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DeadlyAztec11
Ostrakon Agency
Gallente Federation
4521
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Posted - 2014.03.09 06:46:00 -
[1] - Quote
I feel that with the uselessness of damage mods in 1.8 that the only high module option for armor tankers will be Shield Extenders. Myofibril stimulants are non productive to slow fighters,precision enhancers are useless on suits with 55 precision and rechargers/energizers are useless on suits that don't have substantial shields. Shield extenders are the only logical option.
Oh well,
Taco Cat backwards is still Taco Cat
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Awry Barux
Ametat Security
Amarr Empire
1545
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Posted - 2014.03.09 06:48:00 -
[2] - Quote
Intrinsically shield-tanked suits will always be the best dual tankers. It's much easier to compensate for low armor with plates than it is to compensate for low shields with extenders.
Respec in 1.8 due to huge battlefield role shift for MinLogi!
All my posts are respec posts (Gò»°Gûí°n+ëGò»n+¦ Gö+GöüGö+ LockmeBro!
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Proto Annihilator
Fraternity of St. Venefice
Amarr Empire
30
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Posted - 2014.03.09 06:52:00 -
[3] - Quote
Who cares? I find that HP is less valuable than skill. If its a fair fight they die. If they get the jump on me we dance they die. If they bring numbers most of them die. I am not terribly concerned what kind of hp they have. |
Awry Barux
Ametat Security
Amarr Empire
1546
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Posted - 2014.03.09 06:54:00 -
[4] - Quote
Proto Annihilator wrote:Who cares? I find that HP is less valuable than skill. If its a fair fight they die. If they get the jump on me we dance they die. If they bring numbers most of them die. I am not terribly concerned what kind of hp they have.
You're in for a nasty surprise when 1.8 drops. Also, go wave your e-peen elsewhere.
Respec in 1.8 due to huge battlefield role shift for MinLogi!
All my posts are respec posts (Gò»°Gûí°n+ëGò»n+¦ Gö+GöüGö+ LockmeBro!
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DeadlyAztec11
Ostrakon Agency
Gallente Federation
4522
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Posted - 2014.03.09 06:56:00 -
[5] - Quote
Awry Barux wrote:Intrinsically shield-tanked suits will always be the best dual tankers. It's much easier to compensate for low armor with plates than it is to compensate for low shields with extenders.
I agree, though understand that my post was not about who is a better dual tanker. My post was about how the lack of useful high modules means that almost all armor tankers will have no better choice than to run shields. Precision enhancers are only useful on non scouts if they are complex, stacked and used in conjunction with complex range extenders. The use of range extenders would reduce your number of low slots and means your ability at armor tanking would be reduced. Armor tankers also lack the speed to use Myofibril Stimulants effectively. Please understand that Shield Extenders are the only viable high module for armor tankers.
Taco Cat backwards is still Taco Cat
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Proto Annihilator
Fraternity of St. Venefice
Amarr Empire
30
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Posted - 2014.03.09 06:56:00 -
[6] - Quote
Awry Barux wrote:Proto Annihilator wrote:Who cares? I find that HP is less valuable than skill. If its a fair fight they die. If they get the jump on me we dance they die. If they bring numbers most of them die. I am not terribly concerned what kind of hp they have. You're in for a nasty surprise when 1.8 drops. Also, go wave your e-peen elsewhere.
Just being honest. Are you gonna run from everyone who tanks a different hp type than you use?
I don't even know why I am asking, that's probably your strategy. |
DeadlyAztec11
Ostrakon Agency
Gallente Federation
4522
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Posted - 2014.03.09 07:00:00 -
[7] - Quote
Proto Annihilator wrote:Awry Barux wrote:Proto Annihilator wrote:Who cares? I find that HP is less valuable than skill. If its a fair fight they die. If they get the jump on me we dance they die. If they bring numbers most of them die. I am not terribly concerned what kind of hp they have. You're in for a nasty surprise when 1.8 drops. Also, go wave your e-peen elsewhere. Just being honest. Are you gonna run from everyone who tanks a different hp type than you use? I don't even know why I am asking, that's probably your strategy.
You're missing the point of this post entirely. I'am not arguing that I'am afraid of people having more HP. I'am arguing that there will be a lack of diversity among Armor tankers in 1.8.
