence Guard Templis CALSF
647
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Posted - 2014.03.09 13:56:00 -
[8] - Quote
Dude just stop. I've been a heavy since chromosome. That was the days of the long range hmg and the true op heavy. If you are having problems then stop walking around alone. Run squads. In eve if your cruising around in a frigate and a battlecruiser shows up what will you do cry to ccp or adapt. Sounds to me like you'll cry. I wouldn't mind a nerf but stop crying about something that isnt even out yet. Everyone is forgetting that heavies are only trully scary when they wield an hmg, but why do people still assault me from the front and walk in straight lines then complain about it later??? I'll tell you why medium frames want heavies to be walking ninnies. We have hp, we have 30m or less, you medium frames have speed, you have regen, you have equipment, what do we heavies have? We have a big gun and thats it. We only kill medium suits provide support while destroying their enemy. Now yes light weapons on heavies need to be dealt with and lavs yes but not what you suggested.
We fight for the future of the State not our
personal goals
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Himiko Kuronaga
Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance
3200
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Posted - 2014.03.09 13:57:00 -
[9] - Quote
Quote:My suggestion is disallow heavy suits from driving vehicles but they can get in vehicles driven by other players. This allows for proper deployment without removing the heavies speed penalty.
My suggestion is to not balance based on tactics that only work against horrible pub teams.
Quote:Place a 5 minute timer after the loss of a heavy suit before it can be spawned, this would for more tactical use of the heavy rather than using it as a wrecking ball of flaming ****. Similarly this should apply to tanks but slightly longer....
Congratulations on having the single worst idea I have ever heard on these forums. |
bamboo x
Eternal Beings Proficiency V.
175
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Posted - 2014.03.09 13:59:00 -
[10] - Quote
Jacques Cayton II wrote:Dude just stop. I've been a heavy since chromosome. That was the days of the long range hmg and the true op heavy. If you are having problems then stop walking around alone. Run squads. In eve if your cruising around in a frigate and a battlecruiser shows up what will you do cry to ccp or adapt. Sounds to me like you'll cry. I wouldn't mind a nerf but stop crying about something that isnt even out yet. Everyone is forgetting that heavies are only trully scary when they wield an hmg, but why do people still assault me from the front and walk in straight lines then complain about it later??? I'll tell you why medium frames want heavies to be walking ninnies. We have hp, we have 30m or less, you medium frames have speed, you have regen, you have equipment, what do we heavies have? We have a big gun and thats it. We only kill medium suits provide support while destroying their enemy. Now yes light weapons on heavies need to be dealt with and lavs yes but not what you suggested.
Yeah and besides it's easy to kill OP heavies like Jacques.
Sign my petition for mortal tanks
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BL4CKST4R
WarRavens League of Infamy
2005
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Posted - 2014.03.09 14:08:00 -
[11] - Quote
Himiko Kuronaga wrote:Quote:My suggestion is disallow heavy suits from driving vehicles but they can get in vehicles driven by other players. This allows for proper deployment without removing the heavies speed penalty. My suggestion is to not balance based on tactics that only work against horrible pub teams. Quote:Place a 5 minute timer after the loss of a heavy suit before it can be spawned, this would for more tactical use of the heavy rather than using it as a wrecking ball of flaming ****. Similarly this should apply to tanks but slightly longer.... Congratulations on having the single worst idea I have ever heard on these forums.
I'm sorry but tell me a game where you can spawn a suit like the heavy constantly? None. Every FPS out there that has a suit similar to how a heavy plays either has a limit to it, or is given as perk for doing well.
Battlefield, tanks can only be spawned every so often. The HMG is only picked up randomly from certain spawn locations.
COD HMG is given from kill streaks.
Planetside max suit has a 10 minute timer. Tanks have a timer also.
Crysis nanosuit armor is a kill streak.
Blacklight: retribution heavy suit has to be bought and called in every time.
Single worst idea yet it's used in every games that has the feature. Go be a **** some were else.
For the Federation!
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Jacques Cayton II
Providence Guard Templis CALSF
647
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Posted - 2014.03.09 14:12:00 -
[12] - Quote
BL4CKST4R wrote:Himiko Kuronaga wrote:Quote:My suggestion is disallow heavy suits from driving vehicles but they can get in vehicles driven by other players. This allows for proper deployment without removing the heavies speed penalty. My suggestion is to not balance based on tactics that only work against horrible pub teams. Quote:Place a 5 minute timer after the loss of a heavy suit before it can be spawned, this would for more tactical use of the heavy rather than using it as a wrecking ball of flaming ****. Similarly this should apply to tanks but slightly longer.... Congratulations on having the single worst idea I have ever heard on these forums. I'm sorry but tell me a game where you can spawn a suit like the heavy constantly? None. Every FPS out there that has a suit similar to how a heavy plays either has a limit to it, or is given as perk for doing well. Battlefield, tanks can only be spawned every so often. The HMG is only picked up randomly from certain spawn locations. COD HMG is given from kill streaks. Planetside max suit has a 10 minute timer. Tanks have a timer also. Crysis nanosuit armor is a kill streak. Blacklight: retribution heavy suit has to be bought and called in every time. Single worst idea yet it's used in every games that has the feature. Go be a **** some were else. oh cod scrubs how they plague dust 514 and dont understand mmo's
We fight for the future of the State not our
personal goals
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BL4CKST4R
WarRavens League of Infamy
2005
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Posted - 2014.03.09 14:15:00 -
[13] - Quote
Jacques Cayton II wrote:BL4CKST4R wrote:Himiko Kuronaga wrote:Quote:My suggestion is disallow heavy suits from driving vehicles but they can get in vehicles driven by other players. This allows for proper deployment without removing the heavies speed penalty. My suggestion is to not balance based on tactics that only work against horrible pub teams. Quote:Place a 5 minute timer after the loss of a heavy suit before it can be spawned, this would for more tactical use of the heavy rather than using it as a wrecking ball of flaming ****. Similarly this should apply to tanks but slightly longer.... Congratulations on having the single worst idea I have ever heard on these forums. I'm sorry but tell me a game where you can spawn a suit like the heavy constantly? None. Every FPS out there that has a suit similar to how a heavy plays either has a limit to it, or is given as perk for doing well. Battlefield, tanks can only be spawned every so often. The HMG is only picked up randomly from certain spawn locations. COD HMG is given from kill streaks. Planetside max suit has a 10 minute timer. Tanks have a timer also. Crysis nanosuit armor is a kill streak. Blacklight: retribution heavy suit has to be bought and called in every time. Single worst idea yet it's used in every games that has the feature. Go be a **** some were else. oh cod scrubs how they plague dust 514 and dont understand mmo's
What does that have anything to do with the point I was trying to make?
For the Federation!
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Jacques Cayton II
Providence Guard Templis CALSF
648
|
Posted - 2014.03.09 14:26:00 -
[14] - Quote
Every mmo has a heavy tanker like a guy who takes all the rounds and attracts the enemy by killing them, aka heavy. Now what does that mean for dust a fps mmo(soon tm) that means that the heavy fulfills its intended role. This isnt cod or battlefield were all weapons do the same amount of damage and kill at just about the same time. In dust we want a challenge something that keeps us here and is why we stay. If you have your role then you use it dont go running around saying how much cod battlefield or planetside 2 is better or just go back to them doesnt matter to me. Stop be a little girl and grow some American balls and face the challenge head on. ( not like our current gov more like the 1940's american balls)
We fight for the future of the State not our
personal goals
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Patrick57
5880
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Posted - 2014.03.09 14:27:00 -
[15] - Quote
My only problems with Heavies will be-
If they have light weapons
and
No infantry will be able to get into CQC unless they have a Heavy suit of their own
Combine the Heavy's resistance plus the Damage mod and Light weapon nerfs, along with the fact that the HMG isn't getting touched, makes the Heavy suit OP.
I understand the argument about HMGs having a very limited range, but in the middle of a city (for example, the Surface Research Lab) it will be almost impossible to kill them with anything other than your own Heavy.
Also, Heavies in LAVs will be immediate death. Even if they have ****** aim, there's almost no way to avoid death.
Just my 0.02 ISK... |
BL4CKST4R
WarRavens League of Infamy
2005
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Posted - 2014.03.09 14:36:00 -
[16] - Quote
Jacques Cayton II wrote:Every mmo has a heavy tanker like a guy who takes all the rounds and attracts the enemy by killing them, aka heavy. Now what does that mean for dust a fps mmo(soon tm) that means that the heavy fulfills its intended role. This isnt cod or battlefield were all weapons do the same amount of damage and kill at just about the same time. In dust we want a challenge something that keeps us here and is why we stay. If you have your role then you use it dont go running around saying how much cod battlefield or planetside 2 is better or just go back to them doesnt matter to me. Stop be a little girl and grow some American balls and face the challenge head on. ( not like our current gov more like the 1940's american balls)
why are people so narrow minded I never said they were better I only mentioned a feature they had to avoid heavy spam.
For the Federation!