Taco Cat backwards is still Taco Cat
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Proto Annihilator
Fraternity of St. Venefice
Amarr Empire
30
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Posted - 2014.03.09 07:03:00 -
[8] - Quote
DeadlyAztec11 wrote:Proto Annihilator wrote:Awry Barux wrote:Proto Annihilator wrote:Who cares? I find that HP is less valuable than skill. If its a fair fight they die. If they get the jump on me we dance they die. If they bring numbers most of them die. I am not terribly concerned what kind of hp they have. You're in for a nasty surprise when 1.8 drops. Also, go wave your e-peen elsewhere. Just being honest. Are you gonna run from everyone who tanks a different hp type than you use? I don't even know why I am asking, that's probably your strategy. You're missing the point of this post entirely. I'am not arguing that I'am afraid of people having more HP. I'am arguing that there will be a lack of diversity among Armor tankers in 1.8.
like people are really going to stop using damage mods. They are just crying in a vain hope Ccp will reconsider. |
Cat Merc
Ahrendee Mercenaries
General Tso's Alliance
7255
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Posted - 2014.03.09 07:10:00 -
[9] - Quote
Myo stims would be useful if base damage wasn't so pathetic.
Bring it up to 160 and I might just use it.
Hell bring it up to 200 and it's not even a question of "might", I WILL use it 
Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives.
DUST514514
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DeadlyAztec11
Ostrakon Agency
Gallente Federation
4522
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Posted - 2014.03.09 07:13:00 -
[10] - Quote
Proto Annihilator wrote:
like people are really going to stop using damage mods. They are just crying in a vain hope Ccp will reconsider.
Then let me ask you, will you give up 68 CPU for 5% more damage? I know I won't.
Taco Cat backwards is still Taco Cat
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Proto Annihilator
Fraternity of St. Venefice
Amarr Empire
30
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Posted - 2014.03.09 07:21:00 -
[11] - Quote
DeadlyAztec11 wrote:Proto Annihilator wrote:
like people are really going to stop using damage mods. They are just crying in a vain hope Ccp will reconsider.
Then let me ask you, will you give up 68 CPU for 5% more damage? I know I won't.
if I am running a laser I may. I test and tweak my fits in battle. If I need more damage output I add it. Relying on hp is assuming I am going to be in a position to need it. Its sloppy. I find checking corners and not overextending myself is far more useful than a complex shield extender. Using cover and flanking is better than plates. Tactical awareness and good Intel trumps hp and damage mods. I use what I need. |
DeadlyAztec11
Ostrakon Agency
Gallente Federation
4522
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Posted - 2014.03.09 07:26:00 -
[12] - Quote
Proto Annihilator wrote:DeadlyAztec11 wrote:Proto Annihilator wrote:
like people are really going to stop using damage mods. They are just crying in a vain hope Ccp will reconsider.
Then let me ask you, will you give up 68 CPU for 5% more damage? I know I won't. if I am running a laser I may. I test and tweak my fits in battle. If I need more damage output I add it. Relying on hp is assuming I am going to be in a position to need it. Its sloppy. I find checking corners and not overextending myself is far more useful than a complex shield extender. Using cover and flanking is better than plates. Tactical awareness and good Intel trumps hp and damage mods. I use what I need.
Again, you're arguing against something I'am not; and ironically enough I actually agree with you. I'am merely saying that armor tankers will lose diversity in 1.8 because shield extenders will be superior to every other high module. Which means that almost all armor tankers will be dual tankers in 1.8.
The loss of diversity, that is my argument.
Taco Cat backwards is still Taco Cat
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Proto Annihilator
Fraternity of St. Venefice
Amarr Empire
30
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Posted - 2014.03.09 07:36:00 -
[13] - Quote
DeadlyAztec11 wrote:Proto Annihilator wrote:DeadlyAztec11 wrote:Proto Annihilator wrote:
like people are really going to stop using damage mods. They are just crying in a vain hope Ccp will reconsider.
Then let me ask you, will you give up 68 CPU for 5% more damage? I know I won't. if I am running a laser I may. I test and tweak my fits in battle. If I need more damage output I add it. Relying on hp is assuming I am going to be in a position to need it. Its sloppy. I find checking corners and not overextending myself is far more useful than a complex shield extender. Using cover and flanking is better than plates. Tactical awareness and good Intel trumps hp and damage mods. I use what I need. Again, you're arguing against something I'am not; and ironically enough I actually agree with you. I'am merely saying that armor tankers will lose diversity in 1.8 because shield extenders will be superior to every other high module. Which means that almost all armor tankers will be dual tankers in 1.8. The loss of diversity, that is my argument.
the choice is still there. Its the communities fault they flock to one fit. |
Martyr Saboteur
Amarrtyrs
220
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Posted - 2014.03.09 07:46:00 -
[14] - Quote
Proto Annihilator wrote:DeadlyAztec11 wrote:Proto Annihilator wrote:DeadlyAztec11 wrote:Proto Annihilator wrote:
like people are really going to stop using damage mods. They are just crying in a vain hope Ccp will reconsider.