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Jacques Cayton II
Providence Guard Templis CALSF
648
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Posted - 2014.03.09 14:41:00 -
[17] - Quote
BL4CKST4R wrote:Jacques Cayton II wrote:Every mmo has a heavy tanker like a guy who takes all the rounds and attracts the enemy by killing them, aka heavy. Now what does that mean for dust a fps mmo(soon tm) that means that the heavy fulfills its intended role. This isnt cod or battlefield were all weapons do the same amount of damage and kill at just about the same time. In dust we want a challenge something that keeps us here and is why we stay. If you have your role then you use it dont go running around saying how much cod battlefield or planetside 2 is better or just go back to them doesnt matter to me. Stop be a little girl and grow some American balls and face the challenge head on. ( not like our current gov more like the 1940's american balls) why are people so narrow minded I never said they were better I only mentioned a feature they had to avoid heavy spam. Then why mention games that are nowhere close to dust? These games are all the same minus planetside 2. You spawn shoot die rinse complete. In dust you can survive based on your skill level and suit at the time. In battlefield can you sit in a tank and soak every round near you? No these games are I see you blam your dead where is the fun in that?
We fight for the future of the State not our
personal goals
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Shadow Archeus
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
318
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Posted - 2014.03.09 14:43:00 -
[18] - Quote
bamboo x wrote:**** it, let's get rid of vehicles and ride scouts like horses. a billion isk to the person to get a nova knife kill from scoutback
Real heavies use lasers
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Shadow Archeus
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
318
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Posted - 2014.03.09 14:45:00 -
[19] - Quote
Patrick57 wrote:My only problems with Heavies will be-
If they have light weapons
and
No infantry will be able to get into CQC unless they have a Heavy suit of their own
Combine the Heavy's resistance plus the Damage mod and Light weapon nerfs, along with the fact that the HMG isn't getting touched, makes the Heavy suit OP.
I understand the argument about HMGs having a very limited range, but in the middle of a city (for example, the Surface Research Lab) it will be almost impossible to kill them with anything other than your own Heavy.
Also, Heavies in LAVs will be immediate death. Even if they have ****** aim, there's almost no way to avoid death.
Just my 0.02 ISK...
The heavy suits are supposed to dominate cqc and cities.....without a light weapon we are useless In the open unless you're stupid enough to get in my range
Real heavies use lasers
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Hecarim Van Hohen
Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising
563
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Posted - 2014.03.09 15:01:00 -
[20] - Quote
BL4CKST4R wrote:Himiko Kuronaga wrote:Quote:My suggestion is disallow heavy suits from driving vehicles but they can get in vehicles driven by other players. This allows for proper deployment without removing the heavies speed penalty. My suggestion is to not balance based on tactics that only work against horrible pub teams. Quote:Place a 5 minute timer after the loss of a heavy suit before it can be spawned, this would for more tactical use of the heavy rather than using it as a wrecking ball of flaming ****. Similarly this should apply to tanks but slightly longer.... Congratulations on having the single worst idea I have ever heard on these forums. I'm sorry but tell me a game where you can spawn a suit like the heavy constantly? None. Every FPS out there that has a suit similar to how a heavy plays either has a limit to it, or is given as perk for doing well. Battlefield, tanks can only be spawned every so often. The HMG is only picked up randomly from certain spawn locations. COD HMG is given from kill streaks. Planetside max suit has a 10 minute timer. Tanks have a timer also. Crysis nanosuit armor is a kill streak. Blacklight: retribution heavy suit has to be bought and called in every time. Single worst idea yet it's used in every games that has the feature. Go be a **** some were else. Spawn as a heavy non stop? TF2 let's you do that and is a fps game
BANGO SKANK WAS HERE
1.7 best match (HMG): 40/9/9 (K/A/D)
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Jacques Cayton II
Providence Guard Templis CALSF
648
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Posted - 2014.03.09 15:10:00 -
[21] - Quote
BL4CKST4R wrote:*snip* and die
enjoy 1.8 blueberries and redberries.
hopefully I was wrong and you don't get bent over in half... Changed your initial post huh felt stupid didn't you
We fight for the future of the State not our
personal goals
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Archbot
W a r F o r g e d
81
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Posted - 2014.03.09 15:12:00 -
[22] - Quote
CCP: We're going to show some love to scouts in 1.8! Everyone: YAAAAYYY CCP: *turns to the other CCP devs and whispers*...and heavies CCP Devs: AHAHAHAHAHAHAAA
Ya¦Åu-Å Å-ÅGèéGäîGä¦Gä¦Gä¦-ìY
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JARREL THOMAS
Dead Man's Game
170
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Posted - 2014.03.09 15:13:00 -
[23] - Quote
The heavy suits are supposed to dominate cqc and cities.....without a light weapon we are useless In the open unless you're stupid enough to get in my range[/quote] No basic heavys and sentinels dont need the light weapon be smart with were you are in the battlefield or spec into assault. Because light weapons are for commandos and you guys would be getting rid of a reason to even have them.