Then let me ask you, will you give up 68 CPU for 5% more damage? I know I won't. if I am running a laser I may. I test and tweak my fits in battle. If I need more damage output I add it. Relying on hp is assuming I am going to be in a position to need it. Its sloppy. I find checking corners and not overextending myself is far more useful than a complex shield extender. Using cover and flanking is better than plates. Tactical awareness and good Intel trumps hp and damage mods. I use what I need. Again, you're arguing against something I'am not; and ironically enough I actually agree with you. I'am merely saying that armor tankers will lose diversity in 1.8 because shield extenders will be superior to every other high module. Which means that almost all armor tankers will be dual tankers in 1.8. The loss of diversity, that is my argument. the choice is still there. Its the communities fault they flock to one fit.
No. It is CCPs fault for not making more viable choices for high slot modules.
Totally not Fizzer94's forum alt. Definitely just a random dude.
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Sgt Kirk
Fatal Absolution
General Tso's Alliance
5003
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Posted - 2014.03.09 07:49:00 -
[15] - Quote
Proto Annihilator wrote:DeadlyAztec11 wrote:Proto Annihilator wrote:Awry Barux wrote:Proto Annihilator wrote:Who cares? I find that HP is less valuable than skill. If its a fair fight they die. If they get the jump on me we dance they die. If they bring numbers most of them die. I am not terribly concerned what kind of hp they have. You're in for a nasty surprise when 1.8 drops. Also, go wave your e-peen elsewhere. Just being honest. Are you gonna run from everyone who tanks a different hp type than you use? I don't even know why I am asking, that's probably your strategy. You're missing the point of this post entirely. I'am not arguing that I'am afraid of people having more HP. I'am arguing that there will be a lack of diversity among Armor tankers in 1.8. like people are really going to stop using damage mods. They are just crying in a vain hope Ccp will reconsider.
Uhhh, yeah? If you're not a dumbass that doesn't know how to do basic math or have an in-game friend to do the math for you you're not going to be using a Damage mod. It's so much more efficient to dual tank. Especially now since there's no consequences.
1st Official Role Playing Gallente Asshole -Title Awarded by True Adamance
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Proto Annihilator
Fraternity of St. Venefice
Amarr Empire
30
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Posted - 2014.03.09 07:53:00 -
[16] - Quote
we had them. The community stacked damage mods. The community cried for this Nerf. The community is crying because of a he Nerf. The community will cry about anything. If we could all get on the same page instead of trying to get each other nerfed we could get a decent game. Will it happen. No. |
Proto Annihilator
Fraternity of St. Venefice
Amarr Empire
30
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Posted - 2014.03.09 07:59:00 -
[17] - Quote
Sgt Kirk. I'm still going to rapeface in a bpo suit. With the same old bpo mods. Go ahead and dual tank your ass off. When you die well at least you tried your best. (Your best is stacking hp). I don't actually care what other people run. |
Lorhak Gannarsein
Science For Death
2005
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Posted - 2014.03.09 08:03:00 -
[18] - Quote
Proto Annihilator wrote:DeadlyAztec11 wrote:Proto Annihilator wrote:DeadlyAztec11 wrote:Proto Annihilator wrote:
like people are really going to stop using damage mods. They are just crying in a vain hope Ccp will reconsider.
Then let me ask you, will you give up 68 CPU for 5% more damage? I know I won't. if I am running a laser I may. I test and tweak my fits in battle. If I need more damage output I add it. Relying on hp is assuming I am going to be in a position to need it. Its sloppy. I find checking corners and not overextending myself is far more useful than a complex shield extender. Using cover and flanking is better than plates. Tactical awareness and good Intel trumps hp and damage mods. I use what I need. Again, you're arguing against something I'am not; and ironically enough I actually agree with you. I'am merely saying that armor tankers will lose diversity in 1.8 because shield extenders will be superior to every other high module. Which means that almost all armor tankers will be dual tankers in 1.8. The loss of diversity, that is my argument. the choice is still there. Its the communities fault they flock to one fit.
Apparently you don't know how to maths.
Under no circumstances are damage mods better than shield extenders, excepting snipers and AV. Possibly not for AV.
Assault ak.0 w/ScR+ScP 4LYFE
Forum Warrior Level Two. (GëºGêçGëª)/
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Proto Annihilator
Fraternity of St. Venefice
Amarr Empire
32
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Posted - 2014.03.09 08:06:00 -
[19] - Quote
DeadlyAztec11 wrote:Proto Annihilator wrote:
like people are really going to stop using damage mods. They are just crying in a vain hope Ccp will reconsider.
Then let me ask you, will you give up 68 CPU for 5% more damage? I know I won't.
dmg mods fit for less. The numbers lie. |
Rusty Shallows
1068
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Posted - 2014.03.09 08:07:00 -
[20] - Quote
DeadlyAztec11 wrote:Proto Annihilator wrote:
like people are really going to stop using damage mods. They are just crying in a vain hope Ccp will reconsider.
Then let me ask you, will you give up 68 CPU for 5% more damage? I know I won't.
I will, but only for one. Also aiming for that high-slot mod for scan precision.
Here, have some candy and a Like. :-)
Forums > Game
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Proto Annihilator
Fraternity of St. Venefice
Amarr Empire
37
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Posted - 2014.03.09 08:17:00 -
[21] - Quote
I won't respond to the 5quote post. Its a hassle trying to delete all that shite on my phone. To lo. Dmg mods have better pg. Also at the basic level I'll use a dmg mod every time. I encounter a vast number of people who can't shoot for s#it. Why would I need extra shields? |
DeadlyAztec11
Ostrakon Agency
Gallente Federation
4530
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Posted - 2014.03.09 10:56:00 -
[22] - Quote
Proto Annihilator wrote:I won't respond to the 5quote post. Its a hassle trying to delete all that shite on my phone. To lo. Dmg mods have better pg. Also at the basic level I'll use a dmg mod every time. I encounter a vast number of people who can't shoot for s#it. Why would I need extra shields?
Because, when engaging more than one opponent at a time you will live longer while strafing. Also, PG wise shield extenders cost less at militia level, the same at standard, one more at enhanced and two more at proto. Not to much of a difference compared to the CPU gap. I find I always have a nice surplus of PG to use on things like Kinetic Catalyzers and Scrambler Rifles.
P.S I'm using a phone too. You can highlight to delete text.
Taco Cat backwards is still Taco Cat
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Obodiah Garro
Tech Guard
RISE of LEGION
803
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Posted - 2014.03.09 11:00:00 -
[23] - Quote
CCP could force the option of only armor or shield enhancing modules per suit to increase fit variety, which really isnt that bad when you consider 90% of peeps are scrubs.
Nemo me impune lacessit
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stlcarlos989
SVER True Blood
General Tso's Alliance
1225
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Posted - 2014.03.09 12:06:00 -
[24] - Quote
DeadlyAztec11 wrote:Proto Annihilator wrote:DeadlyAztec11 wrote:Proto Annihilator wrote:
like people are really going to stop using damage mods. They are just crying in a vain hope Ccp will reconsider.
Then let me ask you, will you give up 68 CPU for 5% more damage? I know I won't. if I am running a laser I may. I test and tweak my fits in battle. If I need more damage output I add it. Relying on hp is assuming I am going to be in a position to need it. Its sloppy. I find checking corners and not overextending myself is far more useful than a complex shield extender. Using cover and flanking is better than plates. Tactical awareness and good Intel trumps hp and damage mods. I use what I need. Again, you're arguing against something I'am not; and ironically enough I actually agree with you. I'am merely saying that armor tankers will lose diversity in 1.8 because shield extenders will be superior to every other high module. Which means that almost all armor tankers will be dual tankers in 1.8. The loss of diversity, that is my argument.
What diversity? its armor + damage mods wheres the diversity in that? Next build it will be armor + shields. Every armor tanked suit I run into runs damage mods unless they're a complete idiot. Now saying that the gal logi's extra 24.4% damage has been reduced to 12.2% ruins the diversity is ignorant. If anything it helps the vastly UP shield tanked suits considering that currently armor dropsuits have double the eHP and 19%-25% more damage output with only half the movement penalty from a few builds ago.