Caldari Loyalist
I speak for the rabbits
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Texs Red
DUST University Ivy League
282
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Posted - 2014.03.09 15:21:00 -
[24] - Quote
My only issue is when I am using my scout suit and manage to sneak up on a heavy with my AR. The TTK will be so great on heavies that before my AR can kill him, he will be able to turn 180 degrees and mow me down with his HMG or RR or whatever. Should it be difficult to face a heavy head to head or 1v1? Yes, that is the point of a heavy suit. However I have issue when they are so tanky that even getting the drop of them doesn't matter, and wounding them doesn't count. |
BL4CKST4R
WarRavens League of Infamy
2005
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Posted - 2014.03.09 16:01:00 -
[25] - Quote
Jacques Cayton II wrote:BL4CKST4R wrote:*snip* and die
enjoy 1.8 blueberries and redberries.
hopefully I was wrong and you don't get bent over in half... Changed your initial post huh felt stupid didn't you
National to much trolling saved it to my clipboard till after 1.8 when it shall be useful :)
For the Federation!
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Himiko Kuronaga
Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance
3206
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Posted - 2014.03.09 16:02:00 -
[26] - Quote
BL4CKST4R wrote:Himiko Kuronaga wrote:Quote:My suggestion is disallow heavy suits from driving vehicles but they can get in vehicles driven by other players. This allows for proper deployment without removing the heavies speed penalty. My suggestion is to not balance based on tactics that only work against horrible pub teams. Quote:Place a 5 minute timer after the loss of a heavy suit before it can be spawned, this would for more tactical use of the heavy rather than using it as a wrecking ball of flaming ****. Similarly this should apply to tanks but slightly longer.... Congratulations on having the single worst idea I have ever heard on these forums. I'm sorry but tell me a game where you can spawn a suit like the heavy constantly? None. Every FPS out there that has a suit similar to how a heavy plays either has a limit to it, or is given as perk for doing well. Battlefield, tanks can only be spawned every so often. The HMG is only picked up randomly from certain spawn locations. COD HMG is given from kill streaks. Planetside max suit has a 10 minute timer. Tanks have a timer also. Crysis nanosuit armor is a kill streak. Blacklight: Retribution heavy suit has to be bought and called in every time. Single worst idea yet it's used in every games that has the feature. Go be a **** some were else.
COD HMG has nothing in common with Dust HMG.
Planetside Max has an incredible amount of lethality and infinitely more durability than the Dust heavy.
Crysis nanosuit armor has nothing to do with Dust heavy suits mechanically.
Blacklight: Retribution is a crappy game that should never be used in the context of any argument.
The heavy suit in this game does not possess enough advantages to the point that it needs to be limited in availability. If anything, it is already restricted as it lacks equipment, movement, and its specialized weaponry is entirely geographically dependent. It needs team mates to put down uplinks and hives to sustain itself. It requires team mates to run active scanners because it has the weakest scan precision in the game.
You want an example of a game that doesn't limit heavy? Alright. Tribes and Dust 514 don't. TFC doesn't last time I checked. Because they are not obscenely overpowered, and serve a certain role with certain drawbacks. Get used to the idea. |
Jastad
D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
605
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Posted - 2014.03.09 16:19:00 -
[27] - Quote
People tend to forget that the Counter to heavy is not necessary a Light weapon. Nova can do the Job, ADS can do the job too, or you know, something like "focused" fire. When your team is in CQC and find another squad with a heavy you MUST kill him first. It's like how today STILL shot the heavy first while saw that there is a Logi with rep Behind. First the logi, then the Heavy
We have also a 3D way of fighting and on city map people can shoot from roof.
Let's see the patch and IF the HMG is really so beastly, let's tune down it
Amarr SCR user.
Believe in the FORGE, young padawans
C'èSoloDoloreSuCharlie
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TechMechMeds
SWAMPERIUM
2817
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Posted - 2014.03.09 17:06:00 -
[28] - Quote
Blacklight retribution is fking awful, a completely bland pile of ish. Its very 2001 in all the wrong ways.
Level 2 forum warrior.
Dust on the ps4 asap please
I sold my family to the Amarr for isk, its a valid tactic
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Shadow Archeus
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
320
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Posted - 2014.03.10 14:20:00 -
[29] - Quote
Texs Red wrote:My only issue is when I am using my scout suit and manage to sneak up on a heavy with my AR. The TTK will be so great on heavies that before my AR can kill him, he will be able to turn 180 degrees and mow me down with his HMG or RR or whatever. Should it be difficult to face a heavy head to head or 1v1? Yes, that is the point of a heavy suit. However I have issue when they are so tanky that even getting the drop of them doesn't matter, and wounding them doesn't count.
One reason we got so tank is because ttk was broken as fuk.... Imagine buying a suit with much more HP than an assault but takes about the same amount of ttk
Its enough to make anyone go why did I just waste all that sp
Not to mention the hmg was useless in cqc so everyone just bum rushed you with an ar and circle strafed you because we couldn't turn fast enough to keep a bead on a target
Real heavies use lasers
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