STB Director, #1 in Warpoints E3 Closed Beta Build, Water Pipe Aficionado, Cannabis Sativa Connoisseur
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DeadlyAztec11
Ostrakon Agency
Gallente Federation
4530
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Posted - 2014.03.09 12:13:00 -
[25] - Quote
stlcarlos989 wrote:
What diversity? its armor + damage mods wheres the diversity in that? Next build it will be armor + shields. Every armor tanked suit I run into runs damage mods unless they're a complete idiot. Now saying that the gal logi's extra 24.4% damage has been reduced to 12.2% ruins the diversity is ignorant. If anything it helps the vastly UP shield tanked suits considering that currently armor dropsuits have double the eHP and 19%-25% more damage output with only half the movement penalty from a few builds ago.
From a DPS stand point, it takes longer for a suit with a Complex Shield Extender to die than the same suit with a Complex Damage mod can kill it.
Brick tanking traditional armor suits will be the way to go in 1.8.
Taco Cat backwards is still Taco Cat
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Scheneighnay McBob
Hammerhead i Eagle Thrust
4245
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Posted - 2014.03.09 13:36:00 -
[26] - Quote
Here's what COULD happen:
1.8 is obviously going to exaggerate damage type weaknesses. Armor weapons are going to start out FOTM because shield weapons will be less effective against the current trend of favoring armor. To adapt to this, people will start shield tanking to resist the armor weapons, causing people to switch to shield weapons, and so on.
What probably will happen:
lolfluxandMD
Get your nanohives ready; cal logis will be in high demand.
I am your scan error.
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Patrick57
5880
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Posted - 2014.03.09 14:09:00 -
[27] - Quote
Myofibril Stimulants wouldn't be so useless if melee was designed better.
Melee currently has the range of Nova Knives, but isn't enough to kill anyone unless they have barely any HP left.  |
ads alt
139
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Posted - 2014.03.09 14:40:00 -
[28] - Quote
DeadlyAztec11 wrote:I feel that with the uselessness of damage mods in 1.8 that the only high module option for armor tankers will be Shield Extenders. Myofibril stimulants are non productive to slow fighters,precision enhancers are useless on suits with 55 precision and rechargers/energizers are useless on suits that don't have substantial shields. Shield extenders are the only logical option.
Oh well,
This is why shield tanking a caldari suit will be so damm underpowered, everyone wil have almost as much shields as them but 3x the armor
1.8 will release...
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Patrick57
5882
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Posted - 2014.03.09 14:51:00 -
[29] - Quote
Depending on how much SP I have in 1.8, I will run a dual tanked Amarr Logi. :D |
The dark cloud
The Rainbow Effect
Negative-Feedback
2337
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Posted - 2014.03.09 14:53:00 -
[30] - Quote
Shield suits the best for dual tanking? No not really cause once your shields are depleted you run for cover. Armor tanked suits stay and fight cause armor is the last defence for suits and is with that manly. You guys seem to forget that caldari/gallente suits have the exact same slot layouts and the same base HP. But because gallente suits have more low slots the HP potential is higher due to the fact plates>shield extenders.
I shall show you a world, a world which you cant imagine, a world full off butthurt n00bs at the other end of my gun
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Jack Kittinger
Molon Labe.
General Tso's Alliance
175
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Posted - 2014.03.09 16:05:00 -
[31] - Quote
Wow this just keeps derailing... bravo "proto qqer"
People will stack HP-increasing modules more than ever in 1.8, and they will spam those heavies and their light weapons making the battlefield something way different from 1.7, read heavy/commando spam for the first two weeks.
If diversity for Armor tankers might be threatened by the lack of more modules to be used after you stack your two plates and a repper, nevertheless it seems that the nerf and higher TTK will cause inevitable dual tanking for armor tankers to be possible, but not necessary.
why not necessary? Yes more HP will be better for a simpleton scrub, but for players who adapt, the proficient use of multiple weapons to slowly or suddenly kick that crutch out their hands will be much better;
Yes Armor tankers don't have many options to help enhance anything other then range amplification shieldext or pitiful damage modding but IMO it is most likely better to use a higher tier weapon/grenade and leaving your highs empty as an armor tanker.
On diversity; it would be nice to see modules added or switched to be more viable if your race armor tanks or shield tanks like previously suggested, this might not be diversity-friendly but it would help define which modules pair up to make the race's strenghts stand out and compensate for their weaknesses.
On dual tanking made a better case on this tweak
https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=146541
Proud winner of the 'Templar BPO Raffle' by Castor Crave!!
Lucky Number 29
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